(via Salon) Teammates: Allen used "N-word" in college (updated)

[iconoclastic cat]

Quick! Look surprised!

Teammates: Allen used "N-word" in college

Sept. 24, 2006 | WASHINGTON -- Three former college football teammates of Sen. George Allen say that the Virginia Republican repeatedly used an inflammatory racial epithet and demonstrated racist attitudes toward blacks during the early 1970s.

"Allen said he came to Virginia because he wanted to play football in a place where 'blacks knew their place,'" said Dr. Ken Shelton, a white radiologist in North Carolina who played tight end for the University of Virginia football team when Allen was quarterback. "He used the N-word on a regular basis back then."

A second white teammate, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he feared retribution from the Allen campaign, separately claimed that Allen used the word "nigger" to describe blacks. "It was so common with George when he was among his white friends. This is the terminology he used," the teammate said.

A third white teammate contacted separately, who also spoke on condition of anonymity out of fear of being attacked by the Virginia senator, said he too remembers Allen using the word "nigger," though he said he could not recall a specific conversation in which Allen used the term. "My impression of him was that he was a racist," the third teammate said.

Edited to add:

By the way, Mike Stark asked Allen to his face if he used the n-word:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=1983599

At about this time, the picture taking was breaking up as the Senator explained that he had something to do. I walked up to him and said, "If you don't mind Senator, I'll walk with you. You know, you gave a great speech, but given the events in the news, some people back at the law school, I'm sure would like to know the answers to some different questions. Have you ever used the word `nigger'?"

[Redstone]

1. I retract my prior post.

Redstone

[iconoclastic cat]

3. Uh, I asked what it meant when I was 9 and never said it again.

I think I was lectured for a week straight.

[Redstone]

8. And I do NOT, ever, tolerate any racist remarks by my kids.

It's kinda hard for them to say anything racist without insulting their parents, after all, given that I'm half Indian and Mrs R is half African.

But come on, for Christ's sake. So the guy called someone a nigger thirty years ago! I'll bet you that Bill Clinton did that thirty years ago, too.

Redstone

[iconoclastic cat]

11. Redstone, I like you just fine, but please read the article. nt

[Redstone]

14. OK, I just did. And I edited my post (reply #1) to reflect having done so.

Believe it or not, I actually appreciate when somebody proves that I'm wrong, because I don't like being wrong.

Redstone

[iconoclastic cat]

23. Ah, you just have quick draw, that's all.

You're a credit to our organization.

[Redstone]

30. I do tend to reply without following links. So many links lead to

pages that require a subscription, allowing cookies, or aren't readable at all on a Mac running System 9...so at least I do have some reason for doing that.

Redstone

[iconoclastic cat]

31. And porn! Don't forget the porn. nt

[Redstone]

34. That, I rarely get. Because DU is the only online community I belong to,

(Except for CAUSS), I'm pretty safe.

You're going to ask who CAUSS is. I'm their Northeast Regional Director, and we're the reason you don't see those "Work From Home" signs on the telephone poles in your town anymore. http://www.causs.org

Redstone

[ruggerson]

41. You're rarely wrong

you just mistype. :)

[Pirate Smile]

18. A lot of people have never used that type of language including

myself and I'm a 37 year old white chick. That language has always meant someone was racist as far as the way I was raised in the mid-west.

Not cool. Never cool.

The only person who used that kind of language was my Grandfather who we considered racist but blew it off as "he's old". Yet he supported Jesse Jackson when he ran. :shrug:

How old is Allen? I bet he is younger then my parents - 62. They never spoke like that. He should have known better. He is a bigot and from the article it wasn't just the "n" word, it was also the negative intent he put behind it.

[Hosnon]

2. Ouch...pretty damning if true...so long as he used it systemically. I

don't think someone should be held to account for things that occurred at a young age unless strongly indicative of a foundational characteristic.

[iconoclastic cat]

5. I recommend reading the whole article and then posting a comment.

Let me know what you think.

[Hosnon]

7. If that's what you recommend, post the whole article. And regardless, I

stand by my post. It appears to be more systemic.

[iconoclastic cat]

9. Posting the whole article is against DU rules. nt

[Hosnon]

12. Ah - was unaware of that. But still...read the article and I still stand

by my post: It's damning as it appears to be systemic.

