This is good! Press release from Hillary's campaign: The Politics Of Pile-On

[ProSense]

10/31/2007

The Politics Of Pile-On

What happens when the “politics of pile-on” replaces the “politics of hope?”

Hillary comes out on top.

Despite the best efforts of her six fellow candidates to trip her up, Senator Clinton stood strong and made her case on critical issues like Iran, Iraq and Social Security. She kept her focus on the real target in this election: Republicans and the Bush Administration. Instead of going after the other Democrats, Hillary made the argument for why change is needed and why she has the strength and experience to lead the Democratic Party in its efforts to make that change happen.

Sadly, Senator Obama caved to the pressure of the pundits and fundraisers who demanded that he go negative and abandoned the "politics of hope" message that sparked so much interest in him early in the campaign. Meanwhile, Senator Edwards doubled down in his effort to become the guy best known for attacking other Democrats. Not to be outdone, the rest of the pack followed suit and piled on in the hope that they’d get some media attention.

But with each attack, Senators Obama and Edwards undermined the central premises of their own candidacies. The sunny speeches and rosy rhetoric that once characterized their remarks has now been replaced by the kinds of jabs one typically sees from candidates desperate to gain traction in the polls.

The American people are looking for a President who can stand strong and come out ahead under any circumstances.

Last night, once again, that person was Hillary Clinton.

One strong woman.

One big hypocrite!

To those who joined the Bush league's RW attack on Senator Kerry:

But they also share something else in common. When George Bush and the Republican Party decided to beat John Kerry down, John McCain and Hillary Clinton decided to pile on and add a few kicks of their own. Both of these people know John Kerry personally, they know the Republican playbook first hand, they’ve been abused by these same people themselves, and they know full well that John Kerry would never have disparaged the troops. But they both saw a political opportunity to profit by the bloody works of George Bush and Karl Rove, and they didn’t hesitate to take it.

Video: Hillary Clinton Joins In

[madfloridian]

1. I remember in 03 and 04 during the last debates.....we were called whiners.

If we said they were piling on Dean.

:shrug:

Whine whine.

And put a picture of a whiny crying baby up to show how whiny we are.

[polichick]

2. They were piling on, but only because they'd all been lobbing softballs before. nt

[rinsd]

3. That was a pile on?

She was saying Kerry's comments are insignificant compared to the issues.

"What Senator Kerry said was inappropriate and I believe we cannot let it divert us from looking at the issues that are at stake"

[ccpup]

4. oh my God!

she said that?! that was SUCH a pile-on! I've never heard or seen anything that comes remotely close to the venom and utter hatred and outrage that I saw clearly in her comment on the good Senator Kerry! How DARE she?!?!?!

:sarcasm:

[Nedsdag]

6. Her quote alone singlehandedly knocked Kerry out.

She's one tough b@#?*h!

[ProSense]

8. OMG!

Insignificant and inappropriate are the same thing?

She knew what he meant. She knew the comment was about Bush.

Yet she decided to fan the furor by labeling an innocuous comment about Bush as "inappropriate."

[rinsd]

10. "I believe we cannot let it divert us from looking at the issues that are at stake"

Yeah there she was fanning the flames :eyes:

[ProSense]

11. First you say insignificant is the same as inappropriate, now

you just choose to ignore that part of the comment. :eyes:

[rinsd]

12. Reading comprehension is your friend

Here is what I posted "She was saying Kerry's comments are insignificant compared to the issues."

She was asked about Kerry comments, made a quick comment about them and then stated that it should not divert us from the issues.

What are basing your outrage on? clips from FoxNews?

[ProSense]

20. Reading comprehension doesn't confuse insignificant with "inappropriate." n/t

[rinsd]

22. I didn't confuse the two, you did. Most likely deliberately.

By saying that we should not be distracted by Kerry's comments she is calling them insignificant.

She also called them inappropriate.

These are not mutually exclusive concepts.

[ProSense]

25. Here is your response verbatim:

That was a pile on?

She was saying Kerry's comments are insignificant compared to the issues.

"What Senator Kerry said was inappropriate and I believe we cannot let it divert us from looking at the issues that are at stake"

Who used the term insignificant, you or Hillary?

[rinsd]

43. I used the term insignificant while interpreting the second part of her statement.

I've bolded the appropriate sections since you seem willfully ignorant.

She was saying Kerry's comments are insignificant compared to the issues.

