Dean is getting demolished partly because of the taxes issue.

[poskonig]

In the New Hampphire polling, the data indicates Dean was clobbered among voters who believed health care and the economy were their top issue. One would think this is Dean territory -- he cut taxes and balanced budgets forever in Vermont (including through two Bush recessions) and offered healthcare to all of its citizens.

In conjunction to this, Gephardt and Dean -- the two candidates who wanted to raise taxes on the middle class (even if it is small for most of us) greatly underachieved in Iowa.

Additionally, whenever I hear Kerry speak on television, more often than not, he drops the "taxes on the middle class" line soundbite, even if he doesn't call out Dean by name.

None of the pundits have mentioned it, but is Dean getting beat over the head on this issue?

[creativelcro]

1. When voters are fools, what can you say?

I mean, if people don't get the logic of good arguments and fall for false promises, what the hell can you do ? Make more false promises, which is what our Senator has been doing...

[lancdem]

6. Repealing the tax cuts for the rich is a false promise?

I think that's one a Dem president could easily keep.

[Monte Carlo]

9. You need to resist that attitude...

... because it is exactly that type of polarizing, snobby attitude that'll hurt Dean.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

2. Remember.......

Howard Dean wants to roll-back the enire tax cut. That includes the tax cuts for middle and working class folk! Not a very popular idea, now is it??? Heck, I do not want to roll back the tax cuts for working class people. This was a major blunder for Dean.

[creativelcro]

17. It was not a blunder, I think. However, they should have emphasized

that they would restore some funding leading to decreases in other expenses (health insurance, property taxes etc etc). Dean would typically point out that these expenses went up much more than what most of us got back from the tax cut. But I would always left wondering whether getting rid of the tax cut would result in reducing those expenses or not.

[lancdem]

3. I saw that, too

Kerry won on more than just electability. I think many Dems and independents want to repeal the tax cuts on the rich but not those on the middle class.

[pacifictiger]

13. I still havn't heard from any of the ones

that want to save the middle class tax cut, what that means exactly. The only one that came close was Edwards, who threw out "anything under $200,000." Say what? Last I checked the median income was in the mid $40K range. I'm just a bit above that and I didn't see any tax cuts - oh I forgot - the $300 one month worth of medical insurance premium. Didn't get sick, so thats money up in smoke.
Lets get rid of ALL the tax cuts and start over with something that makes sense!!!!! The politicians either woo you with promises, or fill you with fear that something will be "taken away" just to get elected. In reality,the eventuality is usually neither.

[bhunt70]

4. Isn't Dean still waiting to roll out his tax plan?

[Toucano]

8. That's what I was gonna say!

Now might be a good time, Dr.

[Monte Carlo]

5. N.H. is famous for their anti-tax politics.

Watching their campaign commercials on MA TV is tiring. Every commercial is about taxes being too high and little else.

[codegreen]

7. i concur

it was so ridiculous watching him say 'we have to balance the budget/get rid of the deficit' before lowering the taxes again on the middle class, after raising them.

or, when Dean was like 'sure i'll have a tax plan, but i'm not going to show it to you before voting for me. that's just a silly insider game that i won't play. i need your trust'

(sorry to be sounding bitter, but i'm a former Dean supporter/donater and he's let me down so many times in so many ways...)

[flaminbats]

10. sure he is!

and so are Clark, Edwards, and Lieberman....:eyes:

[poskonig]

12. I don't understand.

:beer:

[flaminbats]

14. I know....

After all, Dean didn't come in second for nothing. ;)

[gristy]

11. This is what I want:

I want a government that spends no more than what it collects in taxes. It just makes me ill each time I hear someone say "my taxes are too high" or "I voted for xxx" because he'll lower my taxes. Folks like these are sending us down the no-return path of national bankruptcy. If you include in your definition of "taxes" things such as property taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, and the resultant reduction in our quality of life and medical care because of all the money needed to finance our debt rather than build/maintain our nation's infrastructure and fund our nation's medical research and our public hospitals, you realize that these so-called tax-cutting politicians are benefitting only a small fraction of us while hurting the rest.

