Kerry Makes Chickenhawk Rush Limbaugh Sputter

[DrFunkenstein]

This is worth revisiting:

"Scored a direct hit on the Hot Air Hindenburg today, making the kind of call to Rush Limbaugh halfway through his show that him a stuttering fool and all of the callers who followed trying to repair the damage. His show started with the usual relentless demonizing of liberals, this time John Kerry from Massachusetts, a Vietnam War hero whom Rush was mocking as 'Lurch,' using the Addams' Family theme song. But when he tried to twist Kerry's words Sunday on Meet the Press -- about how 'Sometimes in war a leader looks behind him and the troops aren't there,' as somehow showing as incompetent or a failure -- I'd had enough.

"I jogged to the nearest phone and dialed a dozen times till I got through, then told his call screener that I'd like to make the case that Kerry isn't going to be painted as a garden-variety liberal as easily as they think, given his war-hero status and foreign policy credentials. Guess I sold the screener, because I was put through onto the air within seconds ...

"I told Rush the same thing on the air and then asked him if he'd seen the New Yorker piece on Kerry.

"Slowly and deliberately I told the story about how in response to the Vietnam War, John Kerry had gone down to the recruiting office to sign up to fight along with his two best friends, John J. Pershing III and Fred Smith, the founder of Federal Express. When Rush tried to bring up the smear about him not having his troops behind him, I explained that Kerry had been referring to how he won his Silver Star rescuing crew members of his fast-boat who had fallen overboard, and been wounded even while fending off a Vietcong machine gun nest.

"I then asked Rush how Bush might respond if, in the debates, Kerry asked him where he had been when he didn't show up for his plum assignment for a year. Or for that matter, how could disparage a war hero when he himself had dodged the Vietnam Draft by claiming to have a boil on his butt.

"He tried to lie out of this but I explained that his 4-F form listing a 'pilonidal cyst' was printed in books for all to see . At that point, I was cut off the air and as Rush stuttered and stumbled around like I have never heard him before, his screener came back online and told me, 'You're out of here, buddy -- we've got you pegged and you'll never call again.'

"As with a previous call, when I nicknamed Rush 'The Jabba the Hut of American Politics' (which stuck and caused him to lose 100 pounds over a year's time), all of the rest of the show was dominated by damage-control over my call. A number of callers took issue with the correct labeling of most right-wing war-hawks as 'Chicken Hawks' -- and this allowed Rush to obscure the issue by claiming that he'd merely not served, rather than dodged the draft with a bogus 4-F status. At least nine times that I counted, he referred to me by name with the usual cheap smears, and I collected each as a badge of honor I'm sending to John Kerry to add to his uniform."

<>

http://www.salon.com/politics/conason/2002/12/05/bush/

Feel free to check out this extensive documentation of Bush's AWOL status:

http://www.awolbush.com/

<>

[XanaDUer]

1. Damn, you're good!

Thanks for the great post. :)

[JohnKleeb]

2. Way to go Kerry give him hell man

Keep fighting the good fight.

[damnraddem]

3. LOL!

I heard Kerry on NPR recently and he sounded good. If DLC is throwing in with him, he's probably the best we could get with their endorsement. I'd vote for him, maybe even actively support his campaign; but I would definitely prefer Dean, or even Kucinich, get the nomination.

[deutsey]

4. I wish there was a recording of this available

Good job!

[DrFunkenstein]

5. Follow Up

Cheney:

Despite lacking a military background, Cheney was easily confirmed by the Senate. During the Vietnam War, when Cheney was draft-eligible, he received deferments as a student, and then as a registrant with a child.

“I had other priorities in the ’60s than military service,” Cheney told a reporter in 1989, according to the Washington Post.

