Sharpton's charge against Dean lead story nationwide

[mouse7]

I just looked at google news... Sharpton got himself the top story on Google, and it looks like it's the lead or a lead story all across the country. The corporate media is lapping this up.

Sharpton may have REALLY hurt the party this time. After all the work the Dean supporters have done, if they come out of this process tainted as "supporters of racists" for supporting a candidate Sharpton has basically publically declared "racist", they will never come back to the Democratic Party. Never.

[hellhathnofury]

1. Thanks Al! Now the media can ignore the O'Neill story.

[slinkerwink]

2. thank you Al!

seriously, go fuck yourself.

[auburnblu]

60. He asked a question that needed to be ask.

Too often we hear Diversity, diversity, I love diversity. But often when it comes to certain areas there are some people that love diversity for everyone other than themselves. The so how have you "personally hired a diverse staff"

We've seen some discussion on this board about college professors and some have acknowledged that most lean to the left. Will anyone on here but me acknowledge that in some academic departments you almost have to wonder, do they understand that a professor can be black or hispanic. I have heard a lot of white professors speak on behalf of affirmative-action for students. But when it comes to professors, hold on now, let's not be too hasty seems to be the attitude.

Dean has been arrogant on the issue of race in the campaign. I suppose he thought no one would actually challenge him on the issue.

[hellhathnofury]

62. Holy leaping Rummy's a Lieberman supporter!

Have you looked at Vermont's demographics lately? I'm all for AA but I need some basic qualifications in the field. Find me someone who should have gotten a job but didn't.

We got challenged before, Al said a month ago that we had an "anti-Black agenda," didn't stick then won't stick now. You should check some of our endorsements, Jesse Jackson Jr. and John Conyers are fine with our record and positions.

[incapsulated]

4. Trust me

That story was going to be buried without Sharpton's help.

[mouse7]

5. Yep. O'Neill story now knock out of "Top Stories"

It's 2nd in the US Stories on Google News.

[hellhathnofury]

7. Probably would have gotten buried anyways.

But it's absent on the LATimes site. Sharpton got shafted by Gep in the headlines. Sharpton gets more play on the NYT site than O'Neill.

[Rocinante]

6. I agree

The O'Neill story needs to stay out there. But I'm afraid it will go on the back burner along with the Plame story, etc.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[slinkerwink]

9. I was disheartened to hear your homophobic comments in the other thread

:shrug:

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hellhathnofury]

24. Oh Lord why hath thou forsaken thy creation?

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hellhathnofury]

28. Why did god bring hate into the world?

We'eve been forsaken, I swear it.

[mouse7]

26. You called Sharpton a "street pimp"

I'm furious with Sharpton right now, but I'd never stoop to horrible stereotyping.

[hellhathnofury]

30. I live in a Garden of Eden.

[mouse7]

31. PM me next time :)

[_Jumper_]

8. Do you really think they will leave the party...

...just because one candidate brought up Dean's hiring practices as governor?

Dean's record is fair game. He should have practiced what he preaches now and reached out to have a diverse cabinet. Are you telling me he couldn't find ONE qualified black or Latino person in the entire state? ONE?

[Maddy McCall]

10. Problem isn't the messenger...it's the message.

Sharpton's not the problem; Dean's cabinet appointments are.

[shance]

11. No of course its the messenger as well. Does he not have the self control

to shut his opportunistic, self-serving mouth?

[Maddy McCall]

14. I've seen some of the same people here celebrating Sharpton's message

in the past, but when it hit home tonight, he became self-serving and opportunistic.

Uh huh.

[mouse7]

33. Sharpton didn't call anyone a racist until tonight

Sharpton is ticked at Dean because Jesse Jackson Jr. endorsed Dean.

[Kahuna]

72. When did Sharpton call Dean a racist???? I'm baffled...

When did he do that? Pointing out the truth that Dean didn't practice what he now "preaches" is not racist. I know plenty of people in NJ which is a very racially diverse state who don't interact with people of color very much. If I say that, am I calling them racist???!!! No, I am not. I'm just making a statement of fact and nothing is implied other than that they may be clueless about people of color. Period.

[mouse7]

96. I was reacting to the coverage last night

It looked like the issue was going in front of the news cycle all week. It looked like they were preparing to make it have "stake in the heart" importance.

