To those blaming Kerry for this loss: you are scum. You are in his debt.

[leyton]

Yes, scum.

You can stand by your candidate when he is ahead in polls, when there is the expectation of victory, when he trounces Bush in a debate, but when fate hands Bush better cards, you abandon John Kerry? You leave your man when he needs you the most? You start second-guessing him now, the day after election day?

I don't claim to know what a Presidential campaign is like. But I imagine it involves late nights. Endless speeches. Kissing babies. Shaking hands. Planning. Money. Imagine not only have to endure media attention focused on yourself, but knowing also that Republicans are watching your wife - the love of your life who you do not want subjected to this - for every false move.

John Kerry gave two years of his life to be our standard-bearer, and you desert him.

John Kerry ran a fantastic campaign. He was focused like a laser at the end. He trounced Bush in three debates, delivering flawless performances. He picked the running mate we all yearned for. Sure, there were missteps - perhaps the Swift Boat attack could have been handled better, but in the end did that decide the election? But in the end, the reason Bush won, I think, was his excellent turnout. Yeah, Democrats were mobilized, but so were Republicans, more so than we wanted to think.

As for the concession of the election - no amount of contesting Ohio could have turned that state. There were hardly enough ballots left to count that could possibly swing the election, especially if you consider that many of those ballots were for Bush anyway.

So how about putting bitterness aside. Give John Kerry a rest. He's given this his all, and he deserves better than your scorn. He deserves your praise; he deserves your thanks.

[PROGRESSIVE1]

1. Kerry did everything he could.

The Sheeple are stupid

[nodehopper]

41. NO HE DID NOT. HE PROMISED to count every vote

and then rolled over and conceded before the actual votes came in, not to even mention challenging the voter suppression and intimidation.

He sold us out. Even his own VP was against this.

[BootinUp]

2. I have not blamed him

He ran a great campaign. I will not bore you with my analysis of why we lost, its been posted in other threads.

[Shadder]

3. And you can kiss my ass

Not gonna stop untill all the votes are counted. Right....

[bbernardini]

4. He deserves NOTHING.

He should have fought. He said he would fight. He didn't. "No surrender" was an empty promise. We KNOW there was voter fraud and intimidation in Ohio and Florida, but he just rolled over like everybody else seems to do for Bush.

Fuck Kerry. He's a worthless excuse for a Democrat, and I'm ashamed I spent my time, money and vote on him.

[PittLib]

10. If that is your opinion ...

you got what you deserved.

[bbernardini]

14. My comment to you would get me banned.

He promised he would fight for us, and he didn't. He's pathetic, and that's a fact.

[friesianrider]

31. Ditto.

Fucking Skull and Bones member. I should have known better. Kerry himself was probably a "plant" from Day 1. He had a miracle comeback in Iowa to sweep the primaries...against all polls and predictions. Sometimes it looked like he played right into the Republicans' hands.

He conceded too early, and his speech was less then encouraging. I'm disappointed in him and I'm sorry I wasted my time helping him.

[Cobalt Violet]

5. I agree.

The real blame is with we the people. The scum in the south.

[HappinessPie]

6. Amen! This is not his fault. "The people have spoken, damn them."

[MADem]

36. And the lazy youth stayed home n/t

[nodehopper]

40. yes, they did, through suppression and intimidation. And he didn't fight

like he promised he would. He rolled over before the tallies were even in.

[goddess40]

7. He said he would fight for us and he rolled over instead

so much for having our backs

[Kierkegaard]

19. OK, tell us what he should have done?

What where the next steps he should have taken? And I mean explain in detail for all us novices how he should have proceeded with nowhere to turn. What was his legal recourse? How was he going to pull votes out of his ass when there weren't any?

I've heard this shit 100 times this morning and I'm sick of it. Fairweather democrats are just undecideds that hate bush. Next time, vote for Nader if you can't deal with some dissappointment. You already know what you're getting up front.

[wurzel]

8. We don't blame Kerry for "losing". We blame him for "conceding".

He absolutely should NOT have conceded!

51. Exactly /nt

[PittLib]

9. Agreed ... for those of you turning your backs on JK

I beg you please - don't make me refocus my contempt. If that is what dems do... then I want no part of this party... it deserves what it gets. Kerry fought with all his heart. If you must blame someone, then blame the stupid masses and get out and fight on a local level. That is the only way to incite change. You can't blame someone for rolling over by rolling over.

