If abortion were banned in the U.S., would you move?

[ArthurDent]

Please don't answer if you're not in the U.S. now -- I'm doing this for some level of edification.

Similarly, note the question -- I'm wondering about an outright, federal elimination of abortion.

Also, thank you to Worst Username Ever for providing the necessary celestial body.

[intheflow]

1. No.

I will stay to fight in the Revolution if that comes to pass.

[Lerkfish]

9. if that were the ONLY thing, no....but it wont be the only thing..

it will be a pandora's box of fascist evil.
My leaving the country will coincide with the approaching draft age of my son.
that's about 10 years from now.

Of course, by then, if current trends continue, we'll all be attached to massive machines of death, fueling them with our life fluids.

;)

[NC_Nurse]

2. Don't Panic.

Love your name! :D

I'm staying to oust these asshats!

[Book Lover]

3. No, for many reasons

Mainly to assist those who will seek it out anyway, both the chemical and surgical methods. Herblore is very dangerous in uneducated hands.

[LastKnight]

4. if all they took away was abortion, no...

but how likley is it they will stop there? not likley.

-LK

[Scrooge]

5. stay

I care for my handicapped mother, so we couldnt move. I would however NEVER continue a pregnancy if I was not ready or able. I would visit Canada for a week.

[sonicx]

6. maybe, because...

if abortion is banned, alot of other stuff will be piggybacked...

[Neoma]

7. I'd move near Canada

but not outside of US,revolution would be huge.

[illflem]

8. When you think about how illegal activities

have flourished since abortion was first legalized and how many people are hurting for dough and wouldn't mind the extra money I'm sure abortions will be just as easy to get if made illegal.
Just like booze and prohibition.

[JanMichael]

10. No...and furthermore I wish it would be outlawed

I am sick to fucking death of the women I know who voted for Bush that have had abortions.

I am too old to worry much about it anymore-

This country voted to keep the son of a bitch, let 'em deal with life under conservatives.

OK...I am not sure if I am still knee jerk mad or not....ask this again in three months.

Stephanie

[MrSlayer]

11. No.

Mainly because the issue has no real effect on my life. I'd like to see choice preserved of course and I'd stand up for it but if it goes I don't see it as grounds for me to leave.

[noamnety]

12. No

I'm more concerned that they are slowly poisoning people that are already born with mercury, lead, arsenic, pesticides, etc. (and I will never understand how the people that do that in the name of corporate profits can claim to be pro-life)

[Maat]

13. No.

As my husband said recently, Bush being in office is not going to hurt us. Our kid is only 8 years old, and I will financially be able to visit any country in the world on short notice. This retired social worker hurts for her the middle class and the poor. I'm too old at 46 to be thinking of more children. And she won't be eligible for the draft for 10 years.

But I will stay here and fight the good fight (to those employed at the California State Bar : I will fight legally, of course).

What is sad is that the ones most hurt by Boosh administration policy are my neighbors .... who voted for ... Boosh.

I can afford to stash my kid in a private school (she attends one now), so she will be relatively unaffected by this administration's policy.

[phillysuse]

14. If abortion were banned in the US, would you move?

If and that's a big if, abortion were banned, we'd go back to 1972.
We would see Septic Abortions in young poor women and the rich and
well connected would go abroad - to Canada or Europe just as they
then.

In addition, we now have methotrexate and misoprostol - the combination
of which can induce an abortion - I predict we would see a black
market in these drugs - and they can prescribed by any MD - and
especially by rheumatologists because they use both of these.
It would be impossible to legislate these drugs off the market since
methotrexate, for example, is one of the main drugs used for
rheumatoid arthritis.

I wouldn't move but I'm not at the stage that I am having babies.

I'd stay and write prescriptions!

[Ducks In A Row]

15. we have to stay to help women get the abortions they will need

[zulchzulu]

16. Other

It will never be banned completely. If anything, it would be the dumbfuck Red States that would make it illegal and the smart Blue States that would allow it and offer travel packages for the dumbfuck Red Staters that would STILL have abortions.

I say we let them have Roe v. Wade and then get the Blue states to profit off these dumbass hypocrites. And then the Repugs no longer have Roe v Wade to feed the Reborn Half Wits that use that as their "unifying" issue.

Let's rope-a-dope these Chimpsters.

[sweetladybug]

17. No I would not leave MY country. I would choose to stay and fight

in the next civil war. If they take a women's right to choose away, then no telling what other rights we will be stripped of then all hell will break loose in our country.

[ArthurDent]

19. That's why I asked.

I tend to agree that if RvW were overturned, the effect would be to put the question into the hands of the states. Even if you had a Rehnquist doppleganger taking O'Connor's seat, I think you'd be hard pressed to find five votes upholding a federal abortion ban.

