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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:07 PM
Original message
Should children be banned from buying toy guns?

Proposal would ban kids from buying all toy guns

HONOLULU (HawaiiNewsNow) - Some state lawmakers are looking to shoot down toy gun sales. New bills introduced would make it a crime to sell a toy gun to any child under 18. The idea alone is already creating controversy.

There are posters around campus and staff reminds each class every year not to bring toy guns to school. Still kids learn the hard way and early this school year a Washington Middle School student bought and then brought a toy gun to school. He showed his friend who then pointed it at people. Now both boys are suspended and will miss almost their entire eighth grade year.

***snip***

"Most of these students are buying these guns without their parent's knowledge because it's readily available to them so legislation to prevent that will help because it will keep it off our campus," said Harano.

***snip***

Rep. Scott Saiki, who introduced the bill in the State House, says parents that bought their child a toy gun to play with at home would not be breaking the law, however they still could not bring it to school.
http://www.hawaiinewsnow.com/Global/story.asp?S=13994977


To view the Hawaii Senate Bill visit:
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2011/bills/SB749_.pdf
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. You sure this isn't from The Onion?
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jaxx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
2. Yes they should be.
Guns are shoot em up, kill, and not toys.
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YllwFvr Donating Member (757 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. guns arent toys
toy guns are
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jaxx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. What does it teach them?
Kill.
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Are you saying that those that play with toy gun are potential murderes?
I never played with an Easy-Bake-Oven, but somehow I ended up a fantastic *pats self on back* cook.
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jaxx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. LOL enjoy your day.
I just can't deal with nonsense.
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. See post 15...
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one-eyed fat man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
30. Did your parents allow you to play with a water pistol?
Are you posting from death row?
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Codeine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #30
39. From my cold, wet hands! nt
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. HA! +1
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Nuclear Unicorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. .
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rbnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #7
50. I'm a mom with a son who loves toy guns.
I did not want to allow guns, and I didn't for several years. He shot us with his fingers. He turned sticks into guns. He turned whiffle ball bats, legos, paper towel tubes, stuffed lollipop carnival prizes, drum sticks and remote controls into guns. I did not want to allow army toys. He played army with his stuffed animals.

Eventually, I decided that by not allowing these things, not only was I being ineffective in stopping this type of play, but I was creating taboo and mystique around toy guns and war toys. So, when grandpa wanted to buy him his first nerf gun for christmas, and when he picked out his first army set with a birthday gift card, I allowed it. He used to love toy trains above all other toys, but now it's all about guns and tanks. In a year or so, I'm sure it will be something else.

My son and I talk a lot about the difference between playing war and real war, the difference between toy guns and real guns and what to do if he ever sees a real gun. We spend a lot of time talking about all kinds of things. We have really great communication. I abhor guns, personally. I've had many conversations with him about why I feel that way. We're engaged in a deep ongoing dialog on this and a lot of other subjects. He's an empathetic, loving, curious, intelligent, creative boy who is developing his sense of right and wrong and I think he's doing great.

I don't see the usefulness in banning guns, and I don't see the harm in play in a loving, thoughtful, communicative environment.
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Yes... Shoot em up, kill!!! KILL!!!!!111!!!!11!!
Yup. 90 Days in jail and $2000...









This will lower our crime rates how exactly?
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tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 07:41 PM
Response to Reply #8
45. We used to make our own rubber band guns by cutting a broomstick into
appropriate lengths. We never made the handle grip, though. We just had the piece of brroomstick, the clothespin to hold the rubber band, and the notch at the end of the "barrel" to hook the rubber band into.

We used them to shoot down little pink plastic people that we set up at the end of a long table. It was great good fun.

Somehow I grew up to be very gentle and quite a gun-hating pacifist. But I have pics of myself as a child with cowboy guns in holsters on my hips. I remember how proudly, at e5-8, I used to swagger around the yard, thinking I was the sheriff and nobody would dare mess with me.

