Let's Say You Are Making Out ---

[Tuesday Afternoon]

Your Will and you have a lot of land and a lot of money. You have 4 adult children, 2 males and 2 females. How do you divide your assets among the four and why?

[Orrex]

1. I'd give everything to Regan and Goneril, and Cordelia can go screw herself

O! Untimely Death!

[Tuesday Afternoon]

3. You left out the fourth one

thou hast forsooth and forsaken me in this, my hour of need.

[Orrex]

4. Well, give it to Ophelia. Sure, she's in Denmark, but she seems like a nice, stable girl

[Tuesday Afternoon]

7. Ophelia. Stable?

now that cracked me up. I was going to put this ----> :rofl: but I think we have been chastised for using that one as a reply in some other thread.

[janx]

31. Yeah and Feste can continue romping around. n/t

[Kitty Herder]

2. I'd leave it all to my cat.

Then I'd watch down from heaven as the kids have fits.

(Good thing I don't actually have any kids, huh?)

[Tuesday Afternoon]

13. Lucky Cat

:D

[burning rain]

5. Problem with your post.

You need to write so as to build, not lose, the reader's interest as they move from the Subject to the Message. :)

[Tuesday Afternoon]

8. Sneaky little shit

I am.

[flvegan]

6. Equally.

Trumps future family problems.

My work is done here.

[LeftyMom]

9. Except for the "where the fucking hell did you get four kids?" family problem.

;)

[janx]

11. That's not fair.

If you don't elect to have them, fine--but that's not fair.

[LeftyMom]

15. Well, if I don't elect to have them, he'd have a lot of explaining to do.

All the dependents he brought with him into the relationship are four-legged.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

12. ok---

You have 2 assets of different natures and 2 different genders. What say you split the land among the males and split the money among the females. Is this equal?

[janx]

14. NO. You stipulate that all assets are divided between the

beneficiaries. That is to say, (I love Orwell), that you divide all of the money equally between the kids.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

17. and ...what does one do with the land?

Pack it up and take it with one?

[janx]

21. The land is (unfortunately) another monetary value, to use another

Orwellian term. The land is worth "X amount of dollars."

:( :hug:

[Tuesday Afternoon]

22. you know...what-- You and the Orwell fellow are

NO help at all :D :hug:

[janx]

27. I know.

:shrug:

[flvegan]

16. That's not how Probate in equal division works.

A value is given to each asset, and each heir is given a percentage. In my scenario, each heir gets a 25% stake in the Estate. I leave it to my Personal Administrator of my Estate to work out the best way to take care of it. Sell the assets, dole out the cash, or if one heir is wanting an asset, take the value and subtract it from their stake. All heirs agree to it. If they can't, back to selling the assets and handing it out in quarters.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

19. Probate? I thought probate, was if one did not leave a Will. However,

I think, if I am understanding you correctly, that you are saying the land should be divided in quarters and the money should be divided in quarters, right?

[flvegan]

23. No Will means Probate Intestate.

Probate is simply the settling of an Estate via a court of law. And no, you aren't understanding me correctly. It's assets and monetary value pertaining to the Estate.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

26. I'm no probate lawyer,

but if you have a parcel or parcels of land that can be valued, and you have a certain, determined amount of cash, divvying up the cash is easy - 1/4 to each kid.

Couldn't you have the land appraised, and then divide the ownership to the kids, 1/4 each?

What am I missing here?

[flvegan]

34. You could, of course.

You'd have your Will devise the property to the Heirs via an undivided 1/4 interest each. If you keep the land apart from the cash, you don't need a value.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

40. That seems to me the simplest,

but it would also depend on the relationship the kids have with each other. You'd have to go right back to first-year Property class, and, since I still - after all these years - have the jingle "Seisin is the reason I'm flunking Property," I don't want to think about it.

I just threw the value thing in there. I have no idea why.................

[janx]

30. See?

:shrug:

[janx]

25. It would be great if that were the case, but it's not.

The land will be assessed (it makes me sick to say this) at some dollar figure, and then that will be figured into the "estate."

[Tuesday Afternoon]

28. but, what if One Wants to Leave the Land to the Men and the

Money to the Women. It is one's assets with which to do as One pleases, correct?

[janx]

33. Hell if I know.

Why would someone do that?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

37. uhm...

I am not condoning this just explaining the situation.

The reason why The One wants to do this is because The One does not want the land to leave out of the Family Name.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

43. That's a rough one,

because that would involve inserting a clause stating, essentially, that the kids would never be able to sell the land, except to each other or to another family member.

Probate folks sometimes look at those clauses with a very negative eye ........................