[Blue Wally]

15. We can blame ourselves.....

The so-called "stupid masses" are just what they have always been since the dawn of the Republic. If we can't reach them, it is our fault. Lay out our own "Contract With America" in specific terms of the programs which we will enact if we take back the Congress in 2006. Each of our candidates agrees to run on basis of the contract. Credit Newt Gingrich with a truly great idea and adapt it for our own.

[bbernardini]

16. Fought with all his heart?

What color is the sky in your world? He didn't fight at all!

[Romulus Quirinus]

25. If these guys are so smart,

then why don't they get off their butts and run for president. You know, like JOHN KERRY did.

It takes guts to do that. It doesn't take anything but a modem to posture on the internet.

[el_gato]

11. flamebait

[Kierkegaard]

12. Hear, hear.

I've been getting slaughtered all morning by people calling Kerry a coward, milquetoast, a deserter, spineless, etc. It just made me absolutely sick to my stomach. I couldn't stand by and let it go uncontested.

The man did all he could do for us. He did the only thing he could do, at the end. When it's over, it's over, period. There was no other option available to him.

I say, hats off to a real man. It's a damn crying shame we weren't graced with his presidency to see what he was truly capable of.

[Doohickie]

13. Character is not how you act when you win,

it's how you handle defeat.

I'm gonna sound like Kerry here... we are ALL Americans. The worst thing we can do is sit around on the sidelines and watch our nation slip below the waters. We need to take the energies poured into the campaign and use them to transform America. All your time and effort that hitherto was spent campaigning for Kerry should now be spent volunteering to make a real difference in your community. Tap that same passion to teach kids to read, build homes for the homeless, coach little league or lead a scout group.

If we sit idly on the sidelines and sulk while the ship goes under, we are just as guilty as the Kaptain for its demise.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

55. Traitor?

Who the hell do you think you are?

Kiss My Ass.

[lojasmo]

17. I owe Kerry NOTHING

He was a candidate forced upon me by the DLC arm of the DNC and by the media.

John Kerry owes US for working our asses off for him despite the fact that his campaign abandoned the base to suck up to swing voters and disenfranchised republicans.

fie on your admonstrations.

[robbedvoter]

33. Beautifully said. Thank you.

[Egnever]

39. Well said!

Couldnt agree more Kerryu owes me for being willing to support him even though I knew he was worthless from the begining.

[bkcc]

18. I don't blame Kerry. I blame the idiots who voted for Dubya.

[doodlebugs4kerry]

21. Edwards is why we lost!

He wasn't even able to give us North Carolina! B@stard!

[leyton]

23. Boy, I sure hope you are joking.

He wasn't ever expected to carry NC.

[TSIAS]

49. That's crap

Before you blame Edwards, think of who chose him to be Vice President.

We all knew that Edwards wouldn't make us competitive in the South. We chose him to help with rural areas in the Midwest.

People don't vote for VP. If they did, Dan Quayle never would have been Vice President.

[pdx_prog]

56. Go away troll...

[sandnsea]

22. Guess we are whiny babies

Every time there was the slightest rift in this campaign, this board went into a tailspin, complete panic. No matter how many times others begged them to stay on message, fight back in a unified voice, stop spreading the right's talking points; they wouldn't listen. Now they do it again. We never had a chance because the different factions of the party never really came together. You have to run from the center to win and the left wouldn't let John Kerry do that. The fundies supported Bush, no matter what stupid thing he said.

[sadiesworld]

30. I guess I missed the big Nader numbers.

:eyes:

[justgamma]

24. Thank you!

I came here for a little comfort. I got a lot of Kerry bashing.
I have come to admire this man so much. He worked tirelessly for us. We don't know what's going on behind the scenes. They said the votes will be counted and I believe him.
I know you're mad, so am I. This man has never turned tail and ran in his life. If we are feeling this bad, think how bad all of them must feel.
Can we have 1 freaking thread in here giving kudos to Kerry without someone bashing him.

[Deja Q]

26. WTF?

Kerry's campaign was good, though it could have been better.

I'm pissed at Kerry for conceding on any number of questionable points, most notably the Diebold issue that literally screams "Big ass fraud by true scum."

Don't get off on telling me and others that we are scum.

BTW: I took a few minutes before posting to ensure I remained polite. I might take such hostile words and return them with equally hostile words if I feel insulted or threatened by any DUer who pulls this toddleresque game with anybody.

BTW2: How DARE you tell us we're scum and then say "put this thing to rest", not giving us an equal chance to respond? I won't comment further because I'd be pushing the envelope.

[kimchi]

27. Stop blaming Kerry.

He gave his all, but the bushmachine ran over us all.

He has my thanks; I was for Kucinich, but I really think Kerry deserves to be President. He would have been great.