I don't worry about toy guns as much as I worry about a system that would suspend a kid from a whole year of education because of a toy gun.
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Codeine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
38. And yet I've never killed anyone.
I don't know anyone who has ever killed anyone. We all grew up with toy guns and somehow avoided the urge to "shoot em up, kill".
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YllwFvr Donating Member (757 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
3. What a ridiculous Idea
still didnt ruin my mood watching the egyptian party
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Atypical Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
4. No.
I think it is ridiculous that you can get expelled from school for a toy. The only way I would go for that is if the kid was very obviously trying to pass it off as a real gun.

Give me a break. Expulsion for playing with a cap gun?
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YllwFvr Donating Member (757 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. a cap gun at least looks more realistic
and makes a noise. This crap where the kid gets tossed out for having a ping pong ball shooter makes one wonder what peoples problem is. Maybe Zero Tolerance=Zero Sense
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NV Whino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
9. I have mixed feelings about this
I grew up playing cowboys and Indians, which of course, involved toy 6-shooters. However, neither I nor any of my friends ever brought them to school.

Now, kids play with toy machine guns and rocket launchers. And they bring them to school.

I think the problem lay not with the toys themselves, but with lack of supervision and teaching by the parents. This is a way complex problem and can't be solved on this board or simply by banning toy gun sales to kids.
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JohnnyRingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. Back in a simpler time when I was growing up in the early '60s
I took my dad's deactivated WWII hand grenade to school for show & tell (actually just to show off to my buddies). It was during the TV transition from Cowboy and Indians to WWII shows like "Combat", and it accessorized nicely with my Vic Morrow endorsed Thompson sub machine gun. After a hasty inspection from my teacher who found the ordinance safe, we were sent out to kill each other at recess.

Ten years passing found myself and my playground assault squad carrying peace signs and protesting the war in Vietnam. Fantasy/Reality.
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earthside Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
11. Extreme Nannyism.
This is the kind of overreaching that gets progressives, liberals and Democrats defeated at the polls.

I watched 'Combat', 'The Rat Patrol' and '12 O'Clock High' as a kid ... I had all kinds of toy army gear and killed thousands of imaginary Germans between the ages of about six and eleven years old.

And you know something, I'm about as big a peacenik as you can be.

So, trying to equate toys and play with present or future behavior is problematic at best. If these Hawaiian legislators are serious, though, why don't they ban the sale of video games to kids under 18? There is more play trigger-pulling resulting in graphic blood and guts displayed in most of those games than I evre saw watching 1960s television shows.
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
13. Next ban: Prohibition of children picking up sticks that look like guns.
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:30 PM
Original message
Just wondering. Does this cover the child manufacturing their own to gun?
What about wrapping a rubber band around you hand and pointing your finger and firing the rubber band. Would that be construed to being home manufacture?
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JohnnyRingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. That's funny because a child was suspended near here for exactly that
Now the school has to decide whether to draw the new line at extending an index finger and shouting "bang bang" at another child. Perhaps that could lead to throwing an invisible hand grenade or thrusting two fists downward on an imaginary plunger to blow up the school.

Aggressive child behavior is not the product of a prop.
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tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #13
47. I knew a mother who wouldn't let her son play with toy guns.
I LOL'd the day I saw him pick up a limp piece of string , "aim" it his playmate, and shout, "Bang! You're dead!" That pathetic piece of string hanging from his hand was, in his mind, a deadly gun.

If a kid wants to pretend to shoot, he will use his finger or a piece of string, a scarp of paper, or a pinecone. If he wants to play with a "toy gun" anything at all will become his toy gun.
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JohnnyRingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
14. "Overkill" is an unfortunate description for this legislation
I'm a gun owner and my youngest son is a collector. Neither of us have a stomach for violence, and neither of us think it's necessary to carry. My grandsons know the difference between fantasy/reality and have been taught the responsibility and permanance of a bullet fired.

