Is Bush the Living hedonist??? cause he shows many signs of being one

[opihimoimoi]

He lies cheats and steals, he parties well into the night 10 PM.

He sold his soul to those evil guys who guide him.

Come, we go drink....

[misternormal]

1. Excuse me...

Pagans do not lie, cheat or steal...

The greatest part of the Pagan/Wiccan beliefs are "To Harm None".

Pagans do not believe in Satan, so "Selling one's soul" is not an option.

Please, get your facts straight before you place labels.

Thank you.

(An added note: No pagan I know will have anything to do with him)

[opihimoimoi]

3. I am so sorry, I was led to believe the above from Xtians who

justified the slaughter described in the Bible in Genesis. Whenever the Levites decided it was time to commit genocide...they would attack and kill Pagans/Heathens in some town, then the next...they were on a roll to kill Pagans.

You are telling me...this was wrong...that the Pagans were in fact the GOOD GUYs???

I could go with that.

So what the Hell do we call Bush?

and what do we call the Hebrews who slaughtered the Peeps of the land?

[misternormal]

5. It was more or less...

as it is now... One group getting rid of those that believe and think differently than they do.

I personally see no justification for it, but it is a part of world history.

[expatriot]

2. I think you mean hedonist ...

heathen is simply defined as someone who does not adhere to one of the religions of Abraham (Christianity, Judaism and Islam) and pagan is one who adheres to a polytheistic or animist belief system.

[opihimoimoi]

4. Thank you, sending cold beer and smoked ribs....Hedonist it is

[don954]

6. i find that very insulting

you wouldnt say "is bush really a black man?" for the same reasons, would you? Us Pagans have a code of morality that is at times, more restrictive than xians.

"'an it harm none, do as you wilt" may seem simple, but its very hard not to cause harm to the world and people you live with, we are also prohibited from allowing harm that will befall if we dont do something by the same directive.

[opihimoimoi]

7. Its been changed, its been changed...to Hedonist

My Bad, groveling on the floor asking for forgiveness.

[misternormal]

8. No problem friend...

Have one on me. :toast:

[don954]

10. no problem,

and i hope you learned something today... -grin-
:P
:hippie:
:toast:
:rant:

[Crunchy Frog]

9. What's with the insult of Pagans and Heathens.

Neo-Paganism is an active and growing religion and there are many of them on this board. There's even a Pagan forum here. From what I've been able to gather, their main beliefs include a reverence for nature and a belief in not harming others. The word "heathen" is usually used to refer to people like the pre-Christian Europeans. I think it's used more generally to refer to people who do not belong to any of the worlds MAJOR religious traditions, but practice traditional local beliefs.

I don't see what George W. Bush has to do with either group of people. He may very well be the Anti-Christ, but that's something completely different.

[misternormal]

11. The actual definition of Heathen is...

"People of the Hearth", who did not subscribe to a monotheistic belief system.

[Crunchy Frog]

14. Thanks for the info. I'm working on learning about these things.

I wrote a (small and fairly superficial) paper on Paganism/Wicca for a class, but I have a lot to learn on the subject. I do have some interesting books that I need to read.:hi:

[misternormal]

16. You are quite welcome...

I do not consider myself Wiccan, because Wicca is a recognized, organized religion. I am Pagan. I share much in common with those that call themselves Wiccan, but since I have never been a fan of organized religion, I have chosen to be solitary.

There are many publications that can give you definitive answers and information on the subject.

Good luck in your quest for knowledge.

[opihimoimoi]

12. The Pagan thing has been rectified/reconciled...This was brought up

cause he talks to God, so he claims, but his actions show clearly un Christian behavior.

Perhaps its time for the Pagan Party cause all I have learned is good stuffs about them....clearly vice versa from Bush and his BS.

Come, we go make Pagan Luau, I light the fires...