The question I asked is a red herring. I'm actually wondering if people would move to a different -state-. I'd guess it'd be a resounding no, save for those who are moving to have an abortion.

Why I am interested in that is a post for another day.

[C.C.D.]

18. No. At this point, I'd like to see elective abortion "banned" (m)

Taking away one of their biggest campaign stands being one of the reasons, and preventing the lifelong emotional/mental damage for post-abortive women being another.

[Hello_Kitty]

29. 'lifelong emotional/mental damage for post-abortive women'

Huh?!? Speaking as one of those 'post-abortive' women, I have no emotional and/or mental damage to report.

[C.C.D.]

35. Glad to hear that. Many, however, do. (nt)

[Djinn]

36. many people have

emotional and/or mental damage after childbirth - guess we should ban that.

BTW - what is "elective" abortion, I was under the impression they were all elective?

[C.C.D.]

37. Maybe. (m)

I meant "elective" as in just not wanting to continue a pregnancy w/o other things involved like danger to mother/medical issues/rape/incest etc.

[Djinn]

42. forcing someone to give birth against their will

presents a danger to women in and of itself

[REP]

40. Document or Retract

Please document these ridiculous assertions you are making about abortion. I have posted two articles from mainstream sources to back up mine; please provide cites from other than pro-life websites or anecdotes ("friend of a friend" or "my own horrible story" are anecdotes, not proof).

[C.C.D.]

41. Absolutely (m)

Are you seriously thinking that many women do NOT have trauma post-abortion?

"A relatively new aspect of the abortion debate is "post abortion syndrome", or "PAS". Many people who counsel women who have had abortions report that these women often suffer from emotional and psychological problems as a result of the experience, comparable to the trauma sufferred by victims of violent crimes and similar wrenching experiences."

<begin new source>

"Post –Abortion Syndrome (PAS) is the term used to describe a woman’s inability to process the feelings of fear, anger, sadness, grief and guilt surrounding her abortion experience.

Research indicates that for a period immediately after an abortion, many women experience "psychological numbing." In order to protect their emotional stability, many women employ psychological defense mechanisms to repress any uncomfortable or disturbing feelings. As a result, many emotional reactions to abortions are delayed, sometimes for more than 5 or 10 years.

The early defense mechanisms are very effective in keeping painful memories away, but they consume a lot of mental energy. Eventually, if enough stress enters the life of a woman who has had an abortion, she may find herself without the ability to cope.

What percentage of women experience some form of PAS?

anniversary (54%)

flashbacks (61%)

suicidal thoughts (24%)

regret (69%)

rage (47%)

anxiety (32%)

nightmares (30%)

lower self esteem (54%)

replacement baby (34%)

feeling helpless (42%)

hostility toward men (28%)

bitterness (39%)

depression (98%)

guilt (61%)


Sources Cited:

"Identifying and Overcoming Post Abortion Syndrome," by Paul Reisser, M.D., and Terry Reisser, M.S."

http://www.afterabortion.com/
http://www.afterabortion.org/
http://www.abortionfacts.com/PAS/PAS.asp

and many, many more sites set up to help post-abortive women recover...

[REP]

43. Bzzzt! You LOSE!

I told you I would not accept pro-lie propaganda websites as cites.

Try again. Cite a peer-reviewed article from a medical journal.

[REP]

39. What Bullshit!

WHAT "lifelong emotional/mental damage" are you talking about? Something you made up, heard in a dream, saw on Fox News? The Koop Report says you're wrong, as do numerous studies, such as this one:

New York Times (as printed in the San Jose Mercury 2/12/97)

Abortion does not trigger lasting emotional trauma in young women who
are psychologically healthy before they become pregnant, an eight-year
study of nearly 5,300 women has shown. Women who are in poor shape
emotionally after an abortion are likely to have been feeling bad about
their lives before terminating their pregnancies, the researchers said.

The findings, the researchers say, challenge the validity of laws
that have been proposed in many states, and passed in several, mandating
that women seeking abortions be informed of mental health risks.

The researchers, Dr. Nancy Felipe Russo, a psychologist at Arizona
State University in Tempe, and Dr. Amy Dabul Marin, a psychologist at
Phoenix College, examined the effects of race and religion on the
well-being of 773 women who reported on sealed questionnaires that
they had undergone abortions, and they compared the results with the
emotional status of women who did not report abortions.

The women, initially 14 to 24 years old, completed questionnaires and
were interviewed each year for eight years, starting in 1979. In 1980
and in 1987, the interview also included a standardized test that
measures overall well-being, the Rosenberg Self-Esteem Scale.

