Burglary turns deadly in NW Travis Co. (Texas)

[X_Digger]

http://www.kxan.com/dpp/news/crime/burglary-turns-deadly-in-nw-travis-co.

TRAVIS COUNTY (KXAN) - The Travis County Sheriff’s Office says a burglary turned deadly on Friday after a homeowner fought an intruder in northwest Travis County.

Sheriff’s Deputies received a report shortly after 5 p.m. in reference to a burglary in progress in the 13700 block of Cedar Ridge.

The caller told officials that a man, later identified as Ryan Glen Bradford, 34, had broken into her home and was fighting her husband. According to Roger Wade with the Sheriff's office, at one during the assault the suspected burglar was shot.
...
Detectives do not anticipate filing any charges at this time. They will present the case to the District Attorney’s Office for review and presentation to the Grand Jury.

I'm betting a no-bill, which will also provide civil immunity.

Check out the comments- if they're to be believed, Bradford was drunk and looking to settle a score with someone and may have tried to bust into the wrong house.

[proteus_lives]

1. And the antis say nothing.

Not surprising.

[KansasVoter]

13. Not many of us here. Mostly "enthusiasts" on this place.

[proteus_lives]

23. Yes, we are enthusiastic about our rights.

Such a shame you can't say the same.

[KansasVoter]

24. I agree, all of you are very "enthusiastic"

[proteus_lives]

27. You're funny.

You act like it's a bad thing.

Well, I suppose to a person like you, it is.

[KansasVoter]

28. I know a lot of "enthusiastic" people.

[proteus_lives]

31. Funny, do you annoy them?

[KansasVoter]

33. No, just the really really "enthusiastic" ones.

[proteus_lives]

36. I see, I imagine your constant rants against their rights would be annoying to them.

[Hoopla Phil]

2. Yep, I'm glad we finally got the Castle Doctrine passed in TX. n/t

[sharesunited]

3. 1 point awarded. It is this scenario which keeps the People paranoid and gun loving.

[cowman]

4. Wow

more wisdom from SU who cant even get a story right.

[Travis_0004]

5. One homeowner is still alive today, since he was so 'paranoid'

Also, I don't consider myself paranoid. I enjoy shooting. I own a shotgun, and love to skeet shoot with it. I don't think spending 5.00 on some buckshot in case I need to defend myself is paranoid.

You probably keep a spare tire in your car, are you paranoid that you may get a flat at any second, or are you prepared.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

7. How could you call your self a liberal and progressive and kill all those harmless skeet

:sarcasm:

[spin]

6. It is a scenario which happens and will happen in the future ...

It does sound like you would prefer that the intruder would have faced unarmed victims. Do you love and want to protect people who break into occupied homes to pillage and terrorize the inhabitants?

Do you realize that self defense has been a right for many centuries? It wasn't invented with the Bill of Rights. Technology has advanced over history. A firearm can be an excellent self defense weapon as shown in the posted incident.

Is it paranoid to wear a seat belt or have a fire extinguisher in your home?

[oneshooter]

8. Don't mess with Texas, or Texans!!! n/t

[provis99]

10. you obviously don't know where "Don't Mess With Texas" comes from.

[oneshooter]

11. Yes I do

My version means you don't mess with our laws, customs, families or possessions.

The original was a motto of the Texas Department of Transportation (TxDOT) as part of a very successful anti-litter campaign.

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Statistical]

9. Interesting factoid is the the % of burglaries which are "hot" is much lower in the US than the UK.

Hot is a burglary in which the residence is occupied at the time.

Roughly 16% of buglaries in the US occur when resident is home. Most occur durring day (working hours) to mimize the likelihood of contact with inahabitants.

In UK the situation is the exact opposite. Not only does UK have a buglary rate roughly triple the US (yes 300%) it is made worse by the fact that a staggering 59% involve an occupied residence.

http://www.davekopel.com/2a/LawRev/LawyersGunsBurglars.htm

Why the difference?

Buglars is US routinely are unarmed and hit unoccupied homes. Carry a weapon increases charges and if one is targeting an unoccupied home no weapon is needed. The goal is to mimize confrontation with residences to reduce likelihood of capture (or getting shot).

