Been a dog person all my life; so now I have a cat and a question

[MotorCityMan]

I've always loved dogs and currently breed and show cocker spaniels. Anyways, through a friend, my partner and I got a gorgeous himalayan kitten. Lana (excuse me, PRINCESS Lana) is the sweetest thing and we are thrilled with her

My question; how old does she have to be before I can get her declawed? I plan on getting her front paws declawed only. She will be exclusively a house cat.

Any responses are appreciated. I know there are alot of cat lovers here!

[Blue-Jay]

1. Uh oh.

Wait for it......

[MotorCityMan]

7. Uh oh, hope I didn't open a can of worms!

...

[Bertha Venation]

10. I'm afraid you did, MotorCityMan

Here's my opinion, and I hope you don't take offense because I intend none.

Declawing a cat is roughly analogous to you having your fingers removed at the second knuckle. It is barbaric. There is absolutely no good reason for it.

In my opinion, no piece of furniture or fine carpeting is worth the maiming of a beautiful creature like Princess Lana.

Nothing is worth the suffering she will experience -- and if you don't think she'll suffer, imagine her trying to cover up her mess, standing in it because during the healing process you can only use newspaper in the litter box. That's just the beginning.

Many vets in the U.S. won't declaw a cat. It's illegal to do so in many countries.

Kathy, my partner, and I disagree on this. She doesn't think it's barbaric. I do.

For the love of Lana, please don't do it.

[radwriter0555]

28. Please don't keep your cat if you must mutilate it to deem it an

acceptable companion.

AS you can see from ALLLLLLL the posts here, there is no need or reason to abuse, torture and mutilate a defenseless animal in your charge.

[Skittles]

2. don't do it

That's my advice; it's cruel. And this is from someone who did once have a cat declawed. I very much regret it now.

[MotorCityMan]

5. Can you elaborate?

Why do you think it's cruel and regret it now?

[GainesT1958]

3. The really good vets will tell you...

That it's best to wait until kittens are six months old before either de-clawing or spaying/neutering. We did that for our shaded silver Persian brother/sister combo, on the advice of a great vet--and we're convinced that, along with other important decisions about them, she made the right call. They're both doing great, and it's probably important to wait until Princess Lana reaches that age to do it for her, too!

B-)

[Tripper11]

4. I have to agree....

it's a nasty thing to do to them.
Get some cat nail clippers from the pet store and clip them regularly, that's what we do. One of ours, just sits there and accepts it, the other, doesn't like it getting done, but is fine after it's over. No worse then clipping a kids nails.

[Bertha Venation]

13. Trimming their claws regularly is the way to go!

It doesn't hurt them if you do it properly, and it's very easy to learn. You know immediately if you clip to far, and believe me, you'll never do it again.

They can do very little damage to your furniture & rugs (and skin) with regularly trimmed claws.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

6. NO! Don't do it.

It's the equvilant of cutting off the entire end of your finger up to the knuckle. Pretty cruel. And their balance is never as good afterwards.

[geniph]

8. It really isn't necessary

I've never declawed a cat, and never needed to. Mine don't cause any damage. Please read this before making your decision:

http://www.declawing.com/
http://www.declawing.com/htmls/declawing.htm

It's completely illegal in most of western Europe.

[Castilleja]

16. You can also buy little claw tips

if you are so inclined. I would not do it, I read that it stresses them because they have lost a really important body part, which they will, of course, miss. We have three, and they don't do any damage by clawing either. I do buy them a big corrugated cardboard scratcher which they love. You might try giving her something like that to scratch on instead, but you may have to try a few different types before you find one she really likes.

[elfwitch]

9. I'll answer...

It is better to have it done when they are young. The older they get, the longer it takes for them to heal.

Both of my cats are front declawed. Both are indoor only.
You might want to have it done when you get her spayed (if you are going to spay her). That gets all the operations out of the way in one shot. The vet will also do you a btter deal if you do it all at once.

