Why do some women love Assholes?

[Taverner]

Before you spam me with "I hate assholes!" let me tell you a story...

Back in college I was not doing so well in dating. Then a friend suggested "be an asshole - trust me, you'll get laid more"

So I did.

I would insult my dates, make them feel small, and constantly belittle them. I would insult their friends and make them feel like shit. In short, it worked. It bit me in the ass eventually (which I fully deserved) but it worked.

Why did it work?

[last_texas_dem]

1. I can't see this thread getting interesting at all.

No, not at all... haha

:popcorn:

[cbdo2007]

2. That's just how it goes.

Not only that but the assholes can keep being bigger and bigger assholes and that seems to just make women like them more and more.

[seabeyond]

3. a lot of girls are raised to believe that is how male treats female, what love is.

they are not confident, strong, independent females that have been nurtured and loved. and again, it is not all girls. i can also see a female that just wants a fuck doesnt care if the guy is an asshole. but for the most part, the girls that allow a male to treat them like shit, come bak for more and feel loved by that behavior was raised with that

so really

if you want to be an ass and have females that are messed up from youth... go for it

another thing

i hear this from guys. if you think these relationships provide anything but sex, they dont. the female does not only not respect herself, she doenst respect the guy either and will give like back....

[Taverner]

5. Oh I'm married now and have learned much since then

But I never understood this phenomenon.

And the funny thing was the girls I attracted weren't the smart bookish types that I always preferred, but the "Party Hearty" types who spent their time in college either partying or getting "made up." Add to that that most of these girls were just as assholish as I was, but toward their female friends.

[seabeyond]

7. you get what you put out. you are an asshole, will get an asshole. if it is about a fuck

fine. but those are easy enough to find. if you are wanting anything more.... good luck, have fun, lol.

[Taverner]

11. Yes, learned that lesson too

Personally, I've felt that teenage male America needs to learn the answer to all of their problems is their right (or left) hand...

[Chan790]

44. wait...

you mean you can treat them like crap and they only expect sex from you? really?! wow just wow Ive been goin bout this all wrong. shit. i need to work on my biceps dancin and get some bronzer and a membersonly jacket. oh man im gonna be a dick to woman from now on.

I am the opposite. The following is my mantra:

Eh. I get laid plenty. I'm charming and polite; rakish in just the right measure. I make my own fun. I am fun. People like fun and excitement. People like me as a natural result. Cary Grant is my spirit animal. James Bond pretends to be me. Small boys tell their fathers they want to grow up to be like Chan790 and look up to me like I am Superman. I am Superman. Never fake, always the genuine article. Right now, you have my undivided attention. So teach me something. Later, I'll help your grandma cross the street on my way to take all your ex-boyfriends' stuff at cards; after I use the winnings to send you flowers, I'm going to let you get a great night's sleep. I'm going to call you tomorrow because I do actually care to speak to you. You will have needed that great night's sleep for what I am planning. I am a tall cool drink of water with a bourbon chaser. I curse casually. fuck yeah. Would you like to play some Twister? It's the only game I play...and if we win, well...we always win, because where I come from we treat others the way we want to be treated. I can make even your mother's best advice sound filthy. I scare you and that's why you're enthralled. A confession: I am too, just a little bit.

I'm totally putting that on the back of my business card, just because it's so cheesy and yet...it is kind of me. :rofl:

[I Have A Dream]

60. ...

:D

:thumbsup:

[mcctatas]

4. I will be the first to admit that I like men who are less than sweet...

that being said, the behavior you described above would not get you laid in a women's prison with a handful of pardons IMHO. There is a difference between not being a super-sweet ass-kisser (which I have never been attracted to) and a mean hateful son of a bitch, you just know it when you have it (or it has you :P )

[Taverner]

6. You would be surprised

One trick I learned is never say your date looks good. Find a flaw and magnify it. Bring it up all night.

NOTE TO LOUNGE: You do this to others, and I'll kill you :)

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

9. Aren't you the guy who was gonna fly with the swineflu?

Maybe you're an asshole and you never knew it? I'm getting my :popcorn:

This should be fun.

