Dykes for Dean !

[Hoppin_Mad]

Does any other candidate have a group of GL supporters with enough courage and commitment to call themselves "Dykes for . ."

I thought not ! ;-)

http://www.dykesfordean.org/




 "Stand With Us" HBD MD or "Fall With Them" HM 

[cavebat2000]

1. hehe

:) GO...uh.. DYKES FOR DEAN!

[Sapphocrat]

2. You called?

Oh! Sorry! Thought this was one of those "...check in!" threads. :D

That's pretty cool, though!

[frustrated_lefty]

3. Makes me wish I were a girl. :)

If it helps any, my 3 yr old girl explains that Bush is a fascist Nazi. And she points at the screen during the debates and says "I like him" (her kudos offered to Edwards, Dean and Clark).

[joshcryer]

4. This is absolutely fantastic.

Beautiful. :)

[scheming daemons]

5. Cute... but counterproductive to the ABB goal...

Does any other candidate have a group of GL supporters with enough courage and commitment to call themselves "Dykes for . ."

No.. they don't.

It's why they have a better chance of winning the election than Dean does.

While we all may think its "cool", it's a general election loser. 75% of America would be less likely to vote for a candidate that is supported by a group called "Dykes for Dean".

It's a sad reality... but nevertheless, it is a reality.

You aren't helping your candidate. Should you be ashamed of your orientation? Absolutely not.... but you don't help your candidate anymore than a "Bible-thumpers for Bush" group would help Chimp-boy.

Fringe groups, when they come on too strong, hurt their candidates.

Here's a prediction for you:

As soon as Edwards, Clark, Kerry, or Dean secures the nomination, they are going to look for a "Sister Soulja" moment where they can disassociate themselves with the G&L lobby like Clinton disassociated himself with Jesse Jackson. This will piss off a bunch of people here.. but will help the candidate to diffuse Rove's one big trump card... the gay marriage issue.

Gay marriage should be legal... but if any candidate actively campaigns on that right now, he or she loses. We need to define the terms of debate this fall.. it needs to be about jobs and trust. If Rove succeeds in making it about Gay Marriage... we lose. We need America (not just Liberal America, but moderate America as well) to have a compelling reason to vote AGAINST Bush. In any Presidential election involving an incumbent, the race is about the incumbent's performance more than the challenger's credentials. If we get this election to be run on OUR terms - by talking about jobs and an administration that we cannot trust and about a government headed for bankrupcy, we can win. If we allow it to be about, as Dean says, "God, Gays, and Guns" we will lose in a landslide.

Your group, however sincere, is counterproductive to the goal of removing George Bush from office.

[joshcryer]

6. If America can't support a president that's pro civil rights.

Then America doesn't deserve such a president. So they can have Bush.

[scheming daemons]

9. ...and they will...

... and in four years, will Gays be closer to their goals after Bush has four years to do what he wants WITHOUT WORRYING ABOUT RE-ELECTION?

After he's appointed conservative ANTI-GAY judges to lifetime posts on the supreme court?

After he and his GOP congress push through anti-gay legislation?

or would gays be better off with a Democrat who would appoint progressive judges and block the GOP congress from its anti-gay agenda?

I believe all four main Dem candidates are pro-G&L. Just like clinton was pro-NAACP. But Clinton's "Sister Soulja" event made him palatable to the moderate masses and helped get our "first black president" elected. If the Dem candidate cannot diffuse the Gay Marriage issue, Rove (and his media accomplices) will beat him over the head with it relentlessly... taking the oxygen away from ANY OTHER ISSUE.

And the Dem will lose.... and then where will the G&L lobby be?


Some people, like Mr. Dean, "lead with their heart" too much. It's about winning. We'll work on the issues ONCE WE HAVE THE SEAT OF POWER.

We can't do anything for G&L issues from the back bench as a minority, marginalized party.

Wise up...

