'Girls Gone Wild' Joe Francis refuse to turn himself in (could get 40 years in jail)

[LynneSin]

First and foremost - I think Joe Francis is a pig and I hope they rot his ass in jail for a long, long time. I have no problem with people who enjoy pornography but Francis is nothing more than a leech of society profitting off the fact that some girls, when in the right situation and with enough alcohol in them, might bare their breasts for the cameras or make out with their best friend. And it turns out this fucker doesn't even bother to check the ages of the girls and have had several underage girls in his films - hence the court case!!

Girls Guy Goes on Lam
by Josh Grossberg
Thu, 5 Apr 2007 04:22:29 PM PDT

http://www.eonline.com/news/article/index.jsp?uuid=c7d63226-4612-448f-8141-cb14921a125e

Girls Gone Wild mastermind Joe Francis remained in the wild Thursday, refusing a federal judge's order to surrender to U.S. marshals.

Francis failed to turn himself in by the noon deadline set by Panama City, Florida-based U.S. District Judge Richard Smoak, according to a court clerk. The justice had ordered Francis incarcerated for contempt of court, following an obscenity-laced tirade during settlement talks in a federal lawsuit.

Smoak had vowed to issue a warrant if Francis didn't show, but the court clerk said that as of closing time, no warrant was issued.

Either way, Francis' camp says he has no intention of turning himself in. Ronn Torossian, a spokesman for Francis' Mantra Films, called Smoak's order an example of "judges gone wild."

Francis was sued in 2003 by seven underage girls who claim they were wrongfully exploited in Girls Gone Wild videos—a claim Torossian likened to "extortion."


<<<<snip>>>>>

Francis still faces state felony counts in Pensacola, Florida, for allegedly using underage performers in his DVDs, charges that could land him up to 40 years in prison if convicted.

[KG]

1. um, drunk chicks flashing a guy with a camera is the guys' problem?

[northzax]

2. and underage girls drinking in a bar

is the guy's problem?

Sure, he should have checked better. fine. but I tend to assume that anyone drinking in a bar where they are checking ID is at least 21, since the age limitation for pornography is 18...

people getting drunk and doing stupid things doesn't make this guy a pig.

[LynneSin]

4. The girls weren't just underage for drinking

They were underage period - age 16.

Hey I don't have a problem with folks doing stuff like this, hell I've done it a few times in my life (mind you not in public in front of a camera). But this guy is making millions and how much are these girls getting paid for their roles in the video. At least if it's a regular porn film you know the starts are geting paid something for showing off their breasts.

[northzax]

7. ok, but at what point

if I say "Hey, Lynne, I am making a movie, do you want to be in it? I will give you a t-shirt!" and you say "sure" isn't that your own potentially stupid decision?

[Left Is Write]

10. Underage people are not legally able to enter into a contract.

While the girls' decisions to participate may be stupid, it is far more stupid for the producer not to cover all his bases. That is HIS responsibility, and "assuming" the girls are of age because they are drinking in a bar is colossal stupidity.

[LostinVA]

14. Drunk people aren't able to enter into contracts, either

In most states, you can't even get a tattoo or a piercing if you're drunk, let alone sign a legal contract.

[northzax]

18. but you are still legally responsible for your actions

while intoxicated. you can't sign a contract, perhaps, but it doesn't alleviate your responsibility for your actions.

[MissMillie]

20. here's the thing

if a drunk person can't enter into a contract, the guy can film away, but he can't publish it... LEGALLY.

The drunk person may be responsible for "behaving badly" but this guy is responsible for publishing it.

[Left Is Write]

24. The producer is legally responsible for the films he makes and distributes.

This includes making sure he's not contracting with people legally unable to do so.

Joe Francis may not be responsible for the actions of his subjects, but he is certainly responsible for his own.

[MissMillie]

27. GMTA

:hi:

[northzax]

16. stupidity, yes

exploitative? certainly. but 40 years worth? he'd be in better legal shape if, instead of filming them, he had simply gang raped them. it seems ridiculous that this is a 40 year sentence, don't you think?

