2004 Toyota Prius preview

[midnight armadillo]

2004 Prius

To sum up: same price at $20k, bigger, more power (equiv. to the 4 cyl Camry), better mileage (55 mpg up from 50), and 30% lower emissions over the last Prius. And to think Detroit claims this sort of vehicle is an impossibility that won't sell...

This car is quite an accomplishment - this will be the first hybrid car with mass appeal. I'd buy one if I was in the market! Now if only they'd make it a station wagon...although making it a hatch was pretty clever to make up for the storage loss due to the battery pack.

[Divernan]

1. My daughter bought one a year ago and it is a terrific car.

And it does so have great acceleration, so stop saying that! (directed to American automakers)

[hatrack]

2. You can even get head-curtain airbags as an option

That's one safety feature I'd like to see in more cars.

Hmm . . . roomier, better acceleration, cleaner and even better mileage at the same price.

It's called e-n-g-i-n-e-e-r-i-n-g, if anybody from Detroit's paying attention.

[uberotto]

3. My wife and I have been bugging the local Toyota dealers...

About when they are going to get the new Prius in. I like my Camaro, but it's just getting too expensive. So far, it looks like October will be the best time to find one, although I thought that I'd seen a couple of them on the road around town already.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

4. A friend of mine has one...

Uber-Geek that he is(you will find his name on the motherboards of Amiga 500s and 2000s...) and he loves it. He is gettng somewhere in the vicinity of 70mpg. It's in the way you drive them.

[Bamboo]

5. Tesla coil optional.

One side effect of large SUVs is that automobiles have become larger as well.Compair the Camry ten years ago and today,the 2003 Camry looks like an SUV after one pass through the pasta roller.I resent automakers who have a good small design and then bulk it up to sell more,SUVs have distorted the perception of size,safety and status.The new Prius has become larger which is a mistake in my opinion,the people who buy SUVs and car shaped SUVs are selfish and the hybrid car will still remain fringe.I wonder if hybrid SUVs will become the largest hummers on the road with large diesel engines and electric motors to get them moving.Toyota should produce a non-geek hybrid by stuffing one in the Camry without any indication that the car is different.When I see a car model with midlife spread I am reminded that younger people still drive small cars.http://www.smart.com

P.S.Thanks newyawker99 for welcome.

[Atlant]

6. Station Wagon? Would you settle for a Matrix?

> Now if only they'd make it a station wagon...

Station Wagon? Would you settle for a Matrix? Seriously, Toyota
has announce plans to deploy the same power package in an SUV
(with a pure-electric "rear drive" so no drive shaft or transfer
case/center differential) and possibly a Camry or Matrix. Now's
the time to start lobbying them!

Atlant

[rini]

7. Matrix

I plan on getting the first hybrid SUV, Ford (ugh) Toyota, whatever. BTW, what an interesting discussion.

[Kolesar]

8. That sounds like a fun design

A hybrid system for the front drive wheels and an electric motor and differential to give extra traction to the rear wheels. The back could be a relatively small electric motor (sub-10 horsepower, perhaps).

[Atlant]

9. And that, of course, is precisely the point. :-)

> The back could be a relatively small electric motor (sub-10
> horsepower, perhaps).

And that, of course, is precisely the point. :-)

The new powertrain is being designed from the get-go with enough
extra "watts" to support this sort of electrical power transmission
to the rear wheels, enabling a very simple AWD setup.

By the way, to the poster who was commenting on the size of the
battery pack:

It's actually not very large. Think "small carry-on suitcase". This is
possible because the hybrid design only uses the battery for "peaking"
loads and not for continuous power. Thus, the battery pack is much
smaller than in a pure EV (where ALL the energy must be stored in the
battery pack rather than the gas tank). By the way, a while ago, I
posted an article in here about how even-more-modern design might
team an "ultracapacitor" in parallel with the battery pack. That
provides even better very-short-term efficiency because the
ultracapacitor is much more responsive to sudden charging and
discharging than an electro-chemical battery.

Atlant

[midnight armadillo]

10. Toyota Matrix...

I've driven one, and while the interior was pretty clever in its use of space, I wasn't wild about it. The dash was terrible: a clear case of design and style over function. The Corolla motor didn't have quite enough pep in it either (I didn't try the 180 hp version).

I mentioned the station wagon since my wife & I are expecting our first baby any day now with several more planned down the road, and a wagon makes life easier! Actually, I'd be very likely to buy into a diesel wagon once the low-sulfur fuel arrives and all the neat-o Euro diesel engines cross the Pond. I like to own cars for a loooong time and diesels will run forever - hybrids aren't yet proven in this regard. Plus biodiesel is carbon neutral :-) A Saab turbo diesel wagon running B100 (that's 100% biodiesel) would make me a happy camper.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

12. my '95 camry wagon gets 27 MPG

and that's average. I get close to 30 if it's mostly highway.
Why Toyota stopped making the wagons is beyond me, but they will definitely be back- as hybrid or conventional.

[Atlant]

13. Fashion.

> Why Toyota stopped making the wagons is beyond me,

In the US, station wagons go in and out of style as fashion
dictates.

In Europe, where it costs too much to run a minivan or (shudder)
an SUV, station wagons never seem to go out of fashion.

I figure I'll run my '96 Dodge Grand Caravan for four more
years (until the kid is out of college) or until it really,
really, finally self-destructs, whichever comes first (and
being a Dodge, it's working hard on achieving that second
option!). Then, I'll dump the Caravan and my Audi sedan in
favor of some station wagon or hatchback. Audi, VW, Volvo,
and Saab are all importing fine wagons at reasonable price-
points these days, and maybe there will also be good hybrid-
powered wagon choices by then.

Atlant

[Kolesar]

14. So what would be a fine price for a fine station wagon?

I really don't know. My last wagon was an '89 Chevrolet Celebrity. I have a minivan now, and probably will not dispose of it for another 7 or 8 years when it goes kaput.

[cprise]

15. Jetta Wagon TDI gets 45 MPG

http://vw.autodatadirect.com/ASC/config/frameset.asp?Language=EN&Country=US&Acode=USB30VWC032C0&model=JettaWagon&LeadSource=&DisplayGQ=yes&GQOrigin=VC&LoggedOn=



It gets excellent milage and unlike the Prius you can use 100% renewable fuel:
http://www.biodiesel.org

[NewYorkerfromMass]

16. good call! know a former corolla wagon owner got a jetta

she said: " Hey, I can't afford the Passat! I even drove it once- beautiful car. well worth the 30K or whatever she paid. (Not the bio-diesel version BTW)

[cprise]

17. Base price for this is $19,290

That's the GL with 5-speed manual transmission.

I own a Golf TDI and absolutely love it. It's fun to drive, I go weeks without refueling (50 MPG), and I've cut the oil companies out of my spending with biodiesel.

[Wonk]

11. The green Toyota that can park itself (Reuters)

(snip)

Toyota President Fujio Cho sat in the driver's seat at a demonstration laid on for the press, surprising reporters by holding his hands up as the car quickly parked itself.

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