I'm an Evangelical Christian, hit me with your questions....

[Red State Rebel]

Background - raised Baptist, converted to Catholic in my early 20's then began attending this church in late 80's.

The Church I attend has over 2,000 members and is part of a larger ministry. Christian churces can be very different but I will happily answer genuine questions that you may have about the faith.

There are a LOT of misconceptions out there.

[Maestro]

1. Do you interpret the Bible literally?

-nt

[Red State Rebel]

2. I would have to say as closely as possible considering

there are so many different ways to interpret so many parts of the scripture. The New Testament moreso as it is the "fulfillment" of the Old Testament. I would never consider that I know everything that God meant in the Bible. I am only a human and fallible so I believe in doing the best I can and feel that God knows that.

[Maestro]

8. Well I don't.

As you say, nobody can attempt to try to really know exactly what God meant. Add the fact that that it was written by humans, and therefore fallible, we have to assume that we must look at the Bible as a close attempt to understand God, however it is not and never will be an exact interpretation of His word. Humans, by nature, will screw that up. Those that interpret the Bible literally pick and choose what fits their own belief system; not God's. I am not that arrogant. I simply try to live the best life possible trying to do good to all who deserve it.

[Red State Rebel]

45. I'm curious

How do you decide who deserves your goodness?

I think that is the differentiation we have. I believe that "all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God" therefore we are all equal in deserving love and goodness and forgiveness.

[AuntiBush]

142. Yous say "you're only human,"

As all of us are, so what part don't you understand with respects to all of the "humans" that wrote the bible, and created politically influenced religions?

I know this, but just cusious to know if you do or not since you proclaim knowledge... "Do you know "who" and "why" the Gospels of James, Mary and Thomas were left out of the Bible?

[Pharaoh]

149. the point is

that while the bible was inspired by God, it was interpreted and writen by men in the fallen state and is very skewed on certain points.....................

[agates]

3. How do you define evangelical?

The term is becoming more and more a synonym for fundamentalist. Are they the same thing?

[Red State Rebel]

5. The way I interpret it is

that we believe in the Bible as the inspired word of God and try to live according to it's teachings.

There are some who are more "radical" about that than others. I try to use common sense along with the teachings.

[GreenPartyVoter]

48. Evangelical, to me, is about witnessing to others. Not all evangelicals

are literalists when it comes to the Bible, and not all Christians are evangelicals. :)

[Seabiscuit]

80. "witnessing" = proselytizing, in my book.

e.g.: when 7th Day Adventists knock at my door and try to convert me to their beliefs they see it as "witnessing" (when they say "we're 7th Day Adventists" I tell them "Well, I'm not. Thanks anyway. Goodbye").

I see it as "proselytizing".

I find it offensive when anyone holding any religious beliefs attempts to "convert" me - because transactionally, they look at me as inferior to themselves and in need of "saving". I don't need no friggin' saving, thank you very much. IOW, they're trying to shove their notions down my throat.

[realisticphish]

129. i've had the same things done to me

by atheists :shrug:

not that that excuses the actions of either

[stray cat]

144. Absolutely true.

I don't like listening to any radical (atheist, religious, political) insist on convincing me of their great wisdom and superiority and my ignorance. However, it is a common attitude in political and secular circles. Consequently, I distrust thoughtless dedication and emotionalism in any form.

[GreenPartyVoter]

145. That's bad witnessing. Me, I consider my website to be a form of

witnessing. I've laid out some thoughts and ideas there, and when it is relevant to a subject being discussed, I refer people to it. That's it. Doing anything more than that is intrusive, in my opinion

[Red State Rebel]

166. Different people and faiths have different ways

I personally couldn't do the door to door, or public confrontational witnessing. It's just not me. That being said, I am still, as a Christian told to be a witness for my faith. The way that I feel works for me is in Matthew 5-16 "Let your light shine before men that they may see your good deeds and thus praise your father in heaven."

I do volunteer work, I try to be an "encourager" to people, try to remember to smile more at strangers, run my business in an ethical way, etc. Walk the walk. I'm not always successful, I have good days and bad like everyone else and days I fail miserably, but by the grace of God I get up the next day and try again.

I can't help but feel that when people see you living your life in such a way, when they see you at peace in life and happy, able to stand strong in the midst of tragedy, they are more apt to be curious about what makes you that way and you then have the opportunity to share.

[Arugula Latte]

4. Do you believe evolution is how life forms attained their characteristics?

[Red State Rebel]

10. Let me try to explain this without it sounding like a copout..

I believe in Genesis. I believe that God created the heavens and the earth. I believe that God created man in his own image as he said he did so no, I don't believe in human evolution in that we were amoebas, and evolved. Can living creatures evolve? I suppose so, but I believe that in the beginning they were created by God in whatever form they began in.

[Maestro]

So when was the Earth created?

Billions or thousands of years ago?

[Red State Rebel]

39. Don't know, I wasn't there.

[megatherium]

14. There's a nice book on creationism, evolution and science,

written by evangelical authors with various views: Science and Christianity: Four Views, edited by Richard F. Carlson, Intervarsity Press, Downers Grove IL, 2000.

[Maestro]

15. Thanks

[fujiyama]

91. Do you therefore believe

there is an inherant conflict between Biblical teachings and scientific research and theory?

[Red State Rebel]

116. In some areas, yes

I think that the truth lies not in one or the other "strict interpretation", but a combination of the two. Just my opinion.

[thecorster]

141. Isn't it possible that both Darwin and Genisis could be right?

Supposing that "days" and "nights" could have been millions of years in the beginning, you can account for fossil records and carbon dating, but you can also explain why the Bible says plants appeared on one day, animals on another, man on another.