[LynneSin]

21. He probably won't get all 40 years - the article did say 'up to 40 years'

But I don't see how what he has done, with the underage girls, any different from a child predator who takes pictures of underage girls. Frances has no excuse for what he has done; this guy has made so much money off these videos that he has his own private jet. So if he can't set-up a system where he can verify these girl's age before filming them then he's no better than that child predator taking pictures.

Take a look at the whole package: This isn't "Women gone Wild" or "Ladies Gone Wild" it's "Girls Gone Wild" - because he knows there is a market out there for men who want video of girls who barely look legal enough. If he gets 40 years then I think this world will be a better place.

[Left Is Write]

23. These are criminal acts. What if it were your daughter he exploited and profited from?

[northzax]

30. you mean if my daughter was dumb enough

to flash a guy making a video called 'girls gone wild' while drunk? I'd tell her it was stupid thing to do and that doing stupid things have consequences.

[Left Is Write]

35. Doing stupid things does have consequences -

and Joe Francis has done some incredibly stupid things for which he is legally liable.

[LynneSin]

11. True but.....

if you asked me now while I'm sober I would be inclined to asked additional questions about what you are filming, why you are filming and what you plan to do with the film. And if suspected you might try and make a profit off of me I'd probably ask for more than a tee-shirt.

You ask me after I've been downing frozen margaritas and body shots by the pool for the last 5 hours who knows, I"ll probalby just say "Hell yeah"

We've all made bad decisions while drunk, hell I'd be writing an epic novel if I listed everything stupid I've done while drunk. But Frances makes it a point to prey on drunk girls (many of the videos are from spring break locations) because they're more likely to say "yes" then if he walked up to them when totally sober and made the same request.

[idgiehkt]

69. anybody in that business knows what happens when

you put underage kids in porn. You have to pull the product, because it's kiddie porn and illegal. So it behooves them to make sure of the age and get release forms. Francis thinks he's above the law, and I hope he gets to learn differently.

[LostinVA]

94. Traci Lords

And, the legit porn industry LOATHES this guy.

[xmas74]

97. Hers is the first name that popped

out of my mouth when reading the article above.

Remember the big stink when she announced that she started making movies when she was 15? They had to pull all of her titles off the shelves everywhere.

[LostinVA]

99. She had major death threats against her, too

Jeebus.

[xmas74]

105. I remember that.

She was only 15 when she started-way too young to enter into a contract.

[CanuckAmok]

106. I think that was a ruse....

I have worked with her (in "legit" projects), and I think she wasn't underage. I believe she's older than the claims she is.

Here's my theory: she shoots these movies, knowing full-well that all she has to do is claim to have been underage when they were made, she can make them disappear. You have to remember that her time in porn was before there were the same record-keeping processes in the industry, and there was no such thing as digital media making something exist forever.

Considering she has pursued a "legitimate" screen career and a music career, she gave herself the best publicity ever by being "that underage porn star".

And if it weren't for illegal duplicates of her "early work" circulating in perpetuity around the internet, those movies would have been wiped of the face of the earth.

[skygazer]

108. But wouldn't there be official records verifying her age?

Birth certificate? It seems like nowadays, it's got to be harder to fudge your age in a legal situation. Or maybe I'm hopelessly naive.

[CanuckAmok]

115. Yes, but....

...it's not that difficult to falsify documents. At least it wasn't at that time.

I'm thinking more along the lines of her claiming the movies were shot earlier than they actually were; she didn't "come out" until she was in her 20s, and by that time most or all of the production documents would have been long-gone (assuming there were any; up until relatively recently, porn was a cash 'n' carry operation).

[Zookeeper]

109. My understanding is that the girls don't get paid at all....

unless you consider getting a t-shirt or "Girls Gone Wild" baseball cap as adequate payment for public humiliation.

(Be careful here, Lynne...some guys get really pissed when you challenge them on anything having to do with guns or porn. :eyes: )

[Pacifist Patriot]

51. Exploiting drunk people doing stupid things is what makes this guy a pig.

[wildhorses]

84. photographing for monetary gain---

'females'(not JUST any people)getting drunk and doing stupid things IS what makes this guy a pig.