"Given the persistent assertion that abortion is associated with
negative outcomes, the lack of any results in the context of such a
large sample is noteworthy," the researchers wrote. The study took
into account many factors that can influence a woman's emotional
well-being, including education, employment, income, the presence of
a spouse and the number of children.

Higher self-esteem was associated with being employed, having a
higher income, having more years of education and bearing fewer children,
but having had an abortion "did not make a difference," the researchers
reported. And the women's religious affiliations and degree of involvement
with religion did not have an independent effect on their long-term
reaction to abortion. Rather, the women's psychological well-being before
having abortions accounted for their mental state in the years after the
abortion, the researchers said..

In considering the influence of race, the researchers again found
that the women's level of self-esteem before having abortions was the
strongest predictor of their well-being after an abortion.

"Although highly religious Catholic women were slightly more likely
to exhibit post-abortion psychological distress than other women, this
fact is explained by lower pre-existing self-esteem," the researchers
wrote in the current issue of Professional Psychology: Research and
Practice, a journal of the American Psychological Association.

Overall, Catholic women who attended church one or more times a week,
even those who had not had abortions, had generally lower self-esteem
than other women, although within the normal range, so it was hardly
surprising that they also had lower self-esteem after abortions, the
researchers said in interviews.

Gail Quinn, executive director of anti-abortion activities for the
United States Catholic Conference, said the findings belied the
experience of post-abortion counselors. She said, "While many women
express `relief' following an abortion, the relief is transitory."
In the long term, the experience prompts "hurting people to seek the
help of post-abortion healing services," she said.

The president of the National Right to Life Committee, Dr. Wanda
Franz, who earned her doctorate in developmental psychology, challenged
the researchers' conclusions. She said their assessment of self-esteem
"does not measure if a woman is mentally healthy," adding, "This requires
a specialist who performs certain tests, not a self-assessment of how
the woman feels about herself."

Adoption does, however:

J Obstet Gynecol Neonatal Nurs 1999 Jul-Aug;28(4):395-400

Postadoptive reactions of the relinquishing mother: a review.

Askren HA, Bloom KC.

Deer Valley OB/GYN, Mesa, AZ, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To review the literature addressing the process of relinquishment
as it relates to the birth mother. DATA SOURCES: Computerized searches in
CINAHL; Article 1 st, PsycFIRST, and SocioAbs databases, using the keywords
adoption and relinquishment; and ancestral bibliographies. STUDY SELECTION:
Articles from indexed journals in the English language relevant to the
keywords were evaluated. No studies were located before 1978. Studies that
sampled only an adolescent population were excluded. Twelve studies met the
inclusion criteria and were included in the analysis. DATA EXTRACTION: Data
were extracted and information was organized under the following headings:
grief reaction, long-term effects, efforts to resolve, and influences on the
relinquishment experience. DATA SYNTHESIS: A grief reaction unique to the
relinquishing mother was identified. Although this reaction consists of
features characteristic of the normal grief reaction, these features persist
and often lead to chronic, unresolved grief. CONCLUSIONS: The relinquishing
mother is at risk for long-term physical, psychologic, and social
repercussions. Although interventions have been proposed, little is known
about their effectiveness in preventing or alleviating these repercussions.

Med J Aust 1986 Feb 3;144(3):117-9 Related Articles, Links

[TalkingDog]

20. There are many fairly safe ways to self induce

A number of them are herbal. Women have used them since time immemorial. In more proper times they were euphamistically suggested to "promote menstrual flow".

Yes, they can be dangerous if used incorrectly and by no means do I intend to suggest any woman try them instead of a theraputic procedure. Medical supervision is there to keep women safe. But if Dr.s can no longer legally take care of women, we must be prepared to take care of ourselves.

So no, I wouldn't leave for that reason. Somebody has to stay around to fight the good fight.

[LimpingLib]

21. If sniffing paint were banned would you move?

O wait ... it is banned. Ive seen cops go after some poor guy on TV for doing that.

Im telling you people , the solution to this problem is electing politicians who care about civil libertys. We only hurt ourselves when we make a big issue over just 1 issue.

If we have full civil rights then we have full privacy to do whatever we want with our bodys in the form of eating , drinking , smoking , medical.If we have full medical privacy rights then a doctor has no right to talk to police / CIA / FBI and police/CIA /FBI have no right to snoop into our records. No right to be in the operating room. No right for the CIA/FBI to talk to a mental health doctor except to say hi..nice day..goodbye.


