How do we know that the Repubs aren't going to 'Win" again?

[booley]

And please be sure to notice the Quotation marks around the word Win. I know full well that the Repubs actually in many cases didn't win. But they still got to be in office. That's my point.

Every election since at least 2000 the republicans have cheated. And they have only gotten better at it each time. Electronic voting machines have 'problems" (problems that always favor the Republican). Republican State officials and Congress members work over time to make voting harder. People get thrown off the voting rolls that shouldn't have been (and OOPSY, the people being thrown off are the ones most likely to vote Democratic). And new studies come out showing that our elections are becoming ever more fraudulent.

And the democratic leadership seems for the most part to be acting as if none of this is happening. Not all the Dems do this, obviously. but enough at the top that it's really beginning to look bad.

AND now I hear about problems (AGAIN) with the Diebold voting machines in the race for Cunningham's seat. and it was really close. And somehow the Republican squeaked by despite projections.. and BOY does that sound familiar.

So how do we know that this isn't going to happen again? And again and again?! That once again people will be kept from voting, that the voting machines will have "irregularities, that the margin will be razer thin but the Republicans will "win" even though the exit polls say they should have lost by a wide margin? What's to stop that? I mean, it's not as if the Republicans have really been held accountable as a group over this. So why not do it again when cheating has worked so well for them?

I don't want to be a downer. I actually do want people to explain to me how I am dead wrong, how I have nothing to worry about. I would love to see copious links citing legislation that has passed that fixes the problems of the past. That's there's lots that is being done and going to be done to keep yet another election from being stolen. That when I put my ballot in that box, it's going to matter. I am still going to vote. But I want some reassurance that it will matter.

PLEASE tell me that when I say we could "lose" all over again like we have since 2000, that I am totally wrong and give lots of evidence showing how wrong I am. I really want to be wrong.

[OrangeCountyDemocrat]

1. I Wish To God You Were Wrong

Unfortunately, I think we're just going to spend the next 5 months getting our hopes up, only to have the football snatched away by Lucy, come the first November Tuesday.

[booley]

3. not what I was hoping to hear

:-(

[skipos]

2. We did really well in 05 (VA, NJ, CA) and we can do well in 06. nt

[booley]

5. Ok but

how similar were the elections there to say..Georgia or Texas or Ohio?

In other words, were there electronic voting machines? Now over a third of the precincts have these machines..these easily hackable machines.

I am not an expert on the elections. I wish I was. Maybe I could come up with something to make me optimistic.

That's what i want. Someone who knows a lot about the previouse electiosn who can tell me if we have a chance this time. Have the previouse problems been fixed? Is there som eother factor that will keep the republicans from being able to cheat?

Because if the Cons 'win " again when they are sooooooo despised, I will know our democracy is officially dead.

[skipos]

6. VA has plenty of Diebold

and pre-election polls didn't give Kaine a big edge. I think Rasmussen had Kaine by 2% and he won by 6%.

[booley]

7. ok, so what was different

then in say, Ohio?

Should we expect for the electiosn to be more like Virginia then Ohio or Florida?

Please don't thik I'm haranguing you. But you are the only person who so far has said there is hope.

[skipos]

10. Some states have shitbags running them, some don't

All we can do is support or dem candidates with as much of our time and money as possible, support anything and anyone that is going to make voting as secure as possible, and don't give up. I don't claim to have the answers our problems, but I can tell you that giving up is worst thing we can do.

And as far as Ohio goes, if Strickland continues to maintain his LARGE margin over Blackwell up until the day of the election and then *poof* Blackwell somehow manages to win, I think there will be riots in the streets, or something close to that.

The problem with Kerry is that the pre-election polls didn't favor him. If you average all of the major pre-election polls the day before the election, they pointed towards a slight Bush win. In fact, Fox News was one of the few polls predicting a Kerry win. If Kerry had big leads in all the pre-election polls and big leads in the exit polls, I think America wouldn't have been so complacent. Strickland has a big lead right now.