[pacifictiger]

15. IMHO

to be strong, a society must enable its citizens to be strong. For that it should collect from those most blessed by fortune, resources to enable those born into the lower rung the ability to be strong too. To me that means basic, food, education and health, care of the young and aged. Those must be considered the basic right of citizenship. But it will never happen until the me, me, me, me, society wakes up. The fact that more is spent by this wealthy superpower on killing other people than healing and educating its citizens says a lot for the moral character of this country. Why protect them with the best of weapons if there is no quality of life to protect? I would certainly be willing to part with more dollars if I had confidence it was being used wisely. Our taxes are out of control because of waste and misplaced priorities. And Dean is the only one even beginning to articulate that.

[HazMat]

16. I agree. This point has been overlooked.

Democrats, even many liberals, don't want to run another national campaign based on raising taxes. Period.

Raising taxes is a losing issue no matter how you want to spin it. Mondale. Bush41 (he broke his promise to not raise taxes and Clinton killed him for it).

Democrats must shed the "tax and spend" label if we are ever to regain firm control of the government. JFK cut taxes, yet was able to move this country forward and was committed to social change. It's far more progressive to cut taxes on the poor and middle class, while asking the rich to pay their fair share.

[pacifictiger]

18. I guess if you want to keep the status quo

just keep talking that line. You are all talking "conventional" strategy. We live in an age of globalization and desparate times call for different measures - and to me that means Dean. Of course, I could be wrong. Maybe too many americans are too hypnotized by the entertainment culture to really think long and hard about the big global picture. If that is the case, the country and the world will be poorer for it.

[paulk]

19. I think it really hurt him in Iowa

Kerry's ads bashing Dean and Gephardt on the tax issue were really effective, IMHO. I've also been surprised the pundits haven't talked about it.

[KaraokeKarlton]

20. Dean is the only one telling the truth about taxes

Because he knows full well (as do the others) that there is no way in hell that they can keep all their promises, deal with the deficit AND keep any of the tax cuts. They all know this and are lying. Clark might not realize it simply because he's not a politician, so I'm not going to include him as lying. I think he just lacks enough domestic experience and knowledge to understand the severity of the problems. If we don't deal with the deficit things are going to get a lot worse and we won't have ANY social programs left because we will NOT be able to pay for them. Voters HAVE to choose...it's the tax cuts or keeping social programs funded and protecting those who depend on them. There comes a time when it stops being about "Me, Me, Me" and starts being about what is best for the country in the long term. Howard Dean is the ONLY one who is looking out for the best interest of the country and not the best interest of his political career. He's in this for the country and the people in the country.

If Kerry gets nominated and somehow manages to beat Bush (I honestly don't see that happening, I think Bush will demolish Kerry.) nothing is going to change from how it is now. NOTHING. It will be the same old same old, higher deficits, no health coverage, no peace, no homeland security, special interests will still run Washington and we'll go back to bitching about how we need change but never get it. Well, we have a chance for real change, and that is Howard Dean. If you want the same miserable state of affairs as we have now, then Kerry is your guy.

[MR. ELECTABLE]

21. Thank you!!! n/t

[Toucano]

22. Just like Dukakis did!

I don't mean to jab with that but it's true.

Dukakis said he would raise taxes. Bush 1 said "Read my lips", got elected, and raised taxes.

"Sometimes a lie is the best thing." - Tracy Chapman

[fujiyama]

23. Dean may...

be right about repealing the entire tax cut, but advocating the repeal of middle class tax cuts while unemployment is still high, is not going to win votes.

Voters hear a million different "plans and proposals", half of which never get enacted (this president got lucky because those like Fienstien voted for his tax cut). To most people Dean's health care plan is only that - a plan, and it's all pie in the sky, really.

Plus many probably don't want to give up any money (even if it's as low as 300 dollars) when their savings are also so low. I can't blame them.