Bush said Hezbollah lost; I say there are no winners!!

[dajoki]

Associated Press
http://www.forbes.com/entrepreneurs/feeds/ap/2006/08/14/ap2949166.html

Bush Says Israel Defeated Hezbollah

By DEB RIECHMANN , 08.14.2006, 06:26 PM

President Bush said Monday that Israel defeated Hezbollah's guerrillas in the monthlong Mideast war and that the Islamic militants were to blame for the deaths of hundreds of Lebanese civilians.

Bush admonished Iran and Syria for backing Hezbollah, which captured two Israeli soldiers on July 12 igniting the conflict. Both sides claimed victory Monday, hours after a U.N.-brokered cease-fire took effect, while Bush said Israel prevailed.

"Hezbollah attacked Israel. Hezbollah started the crisis, and Hezbollah suffered a defeat in this crisis," the president said at the State Department after a day of meetings with his top defense, diplomatic and national security advisers.

The United States backed Israel in the war, and Bush made clear he was determined to help the Israelis in the post-fighting struggle of words about who wound up on top.

The president portrayed the war, which killed about 790 Lebanese and 155 Israelis, as part of a broader struggle between freedom and terrorism. He said one can only imagine how much more dangerous such a conflict would be if Iran possessed nuclear weapons.

Bush said Hezbollah lost, though Israel didn't knock out the guerrillas.

[Fredda Weinberg]

1. Sometimes, victory isn't necessary. You just have to

stand your ground. Both sides did ... we'll see what happens now.

[larrysh]

2. Hezbollah has clearly won. Simply because they still exist

[dajoki]

4. The death toll on both sides is tragic...

not to mention the destruction.

[Carla in Ca]

16. Amen, dajoki

But these are some of the most tragic words to come out of his mouth yet. There was no need to say any of it. This isn't a contest, it is a conflict. And one that has been going on for 40 years, not just the last 40 days. These comments are truly going to come back to bite us all.

He is truly the biggest (_?_) Dumb Ass on the planet, bar none.

[dajoki]

Oh, I agree...

the only American president in the last 40 years to be totaly disengaged from the process.

[dajoki]

18. Delete by dajoki...

Double post, SORRY!!

[brokensymmetry]

11. Exactly.

They fought the regional superpower to a standstill.

Hezbollah won bigtime.

[calimary]

30. From what I've read, this is what they believe, themselves.

That they outlasted the Israelis and won, simply because they were NOT obliterated. Conversely, I've also read accounts describing returning Israeli soldiers looking downcast, and expressing disappointment - that they indeed lost this one.

[bronxiteforever]

3. 1.5 MILLION displaced-civilians lost

Does anybody speak for civilians in war anymore? I guess * doesn't give a crap=its not his family.

[dajoki]

5. Nobody seems to...

but it is a shame that it has come to this. The US has never been so hated because of * "policies".

[Democrats_win]

6. Conservatives at least PRETENDED to care. Compassion? yeah, right.

[dajoki]

Compassionate conservatism: Biggest scam going n/t

[bluerum]

7. * says Hezzbolah lost.

Yeah! Looky the good work we done.



The froots of demockracy are ripe for plukin.

[spindrifter]

8. The biggest loser of them all has no right to declare

who won or lost in the Israel-Hizbollah dispute. *'s very comments are likely to cause us problems.

[Josh]

14. I agree -

I actually support Israel wholeheartedly in this, and I know that irks some people, but hey, we're all entitled to our opinions.

But I hate it when Bush puts himself up there with stuff like this. Doesn't he get that he just makes things worse? That he can't be taken seriously anymore? Argh, irritating.

[dajoki]

17. I do also, but...

shrub NOTHING to prevent or stop the slaughter on both sides.

[Ilsa]

9. Isn't there a saying that war is a failure of diplomacy?

Failure. Losers. All are losers, IMO. Sad business.

[dajoki]

10. My sentiments, exactly n/t

[Imagevision]

12. The lebanese peope seemed to have lost the most as the warriors

hid like cowards while slaughtering the people who couldn't leave.

[theanarch]

29. there are so many problems with your post...

...that one barely knows where to begin: first, all the destruction and death wrought on Lebanon was done by Israel (in what was, inarguably, a war of choice, not necessity), almost all of it by long-range/stand-off weapons (cruise missiles, heavy artillery, high-altitude bombers, off-shore gunships, etc); and in the course of targeting civilian infrastructure, little if any care was taken to minimize the collateral damage.

