I dearly hope there are a ton of indictments waiting for Rove on Jan 20

[NEOBuckeye]

Is it wrong for me to want to see that vile bastard crushed under the sheer weight of the justice he so desperately has worked to subvert and evade these past four years? I think not.

I want to see this man utterly and completely humiliated and broken. It will never be enough, however, considering all of the lives that have been hurt and lost as a result of his terrible, destructive methodology.

[sundancekid]

1. my fantasy? frog-march the lot of them at President Kerry Inaugural Balls

[punpirate]

2. It will be very interesting to see...

... the list of pardons Bush will sign on his last day in office. We may not get the answers to who was behind the Plame outing, for example, from the courts in the next few months, but we will from that list.

:grr:

[ogradda]

3. can he pardon people

who haven't been convicted yet?

[RafterMan]

4. Ford did

[ogradda]

10. so he did

i thought he could do that 'cause nixon was a president

[punpirate]

8. Yes.

Presidential pardons may apply to crimes committed up through the day of the pardon, even though they may not yet have been identified or prosecuted.

The prime example of that, as others have mentioned, is Ford's pardon of Nixon. No indictments had been issued, nor had impeachment formally begun, when the Nixon pardon was issued.

Cheers.

[ogradda]

11. can he give himself a pardon?

or would kerry have to do that?:evilgrin:

[punpirate]

12. The guidelines are set by the...

... Justice Department's Pardon Attorney:

http://usgovinfo.about.com/blprespardons.htm

There are virtually no limitations on pardons, except that they do not apply to impeachments. So, technically, yes, the President could pardon himself, although doing so would likely create considerable political baggage for himself and his party.

The language related to Presidential pardons is in Art. II, Sec. 2, of the Constitution.

Cheers.

[ogradda]

13. somehow i don't think he gives a shit about his party

i doubt that would stop him. i've never seen him hold his hand for the sake of anybody ever.

[RafterMan]

5. Number one on his list...

George W. Bush

[ozymandius]

6. The presidential pardon cannot, by law, extend to treason.

A sitting president cannot apply a pardon to himself.

[punpirate]

9. Unfortunately for this instance...

... treason is narrowly enough defined that Bush likely could not be convicted under that law. Unless it can be shown that Bush intended to subvert the security of the US by his actions, it's not treason. Being simply stupid, arrogant, greedy and secretive isn't enough.

Now, however, if some adroit prosecutor were to find evidence that Bush let an attack occur because he chose to instead protect the business partners of his father, that would be another matter, entirely.

[depakid]

14. Now, what would be interesting....

is if the conspiracy theorists here and elsewhere turn up evidence that Bush knew about significant details of the 9-11 plot and did nothing to prevent it. I wonder what the standard for intent is? Would reckless disregard be enough? What acts or omissions might be considered proof of intent?

Not that I believe that, necessarily- I just think that he and the administration were negligent. Still, it's an interesting hypothetical.

[punpirate]

15. If there were prior warnings...

... say, some the general public and justice are not aware of now, and there's a clear trail of general inaction after those warnings, and cover-up of same after the fact, yes, that could be shown as intent, especially if done for political purposes.

[oscar111]

7. moved to social issues forum

....