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What do you think the sixties were like if you were not yet alive?

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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 06:35 PM
Original message
What do you think the sixties were like if you were not yet alive?
I bet your imagination is better than my reality.

There was pretty much sex, though....and drugs, too. And fast cars with big engines.
Great music, too.

mark
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Louisiana1976 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 06:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. Had I not been alive they'd just have been history to me--
like the Forties and early Fifties are to me who was born in 1957.
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theNotoriousP.I.G. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 07:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. I personally think you baby boomers
are way too nostalgic for your own good and have a heightened imagination of your generation's importance.

We Generation x'ers also had sex, drugs,fast cars and kids we felt guilty for leaving in day care but we also were responsible for the technological boom in the late 90`s (google guys are gen xers).

Every generation has there impacts.




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Capn Sunshine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I think if we weren't so cool, Gen Xers wouldn't have such a complex about it
Edited on Wed Nov-18-09 07:31 PM by Capn Sunshine
it's because they feel guily about all that slacking while ten percent of them did all the work over at the Google labs.
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phasma ex machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. +1 baby boomers are way too nostalgic / have a heightened imagination of importance. nt
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madinmaryland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. -1. In 15 years you will be nostalgic, just like the baby boomers are now.
As you say, every generation has their impacts.

:D

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theNotoriousP.I.G. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 05:55 AM
Response to Reply #6
17. oopsie
thanks for pointing that out :D
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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 06:50 AM
Response to Reply #17
20. Can't we all just get along?
Xers are already in the early nostalgia stages, but have not yet been exploited as much as us dinosaur boomers. Just wait-the real sucking is about to start...can you feel it?


mark
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theNotoriousP.I.G. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. When I get my first gray hair....then I'll feel it
I'm sorry for my inflammatory response in the first place. I have a special pet peeve with baby boomers and that is my own issue. I should have held my tongue and let it go.

:hi:
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old mark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #20
29. X'ers, wait till there are TV specials reminiscing over your prime era -
-wait till you get disgusted by how much bullshit is heaped on you, and how much is completely wrong. I'm not trying to irk you here - I'm just saying you will be exploited as much as we were and still are.

And whoever the next great gen'ers are will piss in your punch bowl.

mark
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #2
27. LOL
who the fuck is trying to sound important here? oldmark referred to sex and drugs and you're trying to take credit for the "technological boom" - get OVER yourself
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theNotoriousP.I.G. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 05:45 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. oh calm the fuck down before you
KICK MY ASS. I didn't create Google or facebook or myspace, but generation x'ers did.

Did you see my apology to Old Mark?

Sex and drugs were not unique to the baby boomer bunch, we slackers probably did more of both being the jaded assholes that we are. We had more time to indulge while the baby boomers were selling their souls to corporate America. :spank:
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madinmaryland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
4. Funny, but everything was black and white, except for the green chair
that I liked to sit in with my Mom.
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Auggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 08:00 PM
Response to Original message
7. I was there, and nearly died of boredom
In Ohio -- near Cleveland -- as a kid.
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 08:11 PM
Response to Original message
8. From what my mom says
Teargas, cancelled classes, friends getting drafted, friends going to Canada, and friends sleeping on your couch for years on end to avoid getting drafted or going to Canada. :P
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. And says my mom:
"I have protested against the UC regents many times. I don't remember for what, but I protested against them many times." :D
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david13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
9. 60's were groovy. I had some good times, but all the nostalgia,
across the board, for all generations, etc., is way overblown. Just like now the Route 66 nostalgia.
They totally forget all the bad aspects, and why the freeway system, the interstate system was built in the first place, and they go with all that nostalgia crap, about oh, wasn't it wonderful, and all that.
The 60's (I was there) were very trying times, very controversial, much discord, disagreement, and a 1000 other bad items. And that whole "we" business about how "we" were all doing this, and "we" were all doing that ... total baloney. A lot of the "we" was 5% or 10% of the population. Which means that 90 or 95 per cent was NOT doing that.
But for me, I had some good moments there. So.
dc
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 10:27 PM
Response to Original message
10. Get Thee to the movie " Pirate Radio". I just saw it and it really does give you a real
feel for what the mid sixties were like in terms of atmosphere, clothes and music. Great flick.
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david13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. I thought that might be the case. I saw the trailer, but I usually don't
Edited on Wed Nov-18-09 10:51 PM by david13
go to films. Usually not worth it. But that looked good, and it was one of those legendary things at the time, the pirate radio ships. (Or ship?, was there only one?).
I know there's only one in the film, but I mean in Britain, I think there were several.
dc