The above relates to this

"What Senator Kerry said was inappropriate and I believe we cannot let it divert us from looking at the issues that are at stake"

Is this really that hard to understand? :shrug:

[ProSense]

45. Is my pointing out that you are

ignoring the first part of the statement, the basis of the OP, so hard to understand:

"What Senator Kerry said was inappropriate and I believe we cannot let it divert us from looking at the issues that are at stake"

Really, is that hard to understand?

[rinsd]

48. The basis of the OP is that she was piling on.

When that was obviously not the case when her actual quote was put out there.

When you got called on it, you went off on semantic safari where you suddenly could not grasp the English language.

So I understand perfectly...and now so does anyone reading this thread.

[ProSense]

50. "Inappropriate" equals piling on!

Thought I'd spell it out for you. Jeez!

[rinsd]

53. Except that it doesn't when combined with the 2nd part of her quote.

It was not a defense of Kerry in any way shape or form but it was hardly a pile on.

[ProSense]

58. "It was not a defense of Kerry in any way shape or form but it was hardly a pile on."

OMG, are you reading what you are writing. It wasn't a defense because it was a criticism, ergo pile on.

[rinsd]

63. A pile on would have been the crap you saw the rw do.

Like "How dare Senator Kerry" and those ridiculous demands that Kerry apologize for it.

[ProSense]

67. "Inappropriate," same thing. n/t

[rinsd]

71. Yeah its the exact same thing

:eyes:

[karynnj]

69. What image do you get from the word "inappropriate"?

[rinsd]

72. Depends on the context.

Inappropriate touching has a much more harsh context than he said something inappropriate.

Even the phrase "what he said was inappropriate" has alot to do with the tone in which it was conveyed.

As a critique coupled with her 2nd comment, I found to be mild and obviously I am still a little baffled by Kerry fan reaction directed specifically at Hillary.

[karynnj]

73. Everyone reacts differently when the candidate they respect is attacked

For the most part it was the word and it's meanings - improper and unsuitable. It has a connotation of it being base action. That Kerry obviously did not intentionally misread the joke makes this comment inexplicable. It is a word that goes toward character and it dealt with soldiers. For those of us who are Kerry supporters, one thing that we have consistently seen is that he has an unusual empathy and heart felt respect for soldiers. He is not just saying it because it is the thing one does. In this, for many like me, an anti-war college student in the 1960s, it made me rethink how I feel on this.

Whether it was Kerry's editorial asking people to understand the circumstances the soldiers were under when Bob Kerrey was under attack, Kerry's 1971 testimony speaking of the need to not desert the soldiers now that they were vets, or his discussion of the search and destroy missions in Iraq from the POV of both the Iraqis and the soldiers, what was clear is that Kerry understood then and now the difficulties faced by the soldiers. Kerry's concern on this goes to the heart of who he is.

We saw the video and heard the words and the tone in which they were said. You can have a different response and it is valid - my response was visceral and almost not intellectual - to me this stepped over a line. Obviously, it didn't for you.

I will bet you though that if Hillary gets the nomination, one thing she will likely ask Senator Kerry to do is to work on getting veterans support for her. She knows that he has credibility with many of them.

[rinsd]

74. Understood.

[karynnj]

54. Which point did she place first?

Also why was this said 2 days after the issue blew up, when it was dying down and when the few polls done were showing no negative impact.

[rinsd]

57. She was asked about it,. She responded.

Imam confused, you seem to be implying Clinton brought this up out of the blue? :shrug:

[karynnj]

65. No - I am saying "inappropriate" was her number one point

She could have responded that it was not one of the issues - as people here are saying or even said he flubbed a joke or he put his foot in his mouth - just not imply the RW had it right.

[cuke]

24. Reading comprehension means reading to the end of the sentence

It ends with a period.

[ProSense]

30. Poor thing! n/t

[cuke]

31. "I believe we cannot let it divert us from looking at the issues that are at stake."

[ProSense]

37. "Inappropriate." n/t

[cuke]

41. Ohh, that must have hurt

[karynnj]

52. Reading comprehension leads you to see that the FIRST

point she made was that it was inappropriate.

By the way - it was NOT diverting us from the REAL issue - the one that HRC was wrong on in summer 2006 - the thing that people got out of the repitition was STUCK IN IRAQ, a theme that was positive for Democrats - even if people were mad at Kerry.

