I can only think of one fix for the Israeli/Arabic situation.

[last1standing]

I would like to see Israel cede all territory gains from all wars since it's inception and go back to it's original size. Instead of turning these areas over to Hezbollah/Palestine/Lebanon/Syria or anyone else, they should become a demilitarized zone policed by the UN. Only authorized UN personnel would be allowed any type of weapons in these areas. Any action taken by either side against the other would be automatically met with punitive action from UN forces only. It's time we finally give up the notion that Israel and its neighbors are going to live peacefully together for some years to come. By stationing a permanent UN force we create a buffer between them all. Of course by having a multinational force on the ground, any attack would likely be seen as an offense to several other, larger, nations.

At the same time well publicized mediation should take place under the auspices of the UN. While these probably wouldn't amount to any real solutions those in talks generally don't attack.

I'm sure many will find this answer simplistic or unworkable so if anyone has another solution I'd love to hear it.

[Taverner]

1. What about people (Israeli or Palastinian) who have homes there?

[last1standing]

4. They would still be able to live there.

They just couldn't have any weapons.

[Taverner]

7. Are they Palastinian Citizens or Israeli Citizens?

When the leave the country will they need an Israeli Passport or Palastinian one?

I understand where you're going here, but in essence you'd have a third country now.

Having said that, it's not like I've got a better idea...

[last1standing]

8. I'd call it a UN protectorate.

That way none of the parties can complain about favortism.

[Behind the Aegis]

2. That's not even remotely workable!

Besides, why should the Palesitian homeland be run by the UN?!

[last1standing]

5. I don't think it will happen but I do think it's workable.

As for the Palestinian homeland being run by the UN, I consider that a better option than having it run by Israel. It may not be 100% fair, but unless you can come up with a better solution, I'm going to say it's the fairest possible.

But please feel free to change my plan in any way and repost it here. I'm very willing to go with better answers.

[Smarmie Doofus]

3. Limited right of return combined with massive $$$$....

reparations/compensations for those displaced Palestinians willing to accept that.

[last1standing]

6. I'd definitely support right of return.

I can't make any judgment on the compensation as I don't know what they have been denied.

[Lefty48197]

9. Nuclear annihilation?

.

[last1standing]

10. I'm looking for a solution, but not the final one.

n/t

[Ian David]

11. UnitedNationStan? n/t

[soothsayer]

12. US should take over the whole ME, make it part of the US, then

let anyone and everyone live there, neighborly like.

[Historic NY]

13. Excuse me but land for peace obviously isn't working because

the Palestinians and the rest of the Arab world will not accept it. Israel has give up land foolishly and has got nothing in return for it. The only solution for them is not to have a state of Israel. They are now having to go back to take ground already won to protect themselves.

Name one country in the Arab world is publicly coming to the aid of Israel. Egypt has remains silent.

[last1standing]

14. I'm not looking to debate who's right or wrong.

Everyone has a different take on that. I'm talking about how we can stop or at least alleviate the fighting there. If you have a theory on what could work that's great and I'd love to hear it. Also, I'm not talking about Isreal giving up any land that was ceded to them in 1948.

[dorktv]

17. Actually land for peace would have worked had the US kept at it.

yes the second infatida did start because of Yasser Arafat but there also was an almost total cessation of US involvment in the peace process the day that Clinton left office. How can we claim it did not work when no one kept working on it?

Bush and Co just do not care at all about anything in the Middle East. If they did, someone who is an expert on the region would be Sec. of State rather then the Cold War Russian expert we have now.

[WestSeattle2]

15. This will never be solved...

at the root of all the foolishness, this is really a fight over whose God is the "right", or "real" one. The Koran tells Muslims that the Holy Land "will be returned to them" even if they lose it for a number of years, and Jews\Christians believe their God promises the land to the Jews.

Rational people cannot fathom dying for a pile of sand, or worse, losing a child to such nonsense. However, the idiots who believe everything they read, and take every word ever printed as "gospel truth", construe who controls the pile of sand to proving whose God is the "real", or "right" one. "My God is better than your God". This is the central issue, cloaked in other words and deeds. Whose "Bible" is right, and by extension then, whose God is real.

