Saw my first open carry in town the other day.

[rrneck]

A big fella with a bald head. His jacket covered the butt of the gun but I could see the tan holster well enough. He walked across the street into the hotel. Probably a tourist.

Nothing happened. Nobody got shot.

Carry on.

[CelticThunder]

1. Bwahahahaha. He made SURE the holster was "seeable."

There is no point to open carry otherwise. It's all for show.

Pathetic.

[msongs]

2. it is a status thing, like having a pit bull or a fabulous babe on your arm: look at me nt

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[rrneck]

6. Or like drive by posts with no point... nt

[cleanhippie]

52. reminds me of your posting style. nt

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

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[rrneck]

5. Funny,

nobody ran screaming from the scene. In fact, I was probably the only person to notice. This isn't exactly the kind of town that has a lot of CCW's.

Were you there, or do you just like to snark out of ignorant bigotry?

[Starboard Tack]

16. Where's the bigotry?

If a fool wants to parade as a fool and people laugh at him for acting like a fool.

[rrneck]

20. Um...

big·ot
   /ˈbɪgət/ Show Spelled Show IPA
–noun
a person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion.

[Starboard Tack]

43. I know what bigot means. My question is how was he being bigoted

What utter intolerance was displayed? Acting foolish by wearing a gun is hardly a creed, belief or opinion. You described the guy. Now you don't like the comments. Didn't you think he looked ridiculous? You can't do stand up and complain when people laugh.

[rrneck]

51. Don't be obtuse.

He is of the opinion that he needs to carry a gun.

No, I didn't think he looked ridiculous. Your assumption that he did restates your bigoted opinion.

You think anyone who wears a gun in public is a fool. You would assign an unflattering characteristic to an entire group of people based on a single similarity.

Bigotry.

[Name removed]

54. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hoyt]

91. I agree completely. Every open carrier I've seen looked silly. If that is "bigoted," so be it.

[rrneck]

92. That's a fairly bigoted attitude. nt

[Hoyt]

95. You don't like those against packing and you don't like criminals -- does that make you a bigot?

It's not you -- it's your perceived, and mistaken, need to carry a gun into public, and the harm that does to society and future generations.

[rrneck]

96. As I've told you twice before

I don't carry. I find no particular pleasure at the sight of a firearm carried in public.

I don't dislike people who are against CCW.

I dislike an arrogant elitism that presumes to dictate an ideology founded on some perverse sense of environmental aesthetics and would enforce that perversion with statute law.

I dislike a form of classism that would have the poorest, weakest and most vulnerable among us subjected to laws that offer them no remedy.

I dislike the worst sort of arrogant authoritarianism paraded about as some sort of Progressive ideal.

I dislike losing elections because too many Democrats have some sort of pet-cause-bug-up-their-ass that has no relationship to the real world but is intimately connected to their need for sanctimonious self congratulation.

I'm not too thrilled with anchovies either.

[cleanhippie]

53. So you make broadbrush insults and make shit up as you go along?

Stay classy.

[rl6214]

30. You were there?

You know he made the holster "seeable" on purpose?

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Arctic Dave]

7. I hope you did the right thing.

Point, laugh and scream "sissy boy"

[Name removed]

9. Deleted sub-thread

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[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

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[grilled onions]

8. But Is The Reaction The Same If...

A person walks into a liquor store at night with the gun peeping out for the world to see? Or a fast food place right before closing or a grocery store that has a bank inside the store? We expect them to be law abiding but it's hard to tell in many circumstances.

[rrneck]

11. Easier than you may think.

There is much more to evaluating a person than just what is hanging on his or her belt. Can those evaluations be one hundred percent accurate? No. Is it worth eroding people's civil rights to save us the trouble of making that evaluation? No. Is it even possible to write a law that would help us make that evaluation? Maybe.

[LibertyFox]

33. You were fortunate that the gun was holstered and didnt see you

otherwise it would have forced him to start shooting you.