That said, I decided some time ago my grandkids have wasted enough money on crappy Chinese toy guns. I don't buy them and I don't let them buy one when they're with me. I don't like watching them run around the house shooting at each other, and such senseless horseplay always devolves into a physical altercation that I don't need. This predictable hyperactivity is my real problem with toy guns, and while it's true they could still use toy knives to commit their rumpus room "crimes", at least it's quieter.

If they decide to buy one on their own and bring it to my house, I usually confiscate it at the door, just like real life. I should make one of those ban signs like at the entrance to WalMart with a toy gun at the center. The bottom line is that it is mine and my son's decision, not the government's.
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
15. My rant... An old post...
How we are setting boys up for future failure…

I’m writing the following from my own boyhood and adult perspective. I grew up in the late 80’s early 90’s, so my high-school, middle-school and elementary school life was pre-Columbine.

I remember in my pre-teen and teenage years, playing war, cops and robbers, cowboys and Indians (I always loved being the Indian), pirates, tag, dodge ball (I sucked at it), fireman, etc… I grew up ok. Sure no-one is perfect, but overall I am a very kind and social individual. I have no fantasies of world domination, or a compelling need to wipe out a mall full of people with a machine gun. There are 100 million men in this country. I’m sure that a vast majority played the exact same games as I did. I am also sure that they are well adjusted adults as well. But those are just feelings.

I grew up with other boys who all played those same games with me. None of which turned to a life of crime. The same could be said for the tens of millions of other boys that played the exact same games. But for some reason there are those in today’s day and age that “feel” that we need to suppress this type of activity and behavior in our young boys. Why? Well, several reasons and all seem well and good on paper, but I don’t think our school systems nor have some parents thought out the impact it can have on our young boys. I have been reading on the topic for quite some time and there are several authors who I’m sure could elaborate on the impact far better than I ever could.

There are several factors at work right now in America that are working towards insuring that young boys are being setup to fail in their adult life. Now I’m sure that there are some who would exclaim “Good, it’s about time that women get ahead in this society”. I don’t disagree with this sentiment, but I don’t think that anyone should be “ahead” of someone else at the expense of others. "I am not interested in a debate about gender politics left over from the late 70’s. Yes, the struggle for equal rights for women continues and is quite real. There is so much work yet to be done, particularly when it comes to equality in the workplace. Yes, there need to be more women in computer fields and more women in board rooms and in Congress. But we don't get there by ignoring the very real struggles of young boys."

These “activities” are not acts of violence. They are behaviors. Boys don’t just play with guns, there has to be a reason why, which I will elaborate on.

One question I would like to ask of those who do not allow toy-guns, playing war, cops and robbers, etc… Is why are you doing that? Do these games somehow corrupt our young boys? Do you view these toys as encouraging aggressive behavior and violent attitudes? Do you see them as reinforcing gender stereotypes, with boys playing with guns or swords and girls playing with dolls or cooking sets?

To those questions I would add more questions. When was the last time you really, REALLY watched a group of boys playing some form of war? For those of you who did it as a young child, I would like you to think back. In all the war games we played, how much energy was expressed in the bloody carnage and the death and destruction? How important was the “gun”? Now ask yourself how much of the focus of these games was on the drama? The Oscar nominated, over-elaborate death scenes, or the hero tossing himself on the live grenade, or taking an arrow to the chest so that others may live? How many times did you hear the statement "Go on without me!" or "Save yourselves!"? How often did they go on without you? How often did they save themselves? How much of the game revolved around children, using their imaginations to model notions of courage and sacrifice? Were we just trying to experience the emotions at the extremes of human conduct: facing and overcoming fear to remain faithful to our fellow soldiers, cowboys, Indians, pirates, etc? How much of this pretend war was simply just the timeless theme of the struggle between good and evil in the face of overwhelming odds and certain death? Looking back now, I realize that we were not playing war, we were playing hero.