What torques me, is that the insane asylum is dragging rational, intelligent folks into their asinine squabble, and they're murdering innocents.

Atheists rock. They don't kill as many innocents.

:popcorn:

[Egalitariat]

16. Does the UN have forces capable of "punitive action"?***

nm

[last1standing]

20. They have guns and tanks.

They are capable of punitive action.

[question everything]

18. The history of the UN in that region

After the 1957 "Suez Campaign" Israel withdrew to its borders and UN troops were placed between it and Egypt.

In 1967 Egypt told the UN to leave and they left.

About the UN troops between Israel and Lebanon, from Lou Dobbs early this evening

DOBBS: The idea that the United Nations -- in your book, "Inside the Asylum," you have a picture showing side by side Hezbollah flag with that of the United Nations. You make it very clear that you think that there is far too close a relationship between Hezbollah and the United Nations. Is that correct?

BABBIN: Oh, absolutely. And if you look over history and you talk to the people who have been serving on that border on the Israeli side and you talk to the American observers who have been there, you see that not only has the U.N. effectively welcomed Hezbollah into their positions, they have used the same telephones, the same water. I mean, Lou, these guys are sitting there playing cribbage with terrorists for the past 20 years. How can anybody trust them to do anything different?

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0608/01/ldt.01.html

[last1standing]

19. You're not even trying to talk about the post I made.

You're just throwing out transcripts that mean nothing. Why don't you tell me what you'd like to see happen in the region instead of just compounding the problem with complaints?

[question everything]

26. Not the UN

Back in 1949 the war between Israel and its neighbors ended in cease fire, to determine the final borders in future negotiations.

Jordan and Egypt since signed peace treaties. Syria and Lebanon did not.

There was never a dispute about the border between Israel and Lebanon, but as long as terrorist groups - the PLO in the 70s and Heabollah in the 00's - take over part of a sovereign country to shell Israel, Israel will defend itself.

First, the Arab nations in the region have to realize that supporting terrorist groups does not buy them any peace. That exiling its home-born terrorist like Bin Laden, for example, will not protect Saudi Arabia.

European countries have to realize that, as much as they are dependant on Arab oil, as much as they want to pacify their own growing populations of Muslims, and therefore condemn Israel, will not protect them from riots - as France saw last year.

The whole world - with the exception of Iran, Russia and China, I suppose - has to realize that these jiahdists are a threat to everyone. They do not want Israel to withdraw to some borders. They want to eliminate Israel altogether and to bring back the glory of Islam dating back to the first Millennium (and, of course, to keep women in burkas and to be a fair game for rape to punsih... a male member of the family).

This is not an Israeli-Palestinian problem; this is not a Jewish-Muslim problem; this is not even the US invasion of Iraq problem.

This is a question of securing all the nations of the region and of the world to live in peace as they wish and to commit to eradicate terror group with as much force as necessary.

Back in 1970 Jordan went after the PLO with so much force and exiled them, that the group that later massacred the Israeli athlete at the Munich Olympics called itself Black September after those events. But once the PLO was kicked out of Jordan, it went to Beirut and started there a civil war that lasted 20 years, that brought both Israel and Syria into it (but only Israel was condemned by the world, even though Syria went in to claim Lebanon as it southern province, while Israel went there to stop the shelling.)

It is too complex problem that cannot be solved by Israel simply withdrawing to... where, exactly? The Nazi concentration camps? Again, Hezbollah and Hamas do not want Israel to withdraw to any borders; they want its annihilation. They say do, publicly.

You also have to remember that, following WWI, when Britain and France got a mandate for that part of the word that used to be part of the Ottoman Empire, that they drew borders artificially - look at Iraq where Churchill decided to put three antagonistic tribes together, and to prevent an Iraqi access to the Persian Gulf, tore the oil rich province of Kuwait to be an independent state (this is why Saddam was not that crazy when he invaded Kuwait in 1990).