[Taverner]

16. Yes I am, and yes I did, and no one got sick

I even asked TSA right up front "IF I HAVE SWINE FLU AND THIS MASK, SHOULD (not can) I FLY?"

If this is character assassination time, I'm not into that, sorry

But if this is honesty time, I'm game

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

34. look down thread. Honesty time is fun.

[seabeyond]

playing on someones vulnerability. guess that shows her for putting all her worth in

her looks

interesting subject taverner

i would say a simple,

fuck you

and drive myself home, lol

[Taverner]

17. I wish more people gave me a simple fuck you at the time

It would have stopped teh stupid for a moment...if anything I would have reconsidered my strategy earlier

[seabeyond]

24. absolutely. i wish young girls had more confidence and felt more self worth too. would

help a lot of the young guys today, saving them from pain. no one seems to get the simple concept though

[pitohui]

15. ok now we know that you're making stuff up

i'm sure calling your date fat and pimpled all night gets you laid...NOT

that guy with the PUA website, that's a scam, dude, not something that really works...sheesh...!

[Taverner]

20. You don't go after those kinds of things

At least, not full on. Find a small flaw and exacerbate it. It worked.

I do not do that now btw...

[raccoon]

76. I don't know if you're just posting flamebait, or if you've just dated lots of seriously

fucked-up women from very dysfunctional backgrounds, where their father beat hell out of their mother and maybe kids, too, etc.

Or all of the above.

[unpossibles]

75. a good point - few people want to date a sycophantic bootlicker

but if you do, I may have one in the dungeon you can borrow. :D

[pitohui]

8. we have only your word that it did work so you tell us

a man who insults and belittles me never gets a second chance -- he certainly doesn't "get laid"

i don't suppose that it ever does work, unless you make a practice of targeting the mentally ill, and if that's your type, more power to you i guess

[Taverner]

13. Keep in mind, this was 1988, and I was a lot younger back then

I'm married to an equal now, and I learned my lessons

But - you'd be surprised how well the system I learned worked, at least in the short term.

Long term, my girlfriend cheated on my with my best friend. She dumped me for him in the middle of the date. AND I DESERVED IT 100% if not worse...

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

23. Sorry,

you sound like an ass.... back then.

If you had chosen a girlfriend back in 1988 who wasn't a game player and an asshole, to reflect yourself, you might not have had that painful experience. Please don't alert. I'm just trying to be honest with you.


:hi:

[Taverner]

27. I was a complete ass, but I was eighteen

I'm still an ass, but I'm an ass about different things these days (music too loud, farting at the dinner table...etc)

I'm not going to alert you - calling THAT Taverner an asshole would be 100% fitting

Like I told my ex years later, her ditching me in that way was the best thing to ever happen to me. And I deserved it.

[EndersDame]

10. While I dont want a guy following me around like a puppy dog

I dont want a complete dick. I think that arrogance and assholesish ness on the outside can be somewhat attractive if the guy is a big sweetie when it comes down to his core personality .It also helps if the guy is witty and is not mean

[Schema Thing]

12. Do you have a copy of Gray's Anatomy?

[crimsonblue]

14. Hmm..

Part of the reason that being an asshole, as you put it, is successful is that you are being more confident in yourself. The aura of an asshole is one in which you are supremely confident in your self, to the detriment of others. You may be persuasive, because you are usually very good at getting what you want. Also, the girl may or may not have personal issues that you are triggering by being a dick.

[Taverner]

21. Now THAT makes sense...

[HopeHoops]

18. Not sure - I'll ask my wife.

[Schema Thing]

19. Many (most?) people are broken by their parents and families

and so are comfortable with other broken, brutish people?




How's that for armchair psychological epidemiology?

[Taverner]

22. Makes sense to me...

[seabeyond]

29. broken is a good way of saying it. i was trying to find the word, without

being offensive. but broken, fits.

[LeftyFingerPop]

25. Strength and confidence can be exhibited by a man without him being an asshole...

The only problem is that most men have no idea how to accomplish this.

[arbusto_baboso]

26. There are two ways to gain the interest of women.

The first way is to tear them down - or to "be an asshole", as you said. This way is certainly easier for most men, and plays on the inherent insecurities that so many American women have. (The "I don't deserve a good man unless I can make one out of a bad man" ethos so many women seem to have.)