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/DailyNews/GOPCVN_profile_cheney.html

Ashcroft:

Attorney General John Ashcroft received seven draft deferments for the seven years he was eligible for service.

http://csmweb2.emcweb.com/durable/2001/05/18/fp11s3-csm.shtml

Rumsfeld:

Mr. Rumsfeld...served in the U.S. Navy (1954-57) as an aviator and flight instructor. In 1957, he transferred to the Ready Reserve and continued his Naval service in flying and administrative assignments as a drilling reservist until 1975.

http://www.defenselink.mil/bios/rumsfeld.html

Karl Rove had other things on his mind:

In 1971 he quit the University of Utah and moved to Washington to become executive director of the College Republicans.

In 1973, he and the College Republicans were accused of encouraging dirty tricks during the Watergate campaign year of 1972. The Republican National Committee, which was then chaired by Bush's father, investigated and eventually exonerated Rove.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/campaigns/wh2000/stories/rove072399.htm

<>

Annual Officer Effectiveness Report, 5/2/73: "Not Observed" from May 1, 1972 to April 30, 1973...

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In June of 1973, Air Force HQ asks for more information...

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...and in November, Major Rufus Martin tells them he has none to give.

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[ProfessorPlum]

7. Here's my take on ChickenHawks

click here: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/michael_bower/watch/watch013.html
and scroll down to May 14th.

Also, if we're passing good links around, now is the time for the ChickenHawk Database: http://www.nhgazette.com/chickenhawks.html

And "Who Served"?: http://www.awolbush.com/whoserved.html

Two of the best links out there.

[ProfessorPlum]

6. You know

that's really excellent. I hope that Kerry shows as much fire as a debater as that caller did. If people would just speak the truth and not cling to cordiality as the last virture left, we could really diminish the influence all of these idiots have over our lives.

Would Kerry dare to make the same excellent points in a debate with Bush? One would hope so.

[DrFunkenstein]

8. Kerry On Bush's Cocaine Use In 2000

But despite significant media attention this week, the only government official to touch upon the disconnect between the drug use of political leaders and the punitive drug policies that they often espouse was Sen. John Kerry (D-MA).

On Monday, Kerry was asked by reporters to explain why he thought that questions surrounding George Bush regarding whether or not he had used cocaine were more substantively relevant than Gore's use of marijuana. Kerry, noting that Al Gore had already admitted his use of marijuana, said:

"(H)e (Gore) said 'I used it.' So that's not an issue... And I don't think Al Gore intends, you know, to make prior use an issue of other people, except to the degree that it affects public policy."

Pressed later on the question of the Bush cocaine rumors, Kerry laid out his thinking on why Bush's drug use, if substantiated, is indeed an important issue for voters to consider:

"The issue about George Bush is not the fact that he may have used it, said Kerry. "The issue about George Bush is, how can you, if you have (used cocaine), have a position that is so at odds in terms of being a governor where you send a lot of other people who may have done the same thing you do to jail. That's the issue. It's not a question of whether he used it or when he used it, it's a question of what his policy is today and whether that's hypocritical and dangerous."

http://www.stopthedrugwar.org/chronicle/123/gorequestions.shtml

On "Fox News Sunday," John Kerry claimed Gore was better than Bush because he admitted use, and better than Clinton because he didn't claim he only used it once and didn't inhale. Then he turned around and said Bush's rumored drug use should be the only issue since he supported tough drug laws.

http://www.mediaresearch.org/BozellColumns/newscolumn/2000/col20000203.asp

[ProfessorPlum]

11. Good for Kerry

I'm so happy with our current field of candidates I could just pee.

I thought of another reason I really like Dean - you touched on it yourself earlier. You know that saying "If you aren't outraged you haven't been paying attention"? To me, Dean's anger is an indication that he really has been paying attention, and when I see politicians seeming to sleepwalk through their messages, it angers me, because I feel like they aren't paying attention. That's why I like Dean. He seems wide awake.

edit: homophone problems

[DrFunkenstein]

15. The Wrath of Bill Moyers

Remember I brought up Moyers in another thread as an idol of mine? I think you can definitely sense his outrage when, say, the FCC steamrolls media democracy. But he doesn't act anything like Dean. Does this lack of "anger" mean he is not outraged?