It's a little subjective, but this is how I deal with Creation vs Evolution. God could certainly have placed amoebas on the planet and fostered their growth over billions of years if it was his will. Just because it says "we are formed in his likeness" doesn't mean he looks like us.

[Red State Rebel]

158. See my answer #116 above.

[lumpy]

164. If God created us in his image

then God help us all.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

6. Do you believe that a person who leads an exemplary life

doing nothing but good and helping others but who is not a Christian (e.g., Gandhi or the Dalai Lama) will nevertheless go to Hell?

[Red State Rebel]

18. I believe in God and Jesus Christ

but as a Christian I am also told not to judge others so I don't think I could say that. God loves us all and wants us to know him and his love. Thats a very private thing and I honestly believe that there are people who relate to God in different ways and on different levels.

Who he chooses to be with him in heaven and in what way is something I couldn't begin to fathom.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

22. A fair answer. IMO, there are many paths to the same destination.

But once I got into a really bizarre argument with a hard-core born-again fundamentalist who insisted Mother Theresa would fry in Hell because she was a Catholic, and therefore not a "real" Christian. I thought he was nuts.

[autorank]

120. Red State Rebel...this answer, if it were adopted by the more

puablic evangelical figures would make all the difference in the world. I've been turned off by fervent Christianity all my life due to the statement that, failure to accept Jesus Christ as your personal savior will result in a life of eternal damnation. I think there is a real dilemma between redemption through good workd (which I believe in and which includes all people) and redemption through accepting Jesus as your etc. etc. I think your truly humble view of redemption and acceptance of good works would just about take care of every thing.

[Kire]

30. Gandhi was a Christian

and a Muslim, and a Hindu and a Buddhist. Didn't you see the movie?

[Jamastiene]

49. There is an older book

about Gandhi called "Gandhi, His Life And Message For The World" by Louis Fischer from New American Library that I would recommend to anyone who is a fan of Gandhi or just curious. I found my copy in my aunt's collection and she said I could have it. I thought I had lost it in the move, long story, but it turns out I managed to save it. I'm glad. I really enjoyed that book. Today's progressive leaders could learn from those stories of what happened in India and what Gandhi really thought about the idea of a Pakistan...

[Mnemosyne]

7. Whom do you believe wrote the bible, men, God or

men inspired by God?

Do you believe that men are fallible and could thus have mistakenly miswritten God's intentions when writing the bible? Do you believe that it is possible that they could have intentionally written their own desires into the bible?

Do you believe that the bible has been over-translated and thus been edited by human hands with less than honorable intent?

Thank you much Red State Rebel.

[Red State Rebel]

21. I believe it was written by Men not inspired by God, but as his vessels.

So no, I don't think that the Bible was written with personal agendas added in. I believe in the infinite power of God to see to it that his word is written as he wanted it.

I don't believe there is one word in there that he didn't intend to be there. As far as modern interpretations I believe what I read is what is meant to be there. If it's not, woe be to the ones that bastardized it.

[Mnemosyne]

66. What about the stoning of women that have been raped?

I'd also like to ask your churches views on suicide and hell. I have had several folks of evangelical beliefs insist that all suicides will go to hell. Do you believe this? If so, why?

Thank you Red.

[Red State Rebel]

90. Hmmm...

Our church is taught on the foundation of the New Testament, not on old laws of the Old Testament.

Suicide is the sad end to a troubled mind. I look on anyone who is that troubled with compassion and I've never heard our pastor refer to someone who committed suicide as condemned to hell.

[Mnemosyne]

101. I'm so glad to hear that Red.

God could not possibly punish someone for being in such horrible, relentless pain that they are driven to end their lives to stop the pain. When I have heard the same people tell me "God is love", I want to throw up.

Thank you for spreading true compassion. This has been a brave post Red, I admire you for doing it.

[Red State Rebel]

113. Thanks!

I wasn't quite sure what I would get when I started this, but it has been very interesting and educational. Instead of a flamefest, we all had a wonderful civil conversation.

[farmbo]

133. Good point...New Testament vs Old Testament Christians

Those of us who follow the teachings of Jesus as articulated in the Sermon on the Mount, are being forced off the public stage by the Old Testament Christians--Dodson, Falwell and Robertson-- who have fixated their teachings on a reading of select Old testament passages which very conveniently advocate fire and brimstone against gays, abortion, women's rights and shell fish consumption.

Its time to wrestle the pulpit back, for the sake of true Christianity, and for our country.

[darkstar]

9. With respect

RSR. I don't know you but you've asked the question with an open heart and hope you understand that my question comes from the same place.

It has to do with the seeming paradox of seeing families in Heaven. Does your faith hold this to be true?

If so, and I see my Mom when I die, isn't she with her Mom as well? And her Mom with her Mom, etc.?

And what about my wife? She'll be with me and my kids, and my mom, and so on back into time. But she'll also be w/ her mom and dad, and their parents and so on. And my kids will be w/ their eventual families, etc.

In other words, it seems like the idea of being with your family in Heaven eventually recedes all the way back in time and, horizontally, if you will, across the planet to include lots of folks.

Or does your faith teach that each nuclear family will be intact and not worry about this? That's OK if it does, b/c it's an article of faith. I understand that.

Peace and good will.

[Red State Rebel]

24. My faith does not teach that

I think there is some vague reference to "seeing people in heaven" but I feel there is a LOT we will not understand until we are there. As the scripture says "now we see through a glass darkly" our perceptions of things while we are humans I'm sure are very different from what they will be then.