[Imagevision]

59. K&R!!

[Downtown Hound]

4. Going after somebody because of things they said more than 30 years ago

seems pretty petty to me. I myself said more than a few things I regret when I was in high school. There's plenty of material to attack Republicans with for what they do now. Not what they did when they were young men.

[iconoclastic cat]

6. Wow, there are a lot of speed readers in here.

That whole article took me longer to read than three minutes. But then, I read for pleasure, so I never learned speed reading techniques.

[Downtown Hound]

20. I've now read the whole article

It doesn't really change anything. So a Republican is racist? Half of the Republican Party are racist, homophbic, sleazeball war criminals. This isn't really news. Sorry if I seem like I'm attacking you, the article you posed is rather eye opening and does indicate that his attitudes were much more than those of an ignorant young man that didn't know any better. But all he has to do is deny the charges or say that he made bad choices in his youth, and he will not lose a single vote as a result. That's why I think focusing on this kind of thing isn't going to do any good.
But nevertheless, I'm glad you posted it because it never hurts to have that little bit of information to remind us just who we're dealing with. Thanks for posting.

[rzemanfl]

22. It is not about what he said thirty years ago. It is about the lies

he told about his "tolerance," etc. on Wolfie LAST WEEK!

[iconoclastic cat]

24. Nice catch. Could you post a link/excerpt? That would be cool. nt

[rzemanfl]

28. Sorry, I can't , maybe someone else can. It was in the "I

promised my mother I wouldn't tell anyone she was Jewish" interview with Blitzer.

[sandnsea]

35. When did he say macaca?

It's a pattern, not a one-time misstep over a "made up" word. And contrary to the Republican smears, this really happened.

[NMDemDist2]

42. it wouldn't be an issue without the "macaca" incident. he didn't change

the behavior, just the term it appears

[phillysuse]

10. Words Felix used in college

You mean he didn't call them "macacca"?

And I can't help but wonder what he called Jews. Probably not Mom!

[mrreowwr_kittty]

13. Regularly?

Big difference between a rare utterance and frequently using a particular pejorative as he is described. Recently he uses a racist epithet in public. Is known for having a noose on display in his office, again not too long ago.

That leopard hasn't changed his spots.

[tularetom]

15. I think I have a perspective on this - my son-in-law (ex-cop)

doesn't have a racist bone in his body. I knew his parents before they died and they were pretty strict about that sort of thing and would have whupped him good if he uttered the n-word in their presence. But you ought to hear him when he gets around his cop buddies. N-word this and n-word that. I think he thinks it makes him sound macho but to me it makes hin sounds like an asshole and I've shut him up more than once by referring to his dad. I'm not sure Felix Macaca learned bigotry from his parents (especially from his mom) but when he moved to VA he thought he had to out-bigot the locals to build his credibility with them, not realizing that most of them were probably beyond that.

[iconoclastic cat]

19. Even more of a reason to sink his career.

And let us know if your son-in-law runs for office (like sheriff), please.

[tularetom]

33. Sorry I gave you the wrong impression - I'm not excusing it

In fact it makes Macaca seem somehow even more lacking in character that he thought he had to suck up to people he perceived to be bigots. I hope it does sink his career and as far as my s-i-l is concerned while he's a hard worker and a good guy to go fishing with he'll never be invited to a Mensa meeting and it's easy to back him down in any argument so believe me he'll never run for office and if he did I'd support his opponent.

[sandnsea]

36. Except he used it in so cal high school too

There's a DUer who went to high school with him in California, he was a racist there too. Confederate Flag and all. As someone who went to high school in CA in the 70's, in Fresno no less, NOBODY waved a Confederate Flag, it would have been weird. He's a pure racist and he hasn't changed a bit.

[tularetom]

38. I went to HS in the biggest hick town in CA in the 50's and never saw one

confederate flag. We thought Fresno was the big city full of sophisticated people.

[sandnsea]

39. lololol

I went to school in Fresno, then moved to Sanger for high school until I moved to Oregon. I also had friends in Clovis and Auberry, and my uncle lived up in Mt Shasta. San Francisco was always the sophisticated city to us shmoes in Fresno. But yeah, no matter where I went in that state, never saw a confederate flag in my life.

