What is the consensus? Tarpley, Ruppert, Lance, Hopsicker, Griffin, Marrs

[hang a left]

Whose views do you support the strongest? Please explain.

[eleny]

1. Tarpley and Steven E. Jones

[HughBeaumont]

2. GOTTA Add Paul Thompson to this list.

The rational voice that shoots down OCTs. No speculative, off-the-wall stuff AT ALL in his book; only real documented events that should invite the reader/listener to put two and two together. The articles in his book and others are enough to mount the independent investigation everyone is asking for and to finally give those who lost loved ones that day some closure.

But as for your poll, I'd go with Ruppert, Tarpley and Griffin. Crossing the Rubicon is a great read.

[PerpetualYnquisitive]

3. Why isn't Cheney in prison?

HughBeaumont said:

Crossing the Rubicon is a great read.

"Crossing The Rubes I've Conned" is a great read, if you are looking for some distracting fiction.

[hang a left]

13. Interesting sig line

What is that BTW?

[PerpetualYnquisitive]

16. It's part of the NSA's S.W.I.F.T. program 2.0

j/k.

You can make your own: http://danasoft.com/

Is the Danasoft signature a hacking tool, or can it be used to violate anyone's privacy?

Absolutely not! The Danasoft signature can never be used maliciously. Users come to Danasoft.com and create custom signs, with text that they choose, and they then display their custom signs in forums or on websites using a simple image link. We don't monitor or censor the text that users choose to display on their signs. Regardless of what prankster text might appear on a user's custom sign, the sign is totally harmless.

When you view the sign, you will see your IP address and computer info. When others view the sign, they will see THEIR information. Try it, ask a friend to visit danasoft.com. They won't see your IP, they will see their IP. Your information is never shown to others. This is always true, no matter where the Danasoft sign appears (within web pages, emails, etc).

Whenever you visit a website, your IP address is automatically broadcast to that site, and it's even broadcast to those sites that you don't visit when you load a website that contains images that are hosted by a third party, such as advertisements. When you load the Danasoft signature from a webpage, your IP address is automatically broadcast to us, just like any other site. Danasoft.com does not "hack" your computer to obtain your IP address. One of the purposes of the sign, besides for fun and amusement, is to spread awareness that your IP and other computer information is known to every website that you visit. If that concerns you, there are software programs available to mask your IP and other information when you surf the web, search Google for those.

Danasoft.com doesn't log the IP addresses of people that view our signature graphics - we simply host the custom signatures. When a request comes in to display a signature, our software creates the sign "on-the-fly", and displays the viewer's IP and other computer info on the sign. Our software draws a new sign for every single person that views it.

The Danasoft.com signature graphic is not a website statistics tool. It cannot be used to tell you who is visiting your website because we do not provide that service, and as mentioned above, we don't even know who is viewing the signs since we don't log that information.

For more info, read the privacy policy.

Go ahead, create your own sign to use in forums, on MySpace, on your website, anywhere!

http://www.danasoft.com/aboutdanasoft.php

[greyl]

6. Why? Does he have a discernible view?

If so, please share it.

[HughBeaumont]

21. "Fresh Fish, Fresh Fish, Fresh Fish . . . ", all the OCTers chant . .

Don't think I can't see through the bullshit game you're playing now. "Hey, someone who doesn't post here all that often . . . let's call him out and then gang-flame him". Like I don't know that you haven't examined nearly every author that doesn't fit your Occam's Razor weltanschauung of what happened that day. Traders cannot predict the future on specifically doomed sectors/businesses. Whole governmental organizations trained to the Hilton for events like this just do NOT collectively fail this BADLY. Supposedly elected officials show emotion, concern and leadership in these happenings, not continually mug for photo-ops without a hint of Secret Service sweep. DC Airspace, let alone the heart of America's defense, doesn't go unprotected an HOUR after they KNEW planes were hijacked and crashed and two more were off flight paths.

You're trying to call me out on something that doesn't even hold water. Thompson is nothing but facts, in chronological context and you know it. You got no holograms, missiles, reptilians or pod canards to throw at us here, not even a HINT of controlled demo or Pentagate. The ball's in your court, not mine. You tell me why you think The Terror Timeline is cockamamie David Icke-esque nutjobbery. Please. Enlighten me on how recorded, real life events appearing in mainstream dailies, shows and articles possibly can get lumped in with "missile/pod/hologram/Illuminati/trilateral" stories you people always love to bring up.

