Nostradomus

[Sugarcoated]

From the website of John Houge, "Rogue" scholar, world authority on Nostradamus and the prophetic traditions of the world, I found these fascinating quatrains:

Vn dubieux ne viendra loing du regne,
La plus grand part le voudra soustenir:
Vn Capitole ne voundra point qu'il regne,
Sa grande change ne pourra maintenir.

A doubtful one will not come far from the realm,
The greater part will want to support him:
A Capitol, will not want him to rule at all,
His great burden he will not be able to maintain.

Nostradamus had a passion for hiding major historical figures behind their nicknames, especially if the nickname draws a wicked pun in old French. He only used the word "dubieux" (dubious or doubtful one) and its variant "dubieuse" once in over 36,000 words of his major prophetic work about the future of the world. The rarity is significant. It brings interpretive pressure to bare on its application to one important person in his future history, rather than using this word generally. An obscure Nostradamus prophecy becomes clear when an interpreter uses the right word as a key that unlocks its secrets. The word "dubieux/dubieuse" unlocks two quatrains (6 Q13 and 6 Q95) revealing a similar theme of two leaders, a father and son, and their checkered destinies. Are these the father--former President George Herbert Walker Bush (1988-1992)--and his son, George W. Bush?

This leader, at least from Nostradamus' point of view is a doubtful and dubious one. That means he is someone that bears the burden of illegitimacy in the seat of power. He could be one untrained and unprepared for the job thrust to him by means or the fate of being born the scion of either a royal or political dynasty. He is a "doubtful" man expected to follow his father to the seat of power who is less equipped emotionally and intellectually for the job. It is someone who could have great visions without a grasp of reality to see them fulfilled...

Now to the second Nostradamus quatrain using the word "doubtful" as a link. I believe it continues the vision of 6 Q13. The quatrain is the 95th entry from the same Century or "Volume" of Nostradamus' prophetic work: Century 6 Quatrain 95. Many times the prophet continued his account of a vision in a second quatrain placed somewhere out of sequence in the same volume. This prophecy may continue the tale, shining more light on exactly what makes a second term of a Bush presidency such an unmaintainable "burden" that the Congress in "the Capitol" do not want him to rule. The prophecy reads:

Par detracteur calumnié à puis nay.
Quand istront faicts enormes & martiaux:
La moindre part dubieuse à l'aisnay,
Et tost au regne seront faicts partiaux.

By the detractor calumny (lodged) against the younger born.
When enormous and warlike deeds will go on:
The least part doubtful for the elder one,
And soon in the kingdom there will be patrician deeds.

"patrician" could mean the obvious, but it could also mean "Patrick"? As in Fitzgerald?

For a more:
http://www.hogueprophecy.com

[Flabbergasted]

1. Interesting

The web site is amazing.

[muriel_volestrangler]

3. 'incredible' and 'unbelievable' are the adjectives that spring to my mind

[lavenderdiva]

2. 2 lines in particular interest me:

From the first quatrain: "His great burden he will not be able to maintain."
I am wondering if this means Shrub will either be impeached or resign before 2008.

From the second quatrain: "The least part doubtful for the elder one,
And soon in the kingdom there will be patrician deeds."

I am sorry to say that I don't understand what this means. I do believe that when Nostradamus refers to the 'elder one', he means Daddy Bush. But I don't understand what 'The least part doubtful...' means. Now, I did look up 'patrician' at dictionary.com, and this is what it says:


4 entries found for patrician.
pa·tri·cian Audio pronunciation of "patrician" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (p-trshn)
n.

1. A person of refined upbringing, manners, and tastes.
2. A member of an aristocracy; an aristocrat.
3. A member of one of the noble families of the ancient Roman Republic, which before the third century B.C. had exclusive rights to the Senate and the magistracies.
4. Used as a title for members of a class of honorary nobility appointed by the Byzantine emperors.
5. A member of the hereditary ruling class in the medieval free cities of Italy and Germany.


'patrician deeds', still don't fully understand. Can you, or anyone explain please?

[HockeyMom]

4. Patrician Deeds

as in, tax cuts for the mega rich, oil companies getting richer, elimination of the Middle Class, New World Order, etc, etc.????

Then there is Tecumseh's Curse. Some say this was broken with Reagan, but it can be argued that his Alzheimer's was a brain "death".

Is it possible that Bush might suffer a political "death" instead? We can only hope.

[grumpy old fart]

5. Blue Turban....

As I recall, (don't have the time right now to look it up) WWIII or worse is to begin because of a guy with a Blue Turban. I've kept my out out for such a figure in the ME ever since.

[woodsprite]

6. Maybe they mean someone with a loyalty to Saudi Arabia

who instead wears a blue shirt ;) King of the Mongols (Rev. Moon - I keep trying to fit him in somewhere). That crowning of the "Peace King" in our Gov't building and his criminal ties to the Repubs REALLY gets me ticked.

[Sugarcoated]

7. The mongols thing is from another quatrain

Could that mean China? The Mongols would be ruling China in Nostradamus' time. And just a weird coincidence (or not) Bush is the only president to ever visit Mongolia.

[hippiechick]

8. Ok, I just can't resist ...

Think phonetically, say it out loud ...

"Vn dubieux"
=

[trotsky]

9. Complete and utter bunk.

Nostradumbass was no more of a seer than I am. His defenders take obscure quatrains and s---t---r---e---t---c---h them to absurd lengths to try and fit them to things that have already happened. Hindsight 20/20, anyone?

Once - just once - I would like to see someone make a prediction based on a quatrain BEFOREHAND and see it come true. A detailed prediction that turns out uncannily accurate.

