Remember those refugee camps we all read about a few months ago?

[Buttercup McToots]

Is this one?
Please tell me I'm just a silly paranoid person...

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8272096722231303649&q=FEMA+camp

[Buttercup McToots]

1. Somebody should watch this video

just to reassure me... :scared:

[TheWraith]

34. No reason to fear.

I can't get to the video right now, but it sounds like the same one I've seen before. To be blunt, this is deliberately edited and slanted to imply some horrible, evil intent. They do a hell of a lot of stretching and outright mutilation of accuracy in it. For instance, referring to "giant furnaces," trying to imply that they're for mass disposal of bodies, while they don't mention that you can't just throw bodies in a furnace--you need a purpose-built crematorium. Or describing a radio tower as a "watch tower." Or showing only a handful of fenced in areas and speculating wildly that they're meant for putting people in.

In short, this video is a bit of a tin foil hat thing, deliberately contrived to scare people and convey a conclusion by implying evidence without actually needing to have any. It's paranoid, and seeks to make others paranoid as well.

[TheWraith]

43. Just got to the video--yep, it's the same.

This clip makes good use of the classic old tool of unexplained sinister implication. If you break it down, is it really that surprising that an old train repair depot would have a security camera in the parking lot? Or electronic turnstiles to register people when they go in or out? Wouldn't it be more sinister if there were security cameras all over the facility? In this case, the lack of something undermines the rest of their theories, but it goes unmentioned.

They also refer to a brick building as being "suitable for processing." Again, a sinister implication with no explanation. Are they in on the exact plans for how the facility is supposed to be used? Does it have a secret, invisible sign on it saying "Final Solution Processing Center?"

A US Air Force locomotive sitting on the tracks, possibly abandoned, "indicates federal and military involvement" according to the narrator. But I thought earlier that they said there was nothing here worth stealing and therefore no reason to have security? Which is it?

Several million in federal renovations. Assuming that what they say is accurate, how is this any more odd than a thousand other pieces of congressional pork?

They make a big deal about the fence around the parking lot being tilted out, to prevent people climbing it from side of the tracks. No kidding--since anybody can walk into the facility following the train tracks, without going through any kind of gate, there's an obvious need to provide security for the workers' vehicles if the facility were ever used again. Probably also why they have their one security camera there. Likewise, other parts of the facility would need to be secured from the tracks side to prevent possible theft. Hence, fences which are designed to prevent people standing next to the tracks from climbing them.

On edit: And buildings with barred entranceways and electronic turnstiles to control access through certain doors.

There's a lot more like that in this video, but rest assured, it's a lot of puff and very little substance.

[KoKo]

64. Smithfield Pork Processing Plants and Tyson Chicken Plants look very

sinister with barbed wire fences and scary looking buildings. I have no doubt that there are many new processing facilities being built around the US since Smithfield announced it's buy three other companies including "Armor and ConAgra." Expanded Agri-business killing camps.

[Hubert Flottz]

61. "trying to imply that they're for mass disposal of bodies"

Your conclusion. My conclusion was, that those furnaces in that video are perhaps intended to provide heat for those big buildings(barracks)and to make them suitable for housing of inmates. They'd not want to gas the detainees who were still fit for slave labor.

The person speaking in that video never said what those heating units might be for.

[TheWraith]

66. Of course not. They simply used unfounded sinister implication.

They talked about the installation of large furnaces in buildings which had never been heated. It's a statement designed to lead someone in the direction of a conclusion without actually saying anything that they could be held to. If they had simply been saying that the buildings had heating systems installed, why not say that? "Furnaces," in the concentration-camp context that they're trying to build, can be used to suggest something more sinister than heat, whereas if the systems were used for heat, there could be hundreds of non-sinister reasons.

[MissWaverly]

2. No, I have seen pictures of these

we need to ask, why have we expanded GITMO, it is completely in violation of our treaty with
Cuba, and why do we need these prisons. We would have put the Katrina survivors in places
like this????

[rubberducky]

3. Very, very weird!!

Yes, it really does make you think.

[donsu]

4. you are not a silly paranoid person - thank you for this link

this video should be spread far and wide

[madokie]

5. be afraid very afraid. One day I fear they will come for us

[helderheid]

6. OMG!

:scared: :cry:

[imouttahere]

7. Creepy....our tax dollars at work

nothing surprises me anymore, and I think BushCo is capable of ANYTHING!