[NMDemDist2]

43. I went to High School in Elk Grove (between Sacto and Lodi) and

saw plenty of confederate flags in the 60s and 70s

[sandnsea]

46. Well if you say so

But we drove 99 between Fresno & Shasta several times a year between 1962 and 1973 and I never saw it. I moved back to Atwater in '76 and lived there until 1980 and never saw it there either. I lived in Montana from 1980 to 1996, and only saw one there and that was on some guy's property who had come up from the south. So I guess I just didn't experience what you did.

[NMDemDist2]

47. there weren't a lot of them, but I saw em

usually on the rancher's kids trucks

[tularetom]

44. Corcoran here - now famous as the home of Charlie Manson

but then known as bumfuck nowhere.

[sandnsea]

45. Oh man

that really is in the middle of nowhere. My dad drove a tow truck out of Fresno and we would ride with him when it was just a breakdown - but I don't think I've ever been to Corcoran. That really is some way way far away from everything territory. Pretty sad when the "bright lights, big city" is Fresno or Bakersfield!! :hug:

[lynne]

16. So - which is it? Are 30 year old sentiments in play or not?

If we're willing to ignore Webb's written comments about women from the 1970's it would seem to me that we would also have to ignore Allen's verbal comments from the 1970's.

We can call one a racist and the other sexist OR we can call it a draw and hope that they've both gained some wisdom in the interim.

[iconoclastic cat]

21. Very interesting question.

To be fair, of course, isn't anything in play these days? One of the Democratic party's problems is that that we often forget with whom we're dealing.

[rzemanfl]

25. Not when Allen was on TV last week speaking about what a

"tolerant" person he was raised to be. It's the LIES!

[sandnsea]

37. Webb apologized

Webb said he wishes he had never written them and has grown as a person since then. Allen just used macaca to insult a minority a few weeks ago.

I can't believe you can't see the difference. And I don't even like Webb.

[union_maid]

40. I don't think it's quite the same

I didn't need anyone to tell me that racism was wrong, even as a child. You could figure that out, just by knowing human beings of different races. Or using logic. The women's issues were more complicated. Not all women welcomed liberation at first. A lot of men who've gotten with the program were still behind the curve in 1970. Thinking that women and men should fill different roles because that's what you've seen all your life and it's hard to get your mind around thinking differently isn't really the same thing as thinking one racial group is superior to others.

[Hosnon]

17. Perhaps you should post a different part. The section you have posted

does not suggest it was habitual (hence the responses you are getting).

He seems to have been a racist...express that in the portion of the article you post.

[Ashy Larry]

26. Most disturbing paragraph:

Shelton said he also remembers a disturbing deer hunting trip with Allen on land that was owned by the family of Billy Lanahan, a wide receiver on the team. After they had killed a deer, Shelton said he remembers Allen asking Lanahan where the local black residents lived. Shelton said Allen then drove the three of them to that neighborhood with the severed head of the deer. "He proceeded to take the doe's head and stuff it into a mailbox," Shelton said.

Wouldn't this be considered a hate crime?

[TankLV]

27. Wow - I'm surprised at all the apologists here.

Save it for the repuke party - they're experienced experts at it - we don't have to help them, even if it was warranted, which it is certainly NOT.

It was wrong THEN - it backs up his vocabulary NOW.

It is very PERTINENT.

And as for Web - this conversation isn't about Web - it's about the RACIST repuke pig Allen...

[Pirate Smile]

32. Me too.

[Singular73]

50. Bush wants to institutionalize torture, attack Iran, and steal elections

BUT GOD FORBID WE ACTUALLY USE SOMETHING ALLEN said 30 years ago.

Gosh golly Tuna fish Oh No! Who might we offend! Oh golly, nevermind.

[Old and In the Way]

29. Is the the same George Felix Allen that kept a lynching noose in his

office? No surprise. He's got a documented history of being a racist...he may have cleaned up his act, but that's only for show. A guy like this just doesn't lose his stripes, he merely hides them.

[Singular73]

48. This thread is the reason that democrats will never consistantly win

Look at you people.