[Toucano]

28. I agree with you.

I will be a Kerry-loving, Bush hater forever!

[phish420]

29. Agree...we can NOT blame Kerry or Edwards

They just turned out more voters...somehow, and I dont understand it, but they did...they got that evangelical community voting in such numbers, there was no way to surpass it.

[robbedvoter]

32. Kerry was not MY candidate - never my voice. gave him my vote anyway

He promissed to fight but folded. Gore who was never supported like that, fought and was then bashed for not continuing. Scum yourself with your Mr Softee candidate. Everything was done for him: the promaries, the media, the support. Almost as easy as W. And he doesn't give a damn about our stolen right to vote.

[Kierkegaard]

34. The 'scum' comment was a little brash.

I kind of overlooked that when reading the original post.

I'm not sure which election you were watching, but Kerry busted ass during the primaries. He wasn't relaxing on the beach, waiting for them to award him his candidacy. He went out there and TOOK it.

Media? Are you kidding? Kerry was all but invisible until the DNC, then the media under-reported him, gave preferential treatment to Scrub, and went WAY out of their way to give any damaging news HUGE air time.

Support? Of course he had support. What choice was there? Ever seen a candidate from either of the 2 major parties without support?

And don't waste your energy telling us what you don't know. You have no idea what he does or does not give a damn about.

[robbedvoter]

54. "I have no time for those crying in their teacups for stolen elections"

Also, Jan 6, 2001: "Nobody asked me, I wouldn't have done it anyway"
Your boy's words. he told me what he doesn't give a damn about: voting rights. Look at my handle. I still voted for him. he didn't hold our for counting votes - so I have no right to be angry? What other rights don't I have Mr Asscrack?

[nodehopper]

42. yep. I pinched my nose and supported him

And that scum just sold out all of his supporters.

[Snivi Yllom]

35. I dont blame Kerry, I blame those who sold him to us

the DLC and the corporate Democrats

[nodehopper]

37. oh no. He broke his promise. He is scum.

He made fun of Gore for giving up too early, and he conceded before the votes were even in.


We fought for him and he sold us out with the lamest excuse possible...divided...healing...blah blah blah.

[Greylyn58]

38. Kerry Was A Great Candidate

Please stop blaming him for the stealing of the votes by the Repugs because they couldn't run a clean race.

He ran his heart out as did John Edwards. They both did everything they could.

I love them both and think they would have been incredible Prez and Vice-Prez.

[Senior citizen]

43. I'm in HIS debt? Did he send ME money?

The promise was that every vote would be counted.

A concession means that every vote will not be counted.

There was massive voter disenfranchisement, black box voting fraud, and now a myth that the enormous turnout wasn't ours. Kerry got twice as many votes in my precinct, and I heard that the turnout was similar everywhere. Once more we get the popular majority vote, and lose the election. This wasn't supposed to happen again.

Now that it has, our only chance was to fight--to demand recounts and take it to the courts and fight to see that every vote counted. With pukes in control of the executive, legislative and judiciary branches of government, there is no second chance. We were told there would be no concession. I'm not in the habit of being grateful for being lied to.

With everything at stake here, where was the leader and where was the fight? With 10,000 lawyers, where was the determination to see that every vote counted?

What's really tragic is that next time, if there is a next time, the Democratic Party might really get organized, the candidate might be a decent, honest person ready to fight for democracy, and they'll lose because of people like me who'll be voting Green because I'm tired of getting fooled and misled, and because I'd like to vote my conscience for a change before I die.

But I'm not as angry at Kerry as I am at the people here who have been slamming Nader. Nader never quit. He fought to get on the ballot and he fought for every vote. I wouldn't have voted for him--I'd have voted for Cobb, the Green Party candidate, but Nader was never to blame for the previous election, any more than he's to blame for this one. With a corporate two-party system, systemic voter disenfranchisement, widespread black box voting fraud, an undemocratic electoral college system, and major candidates who don't really care if we have a democracy or not, it was really easy to blame Nader, wasn't it? How about now? Did he send out the absentee ballots in Florida the day before the deadline for returning them? Did he send thousands of pukes to Ohio to harass and challenge voters? Did he manufacture the Diebold machines with no paper trail? We have a deeply flawed system, and his biggest fault is recognizing it and speaking up about it. But why not be fair about it. You blame Nader, I'll blame Kerry, and the fascists can continue to destroy the environment, wage unjust wars, ruin the economy, and do whatever else they like. You say it is Nader's fault for taking votes away from Dems, and I'll say it was Kerry's fault for conceding instead of fighting to the last vote recount.