[joshcryer]

11. I have wisened up.

That's why I'm voting for Dean. No more of this pandering crap. It's time to push for all we got.

I personally think it's bullshit to suggest that any democratic nominee can't win. I think that any democratic nominee, even if it's freaking Hamm, can win against Bush. You're exaggerating Bush's popularity.

[scheming daemons]

12. I hope you're right...

I hope I am exaggerating Bush's popularity....

Rove will have $250 million at his disposal to color this campaign any way he wants...

He'll have a conservative media to carry the message for free, in addition.

Our candidate will have less than half the resources, even under the best scenario. You think the coverage of the "Dean Scream" this week was brutal?

Wait until summer when it's "Gay Marriage" wall-to-wall on your network and cable news networks. And anytime our candidate tries to change the subject, it will be drawn back to "God, Gays, and Guns".

You think Atwater and the Willie Horton stuff was bad? Wait until you see what Rove and company do with G&L issues. It will make Willie Horton look like child's play. Wait until Rove shows video of gay couples getting married at Martha's Vinyard..... in Kerry's home state. There goes West Virginia... and Ohio.... and probably Pennsylvania... and anything south of the Mason-Dixon line..

But that's ok, we'll make our point and win California, New York, and a half-dozen other states. </sarcasm>

[Sapphocrat]

15. And do you really think...

...God, gays, and/or guns are just going to go away if you pretend they don't exist?

And, honey, you don't have to tell us queers about "brutal." Ever see "The Gay Agenda"? Ever see the "research" from Paul Cameron spread throughout every fundie church in America like so much feces from a fan? Ever feared for your own life because a group of jerks in a '72 Pontiac didn't like the way your hair was cut? Ever had a Matthew Shepard as an indelible symbol of what your struggle is all about?

We know "brutal," thanks. We've been fighting back against "brutal" all our lives.

The question, are you up to fighting back?

[Kipepeo]

18. "The question, are you up to fighting back?"

Thanks for that ^^

[Kipepeo]

17. That is so sad...

I'm talking about this: "Some people, like Mr. Dean, "lead with their heart" too much. It's about winning."

I hope I never start to look at the world like that. I don't think there is any way to win except when being led by the heart. I'd like to see you tell any major leader for social justice in history that they were probably leading with their heart too much and ya know, it's about winning and all.

I think that's ridiculous. I don't think you can win without leading with your heart. If we are willing to sell out gays and lesbians or call them a "fringe" group (I can't believe I saw that) then we don't deserve to win anything.

And I think sometimes you need a crazy-nut like Dubya to motivate people to get off their bums and work for change...so no I don't *necessarily* think things will be worse for gay rights under Dubya than under someone like Kerry. If Kerry is going to try and push GLBT rights in the corner during the campaign, then I don't think we can expect more than tidbits if he becomes President...tidbits meant to hold us over, keep us quiet, etc. And one could argue that maybe another Bush term would be just enough to push us all over the edge that we would all get out there and fight for gay rights and not be afraid to do so for fear of our guy not being elected.

I'm just so tired of and depressed by this "vote with your head, not with your heart" kind of talk I've been hearing lately. I don't think my head is being very smart if she's not listening to my heart.

[NWHarkness]

8. Gays are a "fringe group"?

Wow, that's an inclusive attitude you've got there.

Maybe we should tell the Blacks and the Latinos and the Jews and the Moslems to all hide until after November as well, huh?

[scheming daemons]

10. Not to be harsh, but...

If it removes Bush from office, I'd be willing to tell everyone to lay low until the election.

40% of the populace agrees with you. (I'm one of them, actually).

But that won't get us elected. Do you want to WIN or do you want to make a point?


We can operate on principle... and get wiped out and give the Hitler Youth four more years in office...

or we can operate pragmatically... and send Bush to the trash heap of history where he belongs.


...your call...

[NWHarkness]

13. Winning by disowning our brothers and sisters

would make us as despicable as those we oppose.