Update, yes there were several.
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. It was a good flic. Quite touching at times. Mostly lots of fun.
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otherlander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
13. War.
Ideas. Hope. Confusion. Infiltration. Assassinations. Those things happen all the time... Maybe what changes, besides the inevitable progress of technology, and the resulting effects on society, isn't so much a matter of how good or bad things are, as a matter of how much or how little people feel it's possible to make the future better. A lot of people... getting really immersed in politics; other circles of people not overtly political but attempting to set up communities that ran according to ideals often quite similar to those of the more-political folks. The difference between those two groups is, I suppose pretty parallel to what is happening today among many anarchists: The people who would have been SDS or whatever back then are participating in things they call class struggle now, organizing workers, etc, whereas maybe the modern-day equivalent of the less-politically-active counterculture would be the anarchists who the more overtly class-conscious ones pejoratively refer to as "lifestylists".

I think that a lot of the mockery and vitriol directed by "Gen-X"ers towards what was going on at that time comes from a number of sources. One, I think, is that they themselves are the children of people of that generation, and if they have bad relationships with their parents, that, in their heads, becomes a problem with a whole broader group of people. Two, I think, much of it they pick up on from older people who may have actually been around at that time.

That in itself is a complicated thing: Some of those people are of the ruling class, or right-wingers, or otherwise invested in the corporate culture disguised as "individualism". In previous years, they may have been attracted vaguely to the counterculture insofar as they themselves wished to avoid being drafted, or enjoyed the drugs, music, or other consumables that could be detached from the vision of radical social change, but now their main vested interest is in defending exploitative, capitalistic aspects of the status quo, and shitting on anyone's attempts at collectivism, community, or moving towards a more sustainable or egalitarian culture. To get legitimacy in doing this, they will take those surface-level interests they had in the counterculture or political resistance long ago, and pretend that those qualify them to speak on behalf of all dreamers and strugglers of the era, saying, "Oh, yes, we tried the peace-and-love thing and it didn't work, so now it's time to drop the woo-woo and get behind (insert rightwing talking point here)."

But others of them are not. Other people who have participated in the mockery genuinely once felt themselves to be part of the creation of an alternative. I don't pretend to be qualified to explain this, or judge- No judgment, but I will just say, if this does the phenomenon any kind of justice, it may be a bit like this: If your wife leaves you, you're pretty much obligated to say terrible things about your wife, right? And those things won't necessarily be true. After Kent State, Altamont, etc, I'm not judging anyone.

When it comes down to it, I think that basically, people are just people- Damaged, beautiful, self-interested, fallible, hopeful, benevolent, unaware of many of their own motivations, and driven to do terrible things to stay alive- and many of the terrible things they do to others are really extensions of terrible things they've done to themselves- In the interests of self-preservation, we may kill off the best parts of ourselves- The parts that are sensitive, the parts that are ethical and loving, the parts that perceive divinity and nobility in the world. I use the word "divinity" in a somewhat unusual way, perhaps- I don't believe in any kind of God, but one thing I know from my own experience is that atheism and mysticism are not mutually exclusive. I am an atheist, but I have experienced sacred beauty, have seen it in other human beings, because even without a sentient Creator, we are holy on our own merits, holy because we experience pain but strive for beauty and are willing to sacrifice for love.

And as for the word nobility, yes, I think there was nobility. One impression I've gotten is that when people talked about a song at a concert- say, by Joni Mitchell or Janis- or something that happened at a protest- it was often as though they were speaking in code. That is, they were talking about an event or an idea- politics, music, sex, hallucinations- but there was sometimes a sense that this individual thing was just a point plotted on a much broader curve, like you were describing pieces of driftwood as a way of talking-about-without-talking-about the arch of a vast wave that they were all being carried on, so what was lost was much more than what was actually lost in terms of concrete lives and tangible events. I can't understand what forty years are. I can't understand what twenty years are. But I can tell you that the Wave Speech in Fear and Loathing made me cry. I can understand why Hunter Thompson killed himself, I think. I'm sorry that y'all had to live through the 1980's.