I don't want to say that Dean is the opposite, but Bill Moyers has a classy way of being outraged. I used to love it when Paul Wellstone would bang the podium, but I recognize there are different ways of expressing things.

Kerry will never be a podium-banger, but I think he has that essential sense of righteous indignation towards Bush's policies and the man himself.

Don't mistake Kerry's deliberation as a lack of fire. Just ask Bill Weld what Kerry is like when he is on a roll.

[ProfessorPlum]

18. I wanted to mention that

Moyers AND Studs Terkel - you are in excellent company. I love those guys. And they certainly aren't afraid to speak what they see as the truth, another quality they share with Dean.

I would really love to see Kerry on a roll. I saw him on a couple of minutes on some CNBC show late night a week or two ago. He made some pretty good points, but was kind of in quiet/campaign mode. After he was off, the smarmy right-wing host and hostess made snarky remarks about him. And of course mentioned how popular the shrub is. If I could have reached through the screen . . .

[DrFunkenstein]

20. Kerry Nearly Crying

I'll never forget seeing Kerry on C-Span talking about the Vietnam War and the efforts of veterans to fight hard for recognition of their acheivements. He seems to be most comfortable in this situation - surrounded by veterans, and he made some strong points. But I was most impressed when he quoted the Bible: "There is no greater love than the sacrifice made for a friend." At this point, he nearly loses it and has to quickly wrap up the speech. It was very powerful to see.

I actually found it on the web (which is why I have the quote). His speech starts around the 12:00 mark if you're interested.

http://cspanrm.fplive.net:554/ramgen/cspan/edrive/wh111102_vietnam.rm

I think if Kerry can click the way he did at that speech, he'll be our next President.

[ProfessorPlum]

21. It breaks my heart to think

of the position those men were put in, and the horrible position the men and women in Iraq are in now. Everyday, they risk being blown away, and they risk blowing away some innocent person who is just looking at them cock-eyed. And they have no end in sight.

I really wish, from the bottom of my heart, that the leadership in this country on both sides of the aisle could have had the guts to stand up to this horrible junta and say "enough - this war will not happen because it is wrong" before we invaded. What a bunch of cowards they are, collectively.

Everyone can see what a lie it all is. Smirky thinks he needs to find evidence of WMDs so he can placate his "cynical critics". What a joke.

[DrFunkenstein]

22. It Really Is Just A Terrible, Terrible Joke

Don't mistake my attempts to clarify Kerry's vote as anything but utter contempt for the whole process. These four years will be the most shameful in American history. That may not be true, considering the number of f-ed up military interventions in our history, but never on this scale.

As for Smirk, can you even imagine for a second that he wants to find those WMDs to keep America safe? I don't think he has done a single thing in office that wasn't meant to re-elect him. I was be so thrilled when it is all for nothing.

Can you imagine what kind of partying we'll be doing in November 2004!?! And again in January 2005!?! I'll probably not even bother to stop partying in between!

Seriously, think about it. How awesome it will be to know he is gone, and that all the smoke and mirrors will finally put him in history as perhaps the single worst president ever.

If I ever saw him, I seriously think I would take a swing at him - secret service or no. I hate him deeper than any man should.

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[ProfessorPlum]

24. exactly -

Smirky should be sweating and soiling his pants right now, calling for many more troops in Iraq to conduct the search, knowing that those horrifying "WMDs" are missing, are not under our control, are on there way to God know's where . . .

Instead he's all "Mission Accomplished". What Mission? It certainly puts the lie to the idea that HE ever thought Iraq's weapons were a threat. I shudder to think what this war was really all about, and how long it will take us to unravel it.