[cleanhippie]

56. Perhaps the most ignorant post of the day.

Welcome to DU. Enjoy your stay.

[LibertyFox]

61. I apologize

I thought the sheer absurdity of my post would make it clear that I was joking.

Next time I'll add a :sarcasm: tag.

[YllwFvr]

70. i picked up on it

you did well

[cleanhippie]

83. No, my apologies.

Considering the amount of sheer absurdity posted here on a daily basis, I took your post at face value. If you meant it as snark, my apologies to you.

[PavePusher]

80. Dude, coffee time. 8>) n/t

[David West]

22. Yes, it is.

I've open carried in banks, restaurants, grocery stores, and convenience stores in all hours and neighborhoods. Never had any problems. I open carried around down town by all the bars on St. Patrick's day and got into a discussion about it with 3 cops at a taco stand. They were all about it.

[Hoyt]

93. Lots of police don't like it. But some carriers like to impress the guys in blue.

Having lived with police, I'll bet they laughed at you when you left -- probably referred to you as a "cowboy wannabe."

[rrneck]

94. I like pizza.

Lots of people like pizza. Do you like pizza. Policemen like pizza. I heard them talk about it once.

[Hoyt]

97. Do you pack when you go eat one?

[rrneck]

99. nope

Unless I'm going to eat in Venice.

[RSillsbee]

100. Usually , whats the big deal? NT

[Hoyt]

101. If you have to ask . . . . . .

[rrneck]

102. You're Hoyt

:rofl:

[YllwFvr]

35. your examples....

Ive done all of them

[jpak]

37. That's why we need the Castle Doctrine - shoot first, ask questions later

yup

[YllwFvr]

42. is that what castle doctrine says?

hm.. I wasnt aware. I believe your scenario could quite possibly lead to charges being filed

[PavePusher]

45. Cite to evidence, or admit you are bullshitting. n/t

[jpak]

49. That's what they do in Texas - to Latinos anyway

shoot first ask - questions later

yup

[Katya Mullethov]

60. Machete' right ?

I haven't seen that one , but I know where you are coming from .

[PavePusher]

65. Cite, or pound sand. n/t

[Katya Mullethov]

66. Tommy Lee Jones had some kinda amon goeth on the veranda thing going

Rent one like everybody else .

[rl6214]

68. I live, and carry in Texas and have never seen this happen

Then again most of your posts are bullshit, just like this one so it's about par for the course. I'll tell my hispanic wife how ignorant you are.

[GreenStormCloud]

63. Criminals generally don't want their guns to be seen.

They want to produce them at the last second to commit the crime.

[PavePusher]

79. I've done all that.

Of course, in Arizona, it's not uncommon....

Here, people wait until you actually start performing criminal actions before calling the police about guns.

[Starboard Tack]

10. At least we could you could see it. Not like the sneaky sneaks

I always enjoy watching clowns, but I'm wary of the devious.

[rrneck]

12. A volunteer fireman once told me of a maxim

that they used in relation to the various types of chemical fires that could happen and the training that was required to handle them:

"If you don't know don't go."

If you're afraid of people with concealed handguns, stay home. Making carrying a concealed handgun illegal means nothing to anyone who would shoot you anyway.

[Starboard Tack]

14. "If you're afraid of people with concealed handguns, stay home."

And how is one to know when to stay home if they're concealed?

[rrneck]

18. Aye, there's the rub.

If you're afraid of being struck by a car/mugged/poisoned/tripped/struck by lightning or any other unfortunate calamity don't go out. Otherwise keep your eyes peeled and live life with the knowledge that nobody can keep you safe, sometimes not even you. We've been doing it for two million years, there's no point stopping now.