[Sapphocrat]

14. Oh, really?

While we all may think its "cool", it's a general election loser. 75% of America would be less likely to vote for a candidate that is supported by a group called "Dykes for Dean".

Is that so now?

"What beat me was more homosexual money than in any race in history, including from a group called Lesbians for Motherhood."

-- Bob Dornan (R-Calif.), after losing to pro-gay Loretta Sanchez (in a not-so-liberal bastion of Southern California, I might add)

You aren't helping your candidate. Should you be ashamed of your orientation? Absolutely not.... but you don't help your candidate anymore than a "Bible-thumpers for Bush" group would help Chimp-boy.

So we should be ashamed instead of being publicly proud of who we are, and open about our support?

I'll make a note to warn the NAACP about that. A lot of folks don't like "those people" either, and I sure would hate to see "Black Folks for Kerry" ruin the frontrunner's chances. :eyes:

If Rove succeeds in making it about Gay Marriage... we lose.

"If"? "If? In case you haven't noticed, it already is an issue -- and we uppity homos weren't the ones who made it an issue this election year.

Now, you can just pretend this "issue" doesn't exist, and hope it goes away -- thereby giving the Radical Right carte blanche to frame the debate any damned way they please -- or you can pull your head out of the sand and fight alongside us.

I would like to think we would have your support because it is the right thing to do. But I'll put it to you in a way that you may understand much better: If you see us as such a liability to the Democratic Party, then consider your unapologetic, aggressive support of gay rights as your contribution to "damage control."

If there's one thing far too many Democrats do to the detriment of all, it's choosing the defense instead of the offense, nearly every time. And when they can't come up with a good defense, they skirt the issue.

Have you ever thought about taking the offense for a change? Working to make the Repukes' slimy tactics backfire in their faces?

Look:

In your view, backing gay rights is a losing proposition. The truth is, not backing gay rights is not only blind, unfair, and morally wrong; it is a gift to the Repukes. You're running for cover, leaving the field wide open for them to turn this or any other oh-so-touchy issue into anything they want.

And that is really a losing proposition.

[delete_bush]

19. Ridiculous assertion

<you don't help your candidate anymore than a "Bible-thumpers for Bush" group would help Chimp-boy.>

First of all there are tens of millions of bible-thumpers for Bush. Doesn’t hurt him a bit, one entire leg of the party in fact.

As for “Dykes for Dean”, ever heard of the Log Cabin Republicans? And I might be wrong, but I believe most if not all of the members are men. Uptight repukes are much more threatened by gay men vs. women.

Many of them have fanciful lesbian fantasies involving a threesome, resulting in the eventual conversion of the ladies gone astray to straight sex once shown the prowess of a real (read “conservative”) man!

Non-issue.

[AntiCoup2K4]

7. I never knew Yoda was gay

[eridani]

16. The candidate in favor of full civil rights==

==including marriage, is Dennis Kucinich.

[Atlant]

20. This morning, in Massachusetts, full civil marriage is looking more likely

The Boston Globe ran a front-page article this morning
describing how state Democratic legislatures at one of their
caucuses have come out (you'll forgive the expression) in favor
of granting full civil marriage to gay couples (pretty much
as the court order seems to require).

While this would have only been a ripple to the Dean campaign,
if full civil marriage comes to pass from Kerry's home state,
it may make his campaign life a good deal more "interesting".
It will be interesting to see how John Kerry reacts to that.

Atlant

[jumptheshadow]

21. I wonder how these Dykes for Dean will react?

What will they say if Dean doesn't win the nomination and some petulant Dean supporters go third party or stay at home?

Bush laid down the gauntlet to the gay community with his hateful State of the Union address.

Anybody who even hints that they won't cast a vote for the most viable candidate running against him is no friend of the GLBT community. And they can go to hell, as far as I'm concerned.

[Atlant]

22. Thanks for your well wishes. I'll save a seat for you. (NT)