Im beginning to think WE DEMOCRATS have become the party of "fetus freaks" when we obsess over 1 single issue. Roe V Wade needs to be upgraded to actually include all rights , or we need a REAL privacy constitutional amendment then they can overturn Roe V Wade all they want or even have a Human Life Amendment for the unborn. The catch is that somebody can only be prosecuted if they openly admit to what they did since a REAL privacy constitutional amendment will render any attempt of police to get in the operating room as the procedure is happening IMPOSSIBLE.

This is another anti civil liberty "fetus freak" thread and I label them all that whether it is a rightwing anti-abortion thread or liberal pro-abortion rights thread. If it isnt in the context of civil libertys for all.Sadly we loose the fetus freak election battles. Maybe one of these days we will all get pounded so badly that it will magicaly knock some sense into us and get us serious about civil libertys. Sometimes I think (wishfully) a bunch of CIA moles infiltrate our minds and get us obsessed with just one civil right issue and agree to accept all other civil rights violations. or on the other hand we really could all be just so stupid and thus that is the explination for why we are always such "fetus freaks".

[Zynx]

22. No.(eom)

[MRKARNO]

23. Nope

People want it to be legal and thus even if the fundamentalists are successful in temporarily getting it banned, it will eventually be made legal again.

[DaveinMD]

24. if abortions are outlawed

only outlaws will have abortions.;-)

[fujiyama]

25. No

because abortion has no personal effect on me.

But outlawing abortion would be one more step toward a theocratic fascist state. Control of women's bodies (especially reproductive organs) is usually one of the true indications of theocracies and fascist governments.

So, I would be concerned as I would guess that teaching creationism in public schools, having ten commandments posted everywhere, school mandated prayers in public schools, and other steps wouldn't be too far behind...

At a certain point, I'd have to wonder if I'd want to have and raise any kids in such an atmosphere.

[LimpingLib]

27. No it would just turn back the clock a little.

Try pulling some of the "stunts" we did in Vietnam during WW1 or WW2. We would have been in jail if we were lucky. Many jurnalists were for sure.

WE would turn back the clock to the 60s Id say ,well the Patriot Act took us to even darker times , possibly uncharted terrirory (technological hell) actually thanks to technology.

Come to think of it the 60s was full of "radical" activists who were fairly pro civil libertys. Problem is that we got enough of a bone thrown that enough of our coalition (horney men who wanted to screw around and not have to worry about childcare expenses)in the form of Roe V Wade that it effectively saved the day for fascists as enough of our burgeoning movement simply got satisfied enough to their selfish ends.

Maybe we can benefit from turning back the clock as it might wake us up.I have no clue. Personnaly I highly doubt any cares abot civil rights till they loose THEIR right (First they came for Jews but I didnt care............)so maybe its we all get a little jolt to jump start our engines.

[rucky]

26. But it's not, so maybe the fundies should move. n/t

[robbedvoter]

28. So it's settled. Let's name ourselves Vichy Democrats and celebrate

The point of this poll is?

[Clark2008]

30. How 'bout "No, because I couldn't afford to."?

EOM

[Ima]

31. No but I would be mad.

[napi21]

32. Overturning Roe won't ban abortions. There would still be states

where they would be legal. I remember a very long time ago when I was growing up in Pgh, PA and women used to travel to NY for an abortion. Yes, there also were a lot of back alley abortions in all states, but there were states where they could be done legally. Things would revert back to that.

[ArthurDent]

34. Right. So what?

I wrote the question to get around that. Imagine if Congress passed a law criminalizing abortion and the courts upheld it. That's what I'm asking -- an outright, federal-level ban, not an overturn of RvW.

[StrongbadTehAwesome]

33. if it were banned outright, yes.

not that I could really afford to, but I'd be even less able to afford multiple pregnancies and kids. If we lived in enough of a whack-job nation that abortion was banned on a national level, there are many even more unpleasant things (beginning with elimination of birth control) that would probably follow shortly thereafter.

[PlanetBev]

38. The Right-to-Lifers will find out what a hollow victory feels like

This country is used to rights being given, not taken away. A number of things have changed since 1973. The Internet for one thing. There will be a whole cottage industry for abortion on the Net. RU486 will go on the Black Market. My mother told me that when she was growing up in Chicago in the 20's and 30's, there wasn't a dame on her block that didn't know where to go to get an abortion. My grandmother had one. If women could get information before 1973, try and see if you can stop them now.

The one silver-lining about all this. I absolutely believe that the Repuke party will splinter into a million pieces if Roe goes down. Count on it.

[countryjake]

44. No!

No, but I'd get real busy helping to re-establish the network necessary to provide help for women in crisis..."underground" as it used to be, not so long ago. A good old-fashioned D&C Railroad!

Why abandon the safety & sanity of half our nation's population?