For Californians only: Phil or Steve?

[Clarkie1]

I'm trying to decide who to support in the California primary. About a year a go, I donated to Phil Angelides just because I wanted to get something moving against Arnie. Now, I'm not so sure. I honestly don't know much about either candidate beyond the basics. I know All about Phil's endorsements, but that's not what I base my decisions on.

If you do vote in this poll, please let me know why you voted for the candidate of your choice. Thanks!

[Greeby]

1. Well, Phil did give us Schwarzenegger Street

http://www.arnoldsneighborhood.com/index.html

;)

[Clarkie1]

3. LOL. I guess that's where my contribution went. n/t

[bliss_eternal]

5. LMAO! OMG--LOL!

That was the funniest thing EVER! Thanks for the link, I bookmarked it so I can show my dh tomorrow.

:rofl:

[tandot]

11. This is f*cking hilarious. I emailed it to my friends. Thanks! nt

[David Zephyr]

2. I'm with Steve.

I like Phil. It's his turn, but it's not his time.

Steve can beat the fire out of Arnold and humiliate him at the polls.

[Clarkie1]

4. Tell me why he would best be able to do that. n/t

[slackmaster]

6. Don't Blame Me, I Voted For Kodos

:nuke:

[skipos]

7. Who has the best chance of defeating Arnie?

Rasmussen has each of them with 45% to Arnie's 44%. For how low his approval ratings are, I would have expected dems to do better in polls.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/2006/State%20Polls/March%202006/California%20Governor%20March.htm

[Clarkie1]

8. That's what I want to know. n/t

[slackmaster]

10. Arnold will spend more money, and come up with an October Surprise

Nobody will be able to defeat the Governator.

:argh:

[skipos]

13. I am more optimistic than you. Arnie's approval is at 36%

http://www.surveyusa.com/50State2006/50StateGovernor060321Approval.htm

Yes it is hard to beat an incumbent, but I think it is possible. I would guess that many people don't even know these dems yet.

[Webster Green]

15. I don't know about that.....he's pissed a lot of people off....

I think he's going down.B-)

[tandot]

9. I am leaning toward Steve...

But if Phil has the a better chance of beating Arnold, he'll get our vote. We'll be watching the polls closely.

[roody]

12. We better watch

the electronic voting machines.

[radio4progressives]

26. that's an important issue..

let's see what happens with the new lawsuits..

[radio4progressives]

17. Won't matter what the polls say...

Phil Angelides is the Democratic Party's candidate, who has the full backing and support of the entire party apparatus..

Barbara Boxer and Dianne Feinstein came out and endorsed Angelides a couple of months or so ago.. Nancy Pelosi, along with other party apparatchiks like Art Torres and that whole crew is solidly behind Angelides.

Steve does not have their backing and so he won't stand a chance.

Also, considering the Borders Security vs Amnesty for undocumented workers (aka amnesty work program for "illegal aliens") - the fact that a huge part of California's economy is based on Big Agriculture Business, and considering that latinos and hispanics make a huge part of our population's demographics, the latino/a -chicano/a voter is more likely to support Phil Angelides, rather than some gringo like Steve Westly who progressives might prefer to support..

I'd probably vote for Angelides, not because he's party establishment, but he's a far better hope than Arnold who needs to be defeated badly.

Frankly, I would be absolutely stunned if Steve Westly was able to make over on top of the party's preference at the polls.

[omega minimo]

19. Phil started out as the protege of a notorious CA land mega-developer

and earned his fortune and power giving lip service to POD development and transit, etc.-- and didn't deliver on his promises. His "Laguna Creek" spawned the development of Elk Grove and has created typical faceless suburbia, traffic gridlock and commuter nightmares for the region, minus the promised transit hubs connecting with Sacramento. Elk Grove even had to start their own bus company to get decent service.

I would like to hear, if anyone knows, how Phil addresses his background as one of the "greedy" developers who engineered the metropolitan mess that the Sacramento region has become. (Land use planning students nationwide study the Sacramento region as an example of What Not To Do).

I really don't understand the comment about "the latino/a -chicano/a voter is more likely to support Phil Angelides, rather than some gringo like Steve Westly who progressives might prefer to support." Phil is Greek. It was the tightknit Greek/developer/BigMoney community that gave him his start.

Phil has good qualities. Does anyone ever talk about his sordid suburanizing past?

:hi:

[radio4progressives]

23. Greek? Wow ! my bad..

Just shows to go-ya - i made an ethnic assumption based on what sounded like a latino name .. go figure..

Yes, I'm not sure how much of the Angelides ties to big development projects California voters are taking in, it's not as if it hasn't been reported in the press.

Doesn't help the progressive movement, which is essentially what California Liberals are, when both Senators of such high profiles and party backing, backs someone so closely tied to Big Development.

