Teen Arrested For Sexual Assault After Giving Ex-Girlfriend A Wedgie

[matcom]

<snip>

Muskego - A 16-year-old Muskego student accused of giving a "wedgie" to his former girlfriend at school is facing juvenile charges of fourth-degree sexual assault.

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The girl, 15, told authorities that the boy pushed her up against a locker, put his hand down the back of her pants and pulled her thong up above the waistline of her pants, the police report released Wednesday says. The boy also touched the girl's buttocks, the report says.

She told him to stop at least three times and said that the incident was both painful and embarrassing, the report says.

After the assault, according to the report, the boy said, "Now I got some action."

The boy told police that since he had dated the girl in the past, he thought it was OK to do what he did.

Assistant Superintendent Robert Rammer said that the offense did not warrant expulsion but that the student was suspended for five days.

"It's unfortunate," Rammer said. "It was an isolated incident. It was immediately dealt with."

http://www.jsonline.com/news/wauk/oct04/264538.asp

[shoelace414]

1. no.. say this isn't so..

She told him to stop at least three times and said that the incident was both painful and embarrassing, the report says.

[miss_kitty]

2. no...Say THIS isn't so

The boy told police that since he had dated the girl in the past, he thought it was OK to do what he did.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

3. Makes you wonder what his home life is like....

His dad must be a real stand up guy. :eyes:
Duckie

[Bunny]

5. That's the key phrase.

Future Rapists of America candidate? Sheesh. :eyes:

[baldguy]

10. Future President of the Young Republicans

[TheMightyFavog]

37. Yeah, he's from Muskego.

Rethuglican central.

[arwalden]

4. Will He Be Labeled As A Sex Offender For The Rest Of His Life?

[patcox2]

6. Well, the consensus is that would be warranted.

I mean, if we can fairly conclude his father is a jerk and that he is a future rapist, of course we would want to brand him for life for a stupid incident during a confusing immature time in life (I guess some people thought adolescence was a cakewalk and therefore have no sympathy). Maybe we should literally brand him, with a red hot iron, a brand on the forehead, "future rapist?"

We should probably jail the principal and brand him too as an apologist for a future rapist, seems to me he was insuffciently punitive, don't you think?

[Bunny]

7. So, because he used to date her, no doesn't really mean no?

She told him no THREE times, but because he used to date her it was okay? Most people master the meaning of no by the age of 2-3. Guess adolescent boys get a pass. :eyes:

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Phillycat]

20. Oh look, "hysterical". What a suprising choice of word.

:eyes:

[DrWeird]

23. LOL

nt

[patcox2]

25. Yes, I give away my sexist biases with that fruedian slip.

Can't get anything by you.

[Phillycat]

29. Calm down.

I like that one too.

[Mandate My Ass]

27. yes, clearly hysterical

and the girl who got the "wedgie" is just a bad sport and obviously someone who can't take a joke.

[patcox2]

30. Never said that, either.

"Come on, sweetcakes, lighten up (pinch)."

Sorry, wrong stereotype, thats not me.

My points are entirely directed to the appropriateness of the response. I am not excusing the act, it was wrong, wrong wrong. But it seems I have to call for the kids head to demonstrate I am sufficiently tough on sexual harrassment, huh? Its the same dynamic in any political debate over criminal penalties, if you're not for tougher and tougher penalties, you are in favor of crime. Its a bullshit argument, a bullshit tactic. Its why we have more of oour population locked up than any nation on earth, its why we impose draconian penalties for victimless crimes and peddle bullshit like "smoking a joint equals terrorism" to our kids. Its why there will never be meaningful reform of our system too.

I have worked enough in the criminal justice system enough to know it is not the answer to this particular occurrence. Its overkill, its unnecessary, its counterproductive.

Why call the cops in? Isn't therapy, counseling, and school disciplinary proceedings enough, in the wedgie case?

[Mandate My Ass]

35. this wasn't victimless

calling the cops was perfectly appropriate here.

Overkill? Draconian? Punitive?

Now who's putting words in others' mouths.

How likely an event would therapy and counseling have been without the cops coming in? The kid stated he felt he was perfectly justified to commit this assault because he previously dated this girl.

[sangh0]

48. "Draconian penalties"??? WTF???

The boy is being charged as a juvenile, so his record will be expunged when he turns 18. He is being suspended from school for a few days.

You think that's overkill?

Why call the cops in?

Because sexual assault is a crime.

Isn't therapy, counseling, and school disciplinary proceedings enough, in the wedgie case?