The other way is to build them up. This takes longer, and will work only on a woman that has at least a small core of self-esteem. It also requires skills that many men don't possess until they are much older. Frequently the woman has to be a bit older (or at least wiser) for this to work, as well.

But the real benefit is that if you build a woman up, she'll still talk to you after the relationship is over.

I've done it both ways. I was an asshole when I was very young, but quickly learned that it was better in the long run to build a woman up. Better for her and better for me, too.

[Taverner]

28. Very Good Points nt

[seabeyond]

31. right on. you nailed it. nt

[Lucian]

32. I did that in my last relationship...

I built a woman up, and we still talk. She's even thinking about going back out with me (hopefully she will!).

[seabeyond]

33. but then again

i bet she equally built you up. and you felt good too


hm, lol, this is a tough one. which is better? being assholes and neither feeling good or

being good to each other and both feeling good

tough on

bah hahaha

[Lucian]

36. She never built me up.

To her, I was the "perfect guy" (no, I'm not blowing smoke up my own ass).

She needed a lot of work, and she still needs it, but she's getting better. She's getting some, albeit really small, hope for her future. And she's worth the work and effort, even though she doesn't really see it yet.

[seabeyond]

38. hmmm, well yea for you that you can see her worth. but seeing you as perfect

is a pretty damn good ego stroke, isnt it?

[Lucian]

40. I don't let things like that go to my head.

I'm just being me. Whether perfect or not...that's another story.

[Lucian]

30. I'm not an asshole and I get laid.

I guess you were going after women that had self esteem issues.

[Taverner]

35. Hey - I didn't say it was the only way...

2 years later, after having learned, I became "sensitive guy" who always had to know the environment/agreement/rules of engagement constantly

And I got laid by my type (bookish girls who like to talk about intelligent things)

Not as much though, but it was way worth it

[Sky Masterson]

37. Why do some women love men who arent?

Who knows why people feel the way they do.
All I know is that I'd die a virgin before I resort to mentally abusing a woman just to dip my wick.
Guess I'm a nice guy.:shrug:

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

39. I just want to say that since I was 14 years old and had a taste

of asshole, I've never once gone back to an asshole. I love men who treat me like a queen. I will never associate with assholes again. If you are a man and want to play head games and be an asshole (or a woman for that matter) life is much easier if you quit being an asshole.

[Taverner]

42. Although if you were to take a sample of "non-assholes" I would bet you'd find some ex-assholes

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

46. One guy qualified as an asshole in my whole life

I learned the hard way at 14. Never again. I only date and marry devoted men. Life is much easier when your husband is asking for a hug every 5 minutes. I've got the best husband in the world.

[rebel with a cause]

41. Because some women are stupid!

I raised my son to be a nice guy and he is having problems that every girl that he likes ends up wanting him for a friend that she can cry about her asshole boyfriends. He basically has given up on himself. By the way, one girl told him that he needed to go to a different area because none of the girls here were good enough for him. She wants him to now follow her to another state, where he can again be her best friend while she goes after one asshole after another. I know he really loves this girl and she breaks his heart time and time again. Another girl basically told him that his problem is his very mixed racial heritage. (Yes, we live in a racist area)

By the way, I married an asshole but he pretended to be a nice guy until he had control over me. Then he was king of all assholes, so you never know when you meet someone.

Wise up girls, you are not going to make a silk purse out of a pigs ear.

[Taverner]

43. Suggestion: What if your son wasn't an asshole, but an enigma?

Especially if he's a writer or musician

Yeah yeah I know this goes back to playing head games, but dealing with an enigma can be fun

[rebel with a cause]

48. He is a writer!

The problem is that he doesn't want to be like his father and his father is a mind game player big time. I think that my son is too much like me. Honest to the point of it being a liability while internalizing feelings of hurt and anger. :shrug:

He has had girlfriends but usually ends up their friend. (He always thinks it is going to be the opposite, if he is friends with them it will mature into a relationship. He is grown now and wants to have a serious relationship. He does not listen to me. I told him to be an asshole. :rofl:

Honestly, I think he will probably have to go somewhere else to find someone and right now he has the job he went to school to have. Unless he becomes successful enough to move on, I don't think he will leave here. Also, I am in failing health and I may be (probably am) standing in both his and my daughter's way of leaving here.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

54. He'll probably be a great writer......

....so that's something to look forward to.