[MissMillie]

9. yep

I think if you've got a camera, and you're planning to use it to publish nudity for profit, you ought to make it your problem to find out the age of your subject.

I suppose one could argue that if the girl is drunk one could assume she is of age. I'm sure this guy's lawyer has informed him that this is not a safe assumption.

[northzax]

19. indeed

but it seems to me that the assumption of being old enough makes this more of a mistake than intentional underage porn. Sure, fine him, give him a year if it's a repetitive issue, but 40?

[MissMillie]

25. I doubt he'll get all 40

but given this guy's history, it seems he doesn't make all that much of an effort to check... which to me seems intentional.

Knowing that this crime could get you into jail for "up to 40 years" means you check, you double-check, and triple-check...

and then you check again before you release the video (you even give the "performers" a chance to see the finished product and "opt out").

My guess is that the guy didn't want to spend the money.

[Left Is Write]

26. Assumptions? A mistake? This guy has a multi-million dollar industry going.

You don't make "assumptions." You make damn sure to have dotted the i's and crossed the t's. He preys on the vulnerable. You don't think he knows what he's doing?

[Pacifist Patriot]

52. Taking advantage of people's weaknesses regardless of their age...

is more than a simple mistake. He's treating other people as means rather than ends. He's a predator exploiting his advantage in the power differential.

[acmavm]

57. THANK YOU. I kept looking for the perfect word to describe this

asshole and couldn't. Predator is perfect. It describes him to a T.


He may not get 40 years but happily enough his refusal to turn himself in ain't gonna help him any. He's very lucky that the father(s) of one or some of those girls didn't decide to try to rectify the situation himself.

[Pacifist Patriot]

68. I'm frankly at a loss how anyone could shrug away this...

man's responsibilities. The idea that just because someone will do something stupid grants everyone else the license to exploit their weakness is just chilling to me. It's the epitome of unethical behavior and utterly dehumanizing. Total lack of compassion and no excuse for it.

[idgiehkt]

70. he's obviously a sociopath

I'd laugh my hiney off if he got put away and those millions sit there and rot.

:rofl:

[LostinVA]

81. Exactly -- it's sociopathic

INFJs are tres smart.

[petronius]

31. Succinctly stated, and right on target

I hope this jackass gets more than a slap on the wrist - he hasn't been making 'innocent assumptions' and 'honest mistakes', he's a predator...

[Pacifist Patriot]

54. Absolutely!

He has complete freedom over what to do with the images he has captured on film. No one is twisting his arm and forcing him to air the images. If he's going to profit from it he better take responsibility for knowing the consequences.

[LostinVA]

3. Joe Francis is scum

People in the legit adult industry hate him, because he IS scum.

[LynneSin]

5. Seriously!!

At least you know that the people in porn movies are being paid to do what they're doing. These girls aren't getting a dime for 20 minutes of drunken haze thinking "ooo, won't this be fun"

[LostinVA]

12. And, I believe in most states signing a contract while drunk

wouldn't stand up in court. Is a drunk women responsible for getting date raped, because of a sketchy situation? Nope. This is no different.

There is also very good evidence of his raping young women, filming m inors, etc.

This guy isn't a porn producer, or Larry Flynt, or even the guy who owns the local strip club. He is a predator. I don't make excuses for them, even while advocating "personal responsibility." Being young and stupid doesn't excuse his criminality.

[LynneSin]

15. I was just posting about how some stats won't allow Tattoo parlors to tattoo drunk people

I once dated a guy with a tattoo he regretted (he got it before we had dated). It was butt ugly too but he said he was pretty wasted at the time and it just seemed like a good thing to do.

[idgiehkt]

71. that's right

it's one of those circumstances that can void a contract. I mean, I wonder if some women could get together and file a class action suit. Or if they could set up a sting on him....I guess to file a suit they'd have to have technical proof of being intoxicated.