Schools generally can't ensure that the kid will get counseling and therapy. The courts can order that. Generally speaking, children who are charged with sexual assault as a juvenile don't get sent to The Big House. Counseling and therapy in a court-approved program is the general rule for non-violent First-time juvenile offenders, and if you work in the criminal justice system, you should know that.

[patcox2]

32. Funny, nobody minds the "judgmental asshole" part.

Thats kinda funny, in a way. In the future, I will be careful to say "overreacting judgmental asshole."

[Bunny]

41. The person you called a judgemental asshole minds it very much.

And will take the appropriate action.

Oh, and before you get all hysterical, that does NOT mean that I'll call the cops and demand that you be locked up. Maybe just a little "counseling" is all you really need.

[Mandate My Ass]

42. ROFL

I've come to wonder if maybe patcox's overblown, overdramatic inappropriately accusatory post was just a stupid incident during a confusing immature time in life.

Yeah, that must be it. :hi:

[Bunny]

43. Yeah, a little "counseling" should fix him right up!

:hi: Monica_L!

[Bunny]

40. Oh, how nice. I'm a hysterical, silly asshole.

Forgive me, oh wise, sane, calm, rational, and also apparently illiterate one? What a charming person you are. No wonder you think I'm overreacting.

And let me assume that you're a guy, which would of course explain why you have no accurate perspective on the situation. Boys will be boys, right? Guy sticks his hands down your pants, grabs your buttocks, pulls up your underwear, then brags afterward that he "got some". AFTER you'd told him THREE times to stop? At age 16 he hasn't figured out that this is SO wrong? And has no apparent remorse? Oh, I'm sure he comes from the very finest family. :eyes: He's got quite a future ahead of him, all right.

But what would I know, I'm just a hysterical, silly, asshole woman.

On edit: and BTW, exactly where in my post did I say he needs to be locked up and branded for the rest of his life? For someone who claims to be an attorney, the reading skills displayed are astoundingly deficient.

[miss_kitty]

46. check out the flaming I GOT down the page, if you dare :)

apparently, Just describing the act the kid did as 'sexual assault' (which it is) is, according to some, allegedly i might add, tantamount to screaming he be jailed!

I'd like to see THAT stand up in court!

Glad to be in such great company :hi:

[Bunny]

47. No, the pleasure is mine!

Your post #26 is fantastic, incredible, and outstanding! I'd say more, but I'm afraid I'll be deemed hysterical. :)

[miss_kitty]

49. thank you!

and we don't want to become 'lawsuit bait' either now do we?

[Bunny]

53. Teehee! Lawsuit bait!

Good one!

That was a little of the pot calling the kettle black, wouldn't you say? Or maybe a more accurate description would be "hysterical"? No wait, only women can make hysterical, sweeping statements, right? ;)

[miss_kitty]

54. you know, Many attorneys I know won't argue with me

My dad would be included in that number. And he was GOOD!

I usually don't 'brang it', but it was called for-I don't care for bullying dressed up as empty legal threats. "I'm a lawyer and I'm gonna sue you!" Puhleeze-or rather "Jeeze"

And calling someone a name as the poster invited me to do, while almost always satisfying, isn't the most clever way to argue. Also, I don't need unsolicited advice such as call "me an asshole if you disagree with me...", since that would be employing that poster's arguing tactics. That's just a way to be thrown off-track, and get a post deleted.

and actually it may have been a little of the pot calling the kettle black, but the pot was in error to classify the kettle in such a way! heh! :)

[MissMillie]

8. Well, it's definitely an assault

but I'm not sure that it's a sexual assault.

Unless you want to call it sexual harassment.

I don't think the boy should be branded for life over this, but I do think there should be some consequences. "No" means "no".

Someday that boy may have a daughter, and he'd be pissed if someone did that to his daughter.

[Misunderestimator]

9. After the assault... he said "Now I got some" ... YES it was assault.

Harrassment would have been if he had not laid a finger on her and just said sexually harrassing things. This was definitely assault.

[miss_kitty]

11. sexual assault?

The girl, 15, told authorities that the boy pushed her up against a locker, put his hand down the back of her pants and pulled her thong up above the waistline of her pants, the police report released Wednesday says. The boy also touched the girl's buttocks, the report says.

just because his hand were down her pants searching for the waistband of her panties, doesn't mean it's NOT sexual assault. He willfully put his hands in a place we all consider private

The kid seemed to think something sexual in nature went down as well, to wit:
After the assault, according to the report, the boy said, "Now I got some action."

It is sexual assault.

[patcox2]

13. Oh yes, lock him up and throw away the key.

Jeeze.

[miss_kitty]

24. did i say that? where?

