Any Mormon DU-ers here?

[absyntheNsugar]

I'm not LDS...but I've always wondered how many leftist Mormons there were out there.

I know LDS usually votes Repub, but so do Evangelicals and I've met a number of them who vote Dem or even Green.

[Sandpiper]

1. Well, congratulations...

You've just met your first LDS DUer.

[absyntheNsugar]

2. Awesome!

and a Californian at that!

Welcome!

[Sandpiper]

16. There aren't many of us

But we do exist. The number 3 guy in the whole church, James Faust, is/was a registered democrat and once held a seat in the Utah State Legislature as a democrat.

As for myself, like most good mormons, I was raised republican. But as time went on, I came to the decision that the republican party's political philosophy bears little or no resemblance to the teachings of Jesus. And thus I converted (pun intended).

[Dookus]

34. Sandpiper....

Again I want to reiterate my desire to be respectful of your beliefs. But can you tell me if you really believe Joseph Smith found golden plates in Palmyra, a special reading glass to translate them, then had them disappear?

Do you believe Joseph Smith's subsequent revelations were god-inspired?

I'm sorry it's hard to ask this without sounding judgmental.

[aQuArius]

3. Raised Mormon, do NOT practice

I was raised in Utah in a very Mormon family. A lot of things happened (including my parent's divorce); now, none of us go to church and we are one of the closest-knit families I know. Easy going and really rowdy. I still have a lot of right-wing relatives and friends, but we just don't talk politics. I have an understanding of Mormons and the way they believe. I just don't agree with most of it, that's all.

[DemOutWest]

4. I live in

Utah and as of yet, I have not met a Democrat who is LDS. I am not saying they don't exist. However, like the Loch Ness Monster and Yeti, reports of their existence are highly suspicious.

I keep up the search. I even hope to persuade some to be truthful with their thoughts and beliefs. When that day comes, they will yell out to their God and say "I believe in the goodness of all mankind and I will help all mortals upon this earth. I will vote against the evil that is George W. Bush. I will be free."

Maybe not.

[absyntheNsugar]

5. It is ironic, is it not?

Given the Mormon history of being persecuted and eventually getting chased out Navoo, IL by intolerant thugs. One would think they would identify with the African American struggle, or other marginalized groups and cultures in history. One would think they would identify more with the Democratic Party than the Repubs.

On a related note, the Mormon story is a classic story. Whether or not you are a Mormon or not, the whole thing is an epic chapter of American history.

[aQuArius]

6. Mormons have strong "family" belief

Which, in turn, views gays and abortion as major sins.

[45th Med]

9. But they turn a blind eye to bigomy. :rolleyes:

nt

[aQuArius]

13. What you must understand is...

The LDS church no longer includes Polygamy in their practices, in fact, the will ex-communicate members who do prctice it. However, there are sects that still live in and around Utah that practice polygamy but are not recognized by the LDS church in any way. They tried to distance themselves from it almost 100 years ago, and most people think its still part of the religion.

[absyntheNsugar]

14. Actually, the Mormons really cracked down on bigamists

As of late. Mormons I knew in Utah (I used to work for Novell) saw them as the proverbial thorn in their side, and had more contempt for the bigamists than they did any other group.

[Dookus]

7. yes it is...

I find it fascinating.

I'm not a fan of the LDS. But I love reading about their history.

I tried starting a thread a few months ago about "Under the Banner of Heaven" but got no bites. Anybody wanna discuss it?

[aQuArius]

8. I'm in...

[absyntheNsugar]

12. What was "Under the Banner of Heaven"?

Is it a good read?

Also its interesting to note there are actually two Mormon churches: The Church of J.C. And Latter-day Saints and then the Reorganized Church of J.C. And Latter-day Saints.

The latter has much more in common with the Ecumenical churches like the Methodists, Episcopalians and Lutherans whereas the original are the Mormons most of us are more familiar with.

[aQuArius]

15. This is true, I have met some RLDS

they are much different than LDS "mormons"

[absyntheNsugar]

28. Speaking of RLDS

I was just on their site and it could have been the site for Glide Memorial!

Human Rights Watch...Food Drives...totally different than the LDS.

