Explain Rap to me

[johnnie]

Not that I hate it or anything, I just don't understand the premise.

I am asking because I just saw a performance and it is like the other 1,432,989 other performances I have seen. It all really sounds the same to me. I have a heard a few that I dug, but the most part of it sounds like all the other ones.

It reminds me of the "beat" stuff from the 50s but with a drum beat. That's cool and if that is what it is all about than I guess I do get it. What does rap mean to you?

[jpgray]

1. If you're really into words, their sounds and rhythms

A good rapper can make you very happy. Like a good poet can. It's rare, but 75+% of all produced art in any genre is kind of garbage-y. :D And the beats and bass-lines can be cool, and they can have pop-like hooks in them--there's a lot of potential in the genre.

[The Blue Knight]

4. I've been a fan of rap since I can remember

It started off as sorta an anti-authoritarian thing for me. But, I started listening to Eminem, and theres a lot of stuff he raps about that I can relate to. (And I'll stand by my support for Eminem, despite what people think of him around here, although it appears he's fallen off since he dropped The Eminem Show).

I like the flow of rap, the beats, and the originality behind it. I don't listen to that lame, corporate rap shit you see on MTV or BET. Download some Immortal Technique, and you'll see what I mean.

[johnnie]

6. The earliest rap I have heard

Is Eric Burdon from about 1967-68. It is a song called "Year of the Guru"

My leader told me to jump in the river
The river was deep and the weather was winter
After a sailer very kindly saved me
My leader told me, you'd better take it easy
I took it so easy my leader called me lazy

Through the lack of red meat
Everything was getting hazy
Friends looked at me and said,
Man, you gotta be crazy

Oh, oh leader

My leader said son you'd better get yourself together
never mind the fools who know what we're getting into
But a forty mile walk would do us both a world of good
and he sat down and watched me take off down the road

Well, I walked so far my feet began to bleed
If this was good for me I just couldn't see it
A motorist picked me up and said
Look man, you must be crazy

Oh, oh leader
Oh, oh leader

My leader came to see me in a hospital bed
Well at least I really knew that my leader really cared
After giving me a second-hand roach
He said where's your donation man,
It's all for a good cause.

He left me all alone to work the riddle out
But I just couldn't make it so I began to shout
They stuck a hypodermic deep down into me
Said, look out nurse I think we got a loony

Oh, oh leader
Okay baby follow me now
Follow your leader
All right

Now here I sit in a state-run asylum
Limitless, friendless but much more together
I decided to do some good book readin'
About the art of people leadin'

Now I'm the leader and they're being led
What's the matter if they're crazy till you hear what I've said
Being the leader is really where its at
But just how long can a good thing last

Oh, oh leader
Oh, oh leader

Now listen to this baby
This is the year of the guru
Now the thing to do is to ask yourself
What can a guru do for me?
Then you say to yourself
I gotta get a guru

[Heidi]

7. I fell in love with Eric Burdon's voice when I was about 8 years old

and my mom was playing an Animals album. Now I know the next CD I'll buy. Thanks, johnnie! :thumbsup:

[johnnie]

9. I got to meet him back in 83 or so

They did an Animals reunion and I had to go. After the show I hung around and got to chat with him for a while. A great guy and one of the best in music history.

[Heidi]

10. The Animals' version of "House of the Rising Sun"

when I was eight years old gave my mother plenty of 'splainin to do. :evilgrin: I soooooooo envy you, johnnie. :thumbsup:

[jpgray]

11. I hope you gave him five across the eyes for "Winds of Change"

x(

That's really fucking cool that you got to meet him. :thumbsup:

[johnnie]

14. He was one of my heroes back then

I also ended up in the Cleveland Plain Dealer. The rock writer for the paper knew me and asked me some questions about meeting Burdon and I just yapped with her. A few weeks later my friend called me up and said "Johnnie..you're in the paper"...LOL. Oh, the memories. I think I have that article around somewhere. Back then I made it to the papers once in a while.

Dig this...one day I was hanging down in the flats (a Cleveland place) and I heard some harp being blown from one of the places. I went in and it was Paul Butterfield! It was the end of the show and I waited around and went back to where they were. I knocked on the door and he asked me to come on back. I ended up sitting around with him for about 2 hours talking blues, music and drinkin beers with him. What a gas. He died about 6 months later.

[jpgray]

17. That sounds great!

I haven't chatted with too many famous musical figures. Leo Kottke and Sharon Isbin are two recent examples. (I much preferred Kottke. Isbin had all kinds of ideas for how I could record a warmer tone with $4,000+ worth of equipment--also her head is weirdly shaped. :D)

[johnnie]

19. LOL

Well, I don't go out of my way to talk with anyone like that. I just happen to be places sometimes. I've had chances to hang with a lot more "famous" people, but I don't give a shit about doing that. The ones I have met have just been victims of circumstance.