This morning, the O'Neill book is back almost at the top of the scroll, and the coverage has slipped down to something more appropriate.

I'm not saying this doesn't deserve coverage. Dean's cabinet makeup was clearly not a terribly smart thing to have overlooked if one is considering a run for President. It looks like it was "overlooked" and that does mean that Dean shouldn't be lecturing on the subject of race. People who "overlook" things aren't racists, but they aren't masters of cultural sensitivity, either. It's time for Dean to become portray more of a "happily tutored" image regarding racial issues.

[retyred]

91. So dean can shoot from the lip

about everyone else and it's OK, but when the tables are turned, it's "his opportunistic, self-serving mouth?"

Sharpton was right....dean was asked about it, if dean's answer was less than ideal then that's dean's shortcoming not Al's for questioning it.

dean is not always the victim his supporters paint him as.


retyred in fla
“Good-Night Paul, Wherever You Are”
So I read this book

[Melodybe]

13. Bull! Dean has had an exceptional record as Gov.

Sharpton is making a fool of himself.

[mouse7]

18. Fine... watch Dean's supporters walk.

They will. They aren't attached to the party. They are cynical about the political process. That's why they stayed out of the political process up to this point.

If Dean campaign ends in a ludicrous storm of race-baiting, they will walk out of the Democratic Party forever.

[tameszu]

69. So Sharpton's comments will do what Dean's own dirty tricks won't?

Like handing out negative attack flyers at other candidates' events (and then denying responsibility for doing so) after demanding to the head of the party that other candidates stop attacking him? This kind of behavior won't make new voters who are disenchanted with the cynicism of politics walk away from Dean?

No, I think if there is any virtue to Dean's candidacy, it's that many of his supporters are willing to defend anything he says or does, to constantly frame him as the victimized wing of the party, and to turn every legitimate flaw he has into something that's been unfairly created by someone else. Other candidates' attacks won't have much of an effect. The only thing that will peel new supporters from Dean is his own gaffes and maybe the arrogance of some of his supporters.

[Kahuna]

73. Not just Dean supporters.

nt

[w4rma]

105. So… 1 hispanic, 1 african-american, 1 asian, 1 arab, 2 caucasians?

Is that the cabinent that the Dean bashers wanted him to have? Good grief.

Just remember that this is ONLY his cabinent of 6 that we are talking about here.

For reference (Census 2000):
Ethic makeup of Vermont:
One race: 98.8%
White: 96.8%
Black or African American: 0.5%
American Indian and Alaska Native: 0.4%
Asian: 0.9%
Asian Indian: 0.1%
Chinese: 0.2%
Filipino: 0.1%
Japanese: 0.1%
Korean: 0.1%
Vietnamese: 0.2%
Other Asian: 0.1%
Native Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander: <0.1%
Native Hawaiian: <0.1%
Guamanian or Chamorro: <0.1%
Samoan: <0.1%
Other Pacific Islander: <0.1%
Some other race: 0.2%
Two or more races: 1.2%
http://factfinder.census.gov/servlet/QTTable?ds_name=DEC_2000_SF1_U&geo_id=04000US50&qr_name=DEC_2000_SF1_U_DP1

[clarknyc]

12. You're so determined...

so why don't you provide us with a name. Who is that "ONE qualified black or Latino person in the entire state?" Start with Google...

[hellhathnofury]

17. I second. Find me someone qualified and I'll complain to the campaign.

[mouse7]

21. You don't get it. It doesn't matter if none are there

Dean supporters know Dean is not a racist. Everyone here knows Dean is not a racist.

If Dean and Dean supporters are crushed in a storm of race-baiting, they will walk and never return.

[_Jumper_]

25. Wow

Here we have people that are among the most liberal in America saying that there was not ONE--ONE--Latino or black person who had the ability to be a cabinet member. Folks, many Dean supporters have made this comment tonight. What is the implication of this excuse?

[mouse7]

29. He did have a diverse staff.

Dean had many minorities on his staff, however Sharpton found one statitistal anomaly in an administration with a good record on the issue and played it for all it was worth.

That's what race-baiting IS.

[Maddy McCall]

34. You argument is like saying that the school adminstrator had a racially

diverse school because the janitors were black, even though all of the teachers and principals were white.

