disturbing, but serious question

[woo me with science]

what do you do when your sister comes back and starts saying your father was in a satanic cult and ritually/sexually abused her and you and your brothers throughout your entire childhood? she is recovering these memories in therapy, and she believes them.

i am really worried about her. but also really worried about my mom, whom she wants to confront.

[lazarus]

1. Find out who her therapist is

These "recovered memories" tend to be crap. There is virtually no evidence of "Satanic cults" or recovered memories or any of this stuff. It tends to be implanted stuff.

Not saying this is exactly what happened, but I'd be skeptical (surprise!), particularly if you and your brothers don't share these memories, which is what I'm getting from your post.

[derby378]

6. Ditto that

And tell here to try and find a book called Satanic Panic that reportedly blows the lid off this whole "Satanic sexual abuse" fallacy.

Likewise, I don't deny that Satanic ritual abuse/killings don't happen every so often, but a lot of these therapists are just plain dangerous.

[woo me with science]

13. thanks...i'll look for it. nt

[woo me with science]

12. she's in another state

no, i was sitting there with my mouth hanging open the whole time. this is not anything remotely connected to the childhood i remember. dad was a good guy. i went through my own phase of blaming him for all the normal parental failings, but he was overall a good, decent guy. something weird is going on.

i wanted to talk sense to her, but i was afraid she'd stop talking, and i want to know what she's thinking.

[lazarus]

17. Oh, man

That's going to make it even harder.

I'm a layman, but I'd say you need to contact someone seriously professional in the area on this. Quickly, though, you need to let your parents in on what's happening so they can be prepared. She may go so far as to file charges. It's happened before, and it can destroy lives and families.

Some warning is definitely in order, both your parents and your brothers.

Above all, don't blame your sister for this. It's the therapist's fault. When someone goes to a therapist, she is completely vulnerable. To take advantage of that position of power is disgusting. This person should do serious jail time, imo; he or she has committed a form of psychological rape.

[woo me with science]

28. :o(

i really, really don't want it to be this serious. i just want it to go away.

dad died almost 10 years ago, but she is wanting to confront mom.

i do love my sister. it is just so hard to hear these things coming out of her mouth.

thanks for your support. i guess i need to call my brothers, and go from there.
thanks again.

[lazarus]

30. no place like here for support, believe me

you're among friends. Love your sister, remember it's not her fault. Rally your brothers, make sure you're all on the same page. Make sure your mom knows the same thing. Love and understanding and knowledge will get you all through this.

[woo me with science]

32. left a message for one brother...

and will go from there. i'm supposed to meet with my sister again tomorrow. i want to hug her and scream at her all at the same time...but i will keep in mind what you said and love her first.

thanks again for all the support. it really does help. i wasn't sure what people would think--this is so bizarre.

[Maat]

2. Wow....as an ex-social-worker....I sympathize.

Strangely enough, not of the rest of you remember such a thing, correct? Has your sis seemed delusional previously? I, for one (I have a Master's in Psych, and did my therapist-intern hours before I became interested in something else -- social work -- so this is just a lay opinion) do not believe in 'repressed memories.' Believe me, I have interviewed literally hundreds of sex abuse victims -- none of their memories were repressed...they may not have wanted to talk about them ...but.. Your family will be in my prayers.

[woo me with science]

14. no, never delusional

she's always been kind of moody, but not delusional. but she's lived in another state for years, and we've only recently started to have contact again. what she is saying makes no sense.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

3. OMG!!!

thats awful...well if you are certain she is wrong..ask her to go to a second therapist who is non-freudian. more of a behavioral approach...ask her to see what second therapist feels of memory

[Maat]

4. Exactly.

[woo me with science]

15. yeah

i'm just trying to figure out how to approach the subject.
thanks

[La Lioness Priyanka]

29. approach cautiously

do your research first. tell her that before she confronts her mother she must atleast get a second opinion...maybe you should tell your mom first to alert her!

[woo me with science]

31. well

....i'm supposed to have lunch with sis again tomorrow. maybe i'll find some words this time. i was just speechless. i can't even imagine how to bring something like this up to my mom. i think you're right about warning her, though.

i left a message for one of my brothers, but haven't heard back yet.

thanks for the support.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

37. did she accuse you as well?

[woo me with science]

47. no

she said that i was abused too and am not remembering to protect myself. she said all of us kids were abused. in retrospect, she did seem kind of hostile when talking about our brothers, but i interpreted that to mean she was just expecting disbelief from them.

it is all so sick and hard to digest.

[Az]

5. Get her to a real therapist

Unfortunately the damage has been done. She has had her memory essentially rewritten and you will not be able to tell her otherwise. This is a sore subject for me. This is real damage and it is difficult to correct. Belief is not easily removed.