Whatever the steps may be - the UN is the most impotent, biased group to have any say in that region.

Oh, one more point. Many who join terrorist groups do so because they have no alternatives. These are rich countries who do not care about the poor groups. The governments do not offer decent homes and education and medical care and jobs. This is a vacuum that extreme groups take advantage of.

[last1standing]

27. So all the countries in the world but Israel are wrong and biased.

And you don't have any trouble spewing that BS? I've tried to discuss this reasonably with you in other threads but you just can't see past your own ideal of Israel being some sort of Grand State that has never made a mistake or bad judgment. Yet all the other countries on this planet are biased and racist because they don't always support Israel's ever-increasing vindictiveness.

You just posted this:

It is too complex problem that cannot be solved by Israel simply withdrawing to... where, exactly? The Nazi concentration camps?

That is exactly the kind of asinine remark that tells me you have no real solution other than to call me and anyone else who doesn't support mass killings a nazi. Of course you have no problem with Israel killing ten or a hundred Arabs for every Israeli but that couldn't be racism. That's just Israel defending itself against all those nasty Muslims, right?

If you had posted something less hatefilled and more truthful, I would have gone into why I feel the UN is the best solution to this problem. But you don't want to hear that. Your only goal is to act as a propaganda outlet for Israel. You can peddle that bullshit elsewhere.

[question everything]

30. Boy, do you have a problem

I am asking whether the Israelis should withdraw to the Concentration Camp and you read it as I call you a Nazi? This is a simple fact that one cannot separate the establishment of the State of Israel from the Nazi Concentration Camps. A simple fact.

You may want to solve your own problems before you are trying to solve problems in the world of which you obviously cannot even start to comprehend.

I am sorry I do not remember discussing any of this with you in other threads, perhaps because your comments did not leave a lasting impression.

That you see hate in a simple summary of facts and events than this, again, is your problem.

During the 2.5 years that I have been in DU I tried not to attack people personally but to debate their posts. But when you read into what I say things that I did not.. this is something that is beyond my capacity to deal with. I am not a psychologist and am not even trying to be one.

As I am reading my post again, I find only one place where I used the word "you" and it was used a general term, not aimed at you directly. I could have used the word "one."

"You also have to remember that, following WWI, when Britain and France got a mandate for that part of the word that used to be part of the Ottoman Empire, that they drew borders artificially"

Do you find this sentence offending?

No go an look at your post with the personal attacks.

I am not going to reply anymore. You really do have a problem but, I suppose, it is easier to vent on this forum than to fight with the boss, co-worker, spouse, or kicking the dog (assuming you have any of these).

But you'd better start finding another venue for this bile, once this war is over.

[last1standing]

31. Your views really are without merit.

You call me a nazi, then accuse me of attacking you, then toss out insult after insult. You're right about one thing this conversation is over, because your opinions are baseless and your attacks, pathetic.

[fujiyama]

21. Not workable in the least

First of all, Israelis will never live under a Muslim Arab dominated government of any sort. We're talking about very different cultures here. This isn't like Switzerland for God's sake, where you have very similar cultures, with only language dividing the areas.

Second, how does the UN go about confiscating weapons from a nation state? That too, nuclear weapons?

No, the simple fact is, it's about time for people living a half century in the past to realize that it's time to move on. Israel exists and at this time it's a Jewish state (we'll see what happens in the future though as Arab-Israelis have a higher birth rate). Israel is very unlikely to accept the right of return as well. Ideally it would be a secular single state comprising of Palestinians and Israelis, but politically it would be impossible for Israel to accept it and still maintain its status as a Jewish state.

The two state solution is the best one. Restore the area to pre-'67 borders (atleast as close to it as possible). Destroy all Israeli settlements and distribute water equitably and fairly for all in the region. Israel and the US should largely be responsible for monetary compensation for those Palestinians that lost homes since their displacement.

Of course, such an agreement would ultimately require groups like Hamas and Hezbollah to stop using terrorism as a tactic, and force ultra RW zionists to give up the WB settlements...