Cabinet positions are hugely different from staff positions. Cabinet positions demand great trust--the governor appoints people in whom he has the highest faith.

Staffers on the other hand take care of everything from getting correspondence out to mailing brochures.

So this isn't a valid argument. The people in whom Dean placed his highest degree of trust were not black.

[mouse7]

37. Neither were the people Dean served.

There's as many blacks in Vermont as there are in Norway. It's not Dean's fault Vermont hasn't been a place African-Americans chose to live.

Let's look at the appointments made in Scandinavian countries. Scandinavian countries are considered as "enlightened" as any in the world. Lets look at how many Aftrican-Scandinavians are appointed to high positions in Norway and Sweden.

[_Jumper_]

42. Race

They aren't very enlightened on the issue of race.

[mouse7]

44. well... go ask some people that are

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AfricanAmericansForDean/?yguid=141315434

You can ask them how they feel about Gov. Dean's record on race.

[mouse7]

45. well... go ask some people that are

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AfricanAmericansForDean/?yguid=141315434

You can ask them how they feel about Gov. Dean's record on race.

[mbali]

77. And when the Scandinavians start lecturing the rest of us about race

relations, I'll be happy to point out why they're full of crap, too.

[hellhathnofury]

43. Actually staff can be very important. Ever watch the West Wing?

Staffers do all sorts of policy work and behind the scenes negotiations.

[beaconess]

82. Do you get all of your ideas about

government from a fictional television show.

[AngryAmish]

90. I learned about space flight

from "Lost in Space." Rule #1 - keep weaselly professors off the spaceship.

[Fleshdancer]

99. Not exactly

It would be like having a small school board that was white with schools that had a diverse group of teachers, principals, etc.

Senior level staff members does not equate to janitors. :eyes:

[_Jumper_]

35. Good record on the issue?

What was Dean's record on race as governor?

[mouse7]

46. Why don'tr you ask some who are qualified to answer

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AfricanAmericansForDean/?yguid=141315434

They are the best qualified group of people to ask.

[_Jumper_]

51. They may be a little biased

;)

[mouse7]

52. Ahhh The opinions of African Americans suddenly don't count...

...if YOU say they don't count.

[Kahuna]

74. As Sharpton correctly pointed out, Governors recruit from...

out of state all the time. Dean didn't do that. Now it's valid to say that since Vermont is virtually all white, there was no reason for Dean to seek diversity. Fine. But that also means that Dean is in the least position to preach this issue and pretend that he is the "only" candidate who is down with black folks. Dean made it an issue. I'm glad that Sharpton has finally called him on it. Someone should have called him on it long ago.

[mouse7]

97. See #96

[mouse7]

15. Yes...they will leave.

There's too many good people out there that have work too hard to get Dumbya thrown out of office to end out being tainted by bullshit charges of racism.

If the corporate media detonates this mess like it looks like they are, and Dean gets tagged with racism charges that end his campaign, they will take their money and energy and walk.

[_Jumper_]

19. It is a legitimate issue

What in Dean's record proves that he isn't a racist?

[hellhathnofury]

22. What proves that he is?

[_Jumper_]

36. Nothing proves that either

However, there is some evidence that causes some people to raise questions.

[hellhathnofury]

40. We'll Clark hasn't come out strongly against don't ask don't tell.

I think I might start to infer something. Get my drift?

[hellhathnofury]

23. What in Clark's record proves that he isn't opposed to gays?

[CWebster]

61. The story goes

Dean realized that he had a matriarchy in his administration and suggested that they might hire a couple of men, to which the humorous reply was there weren't any "qualified" enough. As a woman, listening to the testosterone poisoned rantings of middle-aged men glorifying their gory glory days of military service as some sort of pre-requisite for leadership, I'll take the matriarchy that seeks alternative priorities than dick-strutting.

[Kahuna]

68. Exactly. It's a valid issue. America is not Vermont...

America is not 98% white. As a black person I kinda prefer a candidate like Clinton who had a clue about people of color.