Second, the question is what Hezbollah--as the only 'military' force available to defend the people and territorial integrity of Lebanon--supposed to do? Pick the the most open ground possible, advertise their presence to the IDF and stand around with their short-range AK-47's, RPG's and light anti-armor weapons (many of them WWII surplus), waiting for the IDF tanks and attack helicopters to show up and blow them away from a safe distance? Or simply stand aside and let the IDF conquer and occupy (a la the West Bank and Gaza) as much territory as they wanted?

This isn't the 18th Century, when armies met on open fields to blast away at eachother in serialed ranks, and charged with fixed bayonettes. This isn't WWII, with equally-armed sides duking it out with air forces, tank divisions, heavy artillery, etc. This is asymetric, state v. non-state warfare: it's dirty, vicious, brutal and unfair; and the state always inflicts exponentially more civilian causalties than the non-state side (just like Vietnam and Somolia).

Israel made damn sure the people of Lebanon "lost" a war they (Lebanon) didn't start and couldn't fight; by battling the IDF to a stand-still, Hezbollah earned (yes earned) the respect and admiration, not only of the Lebanese, but of the broader Arab world as well. Whether one regards this as a good or bad thing is immaterial; the fact remains that Israel instigated an unprovoked act of aggression, committed a major war crime, and lost the war anyway.

[leesa]

13. Maybe Syria and Iran (and the world at large) because they didn't go for

the bait and attack Israel.

[Skittles]

15. someone please tell bush to shut fhe fuck up

geez what a g.d. asshole

[Javaman]

19. One piece of keen insight by that war criminal henry kissinger...

"the guerrilla wins by not losing. The army loses by not winning".

Ergo: Hizbollha won.

[LiberalEconomist]

20. True. There are no winners in war

All wars serve to do is to harm children. I have had it will assholes everywhere killing and maiming our children. Yes, our children.

[dajoki]

22. I couldn't agree more!!

[chieftain]

21. It was a tactical loss for both sides, it is a strategic defeat

for the US and Israel. A key element in our and Israel's power and influence has been the perception of invincible military forces. That perception has been shattered by the Iraq and Lebanon adventures.

[Sparkly]

24. I agree...

Another boost for Iran too, perhaps.

[primative1]

23. Mission Accomplished ...

Its always good to hear when the decider has come to a conclusion. Imagine how confused we might be if he was still pondering.

[MrCoffee]

25. That was my thought exactly...

he also said Mission Accomplished, so what the fuck does he know?

[dajoki]

27. Jeez, we wouldn't know how to think...HA, HA

[Contrary1]

26. I disagree...GW wins.

Check out the "before" and "after" shots of Beirut. Note the scale to size map of Manhattan,
gives you an idea of how much damage was done.

http://graphics.nytimes.com/packages/html/world/20060804_MIDEAST_GRAPHIC/index.html

[dajoki]

28. Ask on the Arab streets who won n/t

[LUHiWY]

31. War on terror?

If I had to guess...I'd say the war on terror has probably already been won. By our side.

But now it is being used to further and continue an economic war and a war of the "state" vs the individual.

Bush uses the word "freedom" to push indoctrination buttons and to promote his war.

What he really means by "freedom" is the freedom of the NWO process to go forward?

This process involves the diminishment of the individual in the political process and the enhancement of govt/big business in this process.

If he runs the bullpucky machine often enough....eventually he can redefine words...concepts...and reality...especially for those who get their news and world views from main stream media?

I don't. Have finally learned to get my news from a variety of sources. I do watch network news...and it is interesting and pathetic to watch the indoctrination being done.

Recently have seen stories about how nice it was for people in China to have our jobs. A story about the really happy maimed and injured people coming back from the war. ;-)

And this recent story about how Hezbollah started the war...Israel won it...and a pic showing the deserted coastline and no tourists...but no mention of the tremendous environmental damage from the oil spill.

If you control the bullpucky machine...you control the world?

[alvarezadams]

32. Nah - Hezbollah won

The stakes were as follows: the underdog merely had to survive while Israel had to destroy or at least disarm Hezbollah.

By any standard, Hezbollah won by a landslide. Not only have they survived but they have become the darling of all Lebanese groups ranging from the Christians to the Shiites to the Sunnis to the Druze... and of much of the Muslim world.