[Starboard Tack]

34. So, all we need to do is dispel the fear and get on with living

For those who fear guns, knives, clubs, big muscles, or the inequities of this world, I say get a grip, enjoy life to the fullest. Stop living in fear, it will lead to nowhere good or enlightening. Play the hand you're dealt and quit whining. Nothing you own is worth killing for, but may be worth dying for. If you can live with killing another human being over property, then you have a very different take on life than me. If you kill someone because that individual is trying to kill you, then the rules of war apply - kill or be killed. That's war. All society's rules are put on hold until you have a choice and as soon as you do have a choice, they kick back in.
If you decide to cave in to the fear and act out by arming yourself when around your fellow citizens, then you must be prepared for the reactions of others who do not share your fears. Those reactions may be harsh. People may ridicule you, because they don't understand or relate to your fear. Many of those people probably have guns in their homes, but they will see you as an oddity.

[rrneck]

41. Would you go to war unarmed? nt

[Starboard Tack]

44. Of course not. That's my point. We're not at war with each other.

Or are we? Am I missing something?

[rrneck]

50. Dead is dead.

Self defense laws are civilian rules of engagement. Why would you disarm people who need to defend themselves?

Do you not see the condradiction in your own statement?

[Starboard Tack]

58. Where did I say anything about disarming people who need to defend themselves?

[rrneck]

59. Do you advocate

making the carriage of firearms in public illegal?

[Starboard Tack]

67. Absolutely. Interesting that you should ask that.

I have been asking a lot of people the same question lately, without stating my own opinion and everyone said the same. An old friend just dropped by and I asked him, a Republican btw, (yes I even have some Repub. friends) and he said the same, including LE, which surprised me. So refreshing to know there is still some sanity in this world.
Guns have no place in the public arena, barring exceptional circumstances.

[rrneck]

69. Then

what firearm free self defense solution do you offer to those whom you would disarm?

[Starboard Tack]

72. Why do you always say disarm?

I advocate banning the toting of guns in public. That is not disarming. They can carry whatever they want. It isn't my job to tell folk how to defend themselves. I'm just advocating they don't use guns. There are lots of ways to defend themselves, each to his/her choice, preferably not with a firearm, which IMO compounds the problem, rather than offering a solution.

[rrneck]

74. LOL! Bullshit!

If it's not your job to tell people how to defend themselves then you can't tell them not to carry a gun.

You are condradicting yourself with every post! Comedy gold!

The Truth is you just want what you want and you don't much give a fuck who has to die for you to get it. It has been explained to you ad nauseum why a firearm is the best solution for personal self defense. But you just ignore them and trot out the same bullshit over and over and over.

It looks like you're going to join the ranks of the rest of the proselytizeers and scolds repeating the same sanctimonious bullshit regardless of the evidence that is presented to you.

The irony is that you will do more to prompt people to support ccw than anybody else because of your unending sophistry.

[Katya Mullethov]

77. Serial Sophistry

Would that be nutty or eccentric ?

[rrneck]

78. Nutty

Eccentric people have imagination and character.

[Starboard Tack]

86. Thanks again for the emotional outburst

I'm glad you have made the choice not to tote. But, tell me, if you're laughing at my "contradictions", then why are you so upset. You presume to know what the truth is. You accuse me of not "giving a fuck who has to die for you to get it."

"It has been explained to you ad nauseum why a firearm is the best solution for personal self defense."
Obviously, it has not been explained successfully, because I am not buying it and I think that your assumption "that you will do more to prompt people to support ccw than anybody else because of your unending sophistry." is completely unfounded and just another emotional response. I believe it will have the opposite effect, because my position is the civilized, common sense position.

Interesting how few antis stick around in this forum. Maybe because of the emotionalism on the part of the hardline toters. I feel very capable of defending myself and I will not cave to intimidation and bullying and I certainly don't need things "explained to me ad nauseum" by people trying to justify antisocial behavior.

[rrneck]

89. Well, lets take this one apart...

But, tell me, if you're laughing at my "contradictions", then why are you so upset.
Another contradiction to facilitate a thinly veiled insult in the most passive aggressive way possible. I'm not upset. When I get upset you'll know it. But read it quick because it will get deleted.