[corporatewhore]

16. I dont think deans a racist

I just think he is full of hot air and hasnt walked his talk

[slinkerwink]

39. he has.......he's championed civil rights in Vermont

[corporatewhore]

49. You mean his

anti aff. action pro gun pro death penalty (a very racist institution) record from vermont

[killbotfactory]

32. Sharpton should get a new cabinet position

"Secretary of race-baiting demagoguery"

[hellhathnofury]

38. Secretary of Self-Promotion.

If Al wants to play hard, boy is he in for a fight.

[Adjoran]

41. It's a set-up

Sharpton brings out Dean's weakness on race - that he is from a state that is 98% white - so that Dean will need Sharpton's help with the black vote. That means a prime-time speech at the convention and maybe a symbolic post in the campaign, which would boost Sharpton's image for his other projects (which is why he's running for President in the first place).

[Printer70]

47. Democrat says Latino candidate is "house Mexican"...

...in California. Either we confront the fact that we're not as tolerant as we say we are, or we'll keep getting hit and deserve as much.

[hellhathnofury]

48. If I was going to deliver that message...

my message sure wouldn't be Al. He ain't exactly a saint.

[imax2268]

50. If Sharpton wants to talk about race...

fine...let's talk about Tawana Brawely...

this is just one way for Sharpton to get his name in the headlines...although it won't do any good...I respeceted him for being a democrat and not being afraid to speak out...but now he's gone to far...

If Sharpton won the presidency...how many whites would he have in his cabinet...or blacks for that matter...

[auburnblu]

55. It is sad

Comments like that and Hillary's recent comment do make me wonder.

[auburnblu]

How diverse will the caucus groups be?

Oh I do have a feeling when I'm watching the news that most of the caucus groups shown will not exactly be the role models for diversity.

[Le Taz Hot]

102. With that statement

I know you don't have any idea how the caucus process works. May I suggest you look up "Delegate Forms" from your state party website? I believe you will be enlightened.

[no name no slogan]

107. You don't need to file to be a delegate at a caucus state

Just a point of information:

Caucus delegates are selected BY THE CAUCUS-GOERS, not by the party or campaign. Unlike the primaries, ANYBODY can be elected as a delegate from the precinct caucus.

Each precinct caucus elects delegates that go on to the county (or state senate district) convention. Delegates from the county conventions elect delegates to go on to the congressional district conventions. CD convention delegates elect delegates to go to the state convention AND to the national convention (depending on how the state works). State convention delegates may also run for "at-large" seats for the national convention.

I went all the way to my state's convention in 1988, without any prior political experience. Caucuses are truly participatory democracy at its very best.

[auburnblu]

56. Maybe this will cause some to really think about diversity

n/t

[mouse7]

53. Now it's Yahoo lead story.

Here it comes.

[hellhathnofury]

54. And O'Neill being ignored.

AP needs to fire their headline writer. Check the weapons cache story.

[mouse7]

58. Oh fer Gawd sake

Yea! Dumbya captured 2 AK-47s and a mortar.

FUCK!

[hellhathnofury]

59. This is what the headline should have been about...

Protesters Clash with Troops Amid Call's for Elections

"Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Husseini al-Sistani's hardened stand came as hundreds of protesters clashed with British troops in a southern city and an ongoing purge of Saddam Hussein (news - web sites)'s Baath party members reportedly removed 28,000 Iraqis from their jobs."

What a liberal media?

[CWebster]

57. Sharpton up to his usual antics

Missed his latest performance but caught his previous acts. He had to do something to get a little face time and the only way to do that, as the rest of the boys know as well, is to latch on Dean's coat tails and yank hard. the corporate vote laps it up. They can't possibly be out to win my vote.

[Renew Deal]

66. Are you saying Sharpton is corporate?

There is no corporation that will go near the guy. My 2 theories are that he wants to make a play for the black vote or he doesn't like Dean for some reason. He has said Dean's policies are anti-black.

[CWebster]

70. Meant to say"corporate press"

but when I went to go back and change it too much time had expired. It was what,3:30 in the morning? Give me a break.

It's all Sharpton has got and that was pretty much gone when Dean got Jesse Jr's endorsement.

[lib 4 all]

63. the media will always look for something

to distract from what is really going on

[JNelson6563]

64. Headline: Sharpton plays race card!

What a shocker!! :eyes:

Julie

[Rose Siding]

89. Sharpton's remarks with his very first debate question

jokingly implied an element of race. He said something like, "I was wondering when I was going to get a chance to talk here at the Black and Brown forum!". This was a little ironic, I thought, considering the people he was gently chiding were both people of color.