Again, I believe there was nobility. There is nobility now, too. And when people feel connected, it courses through them like electricity, and they can use it to power beautiful things. But when these connections snap, it is as though the people instead become terminals for all that electricity, and it fries them, and when people are burnt they can no longer be conductors for such marvelous voltage. Not everyone had good intentions, of course- There were then, as now, the self-serving, the fair-weather, the deceitful. But I think a lot of people who ran away, who retreated back to conventional lives, weren't "selling out," but calculating their losses and counting it as a victory if they could escape with their lives and enough love left in the unburnt parts of their hearts to connect with a few people, have a family, and hopefully bring some joy to the people around them.

I will take your word for it if you tell me that the reason you dropped out into the world of hitchhiking instead of hooking up with some political organization to fight the existing order is because you did not believe there would have to be a fight. And I've heard of the factionalism, the mis-interpretation of ideas like free love into a caricature of mere anti-monogamy, within SDS, etc, and the people who got caught up in the crossfire- I'm sorry if this was you. Or if you were an unwilling soldier who never even made it that close to the resistance, trapped in the vast military industrial complex. But I do think that just because people, being unable to look at their former dreams, their former perceptions of divinity, without wincing, feel compelled to mock them instead, as silly, dramatic, naive, does not mean that these things actually were silly, dramatic or naive- Just because you cannot deal with the nobility of an idea does not mean it was never holy to begin with. And I think that broad-based political struggle and counterculture are compatible- As long as the latter is not insular. There is nothing wrong with forming a community of likeminded people, as long as you keep trying to reach out to people living more in the mainstream, who still have to work day jobs / drive cars, who are less politically conscious, who don't consider themselves activists but would still benefit from changes in the status quo.

If you actually read all of this, I love you. I am also fighting. Don't worry- I know a fair number of beautiful, pot-smoking dumpster-divers. We know how to find thrown-out, disregarded, spat-on things and put them to good use.
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lunamagica Donating Member (430 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-18-09 11:17 PM
Response to Original message
14. FUN. And I realize there were lots of problems, bad things
happening, but I wasn't alive for most of the decade to live through them. So I tend to idealize it. When I'm down, I like to get lost in the music of the decade, and imagine I was a teen-ager back then, full of life and hope...and joy and fun.

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quakerboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 12:42 AM
Response to Original message
16. Kinda like now
only with worse graphics.
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woo me with science Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 06:09 AM
Response to Original message
18. Like this:
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kentauros Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 06:21 AM
Response to Original message
19. Seems like it would be only a slightly nice and idyllic existence
interspersed with bouts of shear terror, what with the presidential assassination, human rights issues and the bloodiest war this nation has ever seen. The drugs issue is what's throwing me off though...

Wait a minute. Do you mean the 1960's?
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otherlander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #19
24. I see what you did there.



:D
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Blue_Tires Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 08:43 AM
Response to Original message
21. they played 'real' baseball back then...
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Steerpike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
22. The 60's?
Edited on Thu Nov-19-09 09:08 AM by Steerpike
Dude, I got a lot of hate from the man. And, the pigs were always giving me a hard time. The old ones hated my long hair (bunch of bald ass fucks!). But, that's all groovy...cause I smoked a lot of bad ass pot. Remember what Free Wheelin' Franklin Sez, "Dope will get you thru times of no money, better than money will get you thru times of no Dope!"
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ipfilter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 09:19 AM
Response to Original message
23. I've always thought the 60's were a mix of black and white and color. nt
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SteppingRazor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 05:04 PM
Response to Original message
26. I imagine it was a bit like a combination of the 50s and 70s. n/t
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-19-09 07:19 PM
Response to Original message
30. Overrated.
Sure, a lot of good things happened, but also a lot of crap was spawned too, Left-wing Ludditism and fear of Science, New Age BS, anti-nuclear hysteria, Vietnam, etc.
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