[Sugarcoated]

10. Lol

I'm sorry if this discussion bothers some of you - feel free to ignore the thread, and your mind hermetically sealed. Mine's open, thankyou verra much.

[trotsky]

11. Yeah, it bothers me that people believe this crap.

Why don't you take up the challenge? Heck, if you do, we can present it as proof of supernatural ability and claim the Randi prize of one million dollars!

Just think of all the liberal causes we could help with all that money. Wouldn't that be great?

[Sugarcoated]

12. Nah

I don't care what he or anyone else believes is true or not. I'm not trying to prove anything to anybody. Just want to discuss the subject with like minded people.

[trotsky]

13. But surely you agree that money could be used for a noble purpose?

If you really believe in the power of these "prophecies," this would be a really easy way to win it and do a lot of good.

Also, keep in mind that this forum is not restricted to "like-minded people." Anyone, even those who might disagree (gasp!) with you, is welcome to discuss issues. If you don't want to hear from anyone who disagrees, you might be better off posting to one of the groups.

[Sugarcoated]

14. So how bout them Bengals

[grumpy old fart]

15. Yeah, how 'bout them Bengals...lol....

Steeler fan here, sorry....

[Sugarcoated]

16. LOL, I'm from Philly

So I guess I should be happy about that. I know my husband probably was.

[Orrex]

19. Skepticism =/= closemindedness

Instead, skepticism describes the withholding of one's conclusion about a phenomenon until adequate data can be gathered to formulate that conclusion, or until the utter lack of supporting evidence suggests that the phenomenon is not as described.

It just so happens that, in the case of NOstradamus, there has to date been no (that is, NO) evidence in support of the claim that his magical quatrains contain any rely information about the future.

I'm sorry if that fact bothers some of you - feel free to ignore reality, and keep your mind credulous and uncritical. Mine is inclined to reason and analysis, thanyou verra much.

[grumpy old fart]

20. I don't think anyone believes this stuff....we're just having fun, no?

At least I hope so.

:donut:

[Orrex]

21. Oh.

I mean, Nostradamus predicted that you'd say that:

A vociferous disbeliever
Proclaiming once more his skepticism
Will be duly admonished
By a guy with a coffee-and-donut sig-graphic

Spooky, when you think about it...

Doh!

[grumpy old fart]

22. lol....n/t

[LostinVA]

26. Oh no.... lots of people believe this stuff

[datasuspect]

33. having an open mind is one thing

but sometimes it can be so open that your brain falls out.

[Emperor_Norton_II]

17. I have a question:

Why is this in the Religion forum?

Seriously. Michel de Nostradame was a nominally religious man for his time and place, and a handful of the quatrains appear to discuss the Antichrist, but as far as religious content to the "prophecies" goes, that's it. There's no good reason to open up a discussion of Nostradamus here. Why not take it to the Lounge, or if you want to try and connect a quatrain to Bush, GD or GDP?

Seriously man, wtf?

[grumpy old fart]

18. Well, this is the superstition forum, no? Now, back to blue turbans....

Out of the country of Greater Arabia
Shall be born a strong master of Mohammed...
He will enter Europe wearing a blue turban.
He will be the terror of mankind.
Never more horror.

In the year 1999 and seven months
From the sky will come the great King of Terror.
He will bring back to life the King of the Mongols;
Before and after war reigns.

I always thought Bin Laden should have donned a blue turban. But I guess he's too "religious" for that ruse. Maybe this new madman president of Iran? Given that he'll shortly have nukes and all....

[Sugarcoated]

23. osaMABUSh

[Sugarcoated]

24. LOL

Petty, petty people. Even here at the DU.

[Richardo]

25. Let's go back to that 'Hister' one

:boring:

[Sugarcoated]

27. The Hister quatrain is amazing

[asthmaticeog]

30. Yeah, but all his stuff started to suck after he signed with a major.

[ghostsofgiants]

36. Did you ever check out his sideproject?

He was playing around with some different styles. Kind of experimental, "healing" and whatnot. Not as good as his indie stuff, but far better than his mainstream stuff.

[ProfessorGAC]

29. WAKE UP!!!!!

I didn't want you to be only one who was bored into slumber. Now wake up and be bored, consciously, like the rest of us.
The Professor

[xmas74]

28. Don't really believe any of them

but I always was more interested in Malachy.

[CanuckAmok]

31. If he was so smart, how come he's dead?

Answer that one, egghead.

[Sugarcoated]

32. He did prophecy not immortality

D-uh fartface :D

[northzax]

35. ahh, but since it seems likely

that at some point in the future, someone will find a way to slow the aging process to a minimum, doesn't it seem likely that el all-seeing one would have taken advantage of it to make a killing in the futures market?

or maybe he wasn't that smart?

[SixStrings]

34. I keep thinking about Penn Juliettes's quote...

"So say it's true. OK, Nostradamus DID see into the future and DID have knowledge beforehand. Having that knowledge and withholding it or codifying it makes him the ultimate evil. To have the knowledge and ability to prevent these calamities, and do nothing - makes him the anti-christ and the most evil person who has ever lived"

The quote is not exactly as above - I just heard him say it while channel surfing one night, but it did stick in my head.

I agree with Penn.

[ghostsofgiants]

37. That was a good episode...

Sometimes I love Bullshit and sometimes I hate it. That episode, I love.

[Midlodemocrat]

38. I always found it interesting the way the quatrains were

used to 'prove' something. Like in WWII, Hitler used them to declare German superiority.

I find it highly entertaining to read.