He was spoiling for a race fight and it was poetically just that CMB was the one who finally slapped him for it.

[Renew Deal]

65. I agree that it was bad.

I don't think what happened to Dean yesterday was appropriate. If VT is 97% white and Dean has 6 people in his cabenet, he is much closer to matching the makeup of the population than if he even hired one minority.

You all saw the bad side of Sharpton last night. I used to despise the guy. I warmed up to him because he was hammering Bush. Last night was terrible.

I also think that all this is helping paint Dean as a racist, rightly or wrongly. If you keep shouting it, it will stick and Dean has had this come up a few times now.

Dean looked bad last night and Sharpton really made it worse. I didn't believe Dean was the best before and I think he is a worse choice now. Too much baggage.

[Kahuna]

67. True maybe. But when Dean begins to preach race to ..

the other candidates, who ALL have had much more experience with racial diversity, it's a fair call by Sharpton. The hypocrasy should be pointed out.

[CWebster]

71. Well, you are going to spin it to your agenda

no surprise there.

[Kahuna]

75. "My agenda?" Excuse me if as a black person I would like..

to have a president who has a clue about black and brown people. I would like to have a president who has experience with diversity and doesn't just preach about it.

[CWebster]

78. I don't believe I was addressing you, but

if you have an issue with Dean's views on race, maybe you should take it up with Jeese, Jr and the numbers of other Afro-Americans who have chosen to endorse Dean over Sharpton, or any of the others, for that matter.

AND, as a woman, I appreciate Deans efforts to overwhelmingly appoint women. You were saying?

[Kahuna]

84. Oops! Sorry. If I have a problem with Dean...

I'll take it up with Dean. Why should I take it up with anybody else.

[CWebster]

86. Don't know, you were taking it up with me. nt

[Renew Deal]

88. Is my agenda to defend Dean?

I said Sharpton was wrong.

[White Mountain]

79. Me too (swirching support)

***I didn't believe Dean was the best before and I think he is a worse choice now. Too much baggage.***

If he can't handle Sharpton, the general election will be brutal.

Dean's Jesus strategy will not work in the South any better that his let's discuss race will work with minorities AND for the same reason.... He has not got a track record that shows these are core beliefs. They are easily dismissed as positioning for election. Southerners and minorities won't buy it.

Yet I am wondering where to go? Clark is a new convert and I am wary of him.

I'm ready to go with Dennis K!

[CWebster]

92. it is incredibly sad that anyone can be convinced

to switch their support based on such a deceptive grandstanding bid on the part of Sharpton. It wasn't like Dean threw the Tawanna Brawley incident in Sharpton's face OR his little "jewish problem"

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0146/goldstein.php

At least it is based on more than the pathetic attempts to smear Dean as a racist.

[mbali]

76. So much for the brilliant Dean strategy

How could Dean let this happen? He brought all of this on himself, yet looked like a deer caught in the headlights last night.

How could a candidate who has been strutting and bragging and preening and lecturing for months about how great he is on race not have bothered to figure out how to respond to questions about his own record on affirmative action? Didn't it ever occur to him or his brilliant campaign strategists that this question could come up, especially given how he has positioned himself as the end-all-and-be-all on all things concerning race relations?

Had he even thought about this, they could have very easily come up with explanations that could have lightened the blow (they certainly could have prepped him to say something better than that stupid Trent Lott line, which only made things worse). Or they could have, like most good campaigns, done a preemptive strike by getting the information out first, before having it thrown in his face in the middle of a debate the week before the Iowa Caucus.

Were they too busy to think about this? Or is this another example of the gross arrogance this candidate and his campaign have demonstrated.

If they think that Sharpton tripped him up - fairly or unfairly - imagine what Bush and Rove will do to this guy in the general.

Last night was Exhibit A for why this guy is just not ready for Prime Time.

[White Mountain]

81. well said

Exactly my reason for swithching direction to Dennis K

[NewYorkerfromMass]

93. He's stupid for not having an answer

it's unbelievable as well.

[CWebster]

94. Garbage

women benefited more than any other minority under AA and Dean went out of his way to hire women. It isn't like he could hire minorities who weren't even there.

