IL: House, Senate OK gun ID at 18

[Narf]

"Pitting Chicago lawmakers against gun-rights advocates, the House and Senate voted separately Thursday to lower from 21 to 18 the age at which a person may apply for a firearm owner's identification card without a parent's permission.

'If you can go off and fight a war without mom and dad's permission, you certainly ought to be able to go out and shoot a few ducks without mom or dad's permission,' said Rep. Ron Stephens (R-Mulberry Grove), a veteran.
The firearm owner's card debate came as lawmakers passed legislation ranging from ensuring that George Bush would be on the fall ballot to limiting the governor's raids on state road funds. They also defeated a bill that would have banned the slaughter of horses for human consumption.

The House and Senate voted on separate but similar bills on firearm owner's identification cards. Thus the two bills simply exchanged chambers, with the House voting 65-38 and the Senate voting 30-26. Both houses must vote on the same piece of legislation before it can go to the governor."

You can read the complete story here:

[Narf]

1. Another victory for law abiding Americans.

[7th_Sephiroth]

15. in florida

its 18 to buy a rifle or a shotgun, but 21 to buy a handgun

[mp40]

2. It's a start...

Hopefully the House and Senate will next target the Firearm ID card.

[Narf]

3. A national preemption law would be nice to see too.

[CO Liberal]

4. And I Guess It Only Stands To Reason.....

...that if you can go off and fight a war without mom and dad's permission, you certainly ought to be able to go out and shoot mom or dad without anyone's permission.

[-..__...]

6. How much more can you grasp at straws?

I mean, really?

"...that if you can go off and fight a war without mom and dad's permission, you certainly ought to be able to go out and shoot mom or dad without anyone's permission."

[Narf]

7. Has anyone here suggested legalizing the shooting of parents?

Where the hell did "you certainly ought to be able to go out and shoot mom or dad without anyone's permission" come from? We're talking about giving adults the choice of whether to be legally armed or not.

You are typical of the "fear of guns" crowd. You seem to believe that all guns are, in and of themselves, evil and possessing of the powers to make people go out and commit crimes. Simply assinine, really. Can you come up with no better argument than "if people have guns they'll all kill their parents"?

[iverglas]

9. talk about yer asinine

(assuming "asinine" was what you were talking about, my dictionary having no "assinine" ...)

You seem to believe that all guns are, in and of themselves, evil and possessing of the powers to make people go out and commit crimes.

Me, I always wonder what drugs are favoured by people to whom things "seem" so bizarre. I must say, CO Liberal doesn't "seem", to me, to believe any such thing.

Can you come up with no better argument than "if people have guns they'll all kill their parents"?

I often wonder where they buy their quotation marks, too, and why they work so differently from the standard-issue ones. Hit the right keys, and very funny things magically appear inside "quotation" marks in one's posts, attributed to people who never said them.


Has anyone here suggested legalizing the shooting of parents?
Where the hell did "you certainly ought to be able to go out and shoot mom or dad without anyone's permission" come from?

Perhaps while you're in the "A" section of the dictionary, you should check out the meaning of the word "able". "Having the capacity" really does not mean "being legally authorized", does it, now?

.

[Narf]

13. Do you have any valid reason to prohibit law abiding adults ...

From owning firearms and carrying them for self defense?

[FatSlob]

14. Of course not!

There are not valid reasons to prohibit law abiding adults from owning firearms and carrying them for self defense.

[Liberal Classic]

10. But you still can't drink!

Demon rum being what it is and all...

And think, 18 year olds can still go out and get married and fuck themselves up real good.

:\

[FatSlob]

12. This is below you.

I would expect decent debate, not something like this.

[-..__...]

5. Non-Subscription link

Here

[Narf]

8. Thanks for the link.

[FatSlob]

11. Another step on the slippery slope to freedom!

[MrBenchley]

16. Gov links weapon ban to lower age for gun permit

"SPRINGFIELD -- After embracing a controversial plan to allow older teens to get a state gun permit without parental consent, Gov. Blagojevich on Tuesday threatened to scuttle the proposal unless the Legislature also bans semiautomatic weapons.
By linking the fate of the permit legislation to a semiautomatic weapon ban -- a divisive issue that failed last year and historically has never gotten off the ground in Springfield -- Blagojevich may have found a poison pill to derail the controversial permit legislation should it reach his desk.
"What I'm saying is that if we can get a ban on assault weapons passed in Illinois, then lowering the age for hunters who want to buy hunting rifles is an appropriate trade-off in the legislative process," the governor told reporters in Chicago. "

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-gun31.html

Oh, especially since, as the RKBA crowd keeps assuring us, an assault weapons ban is meaningless, ineffective and only affects cosmetics. I'm sure the gun lobby will jump at THIS chance (snicker, guffaw).