No thanks on buying "incompetence" or lauding that Easter Bunny, Cheney-friendly faerie tale known as the 9/11 Commission report. They're not going to be able to cover up the truth forever.

Dropped.

[greyl]

24. "Thompson is nothing but facts, in chronological context..."

That's my point, which you missed.
If he's nothing but facts, how can he be added to a list of people whose views may or may not be agreed with?

I simply asked if he had a discernible view.

[HughBeaumont]

27. Because the poll asked "which views do you support the strongest"?

I've read two authors on this list: Ruppert and Griffin. While they each make compelling cases, often times their theories are a bit speculative. I believe in putting two and two together based on what we know actually happened. And if an independent investigation is ever going to gain ground, The Terror Timeline is the key that opens it up.

[hang a left]

11. I think all of the authors in the poll reference Paul's work in their

respective books. Paul's time line is THE definitive documentation on the subject of 9-11. He isn't included in the poll because he has NOT exposed a theory. He is a "just the facts" guy.

[frylock]

4. first rule of a criminal investigation is to follow the money..

Hopsicker.

[greyl]

7. No, that's X from JFK, not Hopsicker.

Did Charles Manson's peeps commit their crimes to earn money?
Where do you suppose the trail would lead if you followed the money in that case?

Point is, the cliche "follow the money" is way overused by conspiracy theorists. It's a valid angle of inquiry, but isn't an infallible test of guilt.

[frylock]

9. someone had to pay for the operation..

whether you believe it was AQ or whomever. Where did the money come from? Whaddup with Wally Hilliard and his ties to CIA drug running ventures?

[greyl]

10. Duh.

You think those who were behind the bombing of the WTC in 93 may have had some distant tangential blurry connection?
Who is Osama in financial debt to, with billions to his name?
If 14 of the hijackers were from Texas, would you conclude that the "real" terrorists were from Boston?

[frylock]

15. why do you always ignore the cia/drug angle when presented?

[greyl]

25. I don't think you responded to my questions. nt

[Nitty-Gritty]

14. Narcotics has long been a source of funds for "special ops".

* Golden Triangle = heroin

* Nicaragua = cocaine

* Columbia = cocaine

* Afghanistan = opium

To mention a few.

[DrDebug]

22. Narcotics is the #1 source for the Intelligence Community

They all run on drugs, because it is by far the easiest way to get loads of untracable money. The best way to solve the massive drugs problem is to get rid off the Intelligence Agencies.

Even things like disinformation campaigns are probably funded by drugs, since you don't want it on the budget of the US government because some uncorruptable politicians (they are not many left, but we still have people like Conyers and McKinney) might ask questions.

[Spoonerian]

28. I agree

that the intelligence agencies should be abolished, but they are a vital appendage to the illegal standing armies that are the US police state.

Step #1: Repeal the drug laws and all other government controls and surveillance over peaceful activity (financial or otherwise).

Step #2: Once the rotten missions of the illegal permanent military, police, and their spook cadres are ablolished and they have no more pretext upon which to push people around, then they will have to find honest employment (preferably after they are tried for their crimes and made to pay restitution to their victims).

"a (federal) bill of rights (must) secure freedom in religion, freedom of the press, (and) freedom from a permanent military..." -- Thomas Jefferson (1789)

[Spoonerian]

29. By the way,

this is what disturbs me most about Hopsicker. Although I love the fact that he does real investigations by knocking on doors and interviewing witnesses and, thereby, provides tons of interesting facts, he seems to accept the whole false premise that you can have government control of markets such as drugs and somehow avoid the brutal police state and all of its rotten consequences--of which financing coup d'etats is only one of many.

It was the same way with all those guys that investigated the Clinton murders, Mena, and the ties to the Bush crime family in the 1990's. They were for the most part all ex or current spooks with ties to supposed "white hats" in the torture brigades.

When you look at all of this, all we really have is internecine warfare between factions of the government mafia with these investigators that don't challenge the drug laws and all controls on peaceful behavior (financial or otherwise) that require these standing armies (illegal under the federal and most state constitutions by the way).

[DrDebug]

30. Organized crime is the correct word for the intelligence agencies

Because they act exactly like organized crime. Their main objective is not intelligence, because that is a useful activity. In reality their main objectives are arms running, drug running, money laundering, terrorism, assassinations and low level military action.

