If a Democrat wins in November, how much credit goes to...

[kentuck]

Howard Dean and his supporters? Whether Dean is the candidate or not, how can we deny the fact that it was he and his supporters that raised the consciousness of the Democratic activists and started the ball rolling? How can we deny the impact that Dean has had on the issues now being debated? I think we all owe Howard and all his supporters a great debt of gratitude for putting their money where their mouth is and by getting a different Democratic message out there. I would like to thank all the Deaniacs for the great service they have done for our country, whether or not Howard Dean wins the nomination.

[Joseph Thule]

1. Alot.

Dean has been key in energizing the base. If Kerry wins in November, I hope he has Howard Dean front and center at the inauguration. I want them to bury the hatchet.

[madmax]

2. I agree - they shook it up.

Dean supporters should be proud of Dean and themselves. The media crucified him, just as they did Gore in 2000. I know most here know the truth about 'the scream'. It was the *&^%^%#%^$# MIC!!

[AlinPA]

3. Thank you. Great post.

Things really changed. It feels better. People are paying attention.

[mandyky]

4. Dean supporters know Dean

made a difference. Some of the more objective folks now supporting other candidates do as well. We'll have to do an exit poll.

What bothers me is that Edawrds and Kerry have heavily "borrowed" parts of Dean's message, Clark to some extent, and the media never says anything. They have Dean pegged as a one issue campaign (anti-war), and that isn't even the whole truth.

[THUNDER HANDS]

5. he deserves a standing ovation at the convention

And if I were the nominee, I'd fire Terry Mac and make Dean the head of the DNC.

[Democrats unite]

6. Of course Dean made a difference...

And I believe that he is going to keep making a difference this primary season.

[patricia92243]

7. This is NOT a compliment for anybody reading this

[HazMat]

8. None

Since most core Dean supporters aren't going to vote for Kerry anyway.

When Kerry beats Bush it will be because of the ordinary, hard working Democrats who REALLY want to take back their country, and not just hang out in Internet cafes.

[Democrats unite]

10. I think right now you are putting the horse before the cart.

eom

[Padraig18]

12. What is the factual basis for your statement?

"Since most core Dean supporters aren't going to vote for Kerry anyway....

May I see the in-depth, scientific survey which proves this, or is it simply the irresponsible, libelous remark about Dean supporters that it appears to be?

[Padraig18]

18. *crickets chirping*

:eyes:

[AntiCoup2K4]

13. "Hard working Democrats who really want to take back their country"

...is the very definition of a Dean supporter. While other candidates are content with supporting the Bush Fraudministration's agenda and even some are tied in with the same criminals backing Junior.

Pity on those who can't see the crystal clear difference. Because an opportunity like this may never happen again.

2 parties both ruled by PNAC, and acting exactly the same?? That's not Democracy, and it's not America.

[ibegurpard]

9. You completely misunderstand why I'm so pissed off

I have nothing invested personally in Howard Dean. Yeah, his positions on issues are across the political spectrum (which I felt could appeal to many people) and he was willing to speak out against Bush and the Republicans when most of the other Democrats seemed to be MIA.
What has pissed me off beyond belief is that many of us who voiced frustration with Democratic Party inaction were shown that it was POSSIBLE for someone to get support WITHOUT having to whore themselves to big money and corporations. We were shown that it was POSSIBLE that the Democrats could stop running away from their core values for fear of not being able to garner support and money. For some reason, the Democratic Party saw that as a threat. You want to thank me for making it possible for the Democratic Party to remain viable without ADDRESSING ANY OF THE PROBLEMS THAT HAS PUT IT WHERE IT IS???? Save your praise.

On edit: Once again, instead of learning from it's mistakes, the Democratic Party is using the boogeyman of the Republicans to frighten everyone into voting for it. That might win it the election but it has shown that there's no way it's going to abandon it's tainting by big money and corporate sponsorship so whose interests do you think it's going to be looking out for?

[lastknowngood]

11. thanks but we hope he comes back

He is the only Democrat who has been takin to the shrub. The rest were bowing and scraping and voting for everything the shrub put forward. He has a real set of nuts that the others are very gingerly starting to fondle and pretend they are their own.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

14. While I do appreciate the infrastructure Dean has created, it may or may

not translate to Dem votes. That will remain to be seen. If they are as fickle representatively as some of the posts on this board, it might not matter.

We will have to wait and see who actually voted for the Democratic candidate to know.

I think if a Dem wins in November, it is just as likely we will be thanking Bush...he fucked up America bad enough to leave us an opening.

[ibegurpard]

16. "it is just as likely we will be thanking Bush"

You really better hope so. I'm afraid that will be the only thing we have going for us. And if the Democrat wins, is he going to sign more things like the Telecommunications Act of 1996 (which was heavily lobbied for be telecom companies who I'm sure put LOTs of money in the campaign coffers of both Democrats AND Republicans and signed into law by Democratic President Bill Clinton) which has done MORE to fuck Democrats over in terms of media consolidation than the repeal of the Fairness Doctrine ever did? With what I'm seeing, I have no confidence that will be the case. How are we going to hold them accountable when we give in to their fear-mongering and they do nothing to change their tactics?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

17. I agree but I think MOST Dems voted for that as it was one of Clinton's

pet projects. My WHOLE problem with Dean is that his types of compromises in working WITH Republicans will lead to the same unintended consequences as that legislation. If Dems could look into the future and see 75% Repub commentary on Tv and 25% everyone else would they have signed it?

[ibegurpard]

19. NSMA, I'm not convinced that half of them care.

The policies they enact don't affect them half as much as they do US. If you had a choice(and I'm speaking rhetorically because I know that YOU personally have too much integrity to choose this) between retaining a pretty powerful position in Washington and risking it for standing up for a policy that would be of benefit to the people but would piss off your past corporate support what would you choose? Examples like the one I gave seem to indicate where many of their priorities lie. Welfare Reform, DOMA, the list goes on. All of these occurred under a Democratic President's watch. How can we hold them accountable? They tossed Gore aside when he started sounding populist themes and they tried their damndest to squash Dean when he was proving that they COULD get support by inspiring PEOPLE and not going begging for big money. Like I said previously, what bothers me isn't that I have so much personally invested in Howard Dean. Yeah, I know he's a centrist who would compromise on a lot of things. But he showed the Democratic Party that it was possible to escape the big money trap and they saw that as a threat. They threw everything they had into stopping him (And the Al Gore endorsement can hardly be construed as Democratic Party establishment backing...if he was part of the establishement he'd be running. They kicked him to the curb) That indicates to me that they don't see it as a problem... which indicates to me that they would rather protect their own little spheres of influence than stand up for anything that affect you or me. By the way, thank you for actually SEEING what I'm trying to say here instead of just discounting it as juvenile Dean supporter sour grapes ranting.
I

[pacifictiger]

15. Ultra

anti bush=70% - Dean's ideas, backbone and energy=25% - Other candidate love=4%

[blm]

20. Credit goes to Bush who made us hate him so much.

.