[darkstar]

28. Sincere thanks

I've been to so many family funerals where the preacher spoke of and Mamie is with her mother and her beloved son Robert" sort of thing that I was confused.

Again, I appreciate it. Especially your "through a glass darlkly" comment.

Take care. :hi:

[Maestro]

11. Don't you think that

the similarities between creation stories between Islam and Judaism and Christianity are proof that either we all believe in the same God or that these are just legends passed down from generation to generation? And why in the heck are there two different versions of the creation in Genesis and for that matter why are there two different Noah stories? And Noah's story certainly sounds like the Mesopatamian story of Gilgamesh. Why is that?

[Red State Rebel]

25. I honestly don't know

I wouldn't be suprised at all if it is all the same God in these faiths. As far as different interpretations of these stories in these different faiths I am not a Bible scholar so I couldn't tell you.

[Radical Activist]

12. Have there been any sermons or Sunday School lessons about

other religions? Like overviews and "warnings" about Mormons or Hindus for example.

[Red State Rebel]

26. NO

I have never heard our Pastor demean another faith. If you truly try to live by the scripture then not being judgemental is imperative. In our church, we have been taught about forgiveness and love and more about what we can do to be better Christians, not what everyone else is doing wrong and why we should hate them.

[Maestro]

13. bump

I want answers. :kick:

[jus_the_facts]

16. As an evangelical christian what are your thoughts on this quote....

...from our forefather Thomas Jefferson about religion?


And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerve in the brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors.

-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

[Red State Rebel]

29. It's confusing to read

who is he referring to as "this most venerated reformer of human errors"? Is he not saying that he hopes that the artificial scaffolding is classifing Jesus, God and the virgin birth as a fable?

Don't know much about the Gospel of Thomas Jefferson :)

[Zhade]

60. Pretty sure he was saying Jesus was the reformer.

He just didn't buy into the supernatural bits (I tend to agree with Jefferson, but then I'm not even certain Jesus actually existed).

[jus_the_facts]

68. Jeffersons Gospel.....

....draw your own conclusions....everybody does...regardless of what I choose to assume to know in the mind of Jefferson or what he meant in his comments to Adams...you'll believe what you want too anyway...how could I even begin to believe to know the mind of a supernatural being whose existance has never been proved to exist...sigh...

http://www.angelfire.com/co/JeffersonBible/

[loveable liberal]

123. check out my jefferson quote from his bibliography at the ...

bottom of my text...

[GreenPartyVoter]

17. Have you ever visited the Christian page of my site? :^)

[Maestro]

19. I have now.

Thanks.

[Red State Rebel]

54. Nice site!

Lots of good references!!

[GreenPartyVoter]

55. Thanks. I felt called to help the religious left get better known on the

'net, and hopefully off the 'net too. :)

[Kathy in Cambridge]

20. That's brave of you to post this, knowing you're opening yourself

up to criticism.

[Red State Rebel]

61. I'm hoping to strike down some of the misconceptions

That is the main reason there is animosity. If people really stopped to understand what most Christians REALLY believe it would be a lot more peaceful. It's easy to pick out the radicals that get themselves on TV and scream at them, but most of us are not like that.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

78. I agree-and you're handling this flawlessly

:-)

[Red State Rebel]

109. Thanks! :)

[Jack Rabbit]

23. Ms. Rebel . . .

What do you believe the Democratic Party should offer to people like yourself in order to make inroads into the GOP's grip on evangelical Christians?

[Red State Rebel]

33. First and foremost tolerance of the difference in beliefs

There are a LOT of different churches with a lot of different beliefs. If Democrats approach Evangelical Christians with the attitude of these are our beliefs and yours are wrong, it will never get anywhere.

There has to be a way to communicate with Christians on a level of what is best for the country as opposed to writing everyone off based on personal beliefs that we have. You can be a Christian and hold a belief different from the Church. The difference is whether you lead your life according to the teachings and your beliefs in a way that is obnoxious and in everyones face or not.

[Jack Rabbit]

34. That is a very good answer. Thank you.

!!

[MollyStark]

27. What church do you go to now?

What is "this church"?

[Red State Rebel]

35. My church

http://www.slfc.org/home/home.html?pa=1

[ikojo]

137. This is the guy who advertises on Channel 5 news!

Thought of another question....with a membership of 2000 people, how does your church go about creating community? It's the size of a small town. Is your pastor accessible should you have a problem and need to talk to him?

Is there a discrepancy in how well the pastor lives versus the living standards of the members of your church?

L Ron Hubbard said that the easiest way to get rich in the US is to create a new religion and he did.

[Red State Rebel]

151. There are a lot of fellowship groups within the church

Lots of activities to involve family, etc. You can be as active and involved as you wish. Jeff is very approachable - any time I've needed to talk to him or ask him something, I've never had a problem doing it.

As you have seen by the commercials, he is a very straightforward, plain talking person and has a great sense of humor - it makes his teachings very fun and interesting.

[AmBlue]

143. What denomination is your church?

I'd be very interested to know because I'm a recovering Presbyterian and since the election haven't been able to find a church that I could feel comfortable in.

I'm also curious if the majority of your church family shares your liberal views and knows of yours? I have simply reached the point that I cannot share pews with people that I know are oblivious to the realities in this country and are directly responsible by blindly going along with the Fallwall/Dobson opinion of life in America.

[Red State Rebel]

167. It is non-denominational

I can understand your frustration. It's impossible to find a church that believes everything exactly the way you do. This place is as close as I've found and I think most of the people are pretty much in the same place with their beliefs. When I run into someone who has a different view, I just smile and nod and avoid them. Church is the best place for sinners and hypocrites!