Everyone by the end of the day had at minimum, 4 purple hearts, a bronze star, and a company commendation. How many times during the playing of this war, were our toy guns pointed at each other? I can vividly remember where a group of 8 of us took on an imaginary army of no less than 500 enemies. How many times in playing can you remember pulling a comrade from the battlefield, to give them medical attention so that they could get back in the war? Again we were just playing hero.

But what happens when we suppress these behaviors in young boys? In today’s day and age, we are suppressing “natural” behaviors inherent in boys. We stopped keeping scores at little league games so our little snowflakes don’t know the horrors of losing. Everybody is a winner. We don’t allow kids to play tag in school. Because God forbid little Johnny has to know what it is like to be “out”. Hell, in some schools running is forbidden on the playground.

Suppressing these behaviors is just a small piece in a bigger puzzle. The outcome of which is that our young boys are being setup for failure. Not only are we suppressing their inherent behaviors by not letting our young boys play and express themselves in ways they feel are natural, we are basically telling them that how they feel is “wrong”. We give them the impression that they are somehow lesser people because we demonize their behavior. So not only are we suppressing them at school, we are also suppressing them at home and on the playground. So basically, nowhere is it ok for boys to just be boys.

So what are the outcomes?

“Boys get expelled from preschool at four times the rates of girls. They are prescribed the lion's share of ADHD medication, they get most of the C's and D's in middle school, and they drop out of high school more than girls. Currently, only 43% of undergraduates in the United States are men.
Let boys be boys by simply letting them engage in the aggressive fantasies that come to them naturally.
We might see them as doing something potentially dangerous. But actually what they're doing is playing around with ideas of courage and valor, good versus evil, and teamwork. These are ideas we want to inculcate in our culture.
Peg Tyre “The trouble with boys”

Let's examine the way our child rearing and our schools have evolved in the last 10 years. Then ask ourselves this challenging question: could some of those changes we have embraced in our families, our communities and our schools be driving our sons crazy?
Instead of unstructured free play, parents now schedule their kids' time from dawn till dusk (and sometimes beyond.) By age 4, an ever-increasing number of children are enrolled in preschool. There, instead of learning to get along with other kids, hold a crayon and play Duck, Duck, Goose, children barely out of diapers are asked to fill out work sheets, learn computation or study Mandarin. The drumbeat for early academics gets even louder when they enter "real" school. Veteran teachers will tell you that first graders are now routinely expected to master a curriculum that, only 15 years ago, would have been considered appropriate for second, even third graders. The way we teach children has changed, too. In many communities, elementary schools have become test-prep factories—where standardized testing begins in kindergarten and "teaching to the test" is considered a virtue. At the same time, recess is being pushed aside in order to provide extra time for reading and math drills. So is history and opportunities for hands-on activities—like science labs and art. Active play is increasingly frowned on—some schools have even banned recess and tag. In the wake of school shootings like the tragedy at Virginia Tech, kids who stretch out a pointer finger, bend their thumb and shout "pow!" are regarded with suspicion and not a little fear.
Our expectations for our children have been ramped up but the psychological and physical development of our children has remained about the same. Some kids are thriving in the changing world. But many aren't. What parents and teachers see—and what this government study now shows—is that the ones who can't handle it are disproportionately boys.
But when nearly one in five boys has such serious behavioral and emotional issues that their parents are talking it over with their pediatrician, you can bet we are facing a problem that requires a more fundamental change in our society than medication or weekly therapy. Let's take a moment, before the school year gets any farther underway, and ask ourselves whether we are raising and educating our boys in a way that respects their natural development. And if we are not, let's figure out how we can bring our family life and our schools back into line.

Peg Tyre: Newsweek, Sept. 8, 2008



If you would like to do your own homework here is some interesting reading… If you’re interested:
http://pegtyre.com/pdfs/wilmette_study.pdf
http://pegtyre.com/pdfs/Kleinfel.pdf
http://pegtyre.com/pdfs/amcounciled06.pdf
and...
http://www.whyboysfail.com /

And, if you don’t agree with a damn thing I said or quoted from Peg Tyre, and would like an opposing viewpoint…

http://www.educationsector.org/research/research_show.h...
http://www.aauw.org/research/WhereGirlsAre.cfm
http://fray.slate.com/id/2173028 /

But just remember. We are/were just boys. We enjoy using our imagination. We enjoy expressing ourselves. We do it differently from girls. Don’t demonize us for just being ourselves, use our imaginations and foster them. Don’t suppress them. Men are not bad, nor are we the root of all evil. We are close, but not the root.