You presume to know what the truth is.
truth
 
 /truθ/ Show Spelled Show IPA
–noun, plural truths
 /truðz, truθs/ show+spelled">Show Spelled Show IPA.
1.
the true or actual state of a matter: He tried to find out the truth.
2.
conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement.
3.
a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like: mathematical truths.
4.
the state or character of being true.
5.
actuality or actual existence.
6.
an obvious or accepted fact; truism; platitude.
7.
honesty; integrity; truthfulness.
8.
( often initial capital letter ) ideal or fundamental reality apart from and transcending perceived experience: the basic truths of life.
9.
agreement with a standard or original.
10.
accuracy, as of position or adjustment.
11.
Archaic . fidelity or constancy.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/truth

When are you going to produce anything listed in that definition?

You accuse me of not "giving a fuck who has to die for you to get it."
When you advocate legislation disarming people to suit you aesthetic predilections law abiding people will conform to the law, no matter how irrational or unjust it may be. Some of them will need a firearm to defend themselves and won't have it because of your aesthetic predilections. They will be seriously injured or killed. You don't appear to give a fuck about that. Defend your curious sense of environmental aesthetics and I might change my mind.

Obviously, it has not been explained successfully,
Projection. Blame others for not changing your mind. You sound like a corporation; distributing risk to defend your turf.

I believe it will have the opposite effect, because my position is the civilized, common sense position.
Killing people is a distinctly UNcivilized activity. Killing is always wrong. Every time. I don't care why. But sometimes it's necessary. People who live in the real world with real world dangers understand that. People who live in the fantasy land of high property values and upper end tax brackets sometimes forget that their kind of civilized behavior cannot be dictated by legislative fiat and forcing others to live that way without providing the resources to make that happen is in itself an UNcivilized enterprise because it is unjust and gets others killed and injured. Of course, in true corporate fashion the real culprits never get their hands dirty but rather swan through life convinced of their moral superiority because they hire their injustice, brutality and murder out to others in the name of "civilized behavior".


Interesting how few antis stick around in this forum.
I'll let you in on a little secret. The guns forum and the religion/theology forum are a lot alike. In R/T the atheists pretty much own the place. Know why? Because religion and faith are basically emotionally based and when any religious person goes over there to defend their faith they are trying to defend an emotional experience. Now, whether they are using that emotional experience to defend what they believe is an actual measurable deity or if they are trying to defend the experience itself, the atheists win every time because the issue invariably gets framed in concrete empirical terms. You can't prove the existence of god with emotion, and you will never inspire anybody that simply doesn't want to be inspired. Faith is only proof of itself, and that's all it has to be. So the believers shrug and walk away in frustration not understanding that they have been snookered into playing another man's empirical game.

The big difference in the two forums is that where faith is emotional, guns are real. Criminals are real. Rape is real. Murder is real. There is a truism in mental health circles that goes like this: You can't tell people how they feel. You may think carrying a gun in public is uncouth, uncivilized, offensive, and foolish. If that's the way you feel about it that's fine. But you simply can't legislate your feelings on the matter. To do so would be telling others how they must feel, and not only is that a Second Amendment issue, it's also a First Amendment issue (see seperation clause).

Maybe because of the emotionalism on the part of the hardline toters.
The "hardline toters" have facts. You don't have to like them, but you have to deal with them if you want to make your case. So far you have failed to do so. Whatever emotionalism you seem to perceive is either projection on your part or frustration at your serial sophistry. Since you are arguing from an emotional point of view, your only choice is to inspire them to share your feelings, and pissing people off is the wrong way to go about it.

I feel very capable of defending myself and I will not cave to intimidation and bullying and I certainly don't need things "explained to me ad nauseum" by people trying to justify antisocial behavior.
If you feel bullied it's because you started something you can't finish. You don't want anyone telling you how to feel on the issue, and they have no right to do so any more than you have a right to tell them how to feel. Unfortunately, this isn't the R/T forum and the topic of discussion isn't how we feel. Bring all the feelings you want, but bring some facts with you as well or you won't get anywhere. If you think demanding empirical proof for an assertion is antisocial perhaps you should associate with others that feel the same way about the issue as yourself.