[Kathy in Cambridge]

31. How old is the earth? Only thousands or billions of years old?

[Red State Rebel]

36. It doesn't say specifically in the Bible

Personally, I think it could easily be billions of years old.

[Kathy in Cambridge]

41. Thank you!

:-)

[rug]

32. Why did you leave the Catholic Church?

[Red State Rebel]

38. This is just ME personally now...

I think being raised in the Baptist Church I was used to the different type of worship and sense of family within the local church. I didn't feel that as much in the Catholic Church and I missed it. It probably would have been different if I had been raised in that faith but I was the only one in my family who had converted. I drifted away and didn't go anywhere for a while then ended up trying this place and really related to the way they worshiped God and related to the Bible.

[BeFree]

37. They say:

All you have to do is hear the word, accept Jesus as your savior and you are saved. Well....

I guess all the Indians living back in the forest for the last 2000 years who never even heard of Jesus, are doomed?

Don't get me wrong...I think Jesus must have been a pretty cool dude.

[Red State Rebel]

40. The God that I know - as a loving God

would not condemn people for not doing something they knew nothing about. I think that God knows the heart of every man and they will be judged accordingly.

[BeFree]

47. So. it's not true

That you must accept Jesus before you are saved? Then why do they preach that all over town?

Also:

Describe in the most simple terms: God

Is it: Creator of all that is?

[Red State Rebel]

73. You were talking about people who either lived before Jesus

or were never told about him. I don't know, but I find it hard to believe God would condemn people for that.

Thats completely different from knowing and refusing.

[BeFree]

74. Good dancing....

I never have gotten a good answer to that question.

If you find it hard to believe, then why not just come out and say it?

Something like:
"Some of the crap that gets evangelized is man-made BS."

[Red State Rebel]

81. The scripture says

that now "we see through a glass darkly". We don't know or understand everything God does or knows and we aren't meant to right now. The time will come when we do.

[BeFree]

84. But

By condemming people to hell for not believing is kinda wrong, eh? Methinks the worst sin is judging people, especially, since, as you say, we don't know what's up with God.

[Red State Rebel]

86. If you read

my posts, you would see I am very much against judging people.

God, however, is the final judge. What he bases his judgements on his not something I would pretend to know or understand.

[Zhade]

64. Joseph Smith used that dilemma when he made up Mormonism.

Pretty clever - if you're going to fabricate a cult, answering that question you posed in a reassuring way has a lot of pull.

I know - Mormons got me with it. Thankfully, I learned the truth about Smith and Mormonism as a whole, and I'm thrilled to be ex-Mormon. I still contend that the South Park episode about Smith is the swiftest debunking out there.

I know that probably offends LDS DUers. Hate to say it, but he was a fraud and the proof is out there.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

42. Does your church sell a lot of "GZUS" bracelets?

Y'all did that, not me. http://www.slfc.org/events/happening.html?pa=1

Just my humble opinion, but marketing and religion have always seemed like oil and water to me. Slick websites, billboards, purchased TV time and the like... Does God need pitchmen?

[Red State Rebel]

50. What is referred to as "The Great Commission"

Matthew 28:18-20 (New International Version)

18Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

Now, as times have changed, the way people evangelize has changed too. Some may agree, some may not, but the intent is the same and that is to spread the word of the gospel as Christians are commanded to by Jesus himself.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

57. Your quote from the bible frightens me.

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you."

Some nut jobs might take that as license for (another) crusade feeling that they are just following the "word."

So you believe it's okay fo Madison Avenue to peddle God... Why not an Army with guns to "spread the word of the gospel as Christians are commanded to by Jesus himself."

It's this kind of talk that frightens a lot of people.

[Red State Rebel]

65. Not if you take it in the context of the love and gentleness of Jesus

If you pick out one sentence, it's easily misconstrued, but if you look at the entire New Testament and understand WHO Jesus Crist is and what he stands for, it is simple to understand what he means.

There are radicals in EVERY religion but that is more a testament to their mentally unbalanced minds than the actual tenets of their faith.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

69. I'll go with you on that, but all it takes is one or two radicals...

And most congregations are filled with many easily led people...

The results have been the same throughout history.

You get a leader who changes the focus from love to power/bringing others to the fold and you have a problem.

IMHO, today's "evangelical/fundamentalist" explosion is flexing it's muscles and about to become very dangerous.

[beam me up scottie]

43. Do you literally believe

the story about Noah and his arc?

[Red State Rebel]

82. Yes

I do. How is it possible? I don't know, I do know that I believe in God and if God wanted to do this, he could.

[beam me up scottie]

89. Thanks Rebel!

nt

[kodi]

110. so, if God wanted "to do" Evolution, He could, could He not?

i do not even expect an answer. but i will state in uncategoric terms that anyone who professes a faith ought to know much more about their holy texts than the mere words that appear it.

one need not be a biblical scholar to know whence it arose and how, and more important, know how to separate the wheat from the chaff in it.

[Red State Rebel]

119. I agree with what you say

I believe it to be a combinatin of the two perhaps.

Thank you for your assessment of my biblical knowledge. I never claimed to be a biblical scholar or a theologian, just a Christian willing to answer questions.

[KittyWampus]

44. Personal Query: Can You Imagine God, Not As A Person

or individual Being, but as an omnipresent Energy or Capacity for Intelligence?

[Red State Rebel]

53. I see him as both

To me, he is omnipresent but but also a real individual being in some form. The scriptures say over and over how he cares for each of us, "his eye is on the sparrow", etc. I guess it's a personal thing.

[Jamastiene]

46. Is it true that someone can sell their soul?

Most modern day satanists say no, but the church I grew up in and many people I know say yes, but won't say how. If it's true, then how?

