Hizbullah encourages Palestinian terror

[msmcghee]

Palestinian terror cells operating in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip in conjunction with Hizbullah are under orders by the Lebanese-based terror group to escalate their attacks against Israel, a high-ranking IDF officer has told The Jerusalem Post.

On Sunday, Palestinians in the Gaza Strip fired two Grad-type Katyusha rockets at Israel, just hours before a UN-brokered cease-fire went into effect bringing 34 days of hostilities between Israel and Hizbullah to an end. Since the cease-fire went into effect in the North, there has been an increase in the number of Kassam rockets fired at Israel. On Thursday, several IDF jeeps were attacked by Palestinian terrorists as they patrolled the Gaza Strip security fence.

"There is an effort to step up attacks within the Palestinian territories now that there is a cease-fire in the North," the high-ranking officer said. "Hizbullah is trying to activate their cells in Gaza and the West Bank and to ensure that Israel is still under attack even if they have stopped their rocket fire in the North."

The complete article is at: http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1154525896459&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

Later in the article the IDF states that Israel does not plan to respond militarily at this time to the stepped up attacks. I hope people here will remember this in terms of which side is instigating the violence. I will be surprised if Hizbollah intends to abide by the terms of the agreement that has been made at all.

We'll see what happens. But, remember and watch what is going on right now in terms of which side is trying to preserve a fragile truce (and the lives of innocent civilians) - and which side is trying to provoke a response.

Of course, to some here, any attacks against Israel are justified as part of the "war of liberation" even though Israel has left Gaza and much of the West Bank. But, if that's what you believe - then don't complain when Israel has had enough again and decides to join in that war with their tanks and F16's - to protect her citizen's lives.

As was the case with S. Lebanon, there will be no doubt as to which side was responsible for the deaths of all the civilians that will surely follow.

[idontwantaname]

1. what are palestinian civilians to do to protect themselves from the IDF?

for the week of: aug 10-16, 2006


*6 Palestinians, including two children and an old man, were killed by IOF.

*A Palestinian civilian from Jenin died from a previous wound.

*36 Palestinian civilians, including 4 children and 3 women, were wounded by the IOF gunfire.

*IOF launched a series of air strikes on a number of houses in the Gaza Strip.

*6 houses were destroyed and a 7th one was burnt in the Gaza Strip.

*IOF conducted 40 incursions into Palestinian communities in the West Bank, and 4 others into the Gaza Strip.

*IOF arrested 48 Palestinian civilians in the West Bank and 5 others in the Gaza Strip.

*4 houses were demolished in the West Bank.

*IOF raided 3 hospitals in Hebron.

*IOF have continued to impose a total siege on the OPT; IOF have imposed a tightened siege on the Gaza Strip and there have been shortages of foodstuffs and fuels; IOF positioned at a various checkpoints in the West Bank arrested 8 Palestinian civilians, including two girls.

*IOF have continued to construct the Annexation Wall in the West Bank; they razed more areas of agricultural land in Qalqilya and used force to disperse a peaceful demonstration protesting the construction of the Wall in Bal’ein village, west of Ramallah.

*Israeli settlers have continued attacks against Palestinian civilians and property in the OPT; settlers celebrated a Jewish wedding inside the Ibrahimi Mosque in Hebron.

http://pchrgaza.org/files/W_report/English/2006/17-08-2006.htm

[madrchsod]

2. they are not god`s chosen people

[azurnoir]

5. I've wondered

if you go back far enough if both parties involved aren't "People of the Book",

[msmcghee]

6. Stop firing missiles into Israel and attacking Israeli border . .

. . patrols or supporting those who do. Demand that operations against Israel from inside Gaza be stopped.

Very simple. If you don't want to be invaded stop attacking your neighbor.

[idontwantaname]

9. what about the west bank?

what was their crime?

[msmcghee]

11. In the 1967 War Arab armies . .

. .attacked Israel across the mountains forming the west bank with the intent to destroy Israel. A look at any map will show that the occupation of the West Bank by any hostile forces places Israel at great risk. Tel Aviv is just a few miles from the border and would allow highly accurate artillery fire from elevated positions at selected targets inside Tel Aviv as well as much of the rest of Israel's population and infrastructure. Since whatever Palestinian authority has ever existed has pledged itself to the destruction of Israel - it would be difficult to understand why any sane people would allow hostile people to control that territory - even though that was the case prior to 1967. Still, Israel has recently dismantled many West Bank settlements trying to accomodate the Palestinians and (until this latest conflict in Lebanon) has planned to remove more of these.