[Pacifist Patriot]

78. Absolutely correct. I have a clause in my officiating contract as follows...

"We acknowledge that, among other things, marriage is a legal and binding civil contract. We agree that if either or both of us appear to be intoxicated or not of sound mind 30 minutes prior to the wedding, Rev. Fuller, at her sole discretion, may not solemnize our marriage. In the event of a cancellation under this provision, deposits and fees are nonrefundable."

My butt is in a big huge sling if I marry a couple when one or both are drunk. If either subsequently contests the marriage they have perfect grounds right there. I'm in legal hot water and my reputation is shot.

Impairment prohibits informed consent.

[LostinVA]

82. "or not of sound mind 30 minutes prior to the wedding"

Uh oh.

[Pacifist Patriot]

98. ahem...

that's for couples who have a contract. ;)

[LostinVA]

100. *Whew*

[Pacifist Patriot]

101. and you'll notice it says nothing about the officiant being impaired

:headbang:

[LostinVA]

102. Hmmm.... good point!

[Beer Snob-50]

6. I have to agree this guy is scum.....

taking advantage of drunk chicks to do things they wouldn't do sober is rotten. He should have gotten signed realeases from these girls at the very least.

[LynneSin]

13. I think he does try to get signed releases but again, these girls are usually drunk

I know there are some states & municipalities that have laws which state that tattoo parlors cannot give tattoos to anyone who is intoxicated simply because of the liability of someone waking up hungover the next day and wondering what the hell did they do THAT last night (and this is not a bust on tattoos - I just think folks should be sober when deciding to get a tattoo since this is a lifetime decision)

[LostinVA]

17. ha! Great minds -- I said this up thread a minute ago

[LynneSin]

22. I just remember the big stink in Ocean City MD when tattoo parlors wanted to open up shop

For the longest time you could not get a tattoo in OCMD, when they finally allowed parlors to open shop, the local law put a condition in that patrons must be sober when getting a tattoo. And I think that's a fair law

[Beer Snob-50]

39. I would think that the signed released is a legal contract

and by being intoxicated you are not of sound mind to make a legal decision.

[NightWatcher]

8. I bet that the other prisoners would love to make him go wild

[BuelahWitch]

28. Wasn't there an instance where a girl was raped too?

I think I remember reading that a few months ago.

Rich asshat thinks he's above the law...

[LostinVA]

29. Yup

[johnnie]

33. It was a cameraman that was accused

And the charges were dropped.

[Shakespeare]

37. No, Francis has been accused, too.

The girl was too afraid to press charges, but has talked about it since, and she has pretty strong corroboration for her story.

Anybody who doubts that Francis is lower than whale shit should look up the LA Times Sunday Magazine piece on him from around last August. The man is a sociopath.

[BuelahWitch]

40. Yeah, the LA Times was where I read about it

Link here:

http://www.latimes.com/features/magazine/west/la-tm-gonewild32aug06,0,2664370.story

[johnnie]

32. On no! Boobies!!!

People still freak out over boobs..LOL Maybe this guy is shitty for taking advantage of drunk women, but what's the harm?

When they came to this area to film, the local news interviewed some of the women walking into the bar and all of them seemed pretty willing to show off their boobies to this guy. I don't know if they were drunk yet, they were just walking in.

Yeah, I know..these girls were 16 years old. I guess that is wrong, but Jesus people...it isn't like he made them blow him on film. 2007 and women's boobies still freak us out? And people here still wonder why breastfeeding is still such a hot topic.

And no, I don't buy his crap.

[Left Is Write]

36. Boobies don't freak me out (you'll see I'm one of the strong supporters of breast feeding) -

but I have no patience, sympathy, or tolerance for a sleazy slimebucket like Joe Francis.

[johnnie]

43. He may be a slimebucket to some, but not to others

I just think that he found a way to make millions off of something that happens all the time. Instead of beads, he gives the women shirts. He may be doing something that some people find "immoral", but it isn't against the law. Chances are he would have never made this kind of money anywhere but in America because we still have boobaphobia.