Also, why is sex seen as evil?

[Red State Rebel]

59. No, and sex is not seen as evil in our church

What I believe is that up until death, you can turn to God. There is no arbitrary way to permanently fix your soul one way or the other while you are alive.

Sex in marriage is not seen as evil. It is seen as a reward for marriage. Do I think if you have premarital sex you are going to hell? No, but I think it is better if you don't. That is speaking as a mature woman and a Christian.

I think the only time I've seen sex referred to in a bad way is when the result was hurtful to someone as in adultry, addiction to pornography, etc.

[BR_Parkway]

127. And homosexulality?

[sakabatou]

51. What do you think about the notion of trying to convert people

In Judaism, it is against the law to go out Pproselytize... so what do you think about it?

[ikojo]

138. I don't mean the threadjack but too many people have the mistaken

notion that proselytizing was not done in Judaism. Where do people think Jesus and the desciples learned to preselytize? Judaism was very much an evangelical religion until the Romans adopted Christianity and began killing Jews for the "crime" of Judaizing. Well, after several years or decades of Jews being killed for preaching their faith, the rabbis felt it was best not to proselytize anymore.

[Taverner]

52. Do you believe in drinking alchohol?

And more specifically, do you beleive the wine drunk in the bible was alchoholic wine, or weaker wine or grape juice?

[Red State Rebel]

56. I believe that anything in excess is bad

Drinking isn't bad unless it becomes destructive in some way. I may not drink, but I eat to much. Who is to say that my overeating isn't as bad as drinking?

I believe when the Bible said they were drinking wine, they meant wine.

[Zhade]

58. I'm bisexual and have had gay sex. Do you consider me a sinner?

How do you feel about the fact that "virgin" was a mistranslation in regards to Mary?

How did you feel when you learned that Jesus' alleged divinity wasn't decided until hundreds of years after he died?

What do you think about the Apocrypha and Nag Hammadi scrolls?

[Red State Rebel]

70. It is not for me to judge who is a sinner

I am commanded by Jesus Christ NOT to judge others and that is something I work very hard at. Personally? I have several gay friends. I'm leaving Wednesday to visit with several of them over the weekend. I've shared motel rooms with gay friends as the only female and my husbands just says "oh ok, have a good time".

I certainly don't want everyone examining everything I've done in my life and judging it and I try to afford the same courtesy to others.

I don't know enough Bible history to answer your other questions. Looks like I have some studying to do!

[Zhade]

72. Good answer!

Much better than the time a certain DUer stated that yes, I am in fact a sinner for being bisexual.

I didn't even MENTION the sex part then, either. I was a "sinner" for BEING bi.

I like your answer much better. :D

[Rabrrrrrr]

62. Why say "Evangelical Christian"? All Christians are evangelical.

It's always seemed to be like saying "Jesus-following Christian" or "Sacramental Christian" or "Christ-centered Christian" or some other redundant thing.

I realize it's because there's more emphasis on the evangel part of Christianity in the Evangelical church than, say, in other denominations, but it's still always struck me as odd.

And it's not just you - the history of "Evangelical" churches goes way back, incl. the German Evangelical Church which came to America and joined with the German Reformed Church (another somewhat redundant phrase, since any non-Catholic church is technically "reformed") and then eventually the United Church of Christ, which is the church I am a part of, the name of which is also kinda odd, since it sort of (though not intentionally) implies that all other churches are NOT united, but that we ARE. Which, in truth other churches aren't - if they were united, there would be only one denomination - but then we actually aren't, either. In truth, we should call ourselves the "The Four Mostly-United Denominations of Christ".

[Zhade]

67. It also implies that other churches are not "of Christ".

From the outside, it looks like the hubris of claiming a church is THE church. But then, that's been going on forever.

[Red State Rebel]

75. To be honest, that is a name that has been given by others

I don't think our Church calls itself that, it is just the name that a lot of people have used to describe bible believing Christian churches that don't belong to any specific denomination.

It certainly isn't meant to be exclusive of any other faiths.

[JVS]

63. Do you believe in "Decision Theology" or "Predestination"?

If Predestination, would that be of the single (weak) variety or the double (strong) variety?

[Red State Rebel]

115. Sorry I'm late! Oy vey! Make me do homework!!

My take on the situation....I don't believe in Predestination in that God dictates the outcome of every situation before it happens. I believe in Free Will - man is free to make decisions that effect his life, but God does have a hand in things. "He gives his angels charge over you to keep you"

If you want something more in depth, I'm gonna have to study the technicalities again and get back with you :)

[gmoney]

71. If everything happens according to God's Divine Plan...

why do people bother praying?

I guess for the same reason Americans bother to vote? We want to somehow feel we make a difference when it's all been predetermined?

[Red State Rebel]

77. Well.....

The Bible tells us to "pray one for another without ceasing". I don't think everything is predestined because we have free will.

[Dees]

156. Would you give a little more insight into

the meaning of "it's God's plan" please. Many Christians fundamentalists often claim that an individual's arrival at a certain apex of life was a part of "God's plan". An unknowing deviation from God's plan I presume is what brings on the bad, evil and misfortune in an individual's life.

[Red State Rebel]

165. My understanding is this...

I think God's plan is basically that he would want us to live according to the example of his son's time here on Earth - according to the Scriptures. That being that, he also gave us free will. He will not force us to obey him. The teaching I have always been given is that God wants good for us. I do NOT believe that God punishes people for doing bad things. The decisions we make in life can bring us unhappiness - if we make decisions for our lives that are irresponsible, we suffer the consequences of that. As far as the "random" problems and bad things that we deal with in life- as much as I believe that there is a force for good in this world, I also believe there is a force for evil. I believe that bad things visited upon us are the works of that force of evil.