[bratcatinok]

26. I agree with you

Both of my cats were fixed and declawed at the same time at around the age of 6 months. I had the choice of either declawing them or getting rid of them. I chose to have them declawed.

They haven't suffered any bad consequences. No loss of balance, no heightened sensitivity in their paws, no infections and they recovered quickly.

Brat is a 9 year old calico and Eve is a 3 year old black siamese mix.

[Isome]

11. No DECLAWING!! PUHLEEEEEZE!!!

I've always heard from vets that it is a cruel thing to do!! Their paw pads atrophy as a result. Besides which, they use those claws to scratch themselves. If you had an itch you couldn't scratch you'd go bonkers.

But on a serious note, if you're concerned about furniture then you have to prepare yourself to discipline the kitty regularly until it learns. The best discipline is spraying water at them. Just get a little spray bottle and fill it with water. When you catch kitty scratching just squirt it a little and it'll stop. Eventually, of course, they'll associate scratching furniture with getting sprayed and they HATE that.

It would be wise to invest in several different scratching posts as well. You can put them in different areas of the house so kitty will have an acceptable place to sharpen those claws, or to just get a good ol' S-T-R-E-T-C-H. Sprinkling a little catnip on them makes the post more inviting than your furniture or drapes.

Please don't declaw the cat... please!! If you need the warnings from other vets, I'll be happy to post some links for you.

[Maine-i-acs]

12. 4 cats, all with claws, no ripped furniture.

Trained with a single scratching post and a squirt gun.

All things considered you will find the cat to be less training, maintenance and work, I bet.

Better than seeing your newly-declawed cat crawling around the house yowling in pain for a couple weeks..

[Beaker]

14. 6 months.

and they get over it just fine. If you like your upholstry, you're making the right decision...no matter how much gnashing of teeth it may bring you in this thread.

[elfwitch]

17. I'm with you...

My cats are just peachy. And believe me, they have more than enough clws to scratch with. I've got a 6 inch scar on my leg to prove that they do just fine with back claws only. (I got in the way of my girls chasing each other and got run over.)

[Lorien]

30. When I was growing up, our cats stayed indoors and

were generally declawed-it was just an accepted practice back then. While I have not and would not declaw my current kitties, I honestly can tell you that I would rather see a destructive pet declawed rather than sent to a shelter. Destructive behavior is the #1 reason so many cats are brought to shelters and put to death-and that IS truly barbaric.I can't recall a single one of our childhood cats "yowling in pain" after declawing (we didn't know that it involved aputation then) they reacted to it in pretty much the same way they did neutering.

Buy several of those cardboard scratching posts, put a little catnip on them or use spray catnip. Kitty will likely prefer the cardboard over your sofa, so you won't have to worry about it. You can also place packing tape on tempting surfaces while she's getting use to her new home (most kitties won't scratch on tape). Good luck!

[Bertha Venation]

15. You may wish to look into SoftPaws -- see link

http://www.softpaws.com/

[MadHound]

18. Don't declaw your Princess, Please!!

It effects a cat's balance and the health of their paws. Also, a point to note since Lana is a long haired cat, claws are needed by cats for grooming and removal of mats in the fur. Plus, I know that you are planning on keeping her indoors, but mistakes can happen and if she gets out, she is defenseless with poor climbing ability. Don't do this, it is equivalent to cutting your fingers down to the first knuckle.

I've had many cats throughout my life, and with a houseful of antique furniture, I've never had a problems with clawing. You will have to experiment to find what your cat likes to claw, be it untreated boards, split logs with the bark on, cardboard orsome corded material. You will have to initially train your cat, and show her where to claw(inticement by rubbing the claw post with catnip is always a good idea), but once she gets the idea it is better than even odds that she will not claw up any furniture.

Did you defang your cockers when they were pups and chewing up everything in sight? No, you trained them to chew only on certain toys. The same idea goes with cats.