The Hillary clip appears to be from CNN - and at any rate HRC said it.

[rinsd]

56. So the rw going apeshit over Kerry's statement wasn't a distraction?

I can see having a problem with Hillary not defending Kerry there. But I thought the 2nd part of her statement was on the money.

[cuke]

60. And regardless, it wasn't a pile-on

Not even close

[MH1]

16. There was nothing inappropriate about Kerry's comment as intended.

She should have said "no comment" or noted that the RW spin was completely false and that Kerry's record of supporting veterans shows that it is false.

Calling it "inappropriate" when it was an attack on Bush that was successfully (with help from her) spun into something different, is piling on, yes.

Maybe she'd be seen better by many of us Kerry supporters if she acknowledged her mistake and apologized. I'm sure not holding my breath for that one though.

[cuke]

27. Speak for yourself

I've been a Kerry supporter for decades, and I know several who support Hillary.

[karynnj]

59. Not to mention, as a Kerry supporter

I would have accepted as fair her criticizing Kerry fairly. Had she said something like, "Kerry stuck his foot in his mouth, but we need to speak of the real issues - I would think it was fair.

The fact that the only way to interpret "inappropriate" is to buy that John Kerry, with his 35 year record of being a real supporter of veterans and the troops, deliberately insulted the troops. Hillary's comment was more inappropriate than Kerry's.

Also, there was this whining heard today that should be the subject. The Clinton team can't have it both ways. They've been telling us that she can take anything.

[karynnj]

47. She did not say "What Kerry said was insignificant", she said inappropriate

Now, leaving out a 2 letter word in a joke, already distributed to the media in the prepared text, would never be inappropriate. In addition, the LITERAL interpretation is not especially inappropriate - the only thing that was inappropriate is the RW interpretation that the soldiers were all dumb and uneducated.

If she meant Kerry comments in Seattle where he explained that he was speaking of Bush not planning for Iraq, then she is a complete hypocrite. Kerry was more in control of himself there than Bill Clinton was when he "taught the Democrats how to fight" shoving his finger in Chris Wallace's face. Kerry defended himself from their lie that he was attacking the troops - it was his right to do so.

Also, the closing argument in 2006 was the Democratic position on Iraq - that by then was where only 13 Senators stood in the summer. Note that HRC is now closer to where Kerry was in 2006, than where she was - not that she would credit it.

I am shocked that the "tough" woman who can uniquely stand up to the Republicans has her campaign whining that people were picking on her. This is nothing compared to what the general election is likely to be.

[rinsd]

51. No but she cast his comments as insignificant in comparison to the issues.

She was calling the rw on their BS distraction.

"I am shocked that the "tough" woman who can uniquely stand up to the Republicans has her campaign whining that people were picking on her. This is nothing compared to what the general election is likely to be."

The Clinton campaign is attempting to get mileage out of attacks on a woman.

It worked with Lazio.

[karynnj]

66. The Senate is not the Presidency

Do you think that using the idea you can't attack a woman extends to the Presidential candidate. State that and you lose.

[MethuenProgressive]

5. Barack and Johnny realy embarassed themselves last night.

Pathetic performances. They can kiss the VP spot goodbye.

[Nedsdag]

7. So they should just stand there and be quiet?

How dare they take on the Queen!

Off with their heads!

[MethuenProgressive]

9. They should talk about why we should support them, not act like Republicans.

Karl Rove would've been proud of the two little puppies yipping at Clinton's heels.

[MH1]

17. It was Hillary who embarrassed herself

do you know how ridiculous she looked on that driver's license question?

[MethuenProgressive]

19. Only if the answer was over your head.

Good answer.

[karynnj]

62. Which one?

:)

[Bitwit1234]

13. I have said this over and over...Obama supporters who took to bashing Hillary

have done their candidate a world of hurt. Truthfully when Obama stood up in front of the convention in 2004, I thought, finally a man in the democratic party with vision. One who is honest and will take us places.

Sadly I was so mistaken. He got a big head and his ego took a giant leap forward, when someone mentioned he run for president. That is all it took. He changed. And now he attracts the type of people who like to bash and slur. And he is taking that route also. I don't know if he can save anything out of this campaign or not. I do know the bashers have turned so many people against him. Of course he isn't going to win the nomination. It is too early. If he had waited a few years he might have had a chance. And we could have seen just what kind of man he was. But his image is not forever tarnished. I'll not vote for him. And I know a lot of people who also changed their minds.