Reputhuglicans regularly trot out bald-faced lies against us, financed by millions of dollars, but NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO we can't actually use anything that Allan said in College...I mean, shucks, that was 20 years ago, golly gee, he may not mean it anymore, gosh golly tuna fish.

For gods sakes. I give up.

[ruggerson]

51. It's sickening isn't it?

IT frustrates me every fucking day.

We need to think like strategists and play hardball and the "idealists" amongst us want to talk about issues and play nice.

Aargh.

[cherokeeprogressive]

53. What a foolish notion.

"You have a talent for leadership, Bob... The country needs young men like you in the leadership of the nation." Byrd recalls that "suddenly lights flashed in my mind! Someone important had recognized my abilities. I was only 23 or 24, and the thought of a political career had never struck me. But strike me that night, it did." <5> The KKK was seen as a stepping stone for aspiring southern politicians — one of the reasons attributed to Byrd's membership."

[sandnsea]

55. Did Byrd call someone macaca?

No. Allen did. He was a racist then and he's a racist now. And in the 70's most young people were working very hard to bring the races together, a lot harder than anyboy is now. To be a young racist in the 70's is really something extraordinary, and he has never acknowledged it or apologized for it either. As far removed from Senator Byrd as one can get on the matter.

[Imagevision]

49. aLLEN AND sANTORUM DEFINITLY MUST BE REPLACED, FOR OPENERS...

[usregimechange]

52. Kick

[LibDemAlways]

54. I don't know how anyone on DU can not be aware of it by now

since I've mentioned it here many times - long before the current election season, in fact. But, for anyone who may have missed it....

I'm the DUer who went to high school with George Allen in Palos Verdes, CA. He was well known on campus for being fond of the Confederacy (car stickers, lapel pin) and for the racist graffiti he spraypainted on the walls of the school - "Die Whitey" "Fuck whitey" - made to look like the work of kids from a predominently black rival school on the eve of a basketball playoff game. He was caught and had to publically apologize over the school PA.

Another high school classmate attended college with Allen in Virginia and remembers him commenting one day after a football loss that the black player who dropped the ball on an important play would have caught it "if it was a watermelon."

None of this would matter, of course, if Allen had cleaned up his act as an adult. But he went on to display the Confederate flag in his home, a noose in his office, and he named his only son for one of the founders of the KKK, Gen. Nathan Forrest.

This election season we've witnessed him taunting a young man with a racial slur, seen his temper flare when asked about his heritage, seen him deny, then tacitly admit to that heritage with the caveat that he still eats ham sandwiches.

It comes as no surprise to me at all that he used the "n" word in college. This is who George Allen was and is - racist to the core.

[iconoclastic cat]

56. That was you? Yeah, I've heard references to it.

Don't be surprised that people haven't, though. It would be impossible to read every post on DU.

[LibDemAlways]

58. Very true. It's just that lately, especially, I've retold the story maybe

50 times on this board. I feel like a broken record, and figured DUers were probably sick of reading it by now!!

[Hosnon]

60. Wow...first I've heard of this. How do people like him get elected in the

first place?

What an ass...

[LibDemAlways]

61. George Allen had the advantage of being the son and

namesake of former Rams/Redskins coach George Allen. He rose to prominence in Virginia on the strength of that name and by reinventing himself as a good-old-boy once he arrived in Virginia as a young adult. (He grew up in Los Angeles and, for a time, Chicago.) The media went easy on him - obviously too easy until now.

It all started to unravel when Ryan Lizza of the New Republic wrote a lengthy investigative piece about Allen back in April called "Pin Prick" exposing Allen's lifelong love affair with the Confederacy and racist leanings. It's now snowballed because of Allen's own actions. It's about time Virginia got to know the real George Allen. Until recently he was consdiered a frontrunner for the GOP nomination for Pres. in 08.

[Hosnon]

62. Hell yeah! Perhaps you can form your own little "Swiftboat" group to help

spread the word about what really happenend.

Note: I guess swiftboat is the wrong word considering you would be telling the truth...

[beaconess]

57. He says he doesn't remember ever saying it - what a nice little hedge

So that if a tape turns up of him saying it, he can claim he didn't lie - he really DIDN'T remember.

Notice he didn't deny saying it.