[beam me up scottie]

76. Am I the only one who didn't get an answer?

nt

[Red State Rebel]

83. Sorry! I missed it!!

Got it now...

[beam me up scottie]

87. Thanks!

I have rejection issues, sorry.
:-)

[JVS]

106. no

[beam me up scottie]

107. Jeez.

Mine was dumbing down the conversation compared to yours.
Way to make me feel inadequate.
:evilgrin:

[Duncan Grant]

79. Leviticus 18:22 - Misconceptions about GLBT people.

At your invitation and with respect, I must ask you about the human and spiritual rights of Gay people. Personally, I consider it contradictory that some followers selectively adhere to one passage in Leviticus to condemn GLBT people while ignoring other informative passages just as 'relevant'.

One of my favorite starting points on this topic is the "Dr. Laura" letter (link below). I ask this with sincerity and respect: Are gay people welcomed and loved at your church - as they are - or must they change to heterosexuality to gain entry and acceptance?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/drlaura.asp

edit: Post 58 wasn't there when I started this - would still appreciate your thoughts. In light of today's events, I'm multi-tasking tonight. :hi:

[Red State Rebel]

85. Yes, Gay People are Welcome and Loved at our Chruch

You cannot truly love God and Jesus and their teachings of love and forgiveness for all mankind and turn around and condemn someone for what you believe is a sin. I couldn't be a part of any church that did that.

[Duncan Grant]

112. It's a progressive church that accepts GLBT people as they are -

not as the church wishes them to be.

Perhaps there will be a reconciliation with organized Christianity for the GLBT people who want it. I'd be happy to see that come to pass. :thumbsup:

[Red State Rebel]

117. You and me both! n/t

[Maestro]

92. Here are some of my thoughts (taken from a post made in GD)

I have been on a spiritual journey for quite some time. My life is one big doubt about most questions of faith. About the only thing I can say with certainty is that a man name Yahweh or Jesus lived some 2,000 years ago. Beyond that I am still trying to figure out what happened. As such I have become in my spare time a weekend biblical researcher looking at events and ideas from a strictly academic almost scientific point of view.

Even though some scripture does indeed condemn homosexuality, the gospels will always have the prejudices and biases of the writers plus the question of proper translation but I am digressing. The Bible has many instances of same sex relationships, David and Jonathan, Ruth and Naomi even Jesus and his disciples. These relationships were not sexual, but they indeed are strong, intimate relationships so the question is does God condone any relationship marked by faithfulness and commitment while devoid of promiscuity or self-gratification as the only reason for being in the relationship? Looking at the Bible in its entirety; especially looking at the teachings of Jesus, I would have to say yes. God loves all heterosexual or homosexual. Churches that choose to "correct" homosexual behavior are ignoring the fact that two loving people made in the image of God have a loving, thoughtful, monogamous relationship. There is nothing wrong with that. So if you ask me, freepers and other ultra right wing fundies that try to change this are saying that God made a mistake. So their work is in fact blasphemous from my cold academic point of view.

[Red State Rebel]

97. I understand exactly what you are saying

My only comment would be that your spiritual journey will be complete when you understand that you will never find the answers in the academic or scientific aspect of religion. Whatever religion you choose, you will only be fulfilled when you take that big leap off of the cliff called Faith.

[Maestro]

102. I think I heard those exact words from my mom.

:)

[Duncan Grant]

114. I'm interested in the early origins of Christianity myself.

There's so much to say about this, isn't there? I experience 'fundamentalism' in all its forms, as the antithesis of religious principle and/or spirituality.

I appreciate your thoughts on this very much. We probably differ on the importance of promiscuity and monogamy as elements of a sacred relationship but on the crucial matters, we are absolutely aligned. :hi:

edit: word choice

[Maestro]

132. Hey, alright

Glad to know that. I have just worked with far too many gay people who for the most part have been some of the nicest people I have ever met. Right now I count two gay individuals as being some of my closest friends. I can't see how God, if there is one, would reject these people.

[Neshanic]

88. Have you accepted Christ as your personal saviour?

If yes, then according to the RULES of Evangelical/Born Again Christians, you must believe in the Bible as complete truth, New and Old Testament. You can't be mushy like thos Lutherans or Methodists.

There is no such thing as an Evangelical Christian that "Cafeteria beliefs" the bible.

As Far as "I can't judge" answers....a bet your preacher gives some good guidance on that.

[Red State Rebel]

94. Sorry, but there are no official "RULES"

and, our preacher, as a matter of fact, will be the first person to tell you to mind your own business and not judge people.

The only "rules" we follow are those we read in the Bible - Love one another, don't judge each other, take of each other.

I'm sorry if that disappoints you, but we don't thrive on hate and condemnation.

[Neshanic]

96. Please answer the original question. Is Jesus your personal saviour?

Then we can get down to the finer points.

[Neshanic]

99. Still waiting for that answer.

[Red State Rebel]

100. Yes, he is

[Neshanic]

104. Ok. Now you know that your belief in the Bible must be total.

That is the RULE. Ask any Born Again.

So how do you square that with the Lord?

[Red State Rebel]

108. Why are you trying to bait me?

I have explained very clearly in numerous posts on here how I feel and what I believe.

I started this thread as a way for people who had misconceptions about Christianity to ask questions. A nice, non threatening forum to explain things from my point of view and what I have been taught.

If for some reason you doubt my beliefs, I'm sorry you came away with that interpretation, but I am what I am.