[helderheid]

8. one more rec

[AndyA]

9. Something wicked this way comes.

I can't imagine what's going on, but it all reminds me of the Concentration Camps Hitler built. And our tax dollars are paying for all this, for what?

We need some answers from our representatives about this. Have any Dems gone on record about these facilities? I'd like to hear what they have to say about them. Or is this another Bush secret that the Dems aren't privy to information on?

Edit to add: Glad to give this one its 5th recommendation! Off to Greatest Page you go!

[RaleighNCDUer]

10. kick

so I can look at it later, when I'm not at work.

[Norquist Nemesis]

11. The hair raised on the back of my neck watching that

not to mention getting a queasy stomach and knot in my throat. :scared:

The skeptic in me is asking...how were they able to roam around? The narrator mentions that the blackhawk flies overhead on several occassions when they've been there. I wonder why it isn't a highly guarded installation. :shrug:

[imouttahere]

16. Because the admin is so arrogant & has people so brainwashed

that if it comes to light they will just say it's the imagination of conspiracy theorists. Works everytime for them.

[helderheid]

17. I'm queasy too. Got up and hugged my kids.

[Mind_your_head]

12. Would a call to the Indiana Govenor's office or calls to

Indiana's Senators and/or Representatives offices inquiring "What's this facility all about?" shed some light on this huge mysterious 'facility'?

Anyone from Indiana willing to make a few calls? :shrug:

[jasmeel]

15. Is this facility in Indiana-I assume so.

[Mind_your_head]

19. Yes, in the beginning of the video the narrator states that we are

looking at an Amtrak facility in Beech Grove (sp? Beach Grove, Beachgrove, Beechgrove), Indiana.

[acmejack]

31. Beech Grove, Indiana

The Amtrak Railcar Repair Facility in Beech Grove, Indianapolis, Indiana

[JHB]

40. Is it THE Amtrack facility?

Or just near it? or some corner of it?

[Mind_your_head]

49. Not sure, but looks like a lot of open property around the Amtrak site

http://google.com/mapdata?Point=b&Point.latitude_e6=39718181&Point.longitude_e6=4208887064&Point.iconid=15&Point=e&latitude_e6=39718181&longitude_e6=4208887064&zm=5000&w=304&h=156&cc=US&min_priority=1

[JHB]

52. Use the aerial photo view, it's more useful for trying to match things.

see also Wikipedia's entry for Beech grove (lost the link), it has an aerial photo that isn't top-down.

[AndyA]

20. I would very much like to know what the officials in Indiana have to

say about this facility.

[enuffs_enuffs]

13. Good ol' plan Rex 84...

AND it was exposed on national media... for about a minute.

[jasmeel]

14. Um - why do they need big furnaces???

:scared:

Whoever is narrating this video sounds like they're inferring these are concentration type camps. Hence the scary furnaces!!

[Fleshdancer]

18. what the hell?

I see it but I'm having one hell of a time processing it.

[Nothing Without Hope]

21. Some ***LINKS*** to archived threads on the huge US detention centers:

I hope other people will also post those they saved.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2062553
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x226361
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=479401&mesg_id=479401
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x485749
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x499461

There is no possible use of these facilities for anything other than evil purposes. Yet they remain mostly unknown by the American public. That has to change. Same thing about the massive Vatican City-sized fortress being built as an "American Consulate" in Baghdad and the permanent US military posts in Iraq.

[seemslikeadream]

55. Thanks NWH could you check the 4 link?

Do you have the title? Maybe google has it. :hi:

[Nothing Without Hope]

57. Here's what I have for the date, title & my comments on that thread:

2-21-06 {flaky opening post source, check military link later} CIVILIAN INMATE LABOR PROGRAM

Looks like the DU admins removed the thread, probably because of at least one of the sources in the opening post being untrustworthy. Unfortunately, I didn't follow my own self-advice about "checking the military link later." Sorry for including this link in my post; I just cut and pasted all my links in my bookmark folder "Building DETENTION CENTERS for US!!!" (which is a subfolder of "GOP SCANDALS & HORRORS"). I do wish I had at least kept the "military link" in the opening post so as to have an idea whether the post referred to anything more solid than the source the admins objected to.