Here's a little history for you:

In 1948, no Palestinian state was invaded or destroyed to make way for the establishment of Israel. From biblical times, when this territory was the state of the Jews, to its occupation by the British army at the end of World War I, Palestine had never existed as a distinct political entity but was rather part of one empire after another, from the Romans, to the Arabs, to the Ottomans. When the British arrived in 1917, the immediate loyalties of the area's inhabitants were parochial -- to clan, tribe, village, town, or religious sect -- and coexisted with their fealty to the Ottoman sultan-caliph as the religious and temporal head of the world Muslim community.

Under a League of Nations mandate explicitly meant to pave the way for the creation of a Jewish national home, the British established the notion of an independent Palestine for the first time and delineated its boundaries. In 1947, confronted with a determined Jewish struggle for independence, Britain returned the mandate to the League's successor, the United Nations, which in turn decided on November 29, 1947, to partition mandatory Palestine into two states: one Jewish, the other Arab.

The state of Israel was thus created by an inter nationally recognized act of national self-determination -- an act, moreover, undertaken by an ancient people in its own homeland. In accordance with common democratic practice, the Arab population in the new state's midst was immediately recognized as a legitimate ethnic and religious minority. As for the prospective Arab state, its designated territory was slated to include, among other areas, the two regions under contest today -- namely, Gaza and the West Bank (with the exception of Jerusalem, which was to be placed under international control).

As is well known, the implementation of the UN's partition plan was aborted by the effort of the Palestinians and of the surrounding Arab states to destroy the Jewish state at birth. What is less well known is that even if the Jews had lost the war, their territory would not have been handed over to the Palestinians. Rather, it would have been divided among the invading Arab forces, for the simple reason that none of the region's Arab regimes viewed the Palestinians as a distinct nation. As the eminent Arab-American historian Philip Hitti described the common Arab view to an Anglo-American commission of inquiry in 1946, "There is no such thing as Palestine in history, absolutely not."

[idontwantaname]

12. diversion??? you didnt address my question n/t.

[msmcghee]

14. Your question doesn't make sense.

It implies that the Arab inhabitants are being punished for some crime.

I attempted to explain why the West bank remains under Israeli military control - even though the Arab inhabitants are largely free to carry on their lives. What depridations they suffer are primarily due to the large number of suicide bombers that have crossed into Israel proper from the West Bank - namely the wall.

If you consider that a diversion - then that is because you have strong emotional beliefs concerning I/P and my answer did not support those (religious-like) beliefs. Those emotional beliefs - on both sides - are the reason that innocent people keep dying.

PS - As I was typing this an NPR report stated that Israel is postponing their plans to evacuate further territory on the West Bank.

[idontwantaname]

16. inhabitants are largely free to carry on their lives

israel never planned to evacuate key settlements within the west bank... they had plans to leave the hostile ones and remove the kinder ones. its actually a shame.

so yes, my question to you is why the west bank not only remains under military control, but what are there 40 separate military actions every week?

why are homes being demolished?

sure there are suicide bombers coming from nablus... but not all these actions take place in nablus. did you know that?

so why are they going on?
why are you OK with them going on?

the israeli army is 10x worse than the US army in iraq... yet you may question why the US is doing what it is doing in iraq, but you dont see the difference when it comes to the west bank???

[idontwantaname]

13. let me make it clearer

why all the death and destruction in the west bank? its 4x what gaza is recieving and they havent fired any rockets nor have they "abducted" any israeli soldiers.



*IOF conducted 40 incursions into Palestinian communities in the West Bank

*IOF arrested 48 Palestinian civilians in the West Bank

*4 houses were demolished in the West Bank.

[msmcghee]

15. I haven't been following this closely . .

. . but I assume it is part of Israel's ongoing effort to rid the West Bank and Gaza of known terrorist cells and infrastructure. I'm sure Israel does not feel they need to respond to specific attacks. If they have intelligence that reveals the location of a cell or group out to attack them - I'm sure they do what is needed to eliminate that threat against Israeli citizens.

Are you forgetting the constant weekly demonstrations where thousands of West Bank and Gaza Palestinians march down the street calling for the death of all Israelis (and Americans)? These are in the news quite often.

Are you suggesting that Israel just picks some West Bank civilians to kill or capture and some houses to destroy at random - just to make sure the Pelestinians still hate them enough to keep sending suicide bombers and Katyusha's their way?

[idontwantaname]

17. you are correct and i was a bit harsh in my last post

i publicly apologize for calling you a bigot, reading now that you admit to not knowing what is going on in the west bank.

let me fill you in, as i have been there and have a fairly good idea whats what.