Real Estate Developers stand in the company of the Tech Industry, Big Ag, and the MIC when it comes to power and influence in California.

(big sigh)

[omega minimo]

27. and they totally dominate/control city councils/county boards

via compromised elected officials "in their pocket" which, again, is how Phil started out. Google Angelo Tsoukopolos (the notorious mentor) for more info.

"Real Estate Developers stand in the company of the Tech Industry, Big Ag, and the MIC when it comes to power and influence in California."

Sacramento's hyperactive development madness really kicked in in the mid-80's. Local officials had a perfect opportunity to not repeat the sprawl-choked mistakes of Los Angeles and San Jose. With the power and persuasion of profit-before-people developers, local government trashed the region with the same mindless, packed-in-like-rats-with-long-commutes sprawl. There was lip service to POD and transit and the promises were never kept.

This included developing the local deepest part of the floodplain in the early 90's-- even AFTER the Mississippi floods that started the discussions about NOT putting people in harm's way. Google "Natomas floodplain." That's a whole sordid story of it's own.

[Pithy Cherub]

33. Ask westly yet about those stock options too...

;)

[realFedUp]

22. It would be stunning but Steve is four points ahead of Phil now

and he has more money for more ads.

I personally am fed up with the Sacramento Dem
Machine that backed the recall of Gray Davis, voted
for Arnold, posed for pictures with him and are now whining
that Steve did his job and worked with Arnold
to keep the checks going out to California state
employees. Steve isn't part of the CA Establishment
Dems and they don't like that.

I think Boxer and Feinstein came out way too early
with their endorsements and I hope it bites them
in their establishments.

I'm voting for Steve and a new way of doing
business in Sacramento.

[radio4progressives]

24. I noticed that.. and i agree with you.

It really pissed me off, but so fvcking predictable considering other machinations that have been going on with the state party caucus, regarding resolutions, stories and shannigans about backing a republican in Orange County rather than the progressive..machinations regarding how certain resolutions and amendments to resolutions were pushed through or hampered. It's certainly enough to make some one become an independent.

[imlost]

29. What????? I take offense to your comment.

"Also, considering the Borders Security vs Amnesty for undocumented workers (aka amnesty work program for "illegal aliens") - the fact that a huge part of California's economy is based on Big Agriculture Business, and considering that latinos and hispanics make a huge part of our population's demographics, the latino/a -chicano/a voter is more likely to support Phil Angelides, rather than some gringo like Steve Westly who progressives might prefer to support.."

Am I missing something, can you explain your comment a little more? As a latina myself I was leaning toward Westly for various reasons, but now you are telling me I should be leaning toward Angelides. Why? because his name sounds Latin.
Being Mexican, I'm not considered progressive? I'm confused.

[demosincebirth]

14. Phil. My union is backing him, but will back any dem against

Arnold in November.

[Clarkie1]

16. My union is backing him, too.

But that doesn't necessarily mean he's my first choice...they also backed Dean, and I never agreed with that.

[demosincebirth]

30. My union (teamsters), have usually been right on with backing

the candidate that I end up voting for.

[brook]

18. Phil

Mainly because I believe he has the backing to win. It's a choice one has to make at times.However,my options are open til we get closer to the zero hour.

[Clarkie1]

20. But assuming Steve won the primary, wouldn't the "Dem machine"

back him just as much as Phil.

I mean, the Party is going to back whoever wins the primary, right?

[radio4progressives]

25. that's a good question...

remains to be seen, i'm not sure why Boxer and Feinstein was compelled to come out so early on the endorsements, except they must have known Wesly was going to be a favorite among progressives from the start, and the party wanted to be sure they got out ahead of the game..

I can't recall if they've ever backed someone they didn't stay with until the end. :shrug:

[scorpiogirl]

21. Phil knocked on my door about a week and a half ago.

He wanted to know if he could count on my vote. I hate to admit it, but I have been so caught up in what's going on nationally that I haven't been paying attention locally. I just told him that we'd be looking at all the candidates. My almost five year old was jumping around trying to get attention the whole time so that was about it.

[realFedUp]

28. Where do you live? No. or S. Cal? What were his primary issues?

What are his solutions?

[scorpiogirl]

31. I'm in Northern Cal

He basically was telling me about some of his accomplishments, but it was difficult to pay attention with my children there. I was kind of a lost cause for him I think. I'm sorry to say I don't really remember what he told me.

[Pithy Cherub]

32. My vote is Phil. More liberal and reaching out to voters of color.

Maxine Waters took him to church with her. Boxer has endorsed him. She is seen in the ads, DiFi is only heard giving her Angelides endorsement.

westly is of those moderate choices.