[slackmaster]

17. No compromise

Fuggeddaboudit.

Kids grow up. Gun bans are forever.

(On edit: Except when they don't actually ban anything, e.g. the federal AWB which will expired in September.)

[DonP]

18. Not gonna happen

The word is that there is no way in hell that Blago is going to get the trade off he asked for yesterday.

I really believe he was sincere on the 18 year old issue. In Illinois a son or daughter can't even go pheasant hunting with their parents or grandparents legally, since they can't have a FOID card.

I think the Gov was trying to throw a bone to downstate (read non Chicago) Dem's in the hopes he could get their support next election cycle.

But then Daley must have pulled the wire he has attached to Blago's tender parts

The downstate guys are really PO'd at him since he threw them under the bus on a lot more than just the gun related issues. Then he exacerbated things when he refused to move to Springfield and said that he would rather raise his kids in Chicago. (It's much safer for him in Chicago than for the average mother in the Cabrini Green or Robert Taylor area since he has a 24/7 armed security detail at his front and back door.)

The downstate Dem's aren't buying the Chicago driven BS and phony promises anymore. They may not give a damn about the AWB but they will refuse on principle to give Chicago another point of control on their lives 300 miles away.

One interesting point. The original proposal they tried last year made the ban ex post facto and provided for the confiscation of any and all classified assault weapons currently in the state.

That would have made a lovely picture with State Troopers going door to door.

[MrBenchley]

19. Of course it's not going to happen...

but then all of us know those claims that the AWB covers only "cosmetics" are straight out horseshit.

Interesting to see, though, that the extremist nutcases in the gun lobby are utterly unable to compromise on any point.

[DonP]

20. No, our extremist nutcases are agreed

Our extremist, nutcase, asswsipe, lunatic gun nuts are pretty much agreed not to make the trade-off and to keep creaming our jeans over our legally owned "assault" weapons here in the Land of Lincoln.

In fact we even have four companies in Illinois that make parts kits for the "currently" legal versions. So there is even a jobs issue attached to this ban question. But the jobs are downstate union jobs, an IAM local, not in Chicago so they probably don't count as much. Hell, they can always find new jobs machining plowshares anyway.

The real disagreement is among the intelligent, thoughtful (and hypocritically protected by armed security details 24/7) gun controllers. 1st the governor wants to lower the age then he doesn't, after the Mayor flies off the handle. Those poor guys just can't seem to make up their mind and their major opponents are the downstate Democrats.

Say, speaking of gun control progress, how is repealing the CCW laws going? I haven't seen any items in GITN lately about the grass roots repeal programs.

[MrBenchley]

21. Says it all, don....

Guess we can see all those claims that the AWB covered only cosmetics is just so much horseshit.

[slackmaster]

22. I don't see how that conclusion follows logically from this discussion

The logic being presented here seems to boil down to "AWs are so important to these lunatic asswipes that they wouldn't sacrifice the right to own them even if it means more potential sales of guns to older teens."

But that's just me. Maybe I'm reading something into the argument that isn't there. Perhaps my thinking is getting paranoid in my old age.

Paranoid personality disorder is an unwarranted tendency to interpret the actions of other people as deliberately threatening or demeaning. The disorder, surfacing by early adulthood, is manifested by an omnipresent sense of distrust and unjustified suspicion that yields persistent misinterpretation of others" intentions as being malicious. People with a paranoid personality disorder are usually unable to acknowledge their own negative feelings towards others but do not generally lose touch with reality. They will not confide in people, even if they prove trustworthy, for fear of being exploited or betrayed. They will often misinterpret harmless comments and behavior from others and may build up and harbor unfounded resentment for an unreasonable length of time....

http://www.psychologytoday.com/htdocs/prod/PTOInfo/pto_term_paranoid.asp

[DonP]

23. Absolutely right

You caught us!

No cosmetics involved at all in that AWB. It's all hard cold fact that makes each and everyone a better killing machine, or is it bullet hose this week?

Each and every one of those items make my assault weapon lookalikes even more deadly.

From bayonet lug to pistol grip, from flash hider to removable magazine. Diane Feinstien caught us and we all give up.

Either way, we are still going to be able to manufacture them and buy them in Illinois, so it really doesn't matter. The good part is that a bunch of workers will keep their jobs and in another few months they can go back to making the pre-ban originals.

Lordy, lordy the gun grabbers are really a funny bunch of folks.

[MrBenchley]

24. Well, Don...

You might as well try to joke about it...it's sure not fooling anyone into thinking there's an honest case for assault weapons.

[demsrule4life]

25. I bet they would be the perfect weapon to use

against all those flying pigs that cause traffic delays.

[Moderator]

26. Locking. Thread started by disrupter. n/t