[DemOutWest]

18. Under Banner

of Heaven. Great book and very informative. Don't take it to be a history of the majority of LDS. It is about the fundalmentalism of any religion.

The LDS portrayed in the book are fundalmentalist. The LDS I know are family oriented and peace loving families.

It is still a good history of the beginnings of the religion and the original beliefs.

[Dookus]

22. I thought it was a great read...

but I've l loved everything by Jon Krakauer... he wrote "Into Thin Air" about the disastrous Everest expedition. He's just a great storyteller.

Under the Banner of Heaven was very different from his other work, but still a compelling work.

I don't want to be disrespectful to believing Mormons, but the early history of the LDS is a fascinating amalgam of shysterism and hokum. Again, sorry, guys - just my opinion.

My brother and his family live in Palmyra, NY, the home of Mt. Cumorrah on which Joseph Smith supposedly found the golden plates containing the texts now known as the Book of Mormon. It was a time in which many new religions were cropping up in the US, and Smith hit it big.

Of course, the golden plates and the special eyepiece provided to him by the angel Moroni are now gone, but people are expected to believe they really existed.

As for bigamy, the LDS gave it up pretty much at gunpoint. Smith believed in plural marriage, but kept it a secret for many years, as did other Mormon leaders. When the feds almost came to war against Utah, they decided to give it up in order to survive. Today, the fundamentalist sects still believe in it.

While I don't have an inherent aversion to plural marriage, the way it's practiced among those people is abhorrent. Generally, young girls (14 or so) are married off to much older men, quite often relatives. They have little say in the matter. One whole community is based on these "families" and their major source of income is welfare.

Furthermore, one major thing most people don't realize is that Mormonism is not a monotheistic religion. Every man is capable of becoming a god controlling his own world, populated of course, by his wives and children.

Again, my intent is not to offend true believers. But I would like a decent discussion about whether you really believe some of the basic tenets of the LDS. Thanks.

[SheilaT]

25. "Under the Banner of Heaven"

actually did get some discussion here several months back. I remember posting in it. Of course, if you miss a couple of days -- or even a few hours in some forums -- you can miss threads entirely.

It's a wonderful book. I got to see Krakauer on book tour several months ago, and he was very good. He grew up in a neighborhood somewhere (I want to say Seattle) surrounded by LDS and has enormous respect for them, but feels that the church has been less than honest in its acknowledgment of its polygamous past and how the current polygamists hurt them.

They've whitewashed their history, which is of course what many groups do.

Read the book, those of you who haven't and have any interest whatsoever in the LDS church. Or if you have any curiosity at all about the Elizabeth Smart thing.

[neebob]

29. I read it a few months ago.

It shook me up a bit. I even posted about it - in GD, as I recall - but now I can't find it and it wouldn't be respectful to discuss my reaction in the presence of active LDS church members. Suffice it to say it gave me a new issue with my parents.

[DemOutWest]

10. Kenny, Kyle and

Cartman recently did a wonderful story on the founding of the LDS church.

Actually, quite educational. I have lived in Utah, off and on, for nearly 30 years of my 42 years on this planet. Learned more in half an hour with the good folks of South Park then anywhere else.

Interesting side bar, yesterday on the local public radio, they did a piece on an Mormon Environemntal Group who are using the Book of Morman to preach environmentalist ways. I will try and find a transcript.

Dum-Dum, de, dum-dum, DUMB.

Peace Out,

DemOutWest

[aQuArius]

11. Can't believe I missd a SP episode about mormons!

DANG!

[cprise]

17. Aren't Mormons fundamentalist?

Belief in biblical inerrancy?

[aQuArius]

19. The mormons believe both the Bible (King James version) AND

The Book of Mormon. Not sure what that makes them because they will explain things in the Bible with passages out of the BOM.

[absyntheNsugar]

20. Actually, no

They hold that the Bible's message got lost in translation, and that The Book of Mormon and the Doctrine and Covenants hold the true message.

I'm sure there are all levels of whether they feel those books were inspired or word for word.

[aQuArius]

26. yes and no, fundamentalists about the BOM, not as much about the Bible

They "believe the Bible to be the word of god (as far as it was translated correctly)"

[aQuArius]

21. but, yes, mostly big fundamentalists.