On the other hand, here's to partying down on a certain Tuesday night next November. :)

[DrFunkenstein]

25. If He Thought They Were A Threat

Why did he take so long to secure the suspected sites and get a massive inspections team in? Wasn't that the reason we couldn't wait 30 more days? Because he could hide them or give them away?

I don't think the scandal is the absence of WMDs, or even the false intelligence. The scandal is that Bush and Rumsfeld are incompetent pricks that failed to do what we put the lives of all those men and women on the line for. Baghdad was the worst military fiasco since the Tora Bora warlords.

And the majority of the reason is they completely shut the State Department out of the planning stage, after they had correctly predicted the events that unfolded.

<>

[ProfessorPlum]

13. Exactly - it's the hypocrisy (stupid)

If we could just wake everyone up to what hypocrites these guys are. Did you see Conason's interview at Buzzflash today? The depths of their hypocrisy are truly terrifying.

What is frustrating is that Conason shows some anecdotes that support the theory that if Democrats were not afraid to hit back a little, to expose these hollow moral pontificators as the blackguards they really are, they would shrivel like fungi in the sun.

Go Dems!

[ProfessorPlum]

9. Is cordiality really a word? cordialness?

.

[XanaDUer]

10. Yes, it is a word.

n/t.

[DrFunkenstein]

12. I Just Found Out Kerry Already Brought Up The AWOL!!!

"Two days before the election Senator Kerry tried to raise the AWOL questions again on NBC's Meet the Press, but no one cared."

http://www.monitor.net/monitor/0011a/election2000.html

Gosh, I love Google!

[ProfessorPlum]

14. no one in the PRESS cared, is more like it.

I'm so tired of being told what people should and shouldn't care about by this pack of hos. I'll decide what I care about, thank you very much.

[DrFunkenstein]

16. I Turned The TV Off Completely For The Iraq War

It was just too distasteful. I would check the BBC, but that was about it. By some strange coincidence, I got to watch the statue falling and Bush's carrier landing, though.

When I saw the carrier landing, I knew it would bite Bush in the ass down the road. I truly and deeply hope Kerry uses it in his TV ads.

[ProfessorPlum]

19. Yeah,

I couldn't take it either. I knew the only thing I was see would be rah rah jingoistic cheering as we blew up people defending their country from invasion.

I even had to stop writing my newsletter and haven't picked that up yet, really. I guess I'm waiting for the dust to settle, mentally, still.

[dajabr]

17. You sir...

Are a credit to your candidate :-)

I'm enjoying this Kerry thread (for once!).

[MarianJack]

23. President Kerry in '04!

These are the reasons I think that Kerry is our best bet to beat president moron. pretzel boy might even try to duck debating Kerry just as he did Gore!

Let's send bush jr. back to the ranch for his favorite activity!:hangover:

[Pavlovs DiOgie]

26. Awesome!

I wish I could have heard it first hand!

[DrFunkenstein]

27. The Freakin' Transcript!!!

Thank you Buzzflash!!!

LIMBAUGH: Here's Greg in Orlando Florida. Nice to have you on the program, sir. Welcome.

GREG: Hello.

LIMBAUGH: Yes sir.

GREG: Yes, about John Kerry. I'm not as sure that he's going to be as easy to write off as a garden-variety liberal. Did you see the New Yorker piece on him a couple weeks ago?

LIMBAUGH: Yeah, you mean the one with molasses dripping off of it.

<>

GREG: It started out telling the story of how when Vietnam happened, he went down to the recruiting station and signed up with his two best friends, John J. Pershing III and Fred Smith, the founder of Federal Express. Now that's the kind of gravitas that gave me a chill up my spine.

And I'm wondering if in the debates with Bush, he might ask Bush just off-the-cuff "Where were you when you were supposed to have shown up for duty in Mississippi and you didn't show up for that year?" -- in the national guard when he dodged the Vietnam draft. And Rush you never mentioned how you dodged the Vietnam draft.