[Hissyspit]

15. Bob Dylan's "Subterranean Homesick Blues" shows

the connection between the blues and rap, with funk coming in the interim. This is all an overgeneralization, of course, but mostly valid.

[johnnie]

18. I see that

Man...could you imagine telling people that the rappers ripped off Dylan?...LOL

[EstimatedProphet]

23. Actually, to an extent so does Johnny Cash

"I Been Everywhere", "25 Minutes To Go", "One Piece At A Time" all have a similar kind of rhythm to them.

[johnnie]

5. Like I said

There are a few raps that I dig, but so much of it seems pretty blah.

[jpgray]

8. Well, obviously I can't convince you of a genre's goodness

But if there are a few you like there are probably hundreds of other tracks of similar or better quality in the same vein. Probably less commercially available even than good rock music these days.

[Karenina]

34. My first rap tune

Ray Charles "Greenback Dollar Bill"
just a little piece of paper,
coated with chlorophyll...

[leftofthedial]

26. pop-like hooks

because often they have sampled and cannibalized actual music to give their performance some element of listenability in between the misogyny, vulgarity, incomprehensibly inarticulate bad "poetry," and crotch grabbing.

you do have a point about "75%+." In rap, it's 95%+. Once in awhile, one of them says something that matters, but it is so rare and so beside the point that usually no one notices.

[CanuckAmok]

2. Well, in order to keep food fresh...

This plastic film is used to wrap the food up, thereby protecting it from drying-out, etc.

[jpgray]

3. Explain the existence of that post to me

x(

[Starbucks Anarchist]

12. It's good stuff.

I'm not talking about the bling bling crap or most of the stuff you hear on the radio.

I'm talking about the stuff you generally don't hear that's more intelligent and better-produced. There are many great and legitimate rap artists who don't get the exposure they deserve.

[johnnie]

20. Give me names

I'm up for anything. Seriously, I would like to hear the finer parts of the art.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

21. Sure:

Blackalicious, Mos Def, Talib Kweli, Common, Jurassic 5, The Roots, for starters. Those are artists with a medium level of success that haven't broken through to the mainstream yet, but are still accessible.

There's more underground stuff which is less accessible, but I'd try the ones I mentioned.

[johnnie]

22. Thanks

:hi: I'll look into them.

[ghostsofgiants]

25. The ones Starbucks mentioned are excellent...

I'd also recommend Sweatshop Union (try "The Thing About It"), Atmosphere(try "Always Coming Back Home To You"), Sage Francis(try "Makeshift Patriot"), Deltron 3030(try "Memory Loss"), Hieroglyphics(try "You Never Knew"), K-os(try "Superstarr Part Zero"). A bunch more, but with the stuff SA recommended, you should have plenty to get started on.

[Omphaloskepsis]

13. Well, rappers suck live..

I've seen Ice-T, Ice Cube, Eminem, Dr. Dre, Slick Rick, Cypress Hill, ect... live.

Rappers suck live. But, I do love the music. For me it is more like telling a story. Most rock is repetition..

For example: Propagandhi -- A punk rock band, They lack repetition and the chorus. (sorry about the ?, mysql burp)

Die Jugend marschiert mit frohem Gesang
bei Sonnenschein und Regen;
die Jugend marschiert mit sieghaftem Drang
dem gro�en Ziel entgegen.
Wir st�rmen die Welt, geh'n fest unser'n Schritt
wer jung ist der f�gt sich freilich mit,
die Jugend marschiert, kein Pfad ist zu steil,
dem Siege entgegen zu eil'n.
Sieg Heil!

"Welcome to the offices of Economic and Manpower Analyses here at our historic and sprawling West Point Academy campus! My name is Mindy! It is my distinct pleasure to introduce you to a loving father of three (and a champion of the sanctioned use of armed force in pursuit of policy objectives). Ladies and gentlemen, put your hands together for the project director of our newest recruitment strategy; our mission to staff future combat systems through current technologies. Without any further ado, I give to you Colonel Casey Wardynski!"

"Thank you! Let me begin with some sentimental appeals to our national myths; assorted clich�s coined by the state; the ideological shorthand meant to sweep your private doubts of this virtual training course. This portal; this Trojan Horse that you living idiots paid for and actually rolled into your own kids� rooms."

"Oops, did I just say that out loud? Oh, well, it�s not like it�s something new. It�s just the logical extension of the decades of bilge water that you�ve let us pump into your homes. The pink noise that hums away in the background while you run the gauntlet we force on you everyday. The billowing candy floss that helps to soften the blow. Deep down you�ve always known that your children already belong to us, so why don�t you cut the outraged parent routine, shut your mouth and get back in your seat. Your children already belong to us. What are you? You will pass on. And they won�t know a fucking thing but this 'community,' this real life Ender�s Game. Forget what you think you know."


It tells a story.. Zero repetition .

Then we have this:

There's a hatchet got a knife
When I awoke there was nothing real in this life
But dreams are so intoxicating, (intoxicating)
When you're doing this alone
Gun, rope, brick on the way
But words have no meaning when its you that says
I really do care, no baby I, I really do care!