I think I was describing 'sexual assault' Please point out where I inferred or implied or said what you have attached to comment #11

[DrWeird]

14. So are all wedgies now sexual assault?

Just curious.

When would a wedgie be sexual assault and when wouldn't it be?

How about the Jr. High prank staple "pantsing?"

[Philostopher]

16. I guess largely, it hinges on ...

whether the perp(s) feel he/they 'got some action' out of the 'prank' or not. I think if he hadn't said those particularly injudicious words, and had only said something mean but not sexually-oriented, the nature of the case would be different.

[Pithlet]

17. No

But, this went beyond wedgie. He forced his hands down her pants, felt her up and then made the comment "Now I got some". Because underwear was involved, the term wedgie was used, so that somehow automatically should give him a pass? This wasn't just a wedgie. This was assault.

[DrWeird]

18. That's true.

Book him.

[Pithlet]

19. Silly me

We were thrown up against the lockers all the time and felt up against our will in school. What's the big deal? It's just a prank.

By the way, I never said book him. I said this isn't just a wedgie. I'm not sure if this boy's life should be ruined over this, but just dismissing the whole thing as an innocent prank is ridiculous.

[DrWeird]

21. No, I'm not being sarcastic.

Seriously, if the victim wants to press charges then throw the book at him.

[Pithlet]

22. I'm sorry.

Sarcasm doesn't always translate well here. I should know that as well as anyone :)

[miss_kitty]

26. I don't know. is everything either 'black' or 'white' in your world?

because that's what you seem to be inferring is going on in mine-maybe I misread you :hi:

is 'pantsing' funny? I mean if it happens to you or someone you love? I don't think so...
look at it this way. A bunch of guys in Armanis, working in the financial district of your large city, chase down another guy in an Armani, knock him over, pin him down, rip his pants off, and hoist them on a flagpole? Assault? Why not when a group of kids do it to another kid?

Scenario #2. Your mom is walking down the street. A guy she dated in the past, sees her, throws her up against a building, while she is saying "no no no." He reaches down her pants or skirt, fumbles around her private area looking for her underwear, so he can pull the back of them up the crack of her ass as hard as he can. "Now I got me some action!" he says, goal accomplished. Funny? He then justifies it by saying-"hey we used to date-I thought it was ok!"

Do you want someone you don't particularly like to reach inside your pants to give you a wedgie? what sort of name would you assign to that activity? just curious. :)

On edit: Spell err

[Phillycat]

28. Post of the day.

:thumbsup:

[Misunderestimator]

33. Agreed. Very well put, m_c!

:thumbsup:

[patcox2]

15. Strictly speaking, every wedgie is a sexual assault.

I am an attorney, a public defender for a time, I know the law, and those of you who argue that what this kid did is a sexual assault are correct.

But it is equally correct then that any wedgie is a sexual assault, it involves the aggressor putting his or her hands in a private place in order to humiliate the victim, and its done for the arguably sexual gratification of the aggressor.

You got me, your right, they're all guilty.

So, where do we build the prison camps? Where do we put the millions of eight year olds who are obviously future rapists? Should we use the civil commitment laws to keep them in prison for life, all these dangerous Nelson Muntzes who have until now been walking free, raping and terrorizing? Should we prosecute the parents, too?

[miss_kitty]

31. as an atty, you must understand why I want you to explain

"Oh yes, lock him up and throw away the key.



Jeeze."
which was attached to MY comment. I did not offer any solution in any of my posts regarding this incident. The reason I am concerned by your inference that a clarification on the situation I posted would include jail time is that prison would be not a choice for an idiot kid like this. Jeeze yourself...I hope you are a little more careful in scrutinising evidence that may concern the defense of your many clients.
i mean really patcox2 how does a statement that reads (basically, for brevity's sake) "That action is sexual assault," equate to "Oh yes, lock him up and throw away the key"?

you might want to get your knee-jerk reaction checked by a professional.

[patcox2]

34. It equates because jail time is the penalty for sexual assault.

You see, you made a judgment that a person's actions met the criminal definition of sexual assault. Jail time is an available penalty for sexual assault, as is lifetime registration as a sex offender and community notification of your neighbors, in my state. And in my state, the registration and community notification is mandatory, applies to juveniles, and would definitely apply in this case in the event of a conviction.

Now the thing about the criminal justice system is that once that legal judgment is made (he committed sexual assault) there is no discretion as to many of the consequences. Get tough on crime laws dictate mandatory jail time for many different crimes, judges have little discretion anymore, regardless of the circumstances.