[helderheid]

22. here's a NYT article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/04/national/04halliburton.html?ex=1296709200&en=01728da2eba059e4&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

[progressivebydesign]

26. Hmm.. Indiana doesn't seem like a good spot for immigration housing..

unless they plan on sending them in on trains or trucks. Perhaps an email or call to Henry Waxman would help, as he's cited in this article as being concerned.

[helderheid]

28. It can't be for illegal immigrants - they need them for cheap labor.

[progressivebydesign]

23. Hmmm.. that was really interesting. I'm processing the whole thing..

Having done some film work in the past, I know that much of what you narrate and choose to shoot can be influenced by what you believe. This leaves me with too many questions to dismiss as subjective journalism... Many of of the features she ascribes her own uses to, can be explained in other ways. But the barbed wire fence facing inward... that's something damning, and the presence of US military equipment, if it's supposed to be for fixing trains.

My first thought is that it's being prepped for weapons manufacturing for the government. Gas heaters added to an old warehouse is not unusual, as workers would need heat during the winter. The red zone, green zone, blue zone, have more to do with loading weapons onto trains.

My vote is some sort of weapons depot or mfg place. I hope someone does call the Indiana govt to get more info on this, because there are things that troubled me, that I could not reason away.

[dipsydoodle]

24. Furnaces and gas pipes ?

They gonna re-name Indiana and call it Poland ?

[MadHound]

25. A glimpse into our future.

A scary sight of hell, as it seems that Bushco and their backers have nicked yet another page out of Hitler's playbook, this one entitled "The Final Solution". And sadly, this time it won't just be Jews, or gays or African Americans, it will also be anybody over on the left side of the political spectrum.

Yet in spite of this possible future, I refuse to be intimidated. This future is not yet certain, and we have much work to do in order to insure it never happens.

[Catherine Vincent]

27. I'm trying not to panic.

But this is frightening.

p.s. I love your screen name! Cute!

[noonwitch]

29. The commentator is doing a lot of speculation regarding this site

I'm not saying that nothing is going on there, I don't know. But there is a lot of speculation during this footage. It seems really sinister, but it also could be a site that the military has a different potential use than that of a concentration camp.

I'm not going to get all paranoid over this. They haven't started rounding up any groups of people by ethnicity, or East Dearborn would be empty.

[QuettaKid]

39. Here is a link to Google Maps

satellite view of Beech Grove, Indiana if anyone wants to help me look for this place. Map view will show you the location of the railroad tracks.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Beech+Grove,+IN&ie=UTF8&ll=39.70022,-86.034794&spn=0.007693,0.021586&t=k&om=0

[helderheid]

30. I sent the link to Keith Olbermann. If anyone knows how to get this

into the hands of the media, please please do. I am panicked.

[Ohio Joe]

32. Sorry but

I do not hear any audio, so I guess I'm missing parts of it. Watching it without audio does not make this any type of menacing footage, it really looks like lots of different facilities i've seen in many different places. It really looks like a bunch of warehouses with security fences about it. There was some footage near the end that showed some cubes of blocks and a piece of heavy machinery but the place looked old otherwise. It did show a copter in flight but from the angle, i'm not sure there was anything shady about it and the one on the ground did not have any context, it could have been filmed anywhere. In addition, the copter on the ground was the only thing I saw to even connect anything to the government. While there were a few shots of signs, they were unreadable I saw no clear FEMA or US signs. Sorry, the tinfoil is just not there for me with this film.

[helderheid]

33. Security fences facing IN. To keep people IN, not OUT.

[Ohio Joe]

36. Context

What side of the fence was the camera on? I don't know, certainly some footage appeared to be inside. The place sure looked old to me, if it's even one place, some stuff looked like it was shot at entirely different locations. Could have been abandoned, I don't know. I'm just saying that for me, I don't see anything suspicious or worrying, I see another internet hoax.

[helderheid]

37. I hope you can watch it on a computer with sound. n/t

[Ohio Joe]

41. I'm not too worried about it

I'm not a believer in FEMA opening up death camps and this paticular piece of anonymous footage on the internet is not going to change my mind.

[helderheid]

42. oke doke

[dipsydoodle]

50. oke doke !

Didn't know you used that expression in the USA. My grandmother was used to say that in the late '40s :rofl:

[helderheid]

53. Where are you from?

I've always said it - thought it was American!

[dipsydoodle]

59. English

We lived at my grandmother's house when I was a small child and I picked up lots of her cockney expressions - thought okey doke was one one of those. Maybe not so since you've mentioned it in your response.