Thank you… I’m gonna go outside and build a fort. I hear the aliens are invading earth tonight.
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rbnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #15
54. +1 +1 +1 +1 +1
Oh, BTW, +1!
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county worker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
17. No. If you want to not buy toy guns for your kid that's your business
Edited on Fri Feb-11-11 12:33 PM by county worker
I grew up playing with toy guns. I had my own shotgun and went hunting with my dad as a kid. It did not screw me up, I don't worship guns, I don't like that so many people carry guns around today, I own a gun, so there!

On edit, I am a Vietnam veteran and know full well what evil can be done with guns of all kinds. I really hate war but kids playing war does not bring about war.
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MissMarple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
18. Another example of punishment not fitting the crime.
Gun facsimiles will never go away. Bringing them to school against the rules is stupid. Punish the stupidity. Personal toys do not belong in school. What has happened to schools today. They seem to be led by the incompetent way too often. Kids will always flout rules, you sanction infractions appropriately. Expulsion is not appropriate unless this is a persistent pattern and the child is unmanageable. Seriously. These people need to get a grip on reality. And do I really need to add they need to understand child development and appropriate behavior modification?

Kids can have a harder edge today, their world is different from the one many of us grew up in. But they are still kids underneath the dodgy veneer.

:eyes:
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Nuclear Unicorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
20. Making a law would be silly
Changing a culture would be more effective but I don't see that happening because "boys will be boys". They will make their own toy guns. Aggressive behavior is part of the male psyche, you cannot change that because you cannot change biology (I'm looking at you, anti-gay rights activists!).

Barbie is far more offensive to me as woman. Yes, girls like to be attractive but that bitch is such a materialistic Stepford wife no good thing could ever come of her influence on impressionable girls. And since then the market has gotten worse with Bratz and others. Anybody that would influence their daughter to look like she fell off stage while shooting one of those misogynist hip-hop videos should be horse whipped.
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JohnnyRingo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. I like your observational humor style of writing.
You wield it as a good vehicle to get your (well taken) point across.
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Nuclear Unicorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 01:11 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Thank-you, you're very kind.
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TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
22. What for? They can get real ones so easily
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Yeah, buy them right at WalMart - no questions asked.
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TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Well, that's another way.
It's easier to go grab Dad's though, judging by the article.
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. So how'd that work out for you?
You never did report back.
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TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:10 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Buy a gun at WalMart?
Never tried. Never will.

I'll have to take your word for it.
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. My bad. I had you confused with another member that claimed you could buy
guns at WallMart with no questions asked. Was going to go out and prove it to. But for some reason never got back to us on that.

My apologies.
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TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Fair enough.
:hi:
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one-eyed fat man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. She did get back
Give it up
I got better things to do with my life than buying guns, or WASTE MONEY on them. Why I told my husband buy me a food processor instead of a gun. Get it?


Try again
I never bothered. My life takes up too much time to waste of something as unimportant as that. My efforts are spent thinking and trying to get out of "paradise".


When asked why she didn't admit to being wrong about her claim...

I never tried so how would I know I was wrong?


You do have to wonder why she simply doesn't leave? She sounds just spiteful enough to stay just so her husband can't be less miserable without her.
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. I'll be darned. Thank of the person and suddenly. . . .
There is some real resentment building up. Something is going to give one way or another.


I do feel very foolish though for confusing the two members.
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one-eyed fat man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. Are there two of them?
I remember this challenge: I will test this myself...

