He Had a Gun Permit, Why Was He Arrested?

[oneshooter]

He has a valid license to carry a concealed weapon. So why was a decorated Vietnam veteran still arrested for having his gun on him?
Robert Keathley says he was just minding his business when Detroit police pulled him over for a routine stop. He offered up that he had a Concealed Pistol License, commonly called a CCW (the old term was "carrying a concealed weapon").

There should have no problem, right? Wrong!

The police came back to his car and told Keathley that his gun license was expired. They arrested him, keeping him locked up at the 6th Precinct for half the night.
So, why didn’t they believe the date that’s printed right on Keathley's license? And what’s he supposed to do about the criminal record that he now has?
Keathley did, in fact, have a valid license. Somehow the renewal for his CCW was never put into the state computer system used by police to verify information.

Action News Investigators hounded the folks responsible for CPL/CCWs - the Wayne County Clerk’s office - for answers. It turns out budget cuts are what landed Keathley in jail.

Budget cuts and bureaucracy strike again. I wonder if he would have a case for a suit?

Oneshooter
Armed and Livin in Texas

[katandmoon]

1. The cops abuse plenty of people for lots of reasons, just because they can. He's not that special.

[east texas lib]

2. Let the finger pointing and blame laying begin!

CYA at its best.

[proteus_lives]

3. That sucks.

:thumbsdown:

[virginia mountainman]

4. here comes a lawsuit...

He does have a case, they dropped the ball, and his rights where infringed. They will pay...they ALWAYS END UP PAYING...

[shadowrider]

6. I should hope he sues AND has this incident wiped from his record

[jeepnstein]

18. He doesn't have a case against the arresting officer.

The officer acted on the information given him through the computer system that is supposed to be reliable and up-to-date. The CCW card is nice but the computer better match the info. It didn't because someone failed to do their job. The arresting officer acted well within the scope of his duties.

[Biker13]

5. K&R

[Euromutt]

7. Strictly speaking, Keathley doesn't have a criminal record, though, right?

I mean, the guy was arrested, but he wasn't convicted of anything, if I understand correctly.

And in all honesty, I can't fault Detroit PD for arresting and detaining him; they acted correctly based on the information available to them, and it's not their fault that that information was incorrect. I don't know what a Michigan CPL looks like, but to be honest, my Washington state one doesn't look that hard to forge; determining its validity would depend largely on verifying that the information on it matched my driver's license and the databases of the Dept. of Licensing and/or the State Patrol.

All of which is not to say the system isn't broken, namely between the county and the state. When the state requires you to acquire a license to do something, not having a valid license can get you arrested and detained, and the physical license is deemed to be insufficient evidence of its validity, the state has to assume responsibility for ensuring that the validity of the license can be verified. Budget cuts aren't a valid excuse when you pay a fee, i.e. give the relevant authorities your money for the specific purpose of covering the costs associated with processing your license.

[shadowrider]

8. As I recall, the arrest remains on his record

whether or not he's convicted. IMHO all information regarding this needs to be expunged, including the arrest. If it isn't, it can lead to potential problems if he's stopped again for a minor traffic violation.

Police: Have you ever been arrested? (Note: They don't ask if he's ever been convicted)
Driver: Yes
Police: For what?
Driver: Weapons violation, valid permit which appeared in your records as invalid

At this point, the radar goes up, and a search for weapons begins. It can turn into a huge hassle.

[Euromutt]

9. Then the system is broken indeed

I've never been so much as issued a traffic ticket, so I have no personal experience with this, but in a system which notionally subscribes to the idea that the accused is presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law, an arrest record in and of itself cannot form a basis of suspicion for legal purposes. Otherwise, we have ventured well into "Constable Savage" territory (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BO8EpfyCG2Y).

If merely being arrested is presumed be indicative of wrongdoing, then we need to seriously sharpen the criteria under which police can even perform an arrest. Or, alternatively, we could explicitly establish--not that we should have to, since that is notionally already the case--that an arrest in and of itself proves nothing, other than it was reasonable to suspect the arrestee at the time, in those circumstances, but that the suspicion proved incorrect.

[shadowrider]

10. You and I completely agree on this.

[AtheistCrusader]

11. I guarantee, even if charges were dropped, that arrest will show up on a FBI background check.

They always do, forever and ever, amen.

[Hepburn]

12. He showed them a CCW permit that when checked had an expired date.

And you ask why he was arrested?

:eyes:

Edit for typo

[jazzhound]

13. self delete n/t

[shadowrider]

14. Look again

His permit was valid, but the paper copy he had showed it was expired. It isn't his fault he followed the law, had it renewed and the government fell down on the job by not getting the info entered.

[X_Digger]

15. Actually, looks like the paper license showed valid..

"So, why didn’t they believe the date that’s printed right on Keathley's license?"

[shadowrider]

16. I mis-read it.

The question now is, how was he able to get a paper copy saying it's ok without it being put into the computer? Paper copies usually aren't spit out unless it's been entered.

[X_Digger]

17. Definitely a bureaucratic screw-up. n/t

[shadowrider]

19. Damn them bureaucratics!!