I don't know enough about how he tries to make sure the women are of legal age to show off their bodies, but there has to be hundreds of thousands of women who he filmed that didn't try to sue him. Why do you think he is a slimebucket?

[Left Is Write]

49. What is against the law is contracting with people who can't legally make a contract.

He preys on vulnerable young women, and that qualifies as slimebucket material in my book. His practices are shady at best and illegal and predatory at worst.

[idgiehkt]

74. because of the accusations

that keep piling up. He physically assaulted a reporter in one instance, it might be the article Shakepeare is referring to. I've also seen a picture of him trying to lift up a woman's shirt while she is fighting him and looking horrified. There is something wrong with him.

[Shakespeare]

75. "There is something wrong with him."

That may be the most succinct summary of that scumbag I've yet read. :thumbsup:

[idgiehkt]

77. I always think of Shirley Maclaine in "Terms of Endearment"

That great scene when she tells Jack Nicholson "There is something wrong with you." It's a classic.

[johnnie]

80. I never heard of these accusations until today

As I have said, I don't pay attention to this guy. I see now what he is about and it changes my mind on him. But when I first posted, it had to do with the comments before mine and that was that he took advantage of drunk women, filmed them and made money. For that, I still stick by my op.

People on here keep talking about "legitimate porn", but I can guarantee there is some pretty shitty things that go on in that industry also. It doesn't mean that people won't watch those films.

If this is all about this dude and what a asshole he is, then I agree with those responses. But as I said, I had no idea and that wasn't what I was talking about originally. As for 21 year old drunken women showing off their tits to someone with a camera for a t-shirt, oh well, I don't give a crap about that.

[idgiehkt]

95. I kind of do

(to your last point) in the sense that it is economic exploitation. Actresses in the porn industry get paid, these young women do not. I know they are making a choic to do that for a t-shirt, but being how much money he's made it's a shame that they can't all get together and make their own movies. I mean it's sex-work in it's strictest sense, so it would be nice if they were paid for their time.

[Shakespeare]

42. Here, let this blow your mind:

I'm a woman. I LOVE porn. And I think Joe Francis is a violent, sociopathic asshole.

It's not about fear of boobies.

[johnnie]

45. Ok, that didn't blow my mind at all

What part is supposed to blow my mind? That you are a woman? That you love porn?

[Shakespeare]

46. No, that you think people hate Francis because they're freaked out by porn.

And that is not so.

[johnnie]

48. Ok, but it still didn't blow my mind

I don't pay much attention to him, but it seems most people who speak out against him say it is because he takes advantage of drunk women and makes money off of them. Just read this thread.

[Shakespeare]

50. Again, I refer you to the LA Times piece, which a couple of others have alread linked.

And my "blow your mind" comment was flippant, as your "boobies" comment was flippant. Just a little rhetorical flourish. :eyes:

[johnnie]

53. My comment on "boobies" had to do with posts above mine

Thank you for directing me to how bad this guy is, I never really thought about him this much. No one mentioned the LA times piece until you, so I was commenting on the boobs, booze and contracts. So I will agree now, they should take this slimebucket who is lower than whale shit and hang him. Then that will leave the door open for others to go out and film drunk women and make cash and if they aren't sociopaths, then everyone will be happy.

[LostinVA]

55. What you said, except I'll add one thing

I'm a woman and love breasts, as well as porn -- but this dude is a predator and a slimeball.

[bullwinkle428]

56. That's just a garbage straw-man argument that Francis supporters

love to use every time this subject is brought up - "Oh, you just hate sex... you don't want to have to deal with sexual images...you want to make women wear burqas at the beach...yadda-yadda-yadda!" :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:

There are plenty of us that enjoy legitimate porn regularly, and are willing to see Francis for what he is - nothing more than an exploitative bully. The funny thing is, if this country actually had a more open and accepting attitude regarding the human body and sexuality instead of the backwards-ass shit perpetrated by religious conservatives, Francis wouldn't be able to a make a fucking dime from the shit he tries to peddle...it's that prurient, "barely-legal" angle that's used to titillate, and his customers frankly aren't much better than he is.