Buglars in UK have little to fear from a disarmed population. Most buglaries occur at night when buglar is confident the resident is at home. This increases the chance that alarm is disarmed (or inhabitant can be forced to shut it off) and includes inhabitants wallet in the take.

While more guns may not reduce crime, more armed residents certain has changed the circumstances of burglary in the United States.

[KansasVoter]

14. Burglary rate in UK is 3 times as high as the USA??? Link please to a NON-ENTHUSIAST site!!!

[spin]

15. U.K. most violent nation in Europe ...

Published: 02 Jul 2009

BRITAIN was officially named Europe’s most violent nation last night.

We also suffer more violence than people in the US or even SOUTH AFRICA, figures show.

A shocking 2,034 per 100,000 people suffer violent crime in the UK, compared to 466 in America and 1,609 in troublespot South Africa. emphasis added

Britain’s damning figures far outstrip those of second-worst EU country — Austria, with 1,677 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

And the UK rate has increased by a shocking 77 per cent since 1998.

The numbers were released by the European Commission.

They also tell how Britain has the second highest OVERALL crime rate in the EU.

***snip***

Britain also has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours, including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.

But overall we came 13th worst in our rate for murders. Lithuania topped the list, followed by Estonia and Latvia.

The figures, recording crime in 2007, also show the UK has the fifth-highest robbery rate in the EU, and the fourth-highest burglary rate. emphasis added
Read more: http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2512514/UK-is-most-violent-nation-in-Europe-and-is-worse-than-US.html#ixzz0uAentc7L

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.
Last updated at 12:14 AM on 3rd July 2009

Britain's violent crime record is worse than any other country in the European union, it has been revealed.

Official crime figures show the UK also has a worse rate for all types of violence than the U.S. and even South Africa - widely considered one of the world's most dangerous countries. emphasis added

The figures comes on the day new Home Secretary Alan Johnson makes his first major speech on crime, promising to be tough on loutish behaviour.

***snip***

The figures, compiled from reports released by the European Commission and United Nations, also show:

* The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.
* It has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours, including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.
* The UK has the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU.
* It has the fourth highest burglary rate and the highest absolute number of burglaries in the EU, with double the number of offences than recorded in Germany and France.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1196941/The-violent-country-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html

Not quite the utopia you thought?

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[KansasVoter]

20. Wow, calling you Einstein hurt your feelings?

[spin]

56. Did I miss something? ...

When did you call me Einstein and if you ever did, why would that hurt my feelings? I would take that insult as a compliment compared to many of the names I've been called in the past.

There was a reply to my post that was deleted before I got a chance to read it. If by chance that is what you are referring to, repost it in a manner compliant to DU regs and I'll be glad to reply. Note: I never complain to the mods. One, because I never get pissed off at any flames I get. Two, because they are too busy to bother. It's not an easy job to herd cats.

[GreenStormCloud]

17. That is easy. Here you go.

For the UK, burglary rate: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1202925/The-burglary-map-Britain-Manchester-tops-crime-league-shame.html

Notice that the link is to a British Newspaper. Go to the link and you will find a table with the various burglary rate for different area. They seem to average about 25 burglaries per every 1,000 households.

Here is the link for the U.S. It is the Uniform Crime Report by the FBI. http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_01.html
Rate for 2008 is 7.3 per thousand.

25/7.3 is close to 3X.

UK burglary rate is about 3X that of the U.S.

Here is some info on the violent crime rate:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/5712573/UK-is-violent-crime-capital-of-Europe.html
Again, please note that this is a British newspaper.

SNIP

It means there are over 2,000 crimes recorded per 100,000 population in the UK, making it the most violent place in Europe.

SNIP

By comparison, America has an estimated rate of 466 violent crimes per 100,000 population.

SNIP

So the UK has a violent crime rate of well over 4X that of the U.S.

[KansasVoter]

19. OK, nice try.......

Pick one chart from certain cities. Wow, like I would fall for that. Let me pick some cities in the USA and see how they do!! LOL.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur_percap-crime-burglaries-per-capita

http://www.conferenceboard.ca/hcp/details/society/burglaries.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Burglaries_per_1,000_pop.svg

UK is about 11-13 per 1000. We are 7. Not even DOUBLE!!