[mitchum]

23. that would be kind of difficult...

since they made up their own.
Nothing more than a 19th century land grab scheme which cobbled together Catholic voodoo and Jewish tribalism.

[aQuArius]

27. LOL, well, this is a prime example (one of many)

of why I do not cosider myself Mormon and do not practice. I can not swallow the whole BOM thing.

[Dookus]

36. Thank you aQuArius

While I've had a lot of Mormon friends (I used to do business in SLC), can you tell me to what degree people really believe in the Joseph Smith stories? Are the golden tablets really taken as an article of faith among members? Is Moroni really thought to be a genuine being?

Please take this question in the manner in which I intend, which is one of exploration, not condemnation.

[Fleshdancer]

24. My mom was raised Mormon....

Now she's...come to think of it, I'm not sure. She's probably a Humanist, but I'll have to ask her tomorrow.

She's just as liberal as I am and always have been. I'm thankful for that. If I had to be raised by freepers, I don't know what I would do. Growing up is hard enough as it is, right?

[LiviaOlivia]

30. Jack Mormon here

That's is not a name but a status. My father and my grandparents
are or were lifelong Democrats and they were/are more devout than
myself. Mormons are human beings and they are as diverse as any group.
My father and I regularly dis the BFEE when we talk and he holds the
position of 'High Priest' within the church.

Here are some books I recommend concerning Mormon history:

'The Changing World of Mormonism' by Jerald & Sandra Tanner
Moody Press, Chicago

'Brigham Young' by Leonard J. Arrington
University of Illinois Press

'No Man Knows My History-The Life of Joseph Smith' by Fawn Brodie
Alfred Knopf, Inc. second edition

'Mormon Enigma: Emma Hale Smith' by Linda N.Newell & Valeen T. Avery
University of Illinois Press second edition

'The Mountain Meadows Massacre' by Juanita Brooks
University of Oklahoma Press (This is the best book on this subject)

'Quicksand and Cactus' by Juanita Brooks
Utah State University Press

'John Lee Doyle' by Juanita Brooks
Utah State University Press

'The Giant Joshua' by Maureen Whipple
Western Epics Press

'Orrin Porter Rockwell' by Harold Schindler
University of Utah Press (excellent bio, he was bodyguard to Smith
and Young and alot more)

[Dookus]

31. Livia

thank you for posting the Juanita Brooks references. It shows you're being very fair-minded.

[BrotherBuzz]

38. The Mountain Meadows Massacre

By C.F. McGlashan, The Sacramento Daily Record (1871) From the Desk of Truckee's C.F. Mcglashan Published by the Truckee-Donner Historical Society, is a pretty good piece of investigative reporting as well...I have heard of Juanita Brooks but have not read her...Thanks for the tip.

[GregW]

32. I was baptized a Mormon ...

... but soon fell off the wagon (by age nine).

[Dookus]

33. man, that was quick...

took me 16 years to become an ex-catholic! ;)

[SimpleMan]

35. I am Mormon...technically...

But I no longer attend. Most of the church members I knew when I did attend were Repugs. They hated it when I stood up for Clinton. I loved pissing them off.

[Dookus]

37. heheheh

good for you.

Can I ask an ignorant question? As a gentile, I honestly don't know.

Do you wear the undergarments? The LDS members I knew SLC always did, but is it universal? Do non-attending Mormons give it up? And if so....

boxers or briefs? :)

[CanuckAmok]

39. I had/have some Mormon friends in Ontario.

I think they're more the classic Republican style, not neocon. They are socially conservative, but many of them seem to be active in local Peace initiatives and charitable organizations. In fact, I lost track with some of them in the late 80s, and 'ran into' one last year, on an anti-war on Iraq forum.

We've never talked politics in depth, but I get the sense they have a "leave us alone and we're fine with whatever you do" menatlity. They seem to interpret the Bible as a guidebook for living 'right', not forcing everybody else to live the way they want them to. Would that make them sort of Libertarian?

[Fridays Child]

40. The late, great Mo Udall...

...was asked at a golf tournament..."what his handicap was. He quipped, 'Handicap? I'm a one-eyed Mormon Democrat from conservative Arizona ... you can't find a higher handicap than that.'"

http://www.tucsonweekly.com/tw/2001-03-29/book.html