[rrneck]

62. Well...? nt

[Starboard Tack]

71. Well what? Do I see the contradiction ?

No. No contradiction. I don't want to disarm someone who needs to defend him/herself. But I don't advocate carrying a gun in self defense unless one is knowingly going into a situation that warrants it. Like a LE action where suspects are known to be armed or there is a reasonable suspicion that they are.

[Name removed]

73. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Starboard Tack]

84. I thought we were trying to have a civil conversation

That's not going to work with the continued insults.

[Name removed]

85. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Starboard Tack]

87. I don't respond to bullying

[Name removed]

88. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Katya Mullethov]

76. Development of the less lethal shotgun round has come a long way

If it's good enough for the US Border Patrol ...........

[GreenStormCloud]

64. Carrying a gun is not "living in fear". It is simply being prepared. N/T

[AtheistCrusader]

98. I don't live in fear.

You see, as a tool using mammal, I am equipped to deal with it.

[slackmaster]

75. I think you should just play it safe and stay home at all times

HTH

[jpak]

38. Why should anyone stay home - these folks don't have the right to intimidate

and that is what is all about

yup

[rrneck]

39. Stop whining and produce proof. nt

[friendly_iconoclast]

47. The proof is in the Protocols of The Elders of The NRA, often alluded to but never seen.

I'm not a member, so I don't know the secret handshake that lets you see them at NRA conventions, or the password to the PoTEoTNRA

VPN to look them up online...

[PavePusher]

81. Handshake? Jeeze-Louise, you guys don't keep up....

They've been using a bar-code tattoo behind the ear for years now....

[rrneck]

90. They're not barcodes any more

They're Glyphs.

[PavePusher]

46. I don't find them at all intimidating.

Why do you? Why do you live in fear of something that will probably never happen to you?

[friendly_iconoclast]

48. Where did you get your degree in telepsychology?

Does the School of Telepsychological Studies have a public website that prospective students might access?

Having the ability to discern the thoughts of people you don't know and have never met would be pretty cool...

[cleanhippie]

57. Always insults with you. Thats all you have.

[Katya Mullethov]

82. They'll steal allayour root beer .

[Pharaoh]

13. Why is he afraid?

I have never felt like I needed a gun to feel safe. But I have to admit, I might want one if I visited Alabama. No offense to any Alabamans O8)

[rrneck]

15. Don't know. I didn't talk to him.

There is precious little to be afraid of around here. That's why I figured him for a tourist. If he knew this town he'd know he could walk around naked and not be bothered.

He probably just carries most of the time and this time was no different.

[onehandle]

17. How do you know he wasn't a Cop or a Fed?

Or a Criminal?

[rrneck]

19. I don't.

He neither mugged or arrested anybody.

[oneshooter]

21. How would you know if he was? n/t

[rrneck]

24. I could make an educated guess.

That's about it.

[Turbineguy]

23. Perhaps they should just legalize

walking around with your schwantz hanging out.

[ZombieHorde]

25. That would be awesome. nt

[rrneck]

26. It already is here. nt

[damntexdem]

27. You have my sympathy.

But you WERE lucky.

[rrneck]

28. LOL! How do you know? nt

[rl6214]

29. No, come on, there's something you're not telling us

Where are the pictures of the blood in the streets or the paniced patrons of the hotel running into the streets. That's what we've been told will happen if we let the moral fabric of our lives get torn apart by open carry.

[rrneck]

32. I was a little disappointed

Maybe his holster had a silencer.

[lynne]

31. How many people are walking around with concealed carry? How many are carrying illegally?

How many is more than you could ever imagine. You are surrounded by guns daily. Just because you don't see them doesn't mean they're not there. They ARE there. Legally and illegally.

I much prefer open carry and its my experience that those who carry legally know the law, know the weapon, and respect both. The gun to fear is the gun you don't see.

[oneshooter]

40. Does that include legal concealed carry? n/t