[rebel with a cause]

56. Thanks...

I think he already is. :)

[Mopar151]

84. Sounds a bit like me

Girls were always a big problem - Women worked out much better!

[Fire Walk With Me]

45. For the same reason some men worship women's feet?

Wait, what are we talking about? ;)

[ProfessorGAC]

47. You'd Have To Ask My Wife

GAC

[trof]

49. I'm just lucky, I guess.

:-)

[Odin2005]

50. Because some people are really shallow and think "nice guys" are wimps.

[NewJeffCT]

51. well, for years I was the guy that was too nice

and I never got laid, and hardly had any dates. But, I think it was more my personality than me being too nice.

However, after I got married & divorced, I had more dates than I knew what to do with and got laid pretty regularly. I was still a nice guy and all, but I think I didn't get too worked up over one date and one woman, so it helped me relax a lot more when I was with women.

[old mark]

52. Because some women are assholes. nt

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

53. You can also fake being gay.

That works too sometimes. Drops their guard. Then they feel special when you say "I want to change for you".

[chrisa]

63. rofl. Could be.

[kayakjohnny]

55. Just curious... why does "Assholes" get capped in your subject line?

Kind of giving them some extra credit before the convo even starts. Anyway, I've never been an asshole to women and I also believe that this subject fits within the generally accepted karmic realms. That being the overall treatment of people and other forms of life.

All that being said, I'm not also hyper-sexually driven either. The two may have something in common.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

58. The real question is it just about "getting laid"?

Most nice guys just want to land a girl for a girlfriend, one way or another. I suppose if one thinks pretending being an asshole is a way to go about it, then okay.......but it isn't the real you.

[barb162]

57. M y theory is some women think it's sexy

A friend of mine was going out with a creep so I introduced her to a really nice guy who treated her well and she ended up going back to the creep. duh

[XRubicon]

59. I walk around in the summer saying

"How about this heat"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPnv8UvKFzc&feature=related

[chrisa]

61. Because it attracts people with low self-esteem.

They expect to be treated like that because they don't feel like they're worthy of any better.

[MissMillie]

101. I think I like this explanation

and I was going to add to it, but I'm going to let it stand on it's own.

[tigereye]

62. because they haven't learned to love themselves and feel they don't deserve

any better?


That's all I got....

[lukasahero]

64. Assholes are generally attracted to assholes

be they men or women.

The fact that you admit to treating women like shit to get laid tells me everything.

[Tabasco_Dave]

65. I got sick of "you're a nice guy but..."

then i noticed women over 30 didn't play that game as much, so i stopped dating women in their 20's and I've been happy ever since. I guess women over 30 already had their share of jerks.

[Evoman]

66. It's because "nice guys" are boring as shit.

It's not about being an asshole, it's about being interesting. At least assholes are entertaining, not like boring old nice guys. The key to being able to attract a women, and not be a complete douche, is to treat her well (which is NOT the same thing as being a rug she walks all over or a kiss ass), but keep an edge. Some mystery. Some independence. Some interest.

If you are telling her how much you like her on the first date, you are doing it wrong.

If you are not making your intentions clear, and not showing her that you want her for sex or love, and instead just try to "friend her until she likes you", you are doing it wrong,

If you do everything she asks, not matter what it is (including compromising your principles or integrity), you are doing it wrong.

These things may work if your really fucking lucky, or have the looks of a god, but it's not a good, consistent way of attracting people.

Of course, none of this makes being an asshole necessary. It isn't. I'll never understand why most guys take one extreme or the other. A woman should never be treated as a goddess or a meaningless ho. She should be treated as a person. Crazy, ain't it.

[Sky Masterson]

72. Bravo!

I really wish I could have gotten this memo in high school.:mad:

[seabeyond]

80. ha

i let y 14 yr old read it, lol
i thought it was good to know too.