[johnnie]

58. I'm not a supporter of his

Never seen any of his videos and don't really give much of a shit. All I have seen are the commercials, so maybe he has "porn" that I have never seen. To me, boobs aren't porn. I should have never opened my mouth because I really don't give a fuck about this. Not as much as others do anyway.

In fact I have never really even owned any porn. I never saw a point in it and I never asked people why they like it. I honestly don't give a shit what people do if it isn't hurting anyone. And maybe I shouldn't have said anything because all I have seen regarding this guy is that he films young women showing off their breasts and making out with each other. I never really considered that porn, but as I have said, I don't have an interest in it and do fairly well without it.

[bullwinkle428]

60. I've never seen the actual videos either, but the commercials

alone have always made my skin crawl...it's just never passed the sniff test for me. I try to think about my state of mind back when I was 16, 17 years old, and know that I was pretty damn impressionable back then...

[johnnie]

64. My thoughts on the comercials are

When I have seen them, I figured it wouldn't be legal to sell "porn" like that, so I never really considered it nothing more than a glorified spring break or Mardi Gras. The women on the commercials seemed young, but 22 is young to me. They all look like college kids to me, it never crossed my mind that the women I saw are 16 years old.

[LostinVA]

66. BINGO! Great post, Bullwinkle!

[lildreamer316]

91. EXACTLY.

Thank you.

[lildreamer316]

90. Johnnie; please read my comment below..

the problem is not the boobies. And I would know. He is just an asshole with no respect for women and no concept of their worth.
I honestly find his videos and his attitude more degrading than some explicit porn.

[skygazer]

34. I always loved Arrested Development's take on it

"Girls With Low Self-Esteem" :rofl:

[noamnety]

38. Joe Francis is a violent woman-hating asshole

Just thought I'd throw that out there, for the folks that think he's just playfully having fun with willing participants. No, he's not. He's physically violent and abusive.

‘Baby, Give Me a Kiss’
The man behind the ‘Girls Gone Wild’ soft-porn empire lets Claire Hoffman into his world, for better or worse

By Claire Hoffman, Times Staff Writer
August 6, 2006

Joe Francis, the founder of the “Girls Gone Wild” empire, is humiliating me. He has my face pressed against the hood of a car, my
arms twisted hard behind my back. He’s pushing himself against me, shouting: “This is what they did to me in Panama City!”

It’s after 3 a.m. and we’re in a parking lot on the outskirts of Chicago. Electronic music is buzzing from the nightclub across the
street, mixing easily with the laughter of the guys who are watching this, this me-pinned-and-helpless thing.

Francis isn’t laughing.

He has turned on me, and I don’t know why. He’s going on and on about Panama City Beach, the spring break spot in northern Florida where Bay
County sheriff’s deputies arrested him three years ago on charges of racketeering, drug trafficking and promoting the sexual performance of
a child. As he yells, I wonder if this is a flashback, or if he’s punishing me for being the only blond in sight who’s not wearing a
thong. This much is certain: He’s got at least 80 pounds on me and I’m thinking he’s about to break my left arm. My eyes start to stream
tears. …

http://stangoff.com/?p=421

I don't have a clue why people don't see connections between violence against women and exploitation of women, and the cycle of poverty that women are - as a class - stuck in.

[Taverner]

41. I had a feeling this would happen

I mean, sure it's the easy way to do it - but you miss out on that whole consent form thing when you do it. Even if every model were over 18, how could you prove it? All you would need is one case and - boom, you're guilty of exploitation. Add the alcohol and you get contributing to the delinquency too.

Personally, I was wondering how long it would take this dumbass to go down.

[alarimer]

44. Wasn't he the guy that assaulted a reporter interviewing him?

Throw his ass in jail forever. Fucking pig.

[Shakespeare]

47. Yep, that's him.

Like I said, violent sociopath.

[Oeditpus Rex]

59. I can't believe anyone here's defending this dirtbag

Yeah, the girls are drunk and stupid. Why does that give him license to take advantage of them?