Was there another like that?
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
25. That would not help my family. My little great grandson builds his
own guns our of legos and he fights aliens. The other day I was babysitting and had to help keep them out of the house all afternoon - the aliens that is. We begin teaching our children gun safety when they are playing with toys. They get timeout for pointing a gun at any human etc. By the time they are old enough to hunt they are very aware that a gun cannot be used to do anything other than self defense and hunting. I know this will not satisfy anti-gun people but we eat the food we hunt and we need it to supplement our budget. As to the original question - kids will invent guns. The only benefit I can see to not giving guns as toys is that they make the toys look just like the real thing and children cannot always distinguish them. We keep our guns looked in a safe for the sake of the kids.
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ileus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
35. we bought our 6 yo a full auto airsoft MP5 replica
for Christmas. It's his favorite toy gun at the moment. I have to admit I have a blast with is also except there's little plastic BB's all over the place.
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one-eyed fat man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
37. Book 'em Danno!!
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #37
41. WAIT! What are the ROE here?
Are we talking Ruby Ridge ROE or just a firehose?
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 07:27 PM
Response to Original message
43. Every kid in Hawaii will have to have a toy gun if this law passes ...
prohibition always backfires.

I predict profitable smuggling of toy weapons which will be sold to children in dark alleys. Of course, this will lead to a War On Toy Guns.
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tblue37 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
44. Can you imagine depriving a kid of an entire year of school over a toy--even if it was a
toy gun?
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RSillsbee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #44
46. Given our current education system
I'm not sure this is a bad thing
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:02 PM
Response to Reply #46
49. I agree. It's possible that a child could end up ahead of his classmates ...
if he couldn't go to school for a year.

Some school systems have a computer based "virtual school" course. My daughter is trying to get one of my grandsons into such a course. He is fantastic at learning on a computer but he has attention problems in a classroom. One year he had to attend summer school because of his grades. The school was experimenting with using computers to teach. His teachers were amazed as he flew through the courses he had to take and he even took a couple more for the fun of it.

There are very few computer games that challenge him, he usually can get to the top level in a day or less.



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Nuclear Unicorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #44
52. I'm sure they're just thinking of the children!
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
48. just the
boyz:P
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rbnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
51. Here's my kid:


And here's something he said that I posted about in the lounge:

"You shouldn't kill bad guys because then the people who loved the bad guys will turn into bad guys too because they will be so sad that you killed them. If you don't kill bad guys, there will be less bad guys. And if there's a bad guy and nobody loves him, you still shouldn't kill him. You should love him, because it's harder to change into a good guy if nobody loves you."

http://demopedia.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=9028992&mesg_id=9028992

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rbnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #51
55. Whoa! I have to add one thing.
How the hell did I get in here? I thought I was in GD.

LOL.

Seriously. I think this is my first time in this forum.

:hi:
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NewMoonTherian Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #55
56. I got here late, but...
maybe the thread started in GD and they moved it here. It usually happens if the conversation starts trending pro-gun. Anyway, hope you'll visit again! :toast:
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rbnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. Thanks.
:toast:
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Callisto32 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-11 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #51
59. The foundation of solid moral character seems to have been well laid.
For a child of that age, it is a surprisingly complex moral formulation, as well; infused with a great deal of pragmatism, no less.

Hopefully, you will someday find that you raised a libertarian. (Since I don't recall having seen your name around here much before, I suppose I should point out that I am the gun forum's resident non-Democrat libertarian.) :7
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rbnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-11 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #59
60. This is my first time in here.
I got lost.

;-)

Thanks for the kind words.
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beevul Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-11-11 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
53. It seems this has been tried before, with toys...


by order of the mayor of sombertown

Burgermeister Meisterburger

Toys are hereby declared illegal immoral & unlawful


Anyone found with a toy in their possession will be

placed under arrest and thrown in the dungeon!!



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Common Sense Party Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-11 12:01 AM
Response to Original message
58. Question: How many people who think banning toy guns is a good idea...
...would say that banning certain video games is a BAD idea?

I'm curious.
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