Now, at law, the term "sexual assault" is synonymous with "rape." The model penal code makes no distinction, its only a matter of degrees. So, you have equated what the kid has done as equivalent to rape when you made the conclusion that it was a sexual assualt. And the law will treat him as a rapist.

Thats why all I have really been speaking to is the response to what he did, not whether it was right or wrong. Labelling a 16 year old adolescent a sexual criminal is excessive in the circumstances, that is my opinion, I think therapy, counseling, school sanctions should be enough.

Now, as to the care I bring to my job as an attorney, you know exactly nothing about it, and your tendency to draw sweeping conclusions in the absence of evidence will get you in trouble someday if you make a habit out of publicly questioning people's professional competence.

You see, a statement such as "thats idiotic" or "you are an asshole" is perfectly permissable, because they are statements of opinion. But denigrating a person's professional competence is libel. Please confine yourself, therefore, to calling me an asshole if you disagree with me, rathering than venturing uninformed opinions about my professional competence, a subject you are unfit to judge.

[miss_kitty]

38. no the inference is yours and you make many

wrong assumptions about me in your post...libellous?

YOU brought up your job-Use your attorney skills. I did not label him a sex offender. I said his action was sexual assault. I did not say or infer in ANY OF MY POSTS that he should do time for this, nor would I. you are accusing me of saying things I have not said. and you are doing it in writing, and what I have of haven't said is out here for all to see-easily provable.

As for sexual assault=rape? what are degrees about? making a deal?

If you are looking for someone who is making sweeping conclusions in the absence of evidence, check the reflection in the mirror...I did not accuse you of proceeding in your job with a lack of due care and diligence I said "I hope you are a little more careful..." Keep in mind, I know the difference between the real world and an online post-and-chat-about-it thing...

I did not libel you. you may want to cut down on coffee, take a nap and lay off the 'legal' threats. I haven't impuned you or your integrity. You accused me of some shit in earlier posts and in this one, which isn't true, and now you are trying to bullshit and bluster your way out of it...I've seen it all before-why don't you brang it?

BTW I DON'T disagrree with you on the kid-I am at one with you there...I disagree with what you say about me, a subject YOU are unfit to judge

[sangh0]

51. The distortions are also patcox2's

As a public defender, he should know the significance of the fact that the boy is being charged as a juvenile. He won't end up in The Big House. Non-violent juvenile first-offenders don't go to jail.

If patcox2 is a public defender, then he knows this.

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

36. I'm against this kind of harassment

The kid obviously knew it was unwelcome. It's one thing to horse around with your friends... This isn't a gender issue, boys get this treatment too from both girls and other boys.

However, I am HIGHLY opposed to bringing the courts into this. The girl should kick the boy in the balls, and a couple of times in the ribs once he's down. I hate the idea of a country where kids call the cops on each other.

[Phillycat]

39. If the girl is 5'0', 100 pounds, and the guy is 6'2", 250, would that work

?

Should a girl in high school be required to take care of her own physical safety? Should they be required to take self-defense classes?

Is it appropriate for a student in high school to respond to physical violence with more physical violence? If the guy then punched the girl for kicking him in the balls, would he be able to claim self-defense?

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

44. If you want equal rights

Learn self-defense.

[Mandate My Ass]

50. Then we shouldn't have a police force at all

Law of the jungle right?

Banks should just practice self defense against armed bank robbers.

Carjackers who are stronger than the car owner should get to keep the car since they kicked ass for it.

Got stuck up at an ATM and got your money taken away because the robber suckered you in the jaw? Too damn bad for being a punk. Better luck next time.



I get it now. :eyes:

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

55. That's the situation right now that you describe

I've been a victim of violent crime and police harassment. The police just add to my burden of self-defense. How many robberies or carjackings get stopped in progress?

I believe in investigators but absolutely no armed/uniformed patrols.

[Pithlet]

52. So, people who, for whatever reason

are incapable of learning self defense aren't entitled to equal treatment? I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what you mean. I'm not sure that the law should have been involved here, especially since I only have details from one story in the media. But, I don't think we need to be sending the message that you won't get help or justice if you can't or won't physically defend yourself.

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

56. I mean women specifically

I won't buy the argument that women are weaker and need to be protected from someone who would argue on a different topic that women are equal and should be treated equally.

I think it's everyone's responsibility to defend themselves and to defend others who for reason of age or debility cannot defend themselves. I am against ANYTHING that empowers the police.

[Pithlet]

58. My argument is NOT that women are weaker

But, I think that you know that, really. And I don't even know how to respond to the police thing :crazy:

[Pithlet]

57. Never mind.

I read post number 55...

[sasquatch]

45. Putting the "ass" in assault

;)