[MotorCityMan]

31. Very Good Point

That's a good comparison. There are a few things more fun than a litter of puppies, but can they be destructive!

Thanks all for the responses. I'm glad I asked as this is my first cat. I had no idea how cruel declawing was.

[TEXASYANKEE]

19. Please don't de-claw them.

Declawing should be an action of absolutely last resort. Start out by trimming Lana's nails and giving her a few scratching posts (made of sisal and carpet and cardboard, so she can choose her favorite). My 5 cats have always let me trim their front nails without a problem and they never claw the furniture. Don't put Lana through a horribly painful procedure if you don't need to.

[Zero Gravitas]

20. Don't declaw your kitty

and remember: dogs have owners, cats have staff.

[TrogL]

21. Lost functionality

those claws are there for a reason.

If they get outside, they can't defend themselves except by biting - and catching any blood-born disease the other cat may have.

They can't jump up properly. If they lose their balance, they can't kick in the four-wheel-drive and hence fall, heavily.

[radwriter0555]

22. Only if you agree to let me rip out your toenails and fingernails up to

the first knuckle.

And since she'll leave cat hair everywhere, just skin her alive so she doesn't inconvenience you in THAT manner, ok?

[Logansquare]

25. Motor, you won't be a true cat person til you can write a post like that

Honestly, cat people are some of the most dangerous people you will ever encounter. I have five of the critters (cats, not cat people),so I know of what I speak. Do not, repeat, DO NOT, admit to feeding your cat supermarket canned food, and on the subject of letting your cat out, well...just don't even talk about it. If another cat owner brings it up, just say "what cat? I don't see any cat."

Seriously, I did de-claw one of my cats a while back, and mostly regretted it. She did completely trash a very expensive couch before declawing, and YES fellow cat people, I DID provide ample alternative scratching pads and posts, but she preferred upholstery. However after she came home, it was so clear that she was in a lot of pain, and her paws actually had scars on the tips---I just felt that it was something I wouldn't do to another pet of mine. So now I have five of the adorable little bastards and three of them never claw the furniture, while the other two are still being squirted and having magazines tossed at them on a regular basis.

You need to make up your own mind, but I'd suggest you do wait until at least 6 months, and also try the alternatives first. You may luck out and get one of those cats that isn't interested in your furniture.
Good luck, may you enjoy many years of happy and peaceful feline husbandry-

[MotorCityMan]

33. Obviously some strong feelings regarding this

I had no idea what declawing involved as I have not had a chance to talk to the vet yet.

Reading through these posts has made me reconsider. I really don't want to do that to her.

[MotorCityMan]

35. I appreciate your strong opinion, but DAMN!

I don't need to be threatened with graphic mutilation to get your point (even though it is a valid comparison).

Please excuse my ignorance on the subject. I honestly thought it was a minor procedure. After reading these posts and the declawing websight, I think I'll pass. Will have to go shopping for a scratching post.

And as for cat hair, do you have any idea how much hair show cockers have?

[jukes]

23. You just don't know

what you're considering. :scared:

Declawing is a hideous and barbaric practice. There are reasonable alternatives to amputation. Clipping claw tips is an easy owner-performed maintenance that will protect as well as declawing w/o the suffering. Since you're getting a kitten, she can be trained to accept routine clipping, if you're patient and attentive while training her.

Also, consider a 2nd kitty, unless you still raise dogs that will companion w/your new cat. You'll have a much better adjusted animal if your kitten has an accepting animal-pal. :pals:

[Heddi]

24. Don't declaw

Everyone here has stated the reasons-

It's inhumane and barbaric---cat claws aren't like our fingernails. The claw actually meets with bone, and to truly declaw, the entire first joint of the cat's "finger" has to be removed.

My 2 cats---each about 9 or 10 years old, are fully clawed, and we've had no problems with them destroying anything.

They have plenty of things to play with---and we give them a cardboard box every few weeks/months for them to just go to town on. We only started doing that a few years ago, and only because we saw that they loved to scratch up empty cardboard boxes.