[johnnie]

63. Well, I'm not defending him

But as I said above, when they came to my area to film, the local news interviewed women walking into the bar they were filming at and they all seemed to be excited about it. But also as I have said, I never seen any of his videos, so I am probably not one to comment.

[LostinVA]

65. Check the LBN thread -- it's crazy

[LynneSin]

67. I can't believe people are calling these girls Bimbos and Sluts

I mean, what if that DUer's 17 year old daughter on the video?

This guy is a predator that knows the key to getting these girls to perform on camera is alcohol. The more they have the more willing they'll show their breasts, kiss their best friend, masterbate on camera, etc. etc. etc.

I know one of the comments that the pro-Joe people have used is that these girls need to be held accountable for their actions even if they are drunk. I've been shit-faced enough times in my life and I've done some really really stupid things while drunk - I take full responsiblity for my actions. But Joe Francis is a predator that knows the use of alcohol will throw away inhibitions and clearly goes after the more intoxicated ones in order to get the video he wants and to profit off that video.

And the last time I checked 21 was the legal age to drink in the states and clearly this guy is going for the under-21 crowd and even the under 18 crowd too.

Perhaps 40 years in jail is too harsh but I think a massive class-action suit filed by the girls from the video against him and all his assets is more appropriate. Those riches he flaunts including a private jet came from those drunken girls he preys - they deserve a cut of the profits

[Pacifist Patriot]

79. I'll consider this a warning to stay away from the thread.

I'll just get pissed off and I don't need that today. I'm drawing an absolutist line here. I will never be convinced of the acceptance of this behavior.

How would people feel if a grown woman was getting teenage boys drunk and getting them to flash their penises on film? Somehow I think a double standard would apply.

[LostinVA]

85. It's horrible -- this thread is way more reasonable and non-flamey

[LostinVA]

83. I know -- it's appalling

And, as I said up thread, their "argument" would mean that a woman who's drunk and gets date raped is responsible for her rape. Hey, she agreed to go to the guys room, right? She gave consent, right? What a bimbo.

I think 40 years in jail isn't harsh ENOUGH. Let some of the pot smokers out, and put this predator away.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

61. If somebody flashes themselves in public.

I've got no problem if somebody takes a video of it and sells it.

Now if this guy committed some other crime and goes to jail for it, that's fine. But let's not confuse the former with the latter.

[Pacifist Patriot]

72. No need to repeat myself. Just go to responses 52 & 68

[Starbucks Anarchist]

62. I hope he gets locked up, too.

[LostinVA]

86. HUG

I love my EVOO Man.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

89. Love ya back!

:hug:

Seriously, every time I see this fucker on TV, I want to punch the screen.

[LostinVA]

92. I've seen him on shows just gloating about how "legal" everything he does is

UGH.

[Forkboy]

73. Bah....softcore....phooey.

He should be arrested for making boring ass wannabe porn if nothing else.

[slj0101]

76. Dude's a fucking scumbag.

[Ignacio Upton]

87. I don't want to directly defend Francis, but many underage drinkers

Have fake ID's. I knew a number of people in high school who were 16, 17 or 18 who had fakes. If these girls told the camera crew that they were really 18 or 21 and then complained later, I don't have as much sympathy for them. However, if they admitted that they were underage (16 or 17) and the camera crew continued, then Francis does deserve what he gets.

[lildreamer316]

88. I'm a stripper and I really DON'T like Joe Francis.

For exactly the reasons stated in the OP, and also for the fact that (sorry; here's my libertarian side; deal with it) I think that the girls should have at LEAST gotten PAID.
I mean really. If you're gonna take your clothes off; have something to show for it. I did/do. Make it work for you; not against you. People will be people; teens will be teens; and I can't control another's decisions, but I sure can comment on how they made that choice work for them in a positive manner.
I know many don't agree; but that's me. JMHO.

He deserves to learn a lesson. He treats women with less respect than some people I know in the heavy porn industry.
Seriously.

[idgiehkt]

103. thanks lildreamer

very nice post. It's nice to have some perspective...I feel the same way, it's not right that he's made tens of millions, has his own private jet, owns an island, and all each of the women got was a tee-shirt. To me that makes him worse than a pimp.

