For Israel, Chance to Strike Before an Ally Departs

[Scurrilous]

<snip>

"For nine days, as European and United Nations officials have called urgently for a cease-fire in Gaza, the Bush administration has squarely blamed the rocket attacks of the Palestinian militant group Hamas for Israel’s assault, maintaining to the end its eight-year record of stalwart support for Israel.

Mr. Bush, in his weekly radio address on Saturday, said the United States did not want a “one-way cease-fire” that allowed Hamas to keep up its rocket fire, and Vice President Dick Cheney on Sunday echoed the point, declaring that only a “sustainable, durable” peace would be acceptable.

Many Middle East experts say Israel timed its move against Hamas, which began with airstrikes on Dec. 27, 24 days before Mr. Bush leaves office, with the expectation of such backing in Washington. Israeli officials could not be certain that President-elect Barack Obama, despite past statements of sympathy for Israel’s right of self-defense, would match the Bush administration’s unconditional endorsement.

“Obviously Bush, even by comparison with past U.S. presidents, has been very, very pro-Israel,” said Sami G. Hajjar, a longtime scholar of Middle East politics and a visiting professor at the National Defense University. “Despite Obama’s statements, and his advisers who are quite pro-Israel, the Israelis really didn’t know how he’d react. His first instinct is for diplomacy, not military action.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/05/washington/05diplo.html?hp

[Idealism]

1. It is possible they wanted to attack before Obama gets sworn in

But the last ceasefire was set to expire a full month before inauguration. Ideally for them Bush would still be in office, but its not like Israel said 'now or never' and jumped the gun.

[azurnoir]

2. And the incident that touched this off was on November 4

coincidence?

[Idealism]

3. November 5th, but whose counting

Maybe they wanted to be sure there wasn't a Bush v. Obama? :sarcasm:

[azurnoir]

4. No it was November 4 2008

it just was not widely announced until November 5 something else was going on the 4th that distracted from that remember?

check this link

http://zionism-israel.com/israel_news/2008/11/idf-operations-in-gaza-to-foil.html

[Idealism]

5. There is some discrepancy with the actual date

Wikipedia puts it at November 6th, other sites claim November 5th. Some claim the 4th, like the one you mentioned. Some say 'election day', but November 4th here means November 5th at times over there. Regardless, i'm not going to get too involved in the details :)

[azurnoir]

6. There is no discrepancy it was reported here too

but from my link

Tuesday, November 4, 2008
IDF operations in Gaza to foil tunnel/kidnapping attempt
http://zionism-israel.com/israel_news/2008/11/idf-operations-in-gaza-to-foil.html

The enthusiasm for liberating Gilad Shalit and the high price Israel was willing to pay no doubt whetted the appetite of the Hamas and their allies for more Gilad Shalits. The Hezbollah swap deal is already paying its blood dividends.

This is the value of the "lull" with Hamas.

According to other reports, IDF found out about the tunnel by accident, after arresting a different Palestinian who was trying to carry out a suicide bombing in the framework of the "lull."


Last update - 23:28 04/11/2008
IDF kills Hamas man in first raid since Gaza truce
By Avi Issacharoff, Haaretz Correspondent, and News Agencies

link to November 4 thread here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=124x224352

[Idealism]

8. Don't know why Wiki would be 2 days off

November 6th
Israel attacks a 250 meter tunnel going from Gaza and under its border. The tunnel is to designed to capture additional Israeli soldiers and hold them hostage. Six Gaza fighters are killed and four Israeli special forces wounded. Hamas responds by firing 30 Qassam rockets at Israel. The truce agreed to five months ago is starting to founder.<72> Between October 29th and November 6th 48 rockets and 21 mortars were fired from Gaza into Israel.<73> Then, between November 5th and November 12th, 22 rockets and 9 mortars were fired into Israel.<74>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rocket_and_mortar_attacks_in_Israel_in_2008#November

Here is one from Nov 5th
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3617798,00.html

Same with this one
http://haifadiarist.blogspot.com/2008/11/what-other-arabs-think-of-israel.html

[azurnoir]

9. The DU thread

was linked to the BBC on November 4 and I forgot it was my thread:blush:, but notice not much reaction until November 6, the CNN report last week had November 5 and I remember thinking WTF with Wiki always check when the last edit was at the bottom of the page, November4 was accepted but not much said except in "alternative" media until Israel began bombing and then all BS over the date started perhaps the M$M did not want to admit that what had been said about Israel choosing November 4 because attention would be focused on the American elections was correct they got caught unaware.

[Idealism]

10. Eh semantics here is ultimately useless

The problem is the needless death and collective punishment of an entire people.

[madrchsod]

7. there will not be a big change when obama takes over

the united states will always support the israelis over the palestinians