LIMBAUGH: I didn't.

GREG: Yes, you did. You claimed you had a boil on your butt—

(Limbaugh mutes Greg)

LIMBAUGH: No, you see, that's part of popular mythology that is out there that I have not whined nor complained about, Greg. But that is just a bunch of Internet B.S. and hyperbole. Never happened. Was not the cause, wasn't the case. This business of Bush is a bunch of BS, too. And if John Kerry tries to bring up Vietnam in a debate with George W. Bush, and asks that question, all Bush has got to do is bring up Bill Clinton -- and all he's got to do is give a couple quotes about John Kerry.

There's just a story in the paper today, Greg, and I'm sorry, you missed this. I forget who wrote it -- it might have been Tony Blankley's column today. John Kerry said something, "You know, I've learned a lot with my military experience and if you're leading the way and you turn around and the troops aren't behind you, you got a real problem."

Now what he was trying to say is: Bush is trying to take us into areas nobody wants to go, but the answer to the question -- or the question that is: "Oh, Senator, you were commanding officer in Vietnam and you actually turned around and troops weren't there? What kind of commanding officer were you?"

We can play this any number of ways you want, Greg, baby. But until you can get your facts straight and stop believing a bunch of Internet B.S. and hyperbole, you guys are --

You see, this is exactly what they have been doing for fourteen years, my friends. And we haven’t been complaining about it -- we haven’t been whining about it.

And not one thing he said has anything to do with the ideas that are important to the American people today. It isn't about personalities, Greg. Although if it were, you'd definitely be climbing out of a hole that you've just dug for yourself. Judy in Chicago, you're next. Welcome...

---

If you want to follow up Rush's anal cyst, here is the lovely people at Snopes talking about the pain in the ass:

http://www.snopes.com/military/limbaugh.htm

[DrFunkenstein]

28. Freepers Blow A Gasket Over The Butt Boil And Commander AWOL

Some of the lively dialogue:

-This is disingenuous of the caller, because Rush isn't running for President.

-It's true. Should be some articles in here on it, just run a search on 'chickenhawks'.

-No, no, you've got to get on the same page as all of us.
It's 'Lurch', as in the Addams Family.

-"It seems to me this vignette shows he (Sen. Kerry) is just a spoiled rich boy."

John Kerry did a tour in Viet Nam in riverine patrol boats. He came away with a Silver Star, a Bronze Star, and three Purple Hearts. Doesn't sound like a spoiled rich boy to me.

-Inoperable or convenient?

-Nobody gives a damn whether Limbaugh served in Vietnam, or whether anybody else did, for that matter. We hold those in high esteem who did serve.

You guys with your "chickenhawk" label are chicken-****.

-So in other words Rush is saying that people like Dick Cheney and Trent Lott and Phil Graham and Pat Buchanan and Newt Gingrich and Danny Hastert and maybe even Rush himself would have served if they had been forced to serve? Thanks, I feel so much better about it now.

-Just because Kerry and Daschle served in the military doesn't make them better people.

-You speak for yourself alone. I don't put much credance in the opinion of warmongers that didn't spend one minute in defense of their country. Military service is important to some of us.

-I couldn't agree with you more, JS, a truly execrable comment from sinkspur. Limbaugh skipped Vietnam because of an operable cyst and now he's a leading hawk on Iraq now that someone else (or someone else's son) is going to do the fighting.

Very similar to my trying to convince someone down the street to beat up the town bully and then bragging about what a "spoiled rich kid" he is when he does what I've been afraid to do. I don't agree with John Kerry, but what he did in Vietnam was not the mark of a "spoiled rich kid".

- I spent four years in navy as corpsman. I treated sailors and marines for the same condition and worse. They recovered and continued to serve their country.

Why can't we just call a spade a spade.

[blm]

29. I think Bartcop had the audio

but I'm not certain. Mike Malloy probably has it.