[smirkymonkey]

50. Thank You!

I am not as angry at Kerry as I am at the Bush cabal, but HE is the one who is in our debt.

Many people devoted their time, resources, money, physical and emotional well-being to his campaign. And what does he do? Gives up without a shred of a fight.

[CityDem]

44. Let's face it -- Kerry was a lousy candidate

He had very few accomplishments in the Senate and was unwilling to take strong positions on issues until the last month of the campaign when his new advisor's told him what to say. Given the closeness of the race speaks volumes about how lousy a president GWB is. Think about what a good candidate would have done last night. I give Kerry credit for trying, but he was a lousy candidate.

[jeff_thompson]

45. I Agree 100%

I thank John Kerry for running a good campaign. My wife, Joyce, and I were volunteers in Florida and worked hard to get him elected. The fault lies with the American People. The fact that they didn't "buy" the truth cannot be blamed on John Kerry.

Now my wife and I have to find a democratic country to live in. Totalitarian America isn't for us.

[Meshuga]

46. Amen!

I see people are bitter we lost and it sucks. I'm also disappointed but to hate Kerry for losing is ridiculous. This was a great campaign. It's not his fault that the American people are so gullable and fall for fear and dumb social issues.

I support the senator and I am proud of the campaign he ran. I'm disappointed he lost but the American people now has the government it deserves.

PS. The way the media run nowadays there would be no FDR since Hoover would probably have a better chance to win after a terrible administration.

47. Scum? Because I blame Kerry?

I don't really care about your words, its you sentiment that matters to me. You seem to think that I shouldn't criticize our blessed leader.

FUCK THAT. That attitude got us here.

Yes, I DO blame Kerry for one reason. He quit. As a resault, I don't owe him shit. What has he lost?

I'm as pissed off as I can be, but I won't call him scum. nor you.

Take your insults home.

[WillyT]

48. I Don't Blame Kerry, I Blame The American People !!!

:evilfrown:

[Sean Reynolds]

52. John Kerry was NEVER my man.

I didn't like him during the primaries and I don't like him now.

So I say, FUCK John Kerry.

[johan helge]

53. John Kerry is a hero

That many here don't see this, is just another example - along with this election - of how little many understand. I know, it sounds conceited, but it's a damned fact.

[Kierkegaard]

57. Another interesting factoid:

this thread is a prime example of why we won't be able to win another general election without some form of unity, organization and discipline.

If we can't stop fighting with each other long enough to unite against a common enemy, how will we ever get anything accomplished?

That we even have to have this conversation makes me ill...

58. We did unite behind Kerry

I was an ardent Dean supporter, but I burned that bridge (to some extent) in an effort to unite behind Kerry.

I gave it my all. Less than others, I admit, but all that I could.

All I have to show for it is a cheesy death threat at work and a handful of regret.

[robbedvoter]

60. Everyone here voted for your boy. We didn't marry him so lay off.

He is in our debt for out putting our confidence in him. I think highly of my vote. He was supposed to make sure it was counted.

[sangh0]

61. I suggest you make note of who's blaming Kerry

and when the Archives open, take a look and see what their position was before the Iowa caucuses.

[dicknbush]

59. I go back to 2000....

And hold that twerp scum self serving cretin Nader responsible for this. If he hadn't sucked votes in Florida Gore would have won. If I ever cross his path I will spit right in his face so hard it will knock his eyes out!

[Kerry in 04]

62. I was behind him even after it was evident he lost. What pissed me....

off was him conceding the bright and early the day after the election.:(

[Skwmom]

63. In debt to a self-serving politician who put his own desire

for power ahead of doing what was right for this country (of course he had practice in voting to send poor kids off to die so that it wouldn't hurt his run for president)? Surely you jest.

[LTRS]

64. I agree - blaming Kerry is bullcrap

He was brilliant in the debates and while every candidate makes missteps along the way, he ran a good campaign.

As for conceeding - litigating would not have changed a thing.

65. This is such a hypocritical thread

we're scum because we criticize Kerry. Oh no! Don't we know what he sacrificed?

Yet, you criticize us. You have no idea what we sacrificed, but you call us scum.

Then you walk away, patt yourself on the back, and feel like citizen.

Hypocrite.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

66. In his debt? For managing to lose to an incoherant boob?

Tell him the check is in the mail.

He waffled, he apologized, he justified, he pandered, he killed a goose, and he still couldn't beat an obvious nincompoop.

In debt to him? He owes us an apology for being such a pathetic candidate.

[Moderator]

67. Locking.....

This is flamebait. Feel free to repost
with a less opening post.

Thank you.

DU Moderator