Dueling quotes... (cue up "dueling banjos" for about 5 seconds...)

[wyldwolf]

"I trusted Bush on Iraq." That, alone, should be enough to disqualify her (Hillary). "Good judgement" is a must-have trait for our next president. --- Markos from DailyKos, during last night's debate coverage, in reference to Clinton saying she trusted the president back in 2003.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/6/3/192532/9950

"Oh, well, I tend to believe the president." --- Howard Dean, speaking about Iraq on Meet the Press, June 22, 2003.

http://www.onlisareinsradar.com/archives/howard_dean_for_president_in_2004/

[Cameron27]

1. Here's one more:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3299583&mesg_id=3300688

Glass houses.

[wyldwolf]

2. lol!

[dionysus]

3. didn't realize Dean was running this year.

[Capn Sunshine]

4. or that he said he believed the president in the run up to WAR.

:nuke:

[wyldwolf]

6. in 2003: "I believe the president." Dean; "I trusted the president." Clinton

:nuke:

[question everything]

19. I think that what she meant was trusting the agencies

that normally would be apolitical - the CIA, National Security, etc.

Whoever would have thought that on such an important issue the administration would fabricate date, like the Niger "yellow cake?"

[wyldwolf]

5. oh, so it wouldn't have disqualified him back in 2003 when KOS and the rest...

...of the netroots just KNEW Bush was lying and why didn't Hillary know?

:rofl:

[dionysus]

7. because Dean said it in 2003 and was wrong then,

that doesn't mean Hillary saying it now is somehow justified.

[durtee librul]

9. First of all , look how far we have come

since 2003 and that little fact alone should close any and all discussion about Hillary's remark that she trusts (or whatever she said) Bush.

To say anything at all that smacks of sympathy or agreement with Bush just sits sideways with me.......again, my gut is telling me she ain't the one....at least not yet in my opinion.

[wyldwolf]

11. no, but it does point out the hypocrisy of those who call Clinton down for it...

...but didn't call Dean down for it (like Markos)

[Egnever]

13. Thats quite a stretch

lets get the transcripts of both before we make that leap. If i remeber correctly dean was defending a statement he had made a few days earlier saying he thought there might be weapons of mass destruction immediately following the UN presentation. Something he said only once.

Hillary on the other hand has repeated hers time and again to this very day,

Not the best day for dean to be sure but certainly no absolution for hillary.

[wyldwolf]

14. that's always the retort.

[Egnever]

15. truth hurts?

Oh, well, I tend to believe the president. I think most Americans tends to believe the president. It turns out that what the president was saying and what his administration's saying wasn't so.



The full quote also helps.

[wyldwolf]

16. spin is entertaining

[Egnever]

20. agreed

hope you had a good time :silly:

[wyldwolf]

24. I did have a good time watching you.

[Egnever]

28. And I you

See ya next time

[wyldwolf]

29. says the spin meister!

[Egnever]

30. To the spin doctor

this is great fun :)

[wyldwolf]

31. is it "next time" already? So I guess you'll even spin what "next time" means.

[Egnever]

34. Would you promise to cherry pick my quotes if I did?

[wyldwolf]

35. I quoted you directly. Oh, is it "next time" now?

[dionysus]

36. there's several key differences, that you will no doubt label 'spin'

First of all, the Dean quote is from 2003, before our premise that bush led us into war based on complete bullshit was proven. That doesn't excuse the fact that Dean said it. It doesn't excuse anyone that said it. It was obvious to anyone paying attention that this war was based on a pack of lies. Unfortunately, it seems that Dems voted along with it to not appear "weak on terra".

If you ask Dean, Edwards, Kerry, ect. today, they will acknowledge that yes, it was a mistake to trust the president. That the vote was wrong.

Hillary, stubbornly clings to that vote, yet gives lip service to ending the war, so what?

Did YOU believe bush in the run-up to the war?

[Forkboy]

8. Must .... deflect ... criticism ... any.. way .. possible...

You do realize that what Dean says does nothing to change what Hillary said,and that of the two she is the only one running,right?

Seriously,is this the best defense you have for Hillary,comparing her quotes to someone not even in the race? Are you that desperate that you have to spin this is such a Fox News worthy way?

"You're grasping at straws Reiger!"

[Cameron27]

10. This isn't to defend Clinton

but she's not the only one who's said this...