Wow, I love the logic on this forum!! Like arguing with GOP voters.

And no one here mentions the murder rate.

[rrneck]

21. Do you think people should be able

to keep firearms in their homes for self defense?

[KansasVoter]

22. Yes!

[rrneck]

25. LOL!

:rofl:

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[rrneck]

35. LOL!

Post #9 - Statistical cites statistics that appear to show a relationship between "hot" burglaries in homes and firearms, using the U.S. and UK as examples.

Post #14 - You demand a more reputable source with three !!!'s.

Post #15 - Spin provides more information from more reputable sources.

Post #17 - You insult him.

Post #24 - You repeat the insult in a format that may not get deleted.

Post #18 - GreenStormCloud provides more information, which you probably didn't read.

Post #21 - You present data that does little more than further parse the issue, but does nothing to actually refute the original premise.

And then, in post #26, you affirm that people have the right to have a firearm in the home for self defense, but with only one exclamation point.

You have insulted two other DUers, unnecessarily parsed the issue without adding anything to the discussion all the while in agreement with the people with whom you are arguing. If you think it's OK for people to have a gun in the house, your point is moot. You're just pulling people's chains out of reflex.

I guess diaper rash just brings out the worst in people. :rofl:

[KansasVoter]

43. OK.....where is there any proof the UK has of 3 times the US rate??? Where????? Link! And....

see my post 21!

[KansasVoter]

44. LOL....post 21 is 100% proof. Please explain how it is not,

[rrneck]

45. You are arguing with and insulting people who agree with you.

For no reason. And you are doing so in the most juvenile and inane manner possible short of catching a pizza. You couldn't discuss the weather without pissing off the Pope.

:rofl:

[KansasVoter]

46. What in the hell are you talking about? I have been called annoying tonight but....

don't report it to the admins.

And you provide NO facts in any of your posts except to disagree with all stats and links.

[rrneck]

47. LOL!

Y'know, these posts are archived. Anybody can read this thread. Forever. Just so you know. :rofl:

[KansasVoter]

48. So, please show your detailed counter of my post 21. I am awaiting your analysis! :-)

[rrneck]

50. Gah Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha

Stop it! You're killing me! :rofl:

[KansasVoter]

52. OK, I get it. You ave nothing to say about the topic so just post graphics......

And your posting history is fascinating! A search reveals many detailed original posts in GDP about the progressive movement.

LOL....actually none this year. But I am sure you are just holding back.

No need to respond to you any longer except with the laughing guy in floor!

[rrneck]

53. I thought pictures would be easier for you to understand. nt

[KansasVoter]

55. LOL....

:rofl:

[Hoopla Phil]

29. Funny post. I think you forgot the sarcasm thingy. Ha Ha Ha.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hoopla Phil]

32. A quote from a PM you sent me.

I know where you are coming from and will never agree with you. But I am sure you feel the same way about me.
Too much violence in this country for me to ever support more guns for any reason.
Good luck!



Speaks for itself.

[KansasVoter]

34. More guns on the street. I am against CC. I am against handguns. Long guns in home are fine with me.

[proteus_lives]

37. So you support your hobby basically.

Long guns only? :eyes:

[KansasVoter]

40. And you are free to shoot anyone you want with your long gun.

[Hoopla Phil]

38. So it's ok if everyone agrees with you. I see. I believe there is a name

for that condition. But I'll respect the D.U. rules on civility. Please do the same.

[KansasVoter]

39. LOL....you have never been civil. Send me a PM. I would love to battle your wits. LOL.

[Hoopla Phil]

41. I don't seem to be the one loosing posts do to violating DU rules on

civility. Nope, and I don't really care what you believe in you own little world.

[KansasVoter]

42. Yes, I called someone "Einstein" and it hurt their feelings.....

seems like tough gun "enthusiasts" would have tougher skin.

The posters here whine to admins more than any other forum.

[GreenStormCloud]

51. We believe in following the published rules. You have a problem with the rules? N/T

[KansasVoter]

54. LOL.....

:rofl:

[Hoopla Phil]

57. Some people just don't think they should have to follow the rules. Yet want

to impose their rules on others. What is the name for that. . .

