Democrats assess Hill damage, leadership

[rodeodance]

Source: msnbc

Democrats assess Hill damage, leadership
The holidays will give the party time ponder this year's hits, misses


updated 2:31 p.m. ET Dec. 16, 2007

WASHINGTON - Congressional Democrats will have plenty to ponder during the Christmas-New Year recess. For instance, why did things go so badly this fall, and how well did their leaders serve them?

Partisan players will quarrel for months, but objective analysts say the debate must start here: An embattled president made extraordinary use of his veto power and he was backed by GOP lawmakers who may have put their political fortunes at risk.
.............



In a string of setbacks last week, Democratic leaders in Congress yielded to Bush and his GOP allies on Iraqi war funding, tax and health policies, energy policy and spending decisions affecting billions of dollars throughout the government.

The concessions stunned many House and Senate Democrats, who saw the 2006 elections as a mandate to redirect the war and Bush's domestic priorities. Instead, they found his goals unchanged and his clout barely diminished.

Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22285011/

[rodeodance]

1. Democrats should force Republicans into all-day and all-night sessions for a week or two, said Norm

Some Democrats say House GOP leaders would have killed any bid to forge a veto-proof margin on the children's health bill. But others say the effort was clumsily handled in the House, where key Democrats at first ignored, and later selectively engaged, rank-and-file Republicans whose support they needed.

Some Washington veterans say Democrats, especially in the ostentatiously polite Senate, must fight more viciously if they hope to turn public opinion against GOP obstruction tactics. With Democrats holding or controlling 51 of the 100 seats, Republicans repeatedly thwart their initiatives by threatening filibusters, which require 60 votes to overcome.

Democrats should force Republicans into all-day and all-night sessions for a week or two, said Norm Ornstein, a congressional scholar for the right-of-center think tank American Enterprise Institute. The tactic wouldn't change senators' votes, he said, but it might build public awareness and resentment of GOP obstructionists in a way that a one-night talkfest cannot.

To date, Reid has resisted such ideas, which would anger and inconvenience some Democratic senators as well as Republicans.

[polichick]

2. Reid's worried about "inconveniencing" senators??

People are getting killed, for crying out loud!!!!

[mzmolly]

3. Republicans are playing it "smart" again and we are being ignorant.

What else is new?

The R's know that if they refuse to budge on XYZ the Demoratic voters will be disgusted and as such will be less likely to vote in 08.

[rockybelt]

4. And how well did their leaders serve them?

One would assume that Pelosi and Reid are the ones referred to here. You can include Feinstein and Schumer in on the failed leadership as well.

The entire fault for this Congress failing at every turn cannot be blamed entirely upon the leadership. Not when you get the lopsided votes that have been coming out of the Houses lately.

Just call it like it is. The ENTIRE Congress failed the American people at every turn since they WERE given a mandate in 2006 and that mandate was for change to happen and for people to be held accountable for the Iraq war and the absolute disaster it has become. Now the finger pointing will start at each other and before you know it the Houses will be divided amongst themselves and this war will go on forever.

Those democrats in the House and Senate that were stunned had better get off their asses, stand up and start shouting at the top of their lungs and keep shouting until the rest of the politicians get the message. The stunned Senators and Congressmen need to hear the angry shouts of the Americans that are sick and tired of these politicians constantly eroding our "Homeland" security, making the U.S. the most hated country in the world, torturing people and claiming that it is not torture, spying on everyone in America, shredding the Constitution and letting a fascist dictator get away with murdering thousands of Americans and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis.

I tell you what, you stinking politicians, your political futures, as far as I am concerned, are in the shitter right now!! I will not vote for any one of you that has voted to give the dictator the powers he thinks he has, voted for this war, CONTINUES to vote to finance this war with borrowed money, are accomplices to the tyranny that is befalling us and in general being a bunch of ass-holes that could care less about your true constituents. Cow and bow to your true "constituents" the corporate greed.

Ask me what I really think of you sleazy bastards and I will tell you.

[Rockerdem]

5. It begins and ends with the war

I consider the Iraq war the litmus test for a real Democrat, not some Lieberman wannabee. It's foreign affairs, militarization of the country, the cozy relationship with sleazy contractors, lobbyists, and a lot of other bad aspects of American politics rolled into one.

Funding for the war cannot be filibustered ... all it takes is a majority to cut it off. All it takes is the majority that we have to straighten the spine and say no to the rhetoric that it's "for the troops." BS, it is.

There are too many left in Congress who voted for the thing to begin with. And for some unknown reason they are still afraid of the mighty Bush/Cheney. Or they're afraid of what is going to said at the GOP convention, imagining that "troops" will be paraded forth bashing the peace contingent in Congress. Or some other irrational fear. What else can explain the recalcitrance for voting for something that was really popular last Spring??? I'm at a loss.

[humbled_opinion]

6. OK so ..

What exactly is the difference between the Republican Controlled Congress giving Bush blank Checks and the Democratic controlled congress giving Bush Blank Checks?

Only now it seems like a slap in the face to me personally to a constituent that voted for change and received assurances of change and got handed the same old, same old...

talk about being disheartened... anyway they can try to spin it like its all the fault of the Rethugs but I ain't buying that... To me the Democratic leadership has failed to LEAD... They needed to be as strong on their convictions to get us out of this debacle in Iraq as strong as the idiot is in staying the course and sorry to say they just plain failed.

They could have impeached him... but no thanks to Pelosi.... They could have cut off all funding and demanded a redeployment but no they capitulated and why...

I know how its gonna get spun and Joe public is gonna buy it too... Here goes...

In the 2008 campaign Bush surge plan worked and Iraq is now on its way to polical reconciliation and a bright future free of violence and terror. Al-Qaida in Iraq have been largely defeated thanks to our bravest and all you need to remember about this whole debacle is if the Democrats had their way our troops would have been removed from Iraq in 2005 and therefore the country would have collapsed and been a breeding ground for terrorists....

That is whats coming....

[Proud Liberal Dem]

10. NO miracle has been performed in Iraq

And to the extent that anything "good" has happened in Iraq, it's been way too little way too late and IMHO we shouldn't even have been over there in the first place creating all of the problems that we've had to expend 4000+ troops and billions (trillions?) of taxpayer dollars to "solve." Anyway, why exactly would "Joe public" care THAT much about what is happening in Iraq when it's becoming increasingly difficult to purchase gas, food, health care, and other essential daily living items HERE. Maybe I'm being hopelessly naive but, aside from people who have family members serving in Iraq or are in the military themselves, how many people have Iraq on their minds 24/7 let alone care THAT much about the outcome to vote Republican (and just so they can keep the occupation going)? Assuming nothing has changed since I last blinked, the general public is still very much against keeping the occupation going, which seems to be a big part of the reason why a lot of people (including myself) are VERY unhappy with the current Congress. Frankly, one thing that I don't understand about Iraq and nobody seems to have asked is, "If we have been so successful in Iraq, why are we NOT pulling (at least) most of our troops out of there and/or redeploying them to Afghanistan where they are needed to counter the resurgent Taliban (or sending them home to spend time with their families and recuperating)?"
:wtf:

[natrat]

7. seems like a scam dontchyaknow--designated party of failure

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

8. Fantasy clout.

Clout is as clout does.

:grr:

[Javaman]

9. They are all victims of a very rare disease...

minus spine-nus.