Innocence gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?
In a sense gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?

Once a skeptic, now the critic
And you think that you finally found a place of your own.
Amongst the cold and timid souls
Where only failure knows your name

Look around for the closest to blame
But look no further than the hands beneath your arms
and now your 6 feet down, buried with, with your passing fame
And fame fame fame fame.

Innocence gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?
In a sense gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?

Oh oh oh you lie
Tell me something more than what you've tried to hide
If you can't find your self, then how can I expect to find you.
Oh oh oh you cry
Tell me something more than what you tried
The greatest tragedy is not your death
But a life without reason, that your life had no purpose
(Life has no purpose!)

Innocence gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?
In a sense gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?

Innocence gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?



That is repetitive crap..

My point is rap usually tells a story.. And I like that.. --I'm drunk--Go easy on me--

[johnnie]

16. That second one sounds cool

"Innocence gone, never take friendship personal
If you can't hold yourself together
Why should I hold you now?"

You don't like that?

I like the words. Who is that one by?

Like I said, I dig the poetry of it, but I don't understand the beats. Maybe they just need the beat to deliver their words, but it sounds rather blah to me then. They need to learn how to make it interesting.

[ghostsofgiants]

24. It's by a band named Anberlin, it's not hip-hop

http://www.purevolume.com/anberlin

[RandomKoolzip]

27. Go to the iTunes Music Store and download the song "Lazy Muthafucka" by

The Coup. I'd lost interest in hiphop for a long time until I heard this song in 2002. It's one of my all-time favorite songs (of any genre) and it's based around a sample of "Going Down" by Freddie King. Incredible stuff: political, angry, humorous and blessed with a sense of righteousness and a an echo of the blues that had all but disappeard from hiphop with Public Enemy's demise. It actually reminds me of when I used to see speeches from H. Rap Brown and Huey Newton as a kid.

After that, proceed to Aesop Rock (the Bob Dylan of hiphop....seriously, this guy could cut just about any modern poet and he chooses to be a rapper), El-P, Vast Aire, New Kingdom....

[ghostsofgiants]

31. Aesop Rock and El-P are both brilliant

[RandomKoolzip]

32. Damn skippy.

"Stepfather Factory" is a masterpiece.

I forgot to mention Mr. Lif, cLOUDEAD, and Anticon.....where's mark414 when you need him?

[ghostsofgiants]

33. Shit yeah.

Mark dropped into the lounge a couple weeks ago. He doesn't have internet access at the moment, though I forget exactly what he said.

[radwriter0555]

28. It's modern poetry.... Sometimes I like it, most times I don't.. but SNOOP

ROCKS.

Yeah, I said it. I'm 45 years old and I think Snoop Dog rocks OUT. He manages to put in some real total 70's vibes into the stuff he's been working on and writing... and it's so smooth and cool.

And he coaches his kid's basketball team.

I get it. He's freaky, he's a horny perv... but I love his music.

[johnnie]

29. Snoops isn't too bad I guess.

I liked some of L.L. Cool J's stuff at one time too.

[samplegirl]

30. Well I tell you its like this

Johnnie dawg
its just a little more advanced than banana fanna
fo with a lot more yo

[johnnie]

37. LOL

That's a good explanation.

[Deja Q]

35. Old school rap is much better.

Pre Hammer-Backlash (HB) of the late-80s thru early 90s; Gangsta Rap came about during the H.B. and that stuff is nasty.

There's a freshness to it; multi-layered use of sounds and rhythms. The use of the record player is probably, by and far, its best since that of its original purpose, and original 'old school' rap (Queen Latifah, Public Enemy, et al, were more into mentioning social injustice and awareness. Even Hammer had when he wasn't bleating about how great he was, but that wasn't very often... )

[johnnie]

36. One good thing about it

It keeps turntables in production for those of us who have crates of vinyl still. :)

[khashka]

38. Good rap is

about rhythm and words. The way they fit together. And using that to express a thought, idea, feeling, experience.

There's a lot of bad rap, but that's true of any musical genre.

Just my opinion.

Khash.

[democracyindanger]

39. It's the hip hop

hibby-to-the-hibbity-hip-hip-hop
ya don't stop
rockin' to the bang bang boogie
said up jump the boogie
to the rhythm of the boogity beat.

That's the best explanation I can think of.

[China_cat]

40. The 'c' in rap is silent.

[William Bloode]

41. I like a lot of Rap.

I came in on the old school wagon though. Todays, and to a large extent much of the old is not so great. But there are some serious artists like Public Enemy, Dr Dre(awsome beats), and the Beastie Boys, Tribe Called Quest.

One to try if you have never hear it is Paul's Boutique by the Beastie Boys. Very smooth mellow groove type tracks, just layered with all kinds of interesting stuff. It's like every time you listen to it you hear something new. One of the best Rap records every.