Our furniture is in excellent condition. No scratches on the legs, no torn rugs.

WE do have a sissal rug in the living room that we let them go to town on---again, that and the boxes are the only things they terrorize.

Google Dr's Watson and Smith - they're a pet-supply company and have a catalog specifically for cats.

In there, they have these little Claw...thingies that you adhere to the cat's claws--they're plastic, and blunted, so the cat can't scratch up things. The plastic caps are shed when the cat's claw sheds its outer layer, and then you just put a new one on.

I've got friends who use them and they LOVE them.

Also, keep her claws clipped on a regular basis. If you're too scared to do it, take her to a vet--they'll generally clip claws for about $10. The reasons cats scratch has something to do with the length of their claws---so beat them to the punch and have their claws trimmed regularly.

I've seen pound kitties that were relenquished b/c when they were declawed, they became disabled b/c of the loss of their fingers. They were unable to walk, so the wonderful owners, on top of mutulating their cats permanently, decided they didn't want to deal with a gimpy cat and gave it up for adoption.

ANd on edit:

When you get an animal, you have to be prepared to accept that animal and the things that it does naturally.

Cats have claws, and cats scratch things. Don't alter the cat to fit YOUR life---either accept that the cat will occasionally scratch things and train it appropriately, or don't get the cat at all.

Dogs bite--should we remove their teeth to prevent Junior from getting a flesh wound from the puppy?

Cats have claws and they use them. There are millions of people in this country, and throughout the world, who have fully-clawed kitties and still hav their furniture, drapes, carpet, clothign, etc, in perfect condition.

Train her with a water bottle. When you see her scratch on something she's not supposed to, spray her.

But don't mutilate the cat so that it better fits in with your lifestyle. Change YOUR LIFESTYLE to fit in with the cat. If you're not willing to do that, then perhaps you should return kitty.

[TreasonousBastard]

27. Have some real fun and go to...

alt.cats or any of the other usenet cat froups and ask this question.

Declawing is actually illegal in some other countries-- it's considered to be cruelty to animals. Here, some vets refuse to do it.

Personally, I'm adamantly against it, but I can't say for sure that a few years down the road declawed cats are actually the worse for it if kept strictly indoors.

I wouldn't object to it also being illegal here, though, and consider it an extraordinarily selfish action of the cat owner.

[VermontDem2004]

29. Please don't declaw your cats

Try a scatching post or something. Cutting off a cats claws is like cutting off your fingers and toes.

[geniph]

32. Can I ask you a question, MCMan?

No flames - but can I ask why you think you should get her declawed? Not having owned a cat before, maybe you've just assumed that everyone does that. Also, what about the contract with the cat's breeder - most contracts explicitly prohibit declawing, and there's good reason for that. The main reason I ask is that I've found it completely unnecessary. I've literally never had a cat damage things because they were clawed. I clip everybody's claws every two weeks - they're very used to it. I just don't want to risk my cats being one of the tragic cases. I hope you'll do a bit more reading about it before making a final decision. Obviously, anything's better than sending a cat to the pound, but declawing is SO unnecessary for most cats and most people (also, you might consider that many declawed cats become biters, and cat bites ALWAYS fester - they're perfect little bacteria-injectors).

[MotorCityMan]

34. Sure

"Not having owned a cat before, maybe you've just assumed that everyone does that."

BINGO! I assumed it was a minor procedure that most people with house cats had done. I haven't talked to my vet about it yet. Knowing how many cat lovers are on this board, I figured it would be a good place to ask about. I had planned on reading up on it first as this is my first cat.

Can't see doing that to her, after reading these posts (and the declawing website). She's a kitten yet so I will get her a scratching post and start working with her.

[Heddi]

36. be consistent when you work with her

otherwise her learning process will be very, very difficult.

Keep either a spray bottle or a little squirt gun around the house ALWAYS filled with water and give a quick squirt when she claws, or jumps on the counter, or whatever.