[misternormal]

13. Count me in...

But I've never been a fan of poi. :-)

[opihimoimoi]

17. Now a days, the Poi is optional...a real international Luau has many kinds

of foods on the menu

Sushi, Kalua Pig, Sahimi, Potato salad, smoked ribs, Poke, etc

Come, we do the Fire Walk... Bush wouldn't couldn't. LOL

[misternormal]

20. I'm there...

[Crunchy Frog]

15. Here's a link to the Pagan Spirituality group here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=262

It's an interesting forum to look through. Unfortunately, if you look at history, much of Bush's behavior is kind of Christian, at least of the type that ignores/rejects the teachings of Jesus and focuses on how their personal salvation makes them better than everyone else and justifies any type of atrocity. Not meant as an insult to Christians by the way, I have nothing but respect for people who actually try to follow the teachings of Jesus. But millions of people have been killed or tortured or enslaved in the name of that religion, and Bush seems to be fully in line with that tradition.

I wouldn't really classify him as a hedonist either. I wouldn't have a problem with him if he only cared about his own pleasure and left everyone else alone.

I will join you for that Luau though.:)

[opihimoimoi]

18. Thanks for the link.what Bush really is ?? most definitely a self centered

asshole who uses code words fed to him by Hughes and Rove....

Whatever he is....definitely not a Leader. Most likey Bass and Stoges
was left on the self. Coveys 7 Habits was on tapes...I bet he missed those too.

Thanks for thoughts re Paganism.

Opi gathering wood for the Fire Walk

[misternormal]

19. I agree with you...

In the sense that anyone, who is a member of any religion, that truly follows the teachings of that religion, and does his or her level best to live in their chosen faith, I have no problem with.

Bush on the other hand is as you define him in a religious sense.

I truly believe that he used christianity to get elected. I am sure that there were many christians who refused to vote in the past, because there was no candidate that they, as a group, felt was moral enough. Then Bush came along with his grandstanding, promising a constitutional amendment banning same sex marriages, and they went nuts over that. And enough of them voted so that the election was close enough to steal.

But then, Georgie will have to atone for his sins. It is just a shame that so many people have, and will continue to suffer for what he has done.

[opihimoimoi]

21. Over 5000 dead because of him...very sad indeed.

Hewil atone?? I canardly believe an atonement...more like rationalization of the delusional type..

[PaganPreacher]

22. A "hedonist"? You are 0 for 2....

As a proud Primal Pagan (and a no-shit Pagan clergyman), and an Epicurian Hedonist, I take exception to your characterizations of W as a "pagan" and/or a "hedonist". He is neither.

W is an evangelical Christian. By no means is he a Pagan, just as he is not a Taoist or Buddhist.

Others here have described Paganism very well, for the most part. One thing that I disagree with in those characterizations is that many (most?) of us do not subscribe to "as long as it harms none, do what you will" as a dictum. It is a nice sentiment, and people who follow it are nice people. However, I am not one of them, and my Norse, African, and Celtic brothers and sisters are not, either.

But now you are bagging on Hedonism by descrbing a man who "lies, cheats...steals..sold his soul" as a Hedonist.

As Inigo Montoya said in "The Princess Bride", "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."



Hedonists are people who seek pleasure in life. That can be as simple as choosing those things that are "fun" or "nice"; or preferring well-prepared food, expensive liquors and cigars. It can be as complex as studying and living by the philosophies of Epicurus, as I have; seeking freedom, tranquility, knowledge, and a society bound by social contract (as opposed to divine decree or the whims of powerful people).

Lying, cheating, and stealing are the actions of unscrupulous people. Those actions are not part of a Hedonist way of life. We certainly don't "sell our souls". As a Pagan, that idea is outside my belief, anyway.

Do us all a favor, and learn about Hedonism before you insult us anymore. Wikipedia has a nice, if simple, page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedonism

The Pagan Preacher
I don't turn the other cheek.

[opihimoimoi]

23. Hey, I got a bum scoop from the others, But you are right, shoiulda coulda

looked it up but didn't my Bad.

I will now play safe and call the Dude an ASSHOLE f Mega proportions..

The insult was not intended.