Isn't it tragic how everyone is so focused on tripping up Dean-with some sort of case manufactured out of thin air, while Paul O'Neill is condemning Bush.

And you worry about what Rove will do to Dean, while you help Rove construct baseless atttacks and help any substantial story to bring down Bush, get buried.

The garbage you spew just causes me to view your argument with less credibility than I did yesterday.

[beaconess]

80. So sad

Many of the Dean supporters are showing their true colors. They've been talking shit for months, lecturing everybody within reach about race, how their guy is so progressive, blah, blah, blah. But the minute his racial bonafides are called into question, they're resorting to exactly the kind of apologist justifications for discrinination that I expect to hear from Republicans - "there are no qualified minorities in Vermont," "how dare you talk about race!" "You're playing the race card!" etc.

It is really sickening. But it's good that people are seeing that this campaign ain't all it's cracked up to be. It' clear that at least some of Dean's support comes from people who don't give a damn about civil rights.

Thanks for sharing.

[Marian]

85. May I

worship at your beaconess? I am serious!

Dean: from broker to doctor to governor to president...he's entitled!

Give me a break.

The 'emperor's new clothes peel off just a bit every time he has to discuss something with others...but the race stuff always gets him.


Your beaconess:
:yourock:

:pals:


:kick:

[Kahuna]

83. Once again, Sharpton neither stated or implied Dean is..

racist. Pointing out that Dean never in his many years as Govenor reached out to recruit a minority is not calling him racist. It's only pointing out that Dean is not the best person to be instructing the rest of us on race.

[wndycty]

87. Exactly, Sharpton did not state a falsehood. . .

. . .if there is another candidate who has a better record on race that should be considered.

[CWebster]

95. This is wrong.

Because a specific minority isn't represented in the population, doesn't mean that efforts to hire minorities weren't undertaken. Dean hired so many women, it was a joke in VT that white males couldn't get a job.

It is through no fault or intent of Dean's and it was dishonest and disgusting of Sharpton to suggest it was somehow deliberate. What a sleazebag Sharpton is. His credibility is truly shot and anyone who would grab onto Sharpton's coat-tails as he grabs onto Dean's should be ashamed of themselves.

[beaconess]

100. Yes, maybe Dean really tried to diversify his cabinet...

So, I look forward to hearing Dean tell us what affirmative steps he took to recruit and appoint qualified minorities to his cabinet and why he was unable to do so.

I'll wait.

[CWebster]

104. You mean women?

Or should he put out a nationwide call to fill the positions with the "appropriate" minority candidates? It wouldn't stop the chorus of bitching.

[maddezmom]

98. International press as well

CNNI just replayed the clips from the debate with Sharpton, Edwards, and Dean.

[ecstatic]

101. Give me a break. Sharpton asked a valid question. Blame the media

for their selective choices on headlines/news. They only cover controversy (i.e. Kerry cursing, etc.) and things that will tear down the Democratic candidates. They never really focus on the numerous Bush f*ck ups and lies. Don't blame Sharpton for this.

[Le Taz Hot]

103. Ah, the Rev. Sharpton

how nice that we can always count on him for the obligatory race-baiting AND that there will always be people out there willing to be used as bullhorns. :eyes:

I'll be glad when the first primaries are over -- The Rev. Al's 15 minutes are LONG past due.

[diamondsoul]

106. Mouse, you have driven me bonkers

in other threads with your comments about Kucinich, but man, I can ignore that for this. I'm right behind you.

This marks a huge first for me. I'm absolutely livid at Sharpton's unfounded charge last night. I have never been this pissed off in Dean's defense before! LOL

I need some help with something from Dean supporters. Is there any way to find out how many of Dean's cabinet members had to be replaced over the 12 years he Governed? I am absolutely defending the man against this charge and someone claims "numerous people" occupied positions on his Cabinet during his 12 year tenure. I don't buy that because I've noticed that once an Official sets up a Cabinet they try not to have to change it much along the way. The requirements and responsibilities are too big, and they have to know the people are loyal and trustworthy.

So can anyone help me counter that claim?

[Constitution]

108. Is this a threat on the part of the Dean supporters to leave the party?

Could it be that many of these people are not now and never were Democrats?