[VenusRising]

93. Joe Francis is a disgusting excuse for a human being.

A couple of years ago, when my sister was a senior in high school, they made a trip down to Columbus. It just so happened that their hotel wa right behind my apartment, so I got to go over and spend some time with her. My sister and I were sitting in her hotel room as a bunch of girls came back from a dance at another hotel. Well, right next to the hotel was a club where they were filming GGW. These little teenage girls, who were definitely not old enough, had come back to their hotel to change into different clothes to go back to the dance to try to sneak over to the club. The only thing that saved them that night was the fact that they were not allowed to leave the hotel again once they returned from the dance. So, the girls put on their swimsuits instead and headed to the pool.

These girls come from rural farm country Ohio, and I heard a few of them say "big break" in the flurry of girl chatter. These girls have no idea, and though they high school age, all they see is what's shown to them on the TV. I'm glad my sister was content to hang out with me for a few hours instead of going with her friends. I know she wouldn't have done the GGW thing, but I can't say the same about her friends.

I've seen Joe Francis interviews, and he acts completely smug and self-righteous when he speaks about what he does. It's enough to make your skin crawl and your eyes dry into little pits in the socket. I hope that the judge puts an end to his special brand of victimization.

[Unvanguard]

96. Exploiting intoxicated people in this manner, underage or not,

seems clearly immoral to me, and probably should be illegal if it isn't already.

[anarch]

104. I have no problem whatsoever with "pornography"

or people making money by providing sexually explicit entertainment, generally speaking.


But that particular dickhead can rot in Hell as far as I'm concerned.

I can't even exactly explain why I hate him and the whole "Girls Gone Wild!" thing so much, but I do.

[UTUSN]

107. Need to borrow this space briefly for copying/pasting graphic. Will delete.

2nd Xmas pope:

[ContraBass Black]

111. What is that photo?

[UTUSN]

113. Oops, sorry I didn't delete. It's da pope, dressed up for his first Xmas n/t

[CanuckAmok]

110. Defining "drunk" might be an obstacle...

Don't get me wrong; I know those dumb-ass girls are drunk. You know they're drunk; Francis knows they're drunk...


...But proving you were impaired when entering into a contract is a whole other ballgame.

I'm not defending the guy, but I certainly think it shouldn't be easy to prove you were drunk when entering into a contract with him, and an impartial Court should not assume you were.

I also think these girls need to assume some of the responsibility for this. I remember when some asshat tried to beat a drunk-driving charge by arguing he was drunk when he got in his car, and therefore not responsible for his actions. He was laughed right into jail, and with good cause.

In this case, it takes two to tango; if you're at a bar where Girls Gone Wild is working(or in any public venue as far as I'm concerned), and if you can't handle your alcohol, you shouldn't drink yourself into a state where you make stupid decisions. I don't buy, for one second, the premise that these girls didn't know what they were doing, and what situations they were getting into.

The bar owners should share some responsibility. Aren't bars sometimes held responsible for their patrons' behaviour?

But don't get me wrong... I can't stand the whole GGW phenomenon. And I think the guy's a dumbass if he didn't check IDs to verify the girls' ages. On the other hand, if he was given fake ID that was good enough to get the girl into the bar, is that his fault? I don't know.

[Zookeeper]

112. Part of what makes him so scummy....

is how he got started with his little enterprise. He walked around with a video camera and asked young women to flash him *for his own private use.* He and his early cameramen never said anything about the fact that the photos were going to become public. I've seen interviews with a couple of those women and their lives were damaged by it.

Joe Francis built his empire on lies and exploitation.

[Danger Mouse]

114. On one hand, I have little sympathy for the girls (it was their choice to get drunk) BUT

on the other hand, Francis is a sleaze who happily exploits people and flaunts the law. Just because the girls were dumb enough to get drunk and flash Francis, doesn't excuse Francis from being responsible for his actions. HE knew what he was doing, knew the risks, and did it anyway.
It is about time he is brought to bay.