[Tuesday Afternoon]

46. Ok, remember you are talking to an ignorant layperson here...

I am confused about the probate part. This Will has not been contested. It is a done deal. Does that mean that the Probate folks turned a blind, negative eye and let this Will be probated (is that the word?). executed? The will has been executed. The executor has executed the will.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

51. OK, want a little primer on how this stuff works?

(I'll be reaching decades back into my brain for the basics of Estates and Trusts class and Property class, so bear with me.)

It's very simple, really.

The document is the Will.

The Will is "executed" when the Testator (the person making the WIll) signs it in the presence of witnesses, the witnesses sign, and it is properly and duly sealed by a Notary Public.

When the Testator dies, the Will is entered into Probate, which is the court that handles estates and stuff like that. Wills go to probate so that the property in the Will can be properly distributed.

The person who does all this - usually named in the Will by the Testator - is called the Executor or the Executrix or the Administrator, depending on the jurisdiction. This is the person who distributes what is in the will to the Legatees (the people who inherit from the Will). This person gets a fee for doing this, usually a percentage of the estate, although I think that varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction.

If the Executor has properly made the distributions, the matter is over, the estate has been probated, and it's all over.

Did that help? I know the "executed," executor," executed" stuff looks confusing, but it's not when you break it down................

[Tuesday Afternoon]

53. Then, it is all over and the Land went to the Men and The money

went to the women and the probate folk must have turned a blind eye. Rather or not there was a clause about keeping/selling the land between the Family name, I know not. Thanks for breaking it down.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

55. You're very welcome .........

Glad to help..........

[Tuesday Afternoon]

57. Question

about these probate folk and the negative eye. So what? What right/power would they have over any of this situation, whether they agreed or disagreed?

[Tangerine LaBamba]

58. In some jurisdictions,

there is a real bias against restrictive clauses. The worst of those - like the ones that prohibited sale of the land to blacks, for example - are now illegal. But a lot of places don't like the idea of someone dictating from the grave what the legatees can or cannot do with their inheritance.

In this case, there may not have been anything in the will about keeping it in the family. Or, if there was, then it's an accepted practice in that particular jurisdiction. Once the judge in Probate Court signs off on the estate - the will and the property included therein - it's over.

You seem to be looking for something. If you could tell me what it is, maybe I could help you figure it out..............

[Tuesday Afternoon]

59. I was not one of the principal players in this scenario, and

do not have all the facts at my disposal. The clause thing has me curious, and I wonder if one was included. Let me find out and get back to you...just as a subject for discussion. May be a few days while I gather some info. Any other questions you can suggest that I might ask?

[Tangerine LaBamba]

60. You have to come up with the questions,

since I don't know what you want to find out.

What's your interest in this matter, if I may ask? That might be a place for me to start, if I can lend a hand...............

[Tuesday Afternoon]

61. at this time it is a moot point and just a mental exercise as I have nothing

to gain from all this except some knowledge about how all this works and how to avoid possible family conflicts in the future. That and passing time in The Lounge.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

62. Avoiding family conflicts -

that's always a hard task.

In drawing up my own will, I set up a bunch of trusts that will keep each kid happy, and a whole lot of stuff goes to charity. The last thing I wanted to contemplate was any kind of dissension between them - there are two - about who got what. I've already given them the jewelry they liked, and that's the one thing they can fight over when I'm gone.

I've seen my own family do horrible, horrible things when family members died. At the age of eighteen, I watched two aunts fight over my dead grandmother's wedding ring - while she was in her coffin, at the funeral home, while everyone was waiting outside to go to the church for her funeral. They grabbed her hand, and were swinging her arm back and forth like it was some kind of lever.

Those images, sadly, tend to stay with you.

Ask me anything, and if I can help - as I said, I've never been an Estates and Trusts lawyer - I'll try to find you an answer.........

[Tuesday Afternoon]

63. The land and money predicament will be an issue although not

on a large of scale as the scenario I was referencing in my little make out scene. I was hoping that I could split the land equally and split the money equally.

In other words...in the above situation.

let us say it was 2000 acres divided by 4 kids = 500 acres per kid, right?

and then

let us say it was 2 million dollars divided by 4 kids = a half mil per kid, right?

I already know it will be a problem about which kid gets which 500 acres, water rights (if there is water, etc. bottom land vs hills, etc)

[Tangerine LaBamba]

65. You can get around that problem,

about what's in or under the land - gold, oil, walruses? - by deeding it to them "in fee simple absolute" with a "joint tenancy." That would mean that they'd all own all of it, and they'd all have to agree to sell any or all of it. No one could sell his or her "share," because there are no shares. Nothing is divided. They have an undivided interest in the land. They all own all of it.

I'm pretty sure that's right I guess my Property class has stayed with me far more than I thought. Amazing ..............

[Tuesday Afternoon]

66. Interesting. I like that.

Badminton, it is :D

[janx]

70. ...

:hug:

I am old and tired and vibrant. I'm also pissed off at all of this.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

73. yeah...