[Hoopla Phil]

58. You've got three violations removed from this thread alone. That does

not count the ones from other threads. That's ok, I understand the mods have a way of dealing with people that show a habit of being disruptors. Keep up the fine work.

[spin]

61. You directed a reply to me suggesting that my feelings were hurt by that comment...

however it was deleted before I read it.

That's a shame as I needed a good laugh. The fan on my AC burned up last night.

Let me assure you that there is NOTHING you can say to me that will hurt my feelings. When I get insulted on DU, I know that I am winning the debate.

Just repost your comments in a more polite manner that will not cause the Mods to delete them. I will be glad to respond. I come here to enjoy the back and forth of a interesting discussion. It's just fun. Sometimes I learn something new or someone is able to point out the flaws in my position. Those are the best moments on DU as life is a continuous journey of learning.

It may surprise you but I enjoy your posts. I doubt if anything I say will change your mind, but still you help to keep the Gungeon interesting.

[spin]

59. Long guns in the home can work but handguns offer some advantages ...

a rifle or a shotgun is awkward to handle quickly in a confined environment. A rifle often has far too much penetration to be the weapon of choice in a urban environment.

Many experts recommend that if you hear a strange noise in the middle of the night, you stay in your bedroom. If you have a shotgun, crouch beside your bed and point the shotgun at the door with your finger off the trigger. If an intruder breaks into your room, you make damn sure that he is not a family member or friend before you shoot. It's also recommended that you have a cell phone with you and if you are certain that there is an intruder, you call the police and stay on the line until they arrive.

I live in a big old house that was once a hotel. Sometimes we have roomers staying with us on a temporary basis. One recent individual was a local police officer who was looking for a house to buy. Several times at night I woke up to some strange noises and decided to investigate. I could have walked out of my bedroom with my 12 gauge coach gun.



But instead, I slipped on my shorts and dropped my .38+P S&W Model 642 into my pants pocket.



Fortunately I found that the police officer or one of his visitors had made the noise, or my of my grandsons had clumsily dropped a glass and broke it.

Because I chose to carry the snub nosed revolver out of sight, I didn't scare the shit out of some innocent person. My hand was in my pocket on the revolver and had I encountered a dangerous intruder, I could have drawn my revolver in a heartbeat and shot the intruder (if absolutely necessary).

A snub nosed revolver does require some practice to develop enough skills to use it for self defense. It's fair to say that a shotgun may be a better weapon than a handgun for someone not experienced with shooting handguns, but unlike in a movie a shotgun is not a weapon you point in the general direction and blow everything in front of the muzzle away. At close ranges you still have to aim.

Plus if you shoot someone with a .38 cal snub nosed revolver, there is an excellent chance he will survive but you will stop his attack. If you shoot someone with a 12 gauge shotgun there is an excellent chance that not only will you stop his attack, but you WILL kill him.

A shotgun or a rifle are the offensive weapons you grab when you know you are going to be in a life and death encounter. A handgun is a good self defense tool when you don't really expect a serious encounter.

We disagree on the subject of concealed carry. I see little problem with a licensed and trained person carrying a concealed handgun for self defense. I see a lot of problems with a criminal carrying an illegal concealed handgun.

Statistics show that the licensed individuals will rarely misuse their privilege to carry concealed to commit a crime or to shoot someone without good reason. Criminals, on the other hand, are far more likely to blow someone away for the shear hell of it or because they felt they were disrespected for some foolish reason.

[armueller2001]

64. Can you elaborate on your

reasons for opposing concealed carry by lawful, trained, permitted citizens?

Is it "feelings" or facts?

[GreenStormCloud]

49. You fail. I used national averages. N/T

[KansasVoter]

63. Post your source and link! I did, 3 of them!

[Glassunion]

66. Um... He did post his source and link...

From his post:

For the UK, burglary rate: (the bolded text is the link) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1202925/The-bur...

Here is the link for the U.S. It is the Uniform Crime Report by the FBI. (the bolded text is the link) http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_01.html
Rate for 2008 is 7.3 per thousand.

25/7.3 is close to 3X.

Here is some info on the violent crime rate (the bolded text is the link): http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/57...