---------------------

yes we would like to think the IDFs intentions are pure any theyre going after "intended terrorist targets". but something to understand is that what the IDF considers a terrorist is the same as a person actively involved with the NLG in the USA. they do not agree with israels actions, and have decided to actively do something about it. it is their act of becoming active which makes them guilty... not the act of picking up a rifle or bomb.

there are maybe 1 in 10,000 protests which call for the death of israelis or americans in the west bank. that statement is truly absurd and highlights the honest lack of understanding you have of the west bank.

------------------

"Are you suggesting that Israel just picks some West Bank civilians to kill or capture and some houses to destroy at random" yes. it is at random. sometimes a good choice. sometimes not.

-------------------

can you continue to support the IDFs efforts in the west bank and gaza knowing that for every 1 intended terrorist killed they kill/injure 10+

1/10 ratio is quite poor and not working... so why support it and not reform it?

[pelsar]

19. let me add some info

the IDF picks up palestenains for a multitude of reasons....based on military intelligence, which for those that dont know, is not always right. (to put it mildly). Other times they're picked up to put pressure on the family or friends for reasons known just to them.

its a very very dirty and ugly business.....

[catmother]

24. i totally agree with you.

:hi:

[azurnoir]

3. This should stop, right now

Hezbollah should be playing very low key right now, they pulled it off, but even a winning hand can be over played and there are parties globally that are looking for a reason to restart hostilities..

[breakaleg]

4. First of all, it would be foolish to accept anything that came out of

the mouth of the IDF - they will do whatever they can to make their aggression look like defense.

Secondly the article said "step up attacks within the Palestinian territories". It is their right to resist the occupying force within THEIR land. That's not called terrorism.

Thirdly, they aren't called "terror cells" when they operate within occupied lands, they are called resistance forces, and I doubt they take orders from Hezbollah.

[cali]

7. Actually,

targeting civilian populations with rockets is terrorism. Israel was guilty of it in Lebanon, and their actions in Gaza are despicable, but that doesn't excuse firing rockets into Israel- by either H'zbollah or Palestinian organizations.

[pelsar]

8. for starters...

they should stop shooting missles at israeli cities and attacking israeli patrols within israel....of course it maybe that some dont consider attacking/targeting israeli civilians terrorism and the kassams and katushas coming out of gaza as "resistant"....

so i would guess then if one wants to be consistant it would mean israel bombing beirut is pretty much the samething, but thats only if one wants to be consistant

[idontwantaname]

10. same question

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=124&topic_id=144233&mesg_id=144287

[pelsar]

18. westbank is a 'different world.."

from the israeli point of view:

a lot of bad stuff is happening out there in the westbank, by both the IDF and the settlers, and the israeli population as a whole has no problem with getting rid of the westbank.....but heres the problem:

we see gaza as a test case for palestenain self rule. If the palestenians can work out their teething problems in gaza, live peacefully with israel, that would be confidence building for the general israeli population, and there would be public pressure to rid ourselves of the westbank.

however if the kassams and katushas keeping falling on israel from gaza, its reasonsable to assume that if israel were to leave the westbank there would be kassams and mortors from there as well. Since the very day israel left gaza the kassams kept on coming and havent stopped since, most israelis have doubts about giving the palestenians more area with which to shoot more missles.

Given that everything israel has done to limit the kassams/katushas from gaza/lebanon has been labled a war crime a one point or another, its also reasonable to assume that any action israel would take to stop the kassams and mortors from the westbank would have a similar response.

for anyone to tell israel to give back the westbank, i would like to hear their solution to the kassams and mortars that will probably start flying from there soon after....and to know that they would back israel in that response as well.

to a certain degree its a "chicken and egg" thing. The palestenians cant create a stable society with israel "between their legs" yet israel cant accept kassams falling on Jerusalem, Tel Aviv, etc

[idontwantaname]

20. i think folks in the west bank

would like to have an economy again. i also think they would like to send their kids to european schools like some of them were privileged to attend. however as the road is being paved right now i do not see the future as being on of happiness and success and i feel if we dont do something quite soon the israelis will have the other half of a failed state to deal with.

lets hope the west bank never gets closed off for years like the gaza strip... i think that would seal the fate for all.

[pelsar]

21. i'm rather pessimistic.....

with the events of the last year or so......hamas, hizballa, iran are the real macoy in terms of religious fanatics...and the israeli right feeds on them (actually they feed on each other, and the settlers get to celebrate on the feeding fenzy....and the palestenains get screwed once again)

[IndianaGreen]

22. IDF propaganda

I am sure the Sunnis in Occupied Palestine will listen to the Shias of Hezbollah.

[Marrak]

23. Bush?

Why does Israel hate the U.S.?