I've been sitting here trying to figure why she called me Ducky sometimes. I tried searching that but nix.

[TheWraith]

45. See my #43... the fences really aren't any mystery. NT.

[Ohio Joe]

47. ahhh, as I suspected, thanks - nt

[bananas]

44. Clearly marked "U.S. Air Force" train, "United States Army" crane.

If you're losing audio, you're probably losing video quality too,
you might be missing a lot.

[Ohio Joe]

51. Almost certainly

I'm at work and our PC's are not really for viewing video and I take what you say as truth. Even with that additional information, I still do not see anything to be worried about.

[JAYJDF]

35. Thanks for keeping this in the light.

It really is scary. Watching and listening, how could anyone not think about Germany. The fences with barbed wire on top in the direction so people can't get out. HELLO. I too wish some Dem official could shed some light on this.

[helderheid]

38. Kucinich I bet would take it on.

[TheWraith]

46. See my #43.

The fences really aren't that scary when you know the logic behind it.

[Buttercup McToots]

54. Why Indiana?

I don't like those new metal turnstiles and the bars...
It looks like a BIG place that is being worked on..
Creepy
Wraith, you have seen this b/4?
How long ago?
Thank you for the reassurance...I got scared.

[TheWraith]

67. Anybody's guess why Indiana.

Any explanation I could give would be speculative, since I don't know why any money at all is dedicated to the place. Maybe it's just pork to feed some IN congressman's district.

I first saw this video some time early this year, I think, maybe March or April. It's mostly undated, though, so it could have been produced pretty much any time since late 2001 or early 2002.

[unpossibles]

48. interesting

I too think there is some bias in the narrative, but it is interesting nonetheless, especially the fencing and US military equipment for an allegedly civilian compound.

Security on any business is pretty common these days though, so we won't know for sure.

One thing that does bother me is this plus the new attempt to strengthen the military's ability to lock up people without due process and who are not under terrorism investigation. It is rather bothersome, or potentially so at least.

[Jack_Dawson]

56. You are SILLY and PARANOID

Nice Blair Witch production value. Puh-leaze people.

:eyes:

[BeHereNow]

58. Relax- Case in point: a so-called "Camp" near my house

Adding to Jack_Dawson's post:

First, let me say nothing the KKKabal does would surprise me,
including rounding people up and detaining them as enemy
combatants; let us not forget the recent efforts of them to make
that legal.

However, that said, when we had Rex-84 fever on DU a few
years ago, there was a site we all freaked out about that
had several pictures of "camps." One of them was
about a mile from my house and so I and a friend decided
to investigate...we climbed the foothills to the alleged
location- we found the exact building and area identified
in the photo from the site.

We felt like fools.

The building was a water treatment plant.
Scary~~~~~~huh?

BHN

[dipsydoodle]

60. The thought had occured to me

that it could be a partly rigged film set.

[BeHereNow]

62. Fact is, they already have us in prison; economically.

People who are exhausted from working just to
"get by" are not all that threatening to them.

Hell, only a third of the country even makes it
to the voting booth, so somehow, I really doubt
they are all that worried about us.
Mere fleas on their agenda.

"Keep them tired and hungry and
we have them under control..." is what
I'm sure they say about us.

"Draft? We don't need a draft, we've
effectively eliminated all other options."

Just saying-
BHN

[KoKo]

63. Our water treatment plant looks like that where I live, too. A big fence

to keep the area secure and lots of pipes and things. We can see it from a bridge so it's not that threatening looking.

I wouldn't put anything past the Bushies either, but maybe getting panicked about it isn't a good thing, either.

[OneBlueSky]

65. by itself, this story probably wouldn't bother me all that much . . .

but when you view it in the context of everything else that has happened (and continues to happen) during BushCo's reign, not to worry about it would probably be foolish . . .

from the Iraq war to election theft to what we don't know about 9/11 to war profiteering to Katrina to all the laws BushCo has violated -- well, you get the idea . . . in light of all we know, the establishment of FEMA camps for some nefarious purpose seems more fitting than out of place . . . and pretty damned scary . . .

[drfresh]

68. Somebody should file a Freedom of Information request

to figure out what its going to be used for. And what the hell is a "Red Zone" ??

[redacted]

69. Why is this in the Sept. 11 Forum?

What does this have to do with 911?