[woo me with science]

16. what you say

is exactly how it felt, sitting with her. when we were kids, if she said something i didn't agree with, i could just tell her she was full of it. but she was so upset and so emotional that all i could do was listen. i really felt like she would walk out or start attacking me or dissolve or something if i challenged her. i didn't know what to say.

[Rowdyboy]

7. You and your brother should sue the bastard

I have a close friend who "recovered" memories of the same thing. Isn't remarkable how prevalent satanism and incest were in the 1950's-1960's? :eyes: Its utter bullshit, but if she's convinced of this fantasy, all I can offer is my sympathy.

Good luck and you guys start looking for a lawyer.

[Maat]

11. I have a friend who is a religious expert.

He said there is no such thing as a Satanic cult. A few people, I guess, practiced 'Satanism', and a few more practiced 'Church of Set,' but I guess these religions were focused on pleasures like liquor, etc. My friend said that if people really congregate and kill someone...they are sociopaths...pure and simple..not religious practitioners.

And I believe I have previously expressed my position on 'repressed memories.'

I do agree, however, with you guys that have said 'beliefs are powerful things.' In fact, they are the only things. You guys are right -- she needs a new therapist. Talented, effective therapists focus on present goals. The past is only a way to understand/clarify the present.

Look up memory studies. Most of our 'memories' are really complete fabrications, based upon what others have told us.

[Az]

24. Satanic cults

Are the modern day witch covens ala Salem. They are consistantly sited as being responsible for all manner of ill. But when sought the claims fall to peaces.

[woo me with science]

27. thanks

i need to do some reading.

[absyntheNsugar]

38. There is an excellent website about this

Unfortunately I can't find it right now!

But it goes through EVERY case the FBI has investigated, and how they all result in nothing.

The FBI has been checking into these since the 40's, but it really increased in the 80's.

[woo me with science]

18. thanks

i have a feeling this is going to get worse.

[yardwork]

8. I'd get a lawyer and a therapist of your own.

[woo me with science]

19. i'm mostly

worried about my sister and my mom. and not sure how my brothers will react.

[Ruby Romaine]

9. contact the False Memory Syndrome Foundation

http://www.fmsfonline.org/



also see
http://www.freedomofmind.com/resourcecenter/groups/f/false/

[woo me with science]

20. thank you!

these links look great. i appreciate it.

[slackmaster]

10. Are you older or younger than your sister?

And by how much, if you don't mind sharing that information.

[woo me with science]

21. i'm younger

by four years.

why do you ask?

[slackmaster]

51. Just curious

n/t

[neverborn]

22. SRA

Satanic Ritual Abuse.
http://religioustolerance.org/sra.htm

Exposes what a fraud this charge is.

Here's the Recovered Memory Therapy one.

http://religioustolerance.org/rmt.htm

[woo me with science]

25. thank you

i appreciate the links. what she says is making no sense.

[Rabrrrrrr]

23. And I assume you have no memories of being abused, nor do your

other siblings?

Strange indeed. i can't believe that ALL of you would have repressed such significant stuff and had to wait for yuor one sister to hit therapy to "discover" it all. I wouldn't trust that therapist at all.

What kind of memories of your father do you have? Is it in any consistent with a potential abuser of this sort?

Weird indeed.

most therapists I wouldn't trust any further than I could throw their BMWs.

[woo me with science]

26. god, i'm laughing and crying at the same time.

you summed it up perfectly.

no...my memories of my father are NOT consistent with satanic rituals and incest and rape. we were not a perfect family, but we were nowhere near what she is describing. dad was a good guy, and he loved us. i just don't understand how this can be happening.

thanks for the support.

[smirkymonkey]

50. However, I would caution you to be

careful with her - the more whacked out part of her story may be therapist generated, but it is possible she was sexually molested and is just going a little to far w/ the embellishments. Try to encourage her to write about it before she confronts anybody and causes a serious rift in the family.

You don't want to dismiss her completely though, as there may be some grain of truth in it all. Tough situation.

[NicoleM]

33. If it helps

I have a relative who "recovered" memories of sexual abuse when she was in a very vulnerable state. When she got emotionally stronger and got into different therapy, she realized that the abuse had never happened. It is possible for her to get beyond this, but you have to be really careful. If anybody gets too aggressive about telling her that it never happened, it will probably only make her defensive. Her therapist has probably told her that the rest of you have repressed the memories and will argue with her, so if you do argue it will only reinforce her belief in the therapist.