Some websites advocate putting things like black pepper and garlic and other nasty things in the water to make it more 'offensive' to the cats. I've even seen sites that advocated putting BLEACH OR AMMONIA in the water to make it even more offensive---obviously plain water works just fine, and doesn't have the potential to..ahem..KILL your kitty (in the case of ammonia or bleach), or possibly cause eye/mouth/ear irritation (in the case of pepper and other stuff like that)

But you have to spray her EVERY TIME to condition her little brain to equate:

Scratching = Water = Bad

after a while, she'll learn that

Scratching = Bad

and won't do it for fear of the water.

I don't know where you live, but be prepared for the possibility of fleas. Our cats are solely indoor, but a few summers ago they just got INFESTED with fleas. We finally had to have an exterminator come in and fumigate the place because our methods just weren't working.

Good luck with your kitty! When you take her to the vet, ask the vet to show you how to clip her claws so you can do it at home. It takes some getting used to, and you can buy the clippers @ the store for a few bucks. There's also a powder you can get in case you cut into the quick and cause bleeding--just put the powder on the bleeding part and it stops the bleeding.

[geniph]

38. If he's used to clipping dog claws, cat claws are easier

because they're usually translucent, so you can see the vein and avoid it. I find dog claws much harder to clip, plus they're much tougher.

The only thing I've ever added to spray bottle water when training my cats (and only with the cat who is completely, utterly unphased by a squirt of water) is a bit of lemon juice. They don't like the smell, but it won't harm them. Mostly, I just put a REALLY sturdy scratch post, preferably wrapped with sisal, near a window with a nice high ledge for them to sleep on. Cats like to scratch and stretch when they wake, and they'll pick something high enough for them to stretch up and sturdy enough not to wobble when they really get cranking on it. That's why so many go for furniture, because they have little wobbly scratch posts, or ones with unsatisfying coverings. I've yet to see a cat that wouldn't scratch sisal rope.

[geniph]

37. Right on!

Glad to hear it. Give her a chance, buy some decent claw scissors, have the vet show you how to do a trim (sneak up on her when she's sleeping and do it until she gets used to it). You'll probably never have any reason to regret your decision.

FWIW, I don't approve of docking most dogs' tails and ears, either.

[Maine-i-acs]

42. Awesome decision MCM

Your cat will thank you later ... Lana doesn't know how lucky she is to have you!

[Kremer]

39. Please don't do it!

It's really a barbaric procedure for the cat. They go way down and remove the claw from it's roots. Plus it is somewhat pshychologically damaging to the cat. Out here in CA, Longbeach earlier this yr became the 1st city in America to pass a declaw ban on cats in the city. They and others like me feel it is just too brutal of a proces to put an animal through. If you really love your little puss I wouldn't do it!

[neebob]

40. Years ago, when I first got married to Mr. Fastidious

I had my two 5-year-old cats declawed after they shredded some old, sun-dried sheers of Mr. F's on top of roughing up the corner of his couch. One of them got so sick afterward, I nearly lost her, and I could tell it still hurt both of them up to a year later when they jumped down to the floor from a few feet up. Then I learned they actually cut off the ends of their toes with the claws. I would never do it again, even to a kitten, because it's extremely traumatic.

Both of those cats are now gone. I live with six sets of claws, and Mr. Fastidious lives by himself.

If you find you can clip Princess Lana's toenails without having to call the SWAT team, more power to ya. They also have these plastic claw covers you can have the vet apply periodically, but it seems like a giant hassle and I don't see it working on any cat I've ever had. My suggestion is you get a scratching post and a squirt bottle, and give her a shot when she scratches something that's not the post.

[ComerPerro]

41. I just hope you understand one thing:

A dog will samelessly kiss your ass, will fall all over itself to please you.

Your cat...

Well, your cat probably likes you. But it really couldn't give a shit what you do or think.