What did all the bashing accomplish. A more focused group of people who dug in and overcame the bashing. Hillary is more stronger than she ever was and a part of it, is indeed, owed to Obama and his bashers.

[truebrit71]

14. What a whiner....

Does someone need the WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHMBULANCE?

:eyes:

[Tellurian]

15. The only relevant facts on this thread lie here:

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/release/view/?id=3981

The funny things is...evreything going on in this presidential campaign is of historical significance, specifically because we have a viable female candidate who happens to be besting all the men running against her AND she happens to be the spouse of the last duly elected president.

Yes, John "Hedge Fund" Edwards sure is a southern gentleman alright. Check in for therapy John, you're doing poorly in the polls because you are not presidential material. That is not Sen Clinton's fault, no matter how you whine about it. It won't change a thing.

[Cameron27]

18. Good turn about for Hill.

It was a pile on, with the moderators included, of course she should use it to her advantage.

[Bullet1987]

21. Awww...poor Hillary is mad because people are pointing out her

hypocrisy.

[cuke]

29. Nope, she's laughing at them because they do it so poorly

[Bullet1987]

33. No...she's crying

[jgraz]

46. Actually, she hasn't been laughing at all lately

I guess her handlers finally figured out that her cackle was scaring people.

[Cameron27]

64. I don't care if she's mad, sad or happy about the debate,

what she's trying to do is turn it around, and that's good politics. I don't know if it'll work, but that's what she's doing.

[mark414]

61. "hedge fund" is a poor critique to make

when hillary's daughter is also employed by a hedge fund

[Tellurian]

70. Chelsea isn't running for president..

and it's Edwards that brought up taking donations from corporations as a pooh, pooh on Hillary!

For your edification, seeing it was still in my browser.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zk16oxb4Ck4

[Forkboy]

23. I thought she was so tough she could withstand the might of a direct comet hit.

[cuke]

34. She just did

She had most of the candidates on that stage go after her at one time or another. She did take some blows, but she handed out a few herself and she is still going strong.

If it were me or you, we'd be jello by the end of it

[Forkboy]

38. See?

:D

[cuke]

40. of course

You mean us Hillary supporters are NOT known for seeing both sides of the issue? Nah, that couldn't be it

[jillan]

26. Biden was the one that handled this right last nite.

When Timmy tried to get him to attack her, he said that he wasn't running against Hillary.
He was running to be the leader of the free world - and went on to say why - and then attacked Rudy-tootie.

And in the post debate interview with Matthews, he reiterated this.

He come out on top for doing this.

[Cha]

36. That is classy...why drag

hillary into his spotlight.

[cuke]

42. a real class act he was

[jefferson_dem]

28. What? Did she leave the debate in a WHAAAAAMBULANCE?

Don't be such a cry-baby, Hillary. It's the price of front-runner status. Deal with it.

[Cha]

32. Thank you for this, ProSense..I

tend to forget this important bit of history every now and then.

hillary needs to be held accountable for her little participation in that BIG PILE ON..Senator John Kerry.. Karma comin' back to bite 'er in the arse, is it?

Rec'd~

[Joe the Revelator]

35. Hillary needs to stop whining and start answering questions clearly....

I've never seen such a whiney candidate. This is politics and she knows it, and she needs to stop playing dumb.

[Cha]

39. But, look how far playing

dumb has gotten her so far.

[Carrieyazel]

44. I don't believe that for a second. This lame debate showing by Hillary has stunned them.

[Carrieyazel]

49. They've panicked over at Hillaryland. Must be trying to stop the bleeding.

The aftermath of that debate has been killing them. They must be totally stunned at the reaction. Except from the lamest of mainstream media whores, the reviews have been deadly. Pandering, waffling, will not answer the questions. Attacked and scored upon by Edwards and Dodd.

[liskddksil]

55. If Senator Clinton thinks this is bad

There is no way she will be able to handle eight months of Republican attacks.

[LittleClarkie]

68. Wah, they're picking on me! No fair!

But look how strong I am to stand up to them.

It's called having a debate, dear.


And hypocrite indeed. She didn't defend Kerry. She called his comment inappropriate when she knew what he meant. She didn't rag on him a whole lot, but she didn't come down on his side either.

Butch up, tootz.