[Neshanic]

111. It's all very nice what you believe, another what is preached to you.

What misconceptions would people have about Christianity?

You mean misconceptions about Fundamentalism/Evangelicals.

You by your own rules. The Bible. You cannot have Jesus as a personal saviour unless you have had a "Born Again" experience.

That "Born Again" experience comes with strings attached. The belief in the Bible as complete truth.

Ask your Preacher.

[cally]

139. Wow. So must of the Christians you know

are not Christians? I'm a Christian. I have definitely not had a born again experience. My church teaches me that born again cults disrespect the baptismal sacrament.

I also was TAUGHT that the Bible was not to be taken literally. It was a path to understanding.

I have asked my preacher many times. Studied. I wouldn't join a faith where there were stings attached. My faith is my own...

NO STRINGS ATTACHED!!
Redstaterebel has made me respect her more than most Christians. She is brave and able to explain her beliefs.

[tjdee]

150. What is this "born again cult"?

I'm a Christian too, and I don't know that I personally am "born again", I'm pretty sure it's a matter of saying "spiritually a 'new person' since I became a Christian". Which seems to make sense, as if you're a Christian you're obviously doing 'new' things that a non-Christian would (i.e., praying to God/Jesus, reading the New Testament, etc.)

I'm not sure how it's a psycho sect... am I wrong in what a "born again" is?

[Neshanic]

160. Look here

http://www.angelfire.com/pa/greywlf/why.html

[GOPBasher]

146. Neshanic, what you're saying is completely untrue.

One can very well accept Jesus Christ as his/her savior without believing every single thing in the bible.

[tjdee]

148. That *is not* the rule.

You are mistaken. Asking any born again, as you say, means nothing. Someone's relationship is between he/she and God. And Jesus doesn't ever say "Once you believe in me, you have to believe every single word of the New Testament which doesn't even exist yet."

As a matter of fact, he says he is there to bring a new convenant, which actually could be construed as negating the entire Old Testament on its face.

"The law and the prophets were until John : since that time
the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.
Luke 16:16"

"this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. (Matthew 26:28)"

[Neshanic]

159. Do you know any "Born Agains?"

If you did, and knew them well, they would tell you that all organized religion is wrong.Of course this would happen as they are trying to convert you.

The interpretation of the Bible verses is lost on them.

Accepting Christ as your personal saviour means you believe the whole Bible as truth.

Of course you can have a personal relationship with Christ in your Church, but again, the largest group growing in the US is "BA" Christians. They believe that all other religions are wrong and they are right.

"Bible as our sole authority: 2 Timothy 3:15

Since God’s Word is the only completely reliable and truthful authority, we accept the Bible as our manual for living. Our first question when faced with a decision is “What does the Bible say?” We practice daily Bible reading, Bible study, and Bible memorization. The Bible is the basis for all we believe."

Radiant Church feature in NYT last Sunday magazine section.

[tjdee]

162. What's wrong with that?

I do know a few "born agains" quite well (they don't call themselves that) who do believe every single word of the bible. I'm just not convinced that it is required of all evangelicals/fundamentalists (one day we should really differentiate between them).

What's wrong with the Bible being the sole basis of belief? That doesn't necessarily mean you believe every single item in the bible. I realize that's kind of "what does "is" mean" defense...I just see a difference between saying "this book contains all the principles of my faith" and "you have to believe and agree with every single sentence in this book". I know some fundies who eat shrimp, for example. It really does all depend on an individual church and an individual person--seems to me you're trying to tell the OP he/she's not really what he/she thinks he/she is?

I'm not a "born again" or a "fundamentalist" or even an "evangelical" (terms I think which are interchangeable here, which may not be necessarily the case)--but I would say that the Bible is the basis of what I believe. Particularly because I'm not a Catholic (popular subject around here lately, LOL), which would dictate that I believe various papal things, church teachings, etc.

However, that does not prevent me from interpreting the Bible as I see fit, and of course it does not supercede what I perceive my relationship to God to be.

Is that the difference between me and a "born again" as you understand it?

[ButterflyBlood]

93. do you believe in evolution? n/t

n/t

[Red State Rebel]

95. See reply #10 :)

[erinlough]

98. This is something I have been asking my church going friends

During this election did your pastor or people in the church give advice on who to vote for? If not directly did they cherry pick issues that you should have in mind when you voted or suggest a philosophy you should adhere to when voting? Also, has your church recently built a big addition for community based programs and if so do you know where the funding came from?

thanks ahead of time

[Red State Rebel]

103. No, he sticks pretty much with straightforward teaching

I've never heard him get involved in politics. No, no new building either.

[erinlough]

105. sounds like a good pastor! congrats n/t

[stopbush]

118. How do you explain the similarities in the life stories of Horus (Osiris)

and Yeshua (Jesus), and the fact the the Egyptian god's mythos pre-dated the Xtian version by thousands of years? A few things they share in common:

born of a virgin named Mary (Meri); birth announced by angels; witnesses to the birth were shepherds; baptized at age 30 in a river with their baptizer later beheaded; tempted by Satan on a high mountain and resisted tempation; had 12 disciples; raised a person from the dead; was crucified with two thieves; was buried in a tomb; descended into hell and resurrected in 3 days (Horus) or 38 hours (Jesus); will reign for 1,000 years; called "the annointed one" KRST or Christ; was also called "The good shepherd, the lamb of God, the bread of life, the son of man, the Word, the fisher, the winnower"; Zodiac sign was Pisces.

And do you disagree with St Paul who preached a never-physically incarnate Christ?