From NBC's Chuck Todd:

"Edwards told The Des Moines Register on Dec. 20, 2003: "Yes, we're safer. We're not as safe as we need to be."

A rival campaign believes this contradicts what Edwards implied tonight regarding whether we are safer now than on 9/11.

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/06/03/21223...

It's about someone arrogantly pointing fingers when he should address his own statements instead.

edited to add that Markos should think about this too.

[Forkboy]

12. Then the OP should have used EDWARD'S words if that's what he meant.

He didn't because he was desperate to deflect the criticism of Hillary.If he wanted to compare Edwards to Hillary why quote Dean?

At least you have brought someone actually running into the equation,and you have a valid point.

The OP didn't.

[wyldwolf]

17. LOL!

I meant what I wrote. Some in the netroots, led by KOS, are complete hypocrites. They'll condemn one person but excuse or spin the next for the same thing.

Why would I be desperate to deflect criticism of Hillary. Outside the netroots, she's the Dem front runner and has won both debates. The futile parsing of her every word is what is desperate.

[Forkboy]

18. Not even a good backpeddle

[wyldwolf]

21. no wonder, since there was no attempt at one.

News Headlines around the Country: Clinton is still frontrunner, wins second debate
DU, Netroots: But.. but.. she's evil... here .. look what she said!

[Forkboy]

23. Yet,she still said those words.

I think she did well in the debate too.So what?

I also don't read KOS or the other "netroots".So I go on the candidate's words themselves,not someone's else's interpretation of them.Shocking,I know.

And those were her words.If you'd rather we discuss Dean's,KOS',or Edwards' words than by all means do so.Still doesn't change a damn thing that came out of Hillary's own mouth.

Why don't you address HER words,either in some kind of rational defense,or to even *GASP* disagree with her statement,instead of trying to deflect it onto others? If the others are being hypocritical we can call them on that (and I'm all to glad to do so)...but once again IT DOES NOT CHANGE WHAT HILLARY HERSELF SAID.

[wyldwolf]

25. ...and so did he.

[Forkboy]

32. Again...we get that wolf.

:eyes:

[wyldwolf]

33. which was always the point of the OP. Not what YOU believe but...

...what the opinion makers on the net believe.

[madfloridian]

22. Dueling words...next co-inhabitant of the WH was not against the war.

Yet that seems to bother no one here.

Bill Clinton once said about Iraq: "I want it to have been worth it."
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1220

"Former President Clinton has revealed that he continues to support President Bush's decision to go to war in Iraq but chastised the administration over the abuses at Abu Ghraib prison.

"I have repeatedly defended President Bush against the left on Iraq, even though I think he should have waited until the U.N. inspections were over," Clinton said in a Time magazine interview that will hit newsstands Monday, a day before the publication of his book "My Life."

Clinton, who was interviewed Thursday, said he did not believe that Bush went to war in Iraq over oil or for imperialist reasons but out of a genuine belief that large quantities of weapons of mass destruction remained unaccounted for.

...."I want it to have been worth it, even though I didn't agree with the timing of the attack," Clinton said"

There are many dueling words.

[wyldwolf]

26. yeah, I want it to have been worth it, too. But it wasn't. Where's the duel quote in your post??

[Cameron27]

27. His statement has to be read with the previous

paragraphs:

"That's why I supported the Iraq thing. There was a lot of stuff unaccounted for," Clinton said in reference to Iraq and the fact that U.N. weapons inspectors left the country in 1998.

"So I thought the president had an absolute responsibility to go to the U.N. and say, 'Look, guys, after 9/11, you have got to demand that Saddam Hussein lets us finish the inspection process.' You couldn't responsibly ignore a tyrant had these stocks," Clinton said.

Pressed on whether the Iraq war was worth the cost to the United States, Clinton said he would not have undertaken the war until after U.N. chief weapons inspector Hans Blix "finished his job."

Weapons inspectors led by Blix scoured Iraq for three and a half months before the U.S.-led invasion in March 2003 but left after President Bush issued an ultimatum to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein to leave the country.

"I want it to have been worth it, even though I didn't agree with the timing of the attack," Clinton said.

He did not say that he approved of the Bush War, just that he hoped it to have been worth it.

from the link in your journal:

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/06/19/clinton.iraq/