[unpossibles]

78. great points

and it took me a few years to learn this one, to balance being a fairly nice, generous, and easy going person with being true to myself, confident, providing not only some interest but a bit of a challenge (yet without playing head games), etc.

It's amusing to me - and sometimes a pet peeve - when someone thinks they can take advantage of me or walk on me because I am genuinely pretty nice. At some point, I have to admit I get a small thrill out of calling them on it and still being relatively diplomatic about putting them in their place, and letting them know that they have absolutely no power over me but without resorting to their level. This is not just dates but in general, at work, etc.

[NNadir]

67. I don't know. I'll ask my wife. She should know.

[proteus_lives]

68. Happens to men too.

I'm drawn to cold, cruel women. I've matured now and don't let myself get sucked in by the bitchy and beautiful set anymore but the desire is still there.

I would guess for both men and women it's about childhood/growing up issues.

[seabeyond]

70. absolutely. good point. we have all seen the guy that goes out with abusive gal. nt

[proteus_lives]

88. Been there.

I spent two years with a woman I simply refer to now as "The Devil".

[seabeyond]

89. so once again, it is more a human thing and not a gender thing. i find that more so than not. nt

[proteus_lives]

94. Yep.

My life experience teaches me that women and men are no better or worse than each other. A little different? Sure but that's part of the spice of life.

Assholes and abusers are the same no matter what equipment they are packing.

[cherish44]

69. When I was younger I was attracted to the alpha male type

you know bad boys, assholes, arrogant pricks... I'm realize now there's a different between a strong man and a swaggering man. Of course now that I'm older, I'm really turned on by men who look good in an apron and can do great laundry. Funny how that happens

[lukasahero]

83. "Alpha male" doesn't = bad boys

or even tough guys. In the canine world (where the phrase comes from that was subsequently applied to the human species - see: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=alpha), the alpha male is confident, calm and protective of his pack. He is not aggressive for the sake of being aggressive and does not assert his dominance randomly.

The men I consider to be true alpha males (my husband among them) demostrate all the best 'masculine' traits with no need to pretend they are tougher than they are or to push their hierarchal standing for it's own sake.

[seabeyond]

85. exactly. i wish people would get this. nt

[alphafemale]

96. Exactly

:yourock:

[unpossibles]

102. so true. In fact, I find that the real assholes tend to be (at best) Beta Males

in that they are always pushing boundaries and trying to prove they are alpha, but are typically too insecure to actually be an Alpha. I've dated men and women like this, so it's not necessarily a gender thing at all, although I do think more men do this than women in the typical American culture.

I've also worked for plenty of people like this, who will stab you in the back to get ahead without a second glance, and are always striving but seldom have what it takes to actually be a good manager. If someone is always going out of their way to prove how awesome they are, watch out; they are probably very insecure and most likely creators of drama and problems.

[PassingFair]

71. It worked because you were just looking to "get laid"....congratulations, you WERE an asshole!

Asshole women go for asshole men.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

73. this works for both genders. we tend to seek things that we can fix

it makes us feel special

[unpossibles]

74. the same reason some men love dating assholes

it's probably just some psychological warfare bullshit playing on others' insecurities. I've seen this happen to, but it's not worth it - for one thing, remember that if you are being an asshole to attract people, you're going to attract people who tend to be insecure drama freaks. Not worth it.

I did once use this type of thing on a DJ though. I was at a club (this was 20 years ago or so) that was playing all of the worst top 40 crap, and I asked if they had any new wave or alternative dance stuff, or even disco. The DJ got all shitty with me and said "we don't play disco" so as I walked away I said over my shoulder, "oh, figures it hasn't hit here yet."

The very next song was Blondie. I did not plan it, but I basically put him on the defensive about his self-image of how cool and with it he was, and it essentially worked. Just implying that he was behind the times completely made him play something that I requested.

Anyway, it's not just women; I know a lot of men who do that shit too. Maybe we're all masochists on some level. If so, if anyone wants a good healthy beating, PM me. :D

[Wapsie B]

79. And the worst of the "dating gurus" concentrate on this warfare.

Experience alone should teach a guy the difference between feeling the need to be a doormat and or to be a jerk to women. Some learn but many others do not.