His source for the UK's data was from a newspaper. I'll do you one better, here is the source of his source...
(the bolded text is the link) http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/portal/page/portal/crime/data/database
In there you will find a set of reports. Crimes reported by the police. From there you can drill into Violent Crime. In there you will find the United States as well. Makes it easier.

Example of some data...
England and Wales 2007 Violent Crimes (actual value) = 1,099,434
United States 2007 Violent Crimes (actual Value) = 1,408,337

Yes the United States has more violent crimes, BUT, we have more people. Quite a bit.

Population of England and Wales = 52,041,916
Population of the United States = 301,621,157

England and Wales violent crime rate per person: 1,099,434(crimes) / 52,041,916(population) = .0211
United States violent crime rate per person: 1,408,337(crimes) / 301,621,157(population) = .0046

From that we can get the crime rate (# per 100,000)
England and Wales (2112.6)
United States (466.9)

England and Wales experiences 4 1/2 times more violent crime than the US.

[safeinOhio]

18. Much better to use Switzerland to compare.

They have very low gun crime. They have a huge number of gun owners. Even with all of the guns they have very strict restrictions on the purchase, carrying and types of weapons.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland

They also have a different culture around gun ownership. It is a collective right to own guns to protect the country as there is no standing army. It is also a very wealthy country compared to the US or UK.

[Statistical]

60. Here is the source. I was wrong it is more like 4x the US burglary rate.

The RDS Crime in England and Wales 2007/2008 report
http://rds.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/crimeew0708.html

The chart of crime rates can be found here:
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs08/hosb0708chap2.xls
Need Excel to view. Second tab has rates per 10K persons. Most countries show date in per 100K persons".

Of course someone who is going to "ban handguns" to reduce crime obviously already did research on the subject. I mean you it is a pretty well known fact that UK has a massive violent crime problem and rates haven't gone down by banning guns.


UK
Burglary: 3090 per 100K
Total Violent Crime: 4930 per 100K
Wounding (Aggravated Assault): 1070 per 100K
Robbery: 710 per 100K

US (per FBI)
http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_01.html
Burglary: 730 per 100K
Total Violent Crime: 455 per 100K
Wounding (Aggravated Assault): 275 per 100K
Robbery: 145 per 100K

So I was wrong (or outdated). The buglary rate in UK is roughly 4x the US.

UK crime problem compared to US.
Burglary: 4x the US
Aggravated Assault: 4x the US
Robbery: 5x the US
Overall Violent Crime: 7x the US

Now the UK does have a homicide rate roughly half the US and the antis love to hold this up as the gospel of the missing gun however there is one flaw. UK homicide rate was about the same BEFORE the banned guns. UK doesn't have a low homicide rate because it banned guns it has managed to keep a low homicide rate after banning guns (violent crime is another story). However in last 30 years the US homicide rate has been cut in half despite NOT banning guns.





http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_01.html

[Glassunion]

67. How about the Violent Crime Rate over time in the US vs. UK?

Source: http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2008/data/table_01.html 
Source:
http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/portal/page/portal/crime/data/database

United States
Year	Rate	% to 1996
1996	636.60	
1997	611.00	-4.02
1998	567.60	-10.84
1999	523.00	-17.84
2000	506.50	-20.44
2001	504.50	-20.75
2002	494.40	-22.34
2003	475.80	-25.26
2004	463.20	-27.24
2005	469.00	-26.33
2006	473.60	-25.60
2007	466.90	-26.66


Year	Rate	% to 1996
1996	663.01	
1997	667.43	+0.67
1998	1164.99	+75.71
1999	1352.13	+103.94
2000	1410.36	+112.72
2001	1563.69	+135.85
2002	1950.46	+194.18
2003	2179.82	+228.78
2004	2311.48	+248.63
2005	2345.89	+253.82
2006	2317.98	+249.61
2007	2114.30	+218.89

[Nomorehannity]

62. The headline should read "Man kills burglar."

Saying "burglary turns deadly" makes it sound like the homeowner was killed. Lousy media.

[Statistical]

65. I would go with "Man defends himself from violent attack with lethal force".

Then again that would put a positive slant on the headline and we can't have that.

guns = ebil. All uses of guns = ebil*



* standard cop exclusion applies, obviously those who want to ban guns needs to "gun on call" service.