[K8-EEE]

121. Raised Catholic, Last Election Cured Me Of Religion.

45 years of going to church and it suddenly hit me, this is BULLSHIT!!! SO sick of religion being weilded politically SO sick of "bible" being used as "proof" for prejudices and stupidity, I feel so free of it all.

I used to think, oh good for you when somebody talked about being so into their faith but I have to be honest -- I think it's all the biggest con in the history of the world. Bible, Koran, whatever, it's all just a con and people like to be taken by the "immortality" etc.

I'm so through with it.

[Name removed]

122. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Merope215]

125. Wow, that was a rude response

to someone who posted in good faith with the intent of opening a dialogue. Classy move.

[VOX]

131. Now that's a thoughtful, caring post.

Very uncool.

[loveable liberal]

124. why havent we heard from moderate christians like yourself....

condemning the whack job christians? It seems to me that these people are out of control especially concerning politics. If you want examples I can provide them. I was confirmed methodist but have given up my faith in a biblical god. I look at god as a parent, and any parent that would send his/her child to burn forever is a piece of crap, regardless of what the child has done. I guess my question to you is, have you counseled radical christians or have you kept your silence?

[Red State Rebel]

154. I've tried to explain this before...

To follow the teachings of Jesus means to try to be like him. Loving, forgiving and non-judgemental. For me to rant and rail against ministers I disagree with means I would be going against those teachings. I am very satisfied knowing that God's judgement awaits those who would bastardize his word for their own gain, whether it is financial or fame.

[More Than A Feeling]

126. Why did you convert to Catholicism?

I am a (American) Baptist myself, and I am curious as to what made you decide to change.

[Red State Rebel]

155. I married a Catholic

I hadn't been attending the Baptist church regularly so I started going with his family. His family was encouraging it because they wanted our children to be raised Catholic.

[More Than A Feeling]

161. oh, ok

Just wondering if it was something about the Catholic Church that made you want to be Catholic more than Baptist. That's cool.

[Swamp Rat]

128. Great post!

If you do any missionary work, I hope it is with right wing Christians who have been sucked into Falwell's nefarious vacuum cleaner.

:thumbsup:

[GeorgeGist]

130. Which do you have more faith in...

Your soul or your religion?

[ArchTeryx]

135. Outstanding post!

(Whoops! Misposted here)

[Red State Rebel]

157. My faith is in my personal relationship with God

Period.

[ikojo]

134. I have two questions....

1.What is the difference between an EVANGELICAL Christian and a FUNDAMENTALIST Christian?



2. Does your church preach that there is no sin that is worse than another sin (i.e. murder and stealing are the same, they are both sins) and that a murderer (say a mass murdering dictator) will go to heaven as long as said mass murdering dictator said the Believer's prayer (http://www.webspawner.com/users/skycoke2/) and accepted Jesus into his little Nazi heart?



OK another question,

3. Does your church preach the Prosperity Gospel (http://www.hyperfaith.bun.com/prosgosp.htm)


I think that's it right now.

[Red State Rebel]

153. First off, NO on the prosperity stuff

There is one local church that of I know that does that - the pastor used to have a 1/2 hour radio ministry and any time he came on I was really offended by that message.

I have always been taught that all sin is equal, the same way that Gods love and forgiveness are equal to all regardless of who they are. Only God can judge how sincere a persons plea for forgiveness is.

I think those names mean different things to different people. Some consider them interchangeable, some don't.

[ArchTeryx]

136. Outstanding post!

And a very gutty one.

You strike me as being what I believe is the majority, the 'moderate Christian'. One that has as close to an internally consistent worldview as a human being can.

For myself, I'm an agnostic, but what really, really bothered me wasn't the tenets of Christianity or many of it's moderate followers. It was the rank hypocrisy of the modern day 'Pharisees' that see Christianity simply as a vessel to hold money and power for themselves. Most (but not all) Christian politicians and pretty much every televangelist I've ever seen fall into this trap.

I'm glad...really glad...someone with a more moderate bent had the courage to speak out. When the moderates are silent, the fanatics fill the gap and run free, ruining it for everybody.

[noamnety]

140. Do you think it would make a difference if

we had a weekly acitivist group that printed out an article on a current issue of morals, and put them in the mailboxes of local pastors? Would they stop and read them? Would they question their church's stances and priorities?

For example, if one week, they got a copy of this article:

http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/040105Rockwell/040105rockwell.html

would they read it and understand the moral implications, and pass it on to their congregations in a meaningful way?

[Red State Rebel]

152. I can't speak for pastors, but

Our pastor is intent on NOT bringing politics of any kind into the church. St. Louis city area is heavily democratic, but the county is becoming more and more republican. With such a mix, I don't think any pastor would want to risk alienating someone from their faith over a political matter.

[CelticWinter]

147. Red State Rebel, Thank you for your post.

I found it refreshing to see someone who isnt the "hell, fire, and brimstone" side of the Christain faith. Unfortunately when I was raised it was by those who teach to be judgemental, hate those who dont believe as we do and so on. Thank God, I dont go to such places anymore, but as a child growing up that is what we were taught. At the age of 17, I had the "preacher man" of the church tell me that I was going to hell for the questions I asked on God, forgiveness, compassion, etc. This experience has made me extremely gun-shy of any organized religion. I do believe in God, but I feel that I dont have to belong to a church to have a loving relationship with him.
Thank you once again for your refreshing post :-)
~~Celtic

[bufffbison]

163. unaffiliated

im unaffiliated from all religions. i do believe there is a God (as the bible percieves), as well as Jesus. I just believe religion distorts the message of God's word and doesn't recognize what Jesus sacrificed on the cross. And I also believe everyone goes to heaven, no matter what sins they commit.