Kind of sad, isn't it? :hug:

[flvegan]

38. Then that's a specific bequest that must be set forth in the Will.

Perfectly appropriate and legal of course.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

41. It is,

and I am assuming that the testator knows that the land and the cash are approximately the same value.

Or else he likes the boys better than the girls, or something like that.

Or he hates their spouses.

It could happen ..................

[Heidi]

87. I hope my parents spend every cent of their money, including proceeds from assets,

before they die. They earned it. It's theirs to do with as they please. And if they don't spend every cent, it's still theirs to distribute as they please. No way in hell am I interested in fighting with anyone over money that I didn't earn.

[janx]

10. As equally as possible. n/t

[Tangerine LaBamba]

18. If that were my will,

I'd instruct my legatees, the kids, that the survivor of a badminton game to the death gets everything.

But, see, I've always told my children that I'd get even ..................

[Tuesday Afternoon]

20. Spoken like a lawyer

that hates badmintion.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

24. OK, tennis,

but that's gonna end a whole lot faster....................

[Tuesday Afternoon]

29. I don't know

I am liking the badminton scenario. Visions of green lawns and iced lemonade beckon ;)

[Tangerine LaBamba]

39. SEE?

Believe me, I've put a lifetime of planning into this scenario. I wouldn't want anything violent or less-than-genteel, and what is more precious and gentle than badminton. Even the shuttlecock weighs practically nothing, and no one can be injured by a flying shuttlecock.

Shuttlecock. I like typing that.

I'm glad you're open to embracing it ................

[3.14158675309]

32. Agreed!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1-NpyaOWV0

[BeachBaby]

36. Isn't your phone ringing or something?

:loveya:

[Juche]

35. Dance off competition

[Tuesday Afternoon]

42. Prancing WIth The Scars

or something like that?

[Juche]

48. Why not

What harm could come from it?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

54. oh lord!

that was photoshopped, no?

[Juche]

56. I think its real

Poor guy, getting an erection on national TV from dancing with a 17 year old. That can't be good for your reputation.

[Lyric]

44. All to my partner

assuming that we've been together for at least a year.

:)

[Tuesday Afternoon]

47. What if your partner passes before you?

:shrug:

[Lyric]

49. Then to our child.

:)

[Tuesday Afternoon]

52. Lucky You. Problem solved.

:)

[Kali]

45. oh eldest son gets it all

simple and they can work out the disputes themselves}( :yoiks:

[Tuesday Afternoon]

50. Benevolent Patriarch would he be?

:o

[LostInAnomie]

64. Money is easy. Just split it four ways.

The land is only hard if you are wanting to split it up. If it is farm land, leave it as one large plot and have the proceeds be split every year. What gets difficult is when the kids want to sell it off. Then, someone will have to assess the land to figure out the per acre value and which acres are more valuable than others.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

67. Yep...money is easy.

earning it, not so much though.

[sandnsea]

68. Any old way you want to

My parents left their land to my brother because he did so much to help them over the years. The cash, vehicles, etc. were sold and split evenly.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

69. you damn skippy.

:toast:

[midnight armadillo]

71. Leave your estate to the strongest

Let them martial their armies and fight it out.

Or, alternatively, offer the largest share of your estate to the child who loves you most. If any object, banish them! Then spend your days traveling between them. What could go wrong?

[elshiva]

72. OT, but what is that quote in your sigline from?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

74. I should probably give credit wher credit is due

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=8786922&mesg_id=8786934

[elshiva]

76. LMAO

[Tuesday Afternoon]

78. yeah...

its a keeper.

[elshiva]

79. You're a keeper, too.

:hug: :loveya:

[Tuesday Afternoon]

80. that last photo ...

you and me, babe ;) :loveya: :hug: :hi:

[elshiva]

81. Thank you. We're friends, honey.

:hug: ;) :pals:

[Tuesday Afternoon]

82. you know it, doll

http://www.youtube.com/v/rbo4OYSLTdI&hl=en&fs=1&color1=0x2b405b&color2=0x6b8ab6

[elshiva]

83. Thank you, good night, honey.

:) :hug:

[Jamastiene]

75. Say! What's the big idea here?

I expected to see a sex thread and THIS is what it's really all about?

You tease you.
:evilgrin:

[Tuesday Afternoon]

77. Funny, how that sentence breaks

and just changes track like that ;)

[GoddessOfGuinness]

84. Evenly; BUT...

I'd want to be sure that each of my children had at least one thing they would truly cherish...some special piece of jewelry or knick knack or book that would never be sold; but would bring them pleasure as a remembrance. It's all fine and good to become wealthy upon the death of a loved one; but it's so much better to have a token of love from the deceased...no matter how little its monetary value. I'd take that over land and money any day.

[elleng]

85. Equally, per capita.

Because.

[rcrush]

86. Donate it all to some pot farmers.

So I know that the land will be put to good use.