[Lib Grrrrl]

14. Well, If We Manage To Get Rid Of Santorectum Here In Pennsylvania

I might have some confidence restored re: voting machines.
Because Bob Casey Jr has a sixteen-point edge on Rick The Prick.

[skipos]

15. Santorum is gone for sure. nt

[booley]

16. I am not suggesting giving up

And while I disagree that kerry wasn't favored in the polls, I can see your point that if Blackwell suddenly wins when he's so far behind it will look bad.

However, when Shrub won when kerry was favored in the exit polling, it became a Con mantra that "values voters" suddenly wen to the polls and tipped the balence. I mean, that too was highly suspicous. It should have cuase 'riots" (peaceful riots) in the streets. But it didn't. The media bought it and sold it to us in turn.

[skipos]

18. Check out these pre-election polls

Most of them didn't favor Kerry.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/bush_vs_kerry.html

[Lib Grrrrl]

4. I Wish To God You Were Wrong, But...

unfortunately, I share your disillusionment.

Please, someone help BOTH of us. I think it's gonna keep happening, too.

Great metaphor, incidentally, because that is exactly what this is like...fucking Lucy VanPelt pulling the fucking football at the last second.

[WestSeattle2]

8. Well I don't know about anyone else....

but if the Democratic leadership in this country cannot take back at LEAST the House in November, it's time for new leadership.

For crying out loud, the r's are practically screaming "take control from us PLEASE", while trying to thrust their leadership roles into the laps of Democrats. They've been busted lying, cheating, and stealing.

Their positives are in the tank, and their negatives are pushing into the stratosphere. If we can't win control under these circumstances, it speaks volumes about the Democratic Party leadership, starting at the top.

I've budgeted $3,500 for this election cycle, for donations to federal, state and local Dems, a few out of state Dem's, the national party coffers, and of course my favorite issue-based organizations.

You better believe that if we don't win back the House, I'm not donating another penny to the national party until the entire leadership is ousted. We've been taking shit for the last 6 years- I'm pissed, and I refuse to lose anymore.

We need people at the top who know how to win, period. This November will tell the tale. No more bullshit, no more "but we tried", no more "wait until next cycle", no more "but we came close". No! No more fucking waiting. It's already late in the 4th quarter and we're down by 14. Pull your fucking heads out.

I'll be hosting fundraisers, making phone calls, and writing checks. They better do their goddamn jobs. :mad:

[Lib Grrrrl]

9. Shit, I Wish I HAD $3500 To Budget!!

Likely, $3,500 is going to be approximately my entire income this year!

thanks for the GREAT economy, Boooosh, you fucking asswipe!

[WestSeattle2]

11. I don't have a car payment, so that money goes into

political activities........At least in my state, (Washington), we actually see Democrats elected, so I do see some return on my investment. Nationally, the lack of direction and leadership really has me frustrated, though Emmanuel appears to have what it takes.

[Lib Grrrrl]

13. I Don't Have One, Either

I own my 10 year old car outright. If not for that, it woulda gotten re-po'ed a long time ago. I haven't been able to afford car payments in quite some time now, thank you, George W Asswipe Boooosh!

[Awsi Dooger]

12. They didn't win in 2005

I'm referring specifically to the Virginia governor race and New Jersey governor race. We bettered the pre-election poll numbers in both states. The Diebold crew basically had to shut up, for a few days anyway, after the Virginia outcome.

2006 will be more similar to 2005 in terms of public opinion than 2004 or 2002.

We'll win big in governorships, moderate to large in the House, and break even to a pickup of a few seats in the senate. Only the senate playing field keeps our numbers down. The conventional wisdom post-2004 was the GOP was on offense in the 2006 senate, considering the number of defended seats and where the competitive seats would be. So any Democratic senate gains should be looked at in that regard, not in terms of failing to regain control.

[booley]

17. thanks

That doe sgive me more hope.

And at no time was I ever suggesting that we give up or not vote. I am going to vote.

It' s just that I recal how TWICE I went to bed thinkign that the Dem for President had won and twice it suddenly turned aroudn out of the Blue. and while I have no doubt public opinion hasn't gotten worse for Republicans, they also have so much to lose as a party. and that includes Shrub.