That means that it is an illegal and thus criminal organization. To make matters even worse, they are and always have been cooperating with known organized crime like the mafia. There is also no oversight anymore with new inventions like Kroll which is a privatized CIA and that means that the US government has no say over what they do and to make matters worse it is no longer a US company either, because like other semi-legimate companies they are registered in Bermuda, so technically speaking the new CIA is a British company (One big fuck you to the Declaration of Independence). Lots of front organizations are Bahamas, Caribbean islands, Cayman, Estonia and other exotic countries where you can be lawless which is exactly what they are.

[Spoonerian]

34. "To make matters even worse,

they are and always have been cooperating with known organized crime like the mafia."

The government mafia is the original mafia. The Italian and ethnic mafias are mere sub-contractors. The "dons" of the government mafia are the conservative church ladies and liberal soccer moms who chart the missions--i.e. order their republicrat legislative and executive agents to pass and enforce laws against users and dealers of drugs and almost every other good and service.

From there you have so-called "corruption," pay-offs, quadruple-reverse-stings, truth-investigations, etc. But the criminals at the top of the pyramid are the church ladies and soccer moms.

"There is also no oversight anymore with new inventions like Kroll which is a privatized CIA and that means that the US government has no say over what they do and to make matters worse it is no longer a US company either..."

This reminds me of populist criticism of the Federal Reserve. They tell us that the Fed is bad because its private and not a government agency. But, here again the problem is the demands from Mr. and Mrs. Joe six pack that the markets in monetary commodities be controlled and regulated by the government mafia.

DrDebug, I love your compilations and all the interesting stuff you post here. But, there are certain natural laws of justice that govern human societies. People naturally want to produce, consume, and trade things including drugs, oil, guns, and monetary commodities. This can be done peacefully, or--when mafias and rackets emerge--things will get bloody and ugly quickly. That these mafias and rackets call themselves governments and are "controlled" by mom and pop America, it matters not.

[DrDebug]

31. Did you see this document. Venice was under martial law 9/7/01-6/30/03

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=101961&mesg_id=101976

Read the document very close and notice that it was about the third argument, ie. counter drug operations. This documents shows that Venice was under martial law from September 7, 2001 until June 30, 2003 and thus protected by the Florida National Guard instead of the police. This was probably done to prevent overambitious cops from investigating the flight schools. It also shows that Jeb Bush knew about 9/11 and signed Executive Order 01-261 prior to 9/11 to protect their illegal operations.

[Artdyst]

32. Do you really believe that Gov. Bush is a criminal? It's hard for me to

believe, and wouldn't it be more accurate to say that it's your belief that he signed an E.O. to protect an illegal operation?

[DrDebug]

33. Yes I do. That third option didn't belong there, so that was what is

was about.

[wildbilln864]

19. that analogy does not apply here...

Manson's peeps left evidence that led straight to them and there was a solid case! "Follow the money" is a frequently used method of most good investigators when other solid evidence is lacking. Sometimes it does lead to more evidence that clenches the case. By the way aren't investigators also conspiracy theorists until the evidence clearly shows a conspiracy fact in some cases?

[hack89]

5. Why isn' t none a choice? nt

[hang a left]

12. Because I figured you could post your own poll Hack. nt

[hack89]

18. Nothing like a biased poll to get to the truth nt

[wildbilln864]

20. It is by...

not voting.

[salvorhardin]

8. Two missing choices

None and other

[Sven77]

17. first Alex Jones then Tarpley

Alex Jones is #1, he predicted 9/11 before it happend. Tarpley is tops of your list for me. Tarpley believes a cruise missile might have hit the pentagon, Alex does not. Ruppert believes its war for peak oil. Alex believes its war to control the oil and keep it offline to drive prices up. Many in the movement have had jealous spats. Tarpley and Jones are friends. I think they dislike Ruppert.

[DrDebug]

23. Other. Ty Rauber

For obvious reasons.

All the others listed are used as well in the research, however I think that Ty Rauber discovered the most important piece of the puzzle.

By importance:
1. Mike Ruppert: Inside trading research. The only piece of direct and undeniable involvement in 9/11
2. Daniel Hopsicker: Drugs for Black Ops.
3. Webster Tarply: Because he listed some much shit on Rudy Giuliani that it really goes beyond reasonable doubt IMO
4. David Ray Griffin: Because he proved that the OCT can be thrown in the trash.

[graphixtech]

26. Other – Jim Hoffman

9-11 Research critically examines the official government explanation
of the attack and concludes that many of its key assertions are impossible.
http://911research.wtc7.net/index.html

Sitemap (extensive site)
http://911research.wtc7.net/sitemap.html