[unpossibles]

81. it's true. I have to admit that when my ex started dating a guy who owned a copy of

"The Game" or whatever it's called - the book about how to be an asshole and get laid - it kind of made me wince but also was not my call. Sad though.

[deucemagnet]

77. Raw Truth #3a.

#3a. Always keep this in mind when trying to win someone’s love or respect: people care more about how you treat yourself than how you treat them. If you treat someone better than you treat yourself, especially if you help them at great expense to yourself emotionally, financially or psychologically, they will actually end up loving and respecting you less.

http://therawness.com/a-work-in-progress-the-raw-truths/

There are lots of little pearls of wisdom on that web page, whether or not you agree with all of it.

[Deja Q]

82. because it's harder to get pregnant in there?

:hide:

I won't say I know the first thing of psychology, but the ancient animal instinct of aggressive masculinity is still there.

Anybody can say they want ___ and ___. Until it's proven, via deliberate intent, accident, mental illness, or otherwise, words are not actions. In short, saying "I want a nice cozy relationship with a man I can trust" cuts no ice if she likes to find convict in prison to chat with because nerds and geeks and others more inclined to be trustworthy don't turn her g-spot on.

Oh, Darwin was a prat... :D

[ismnotwasm]

86. Why do some men love assholes?

Why does anybody love anybody? I understand what you're saying though. My personal observation is that most women do NOT prefer to be treated like shit, and my guess is those women would have told you to fuck off the first time. Depends on the crowd you're around, and what 'issues' are present. I work in a profession that's mostly women, and one interesting thing I've found is there are some fascinating women who would rather remain single rather that put up with that bullshit, even a little bit. They don't tolerate it. They take their time and are extremely picky. Of the ones in healthy relationships, these woman are well loved, as well as being loving.

They don't understand the 'women love assholes' theory. Some of then understand the pain of failed relationships of course, for whatever reasons of the failure. Some of them just like to get laid and skip the whole 'relationship' part. Those types don't like assholes either, they want good sex.

What it sounds like you're actually talking about is mostly just sex. Sometimes women will wait it out to see if it delivers the initial promise, then give it up for a bad deal.

[Sanity Claws]

87. Some assholes make a lot of money

and these women want the money. The money can buy them prestige, clothes, beauty,etc. and also allow them to be haughty towards others.

[UTUSN]

90. Physicality. Sex. Fantasy. n/t

[Manifestor_of_Light]

91. Because our parents never told us to stand up for ourselves.

The parents were very critical of me, never told me to assert myself. Took me two horrible marriages and a complete physical breakdown complete with life threatening pneumonia (from Mr. Asshole trying to nag me into an early grave) before I got the idea to not tolerate critical, abusive men.

I'm a woman and over fifty.

This is what raising girls with bad self-esteem does. I thought "well if I love him enough he'll love me back". BULLSHIT.

[raccoon]

97. Sounds like we had the same parents. nt

[donheld]

92. Because without them they'd explode.

:D

[donheld]

93. Because without them they'd explode.

:D

[urgk]

98. Hahahahahahahahaaaa.... hrmmmm.... ha. :) (n/t)

[urgk]

99. I think it's from ancient biology. What are the chances that the nice guy will lead the pack?

Instead of complaining, I think nice guys need to learn to be more assertive. They (we) don't have to be jerks, but they (we) need to learn to compete. I, for one, used to just get really quiet and do something like pout when the a**hole was getting the attention from a girl I liked. You can imagine how well that went over.

[seabeyond]

100. women like confidence (as do men) but gotta be biological?

could merely be the healthy and balanced want same.

and that includes confidence, self worth and self respect.

i see nothing biological in that.

[urgk]

103. I think the reason confidence is sexy to humans is because of ancient biology.

That is, at some point, evolutionarily speaking, it was advantageous to find confidence sexy. Human beings were selected for confidence, among other biologically-based, useful traits.

[rrneck]

95. They're like opinions... nt

[TheKentuckian]

104. Because they are stupid and get what they deserve.

Wanna play a bunch of games to be entertained? Go ahead and raise those three kids with no child support with some leftover lumps on your head.