Beyond that there would be other border negotiations between actual legitimate governing bodies of the respective states. That would also require a Lebanon that has a strong central authority and military that would control Hezbollah.

Of course, a good first step would be a ceasefire. After all, this isn't going to go anywhere if one side is bombing villages killing many civilians in the process.

[last1standing]

23. I won't pretend to have all the details worked out.

but it wouldn't be a muslim dominated government. It would be a secular government run by the UN. As for the weapons confiscation, I'll leave that in the hands of those who have done it before.

But I would like to say thanks for being one fo the few to actually respond with another idea. I may not agree with you but I appreciate the input.

[fujiyama]

25. Thanks for the comment

I like reading people's suggestions when presented in a balanced manner.

Hell, I'm not sure if I even agree with myself half the time. But sometimes it's a matter of putting forth what I believe may be a more likely solution. Ideally your situation would work...but then again, ideally this conflict wouldn't have been raging on for many years...

But I see a lot of different agendas (economic and from religious fanatics on all sides), a frustrating and incredibly violent and blood stained history, and a lot of hatred that I don't see meshing together in one country.

[Popol Vuh]

22. I say

Impose sanctions and cut ALL economic and military aid to Israel until it fully complies with all UN resolutions and announces that it recognizes the right of Palestine to exist.

And as soon as both sides respect each others' rights and knocks all this nonsense off. Then sanctions can be lifted. And aid to BOTH sides should resume.

Simplistic? Yes. But hey, when everything else won't work....

[last1standing]

24. I'm good with simplistic.

I don't really think sanctions would work in this case since the US would violate them for Israel and Iran for Hezbollah and the Palestinians, but if it could work I'd like to see it tried.

[McFink]

28. YOU ARE KIDDING...

...about the UN, correct? The anti-Semetic, dictator-infested organization whose quote Peace Keepers unquote have a history of sitting on the sidelines and watching the Rwandan genocide? (Oh, wait, that was Wes Clark and Bill Clinton...sorry. The UN was responsible for The Sudan, the DPRC, and now Somalia, and it did not 'sit on the sidelines,' instead, they were responsible for the molestation of children, forcing girls into prostitution, and selling UN relief supplies to local thugs). A competent Security Force can be amassed, unfortunately the world Governments would whine as soon as the mandate was enforced - when the Security Force engaged Hizb'allah for continuing to fire Katyusha rockets and kidnapping innocents. But who would accept the task of composing the Security Force? Not the French - too many ties with Lebanon and Syria (not too mention too many Muslims of North African extraction in the slums surrounding Paris), not the EU (which, with the exception of Britain, has the military capacity of an early 20th Century potato farm), and definetly not the US (it would look too bad on the world stage). Would you like the Russians in there? (They have problems of their own in Chechnya and the Southern provinces). What about the PRC? (They're busy in Nepal, watching (drooling over) Taiwan and, besides, they have their own Muslim fundamentalist problem in the West). Or let's leave it to to the OIC (Organization of the Islamic Conference)? Would you, like Israel has recommended, have NATO deployed as the Security Force? Then we're back to "What happens when the Security Force enforces its mandate" and engages Hisb'allah?? I vote that Israel be allowed to emulate the greatest fighting force in the world, the USMC, and go in and clean out the rats nest which has been a boil on the ass of the Middle East for at least 27 years. If you have any credible evidence that the UN is capable of fielding a a Security Force which has any possible chance of actually providing security (think UNIFIL!), please elaborate.

[last1standing]

29. Ummmm.........Yes? Or No......really I have no clue.

I have to admit that I don't have a clue as to what you were trying to say there. Maybe if you take a deep breath or two then try to type slower, it would help. Honestly all I got out of that was something about Clark and Clinton, a potato farm, the Russians, and (think UNIFIL!). I mean I'd like to elaborate, but you'll have to let me know what I should be more detailed about. I don't know that much about potato farming so if it's about that, then you might try an almanac or something.