The Shroud of Turin is a Fraud

[Quixote1818]

Just watched a show about the Shroud and they wrapped a cloth around this guys painted face and when the towel was unwrapped the image looked NOTHING like a face. Because a head is sphere or egg shaped the ears were way off to the side of the cloth and the cheeks were huge! The image of this guys face was so distorted it looked nothing like a human face. Their is no way the image would look just like a face if the cloth was wrapped around it. Anyone who believes it to be authentic should try this experiment.

[RebelOne]

1. The Shroud of Turin was proven to be a fraud

many years ago.

[tg]

15. Wasn't that when carbon dating failed the Shroud of Turin test?

[Quixote1818]

23. Yes, but their are still many idiots who say the carbon dating was flawed

If you do a search of the Shroud it's amazing how many sites still promote it as real and say the science behind the carbon dating was flawed. They will try 100 experiments to prove it's real and 99 of them will say it's false and then one will say it's real and they will go by that one lone test that gave them the results they wanted.

[northzax]

2. um, what part of 'miracle' are you not getting?

it's Jesus, I don't think the laws of physics apply.

[sniffa]

3. and there's an apparition in my Lunch

[sui generis]

6. oh no not another virgin mary cheese sammich

I wonder if Elvis has ever appeared on a fried peanut butter nanner sammich?

[sniffa]

9. actuaLLy

it appeared in my Lunch after it Left my body.

[sui generis]

12. holy shit!

(it was a dirty job but someone had to say it)

[Squatch]

4. LOL. Good point.

[Quixote1818]

8. That is intellectual anarchy

If something goes against the laws of Nature and we can't evaluate it by human reason then you can make ANYTHING true without scientific observation. Based on science their is NO WAY it's real but if you want to throw the laws of science out the door then fine but without the ability to evaluate something with human reason then anything goes regardless of the cold hard facts. So why bother even trying to determine if it's chemically real and has real blood if you are going to throw out the laws of how shapes work? You can't have it BOTH ways.

[DS1]

13. Quixote1818 broke his sarcasmatron

Anyone got a spare? ;-)

[Quixote1818]

18. Their are plenty of people on DU who actually believe the shroud is real.

That post could be taken both ways.

[northzax]

21. BELIEVE is your key word

if you belief the shroud of turin is the burial shroud of the son of God, then no amount of science based on the inability of pieces to fit together will convince you otherwise.

[northzax]

20. well, based on science

there is no way that anything associated with Jesus is real, right? I mean obviously he didn't turn water into wine and feed the masses with loaves and fishes, or heal the sick or raise Lazarus from the dead, or any of that.

so given the fact that Jesus was, at best, a decently quotable iternerant preacher, then the Shroud of Turin doesn't mean anything anyway.

you can't have it both ways. it is either important because Jesus was important which acknowledges Jesus, or a 2000 year old cloth, because Jesus wasn't anybody special.

which do you want? you can't have it both ways either.

and by the way, I have a spare capacitator for your sarcasmometer if you need one.

[DS1]

11. and besides, perhaps his face was swollen from his passionate beating

:shrug:

[northzax]

22. damnit Mel- go back to Malibu.

[redqueen]

5. No! Follow the gourd!

:eyes:

Silly monkeys.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Quixote1818]

14. Who said this was news? Most people believe it's real so why not educate

them?

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Quixote1818]

24. Yes, and then Pat Robertson would crucify him again nt

[WeRQ4U]

19. Meh..

Those who "beleive" take this as a miracle in the first place. They are not, in the slighest bit, interested in your scientific theories. So you're disproving something, via science, that has already been slated as divinity. What's the point? Those you will be able to convince probably aren't the ones with deep religious beliefs in its authenticity and therefore didn't believe in it anyway.

Sure, you've proven a point, but only to those who could care less.

EDIT: And I'm not just being an asshole, I'm just trying to think how a religious nut-job who doesn't believe in the dinosaurs would think.

[Quixote1818]

25. I am not so sure about that

I told my friend, a Principal at a Catholic School about the experiment and he was quite taken buy it. He had always been torn on if he believed it was real or not but that was enough to put him on the doubting side. Their are many people who are not Zealots who are open to new information on things like this. A lot of Catholics are more free thinking than you know. In fact I would say most people are reasonable and willing to hear facts.

On Edit: But you are right that someone like Pat Robertson would not be fazed and as one person said "If Jesus came down in person and said he never touched the thing" They would still believe it to be authentic.

[DS1]

10. Not if it were burned in by a flash of phased heavenly light

when The Son of Our Lord was reborn from above :-)

[AllegroRondo]

16. There was a show on Discovery recently

that looked at ways the shroud could have been made.

theory 1 - pressing made with wet linen against a heated bas-relief sculpture, which were very common on tombs in the middle ages.


theory 2 - very primitive photography. They used photoreactive chemicals that were known at the time of Da Vinci, and an early form of camera called a 'camera obscura', basically a tiny hole in a wall of a dark room. They were able to reproduce a shroud almost identical to the Turin shroud, even the 'negative effect' (you see much more detail in a photo negative of the shroud than on the actual shroud itself). This also explains why the front and back images on the shroud are different sizes (they were different exposures), and why the head is the wrong size for the body (a separate exposure, with more detail)

[trotsky]

26. You've definitely got the right screen name for this quest.

The believer can ALWAYS reach into his or her bag 'o' tricks and pull out the "it's a miracle!" one-size-fits-all answer.

Sometimes I think Jesus H. Christ himself (if he was real) could appear to some folks and tell them "No, this is NOT my burial shroud" and they'd call him a liar.