[woo me with science]

34. this was exactly

the sense i got when i met with her...i found myself saying nothing, because i was scared to challenge anything she was saying. it was strange...it was like she wasn't the sister i remember. what she was saying sounded almost scripted, but at the same time she was so genuinely upset. it's hard to describe.

she is only supposed to be in town through the weekend. i'm hoping she won't try to confront mom while she's here. she seemed like she was still thinking about it.

[NicoleM]

39. What I said at the time

was that I didn't remember anything like that happening. I left it at that, I didn't challenge her memories.

It's a very difficult situation. She really needs to see a different therapist, but I don't know how you can make that happen. Is there any way you can get her to come back and go to a family therapist with all of you?

[woo me with science]

46. that's what i said too,

nothing more. i'm going to try to say more tomorrow, though, or at least feel her out. she's only in town through the weekend, so i feel like i'm walking on eggshells but also running a race. i'm going to talk to one brother later tonight too and see what he suggests. i wish we weren't scattered all over the country.

[woo me with science]

36. posted too soon

i really appreciate your telling me about your relative. sorry i was so focused on my own situation that i forgot to write it, but i'm so glad for you and her and your family that she realized she was wrong. it does help to hear that, too-gives me hope. my sister seems to be so deep into this stuff, and i also wonder if she is taking some heavy medications. i am not even sure how long she's been in therapy, but i would imagine it takes some time to get to the point where you believe you were in a satanic cult.

thanks again. i really do appreciate it.

[NicoleM]

40. Very sweet of you.

She's lucky to have such a caring brother.

[woo me with science]

45. actually, i'm her sister

but she has three caring brothers too.

thanks.

[Droopy]

35. I think your sister may be in serious trouble

Delusional people can have false memories. From what I've read in this thread, about you and your siblings having no such memories, I'd say that your sister is suffering from psychosis. I don't know what kind of therapist she's seeing, but he/she is a quack if he/she doesn't recognize these "memories" for what they are.

I know what I'm talking about when it comes to this. I have a mental illness known as schizoaffective disorder. It's a mixture of schizophrenia and manic-depression. I, too, in a psychotic state thought my father had sexually abused when I was young and was only then recovering the memories. I even went so far as to go over to his house to beat the hell out of him. Fortunately he wasn't home at the time. I then went over to me mother's and told her what I was experiencing and she told me to go to the hospital. I was in the psych ward for a week and they started me on anti-psychitics. I saw how those "memories" had been a product of me over-worked imagination.

I think your sister needs to be hospitalized.

[NicoleM]

41. It's not necessarily psychosis.

For a while (in the early 90s at least) it was common for therapists to believe that women and girls with eating disorders had them because they had been sexually abused. And that may be the case with a significant percentage of them, I don't know. But at the time, if you had an eating disorder and you didn't remember any sexual abuse, you were often told that you were repressing the memories. I had a therapist suggest that the reason I didn't like to eat meat was because my father had sexually abused me and then forced me to eat meat for dinner. That never happened. But if I had been more suggestible, I can easily see myself having "recovered" that memory. It made sense at the time, given the fact that at the time people really did believe in repressed memories.

<edit> That is how my relative came to believe she had been sexually abused--she had an eating disorder and her therapist/s convinced her it was due to sexual abuse that never happened.

[Droopy]

42. Good point

I had other issues too. I was hearing voices and I thought that people could read my mind, so maybe she isn't psychotic. I still think that therapist is a quack, though.

[NicoleM]

43. For sure.

There is no way an entire family is repressing memories of satanic ritual abuse.

[woo me with science]

44. thanks

what you experienced sounds really scary. i'm glad you got help. i had a brief psychotic reaction to a medication once, and it was the scariest thing i've ever experienced.

i think she's in real trouble too. i'm not sure if it's psychosis or not, but she is in trouble.

[woo me with science]

48. thanks to everyone who responded

i'm sort of overwhelmed by all the responses. i'm pretty new to DU and posted here because i figured it was anonymous--what's happening is so bizarre i wasn't sure what the response would be. i didn't expect so much support. you all have confirmed my belief that democrats are great people....thanks.

i'm signing off for now...gotta make some important phone calls tonight. thanks again for all the support.
ant

[Ladyhawk]

49. I don't trust hypnotic regression "therapy"

Is this how she "recovered" her memories? A person under hypnosis is in a highly suggestible state. Just look at all the past lives and UFO experiences "recovered" this way. It's nothing but bunk.

[truthspeaker]

52. the psychiatric community agrees with Ladyhawk

memory-regression therapy was debunked several years ago. Can you find out who her therapist is and report her to a professional board in her state? This therapist is seriously messing up your sister.

As if implanting false memories weren't bad enough, this kind of thing can undermine the credibility of people who really were sexually abused as children.