Sometimes I forget how real it all is

[Skip Intro]

scary as hell when you realize, isn't it?

Our side is fighting for the very life of this nation, and the usurpers, the criminals, the thieves and liars and murderers are fighting back. They've stolen the nation, they think, and they're going to fight back against law enforcement, so that they can continue to rape and kill and pillage and loot. And its happening right in front of us. Right now. A fight to save America.

And on these boards and on bumper stickers and on cable "news" it just comes so fast and furious, and for what seems like forever - it almost seems surreal, even unreal - like a show of some kind, or a sport. But its not entertainment, its real. And our nation hangs in the balance.

Sometimes I forget that, and when I'm reminded by the latest assault on this nation from within, it all comes screaming right back to slap my face once more. And its scary as hell.

God be with the patriots.

[carolinalady]

1. It is going to get ugly I fear. At a mimimum they can raise the

cost of living so high we can not exist. On the opposite side of the spectrum, they can ensure that we do not exist. I have never been more incredulous. I can not even believe that this country is so self absorbed that they are letting it happen under their nose, while they happily purchase their suv's and vacation homes. It is very scary indeed.

[fooj]

2. Yes! It is a frightening time, indeed!

I was getting my hair cut today and this little old lady was waiting for a ride. My hairdresser and I were chatting and she brought up Shrub and his BS "Press Conference" yesterday! That woman stood up and just started ranting and raving! I'd say she is in her late seventies/early eighties. She was pissed!

Guess what? She KNEW all about the PNAC!!! I couldn't believe it. I was stoked. I told her that it's nice to know that I'm not alone in my disgust and anger. She grabbed my hand and squeezed it and said "Honey, you're young enough to get out there and fight like hell for our country. Please. Please. Don't let us down."

This is real. This is very, very real.

Peace.

[rzemanfl]

9. Sunday a guy was outside our local library soliciting signatures

to get on the ballot for City Councilman. When I left there was an elderly woman lecturing him on Kellogg, Brown and Root, Halliburton, etc. like she was giving a book report on House of Bush, House of Saud. There are plenty of old folks that don't drink the Kool-Aid.

[babylonsister]

3. What's scarier are the people who don't have a clue and

couldn't care less. But these are scary times. I'm thankful for you and DU to keep me informed, and usually outraged! :toast:

[Hotler]

6. So true, so true, very scary indeed.

and I agree that's going to get ugly before it gets better. The neo-cons will not go quietly into the night. We'll have to drag them kicking and screaming from office. Hopefully in leg irons.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

4. God be with us

When I get scared, I think back to Moses Cleveland, who, while fighting the Revolution, was captured by the Native Americans who were siding with the British, and how he was able to escape with his life. I think of William Weaver, a poor man from Tennessee who enlisted in Illinois to fight for the Union, only to be invalided for life while one of his brothers died in battle, another was gravely wounded, and another went insane. The blood of these men flows in my veins, for they were some of my ancestors. They were willing to give all for America-dare I do less?

[HeeBGBz]

7. I think of my father

Who fought in WWII and my uncle who was on the Bataan death march and was a POW for 2 years and lost a lung due to TB.

They didn't fight so some sniveling little AWOL DICKtater could piss on the constitution.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

10. Yeah

I think of all those who fought, those who didn't come back, and those who did but who were haunted by the experience the rest of their lives. You are right. None of them sacrificed so that we could wind up with another King George.

[justabob]

16. yes

My family too has a long history of military service, most recently: Grandad was a marine pilot in the Pacific, Dad was USAF and died in his jet, brother currently serving... I hear you. (side note: I have a friend who's grandad was in the Bataan death march as well, we had a conversation along these same lines just a few days ago).

[HeeBGBz]

26. They didn't talk about it much

To me, anyway. The bad things.

It just makes me ask myself "How long do we allow these blatant thefts of freedom to continue?"

[justabob]

14. thank you for that

You give very good advice. I don't know as much as you about the specifics of my revolutionary ancestors, but I do think of them often. That helps when I am gripped with terror, as I noted elsewhere in this thread. I take it as an insult to my family that these traitors have done everything they can to subvert what your family, mine and so many others fought for back then.

[feelthebreeze]

5. Oh I am fighting like hell, and cannot give in to the lure of easy chair..

TV hypnotism. These spoiled people who we are striving to wake up is so disturbing. I am talking about people who are close and dear to me. Good people who seem to crumple and become overwhelmed by the prospect of all of this. Why have we as a nation been unable to rouse ourselves? It comes down to cynicism and disbelief in our very real power as a collective force. I will lead if others follow. I will follow if others lead. Surely there are millions of like minded Americans who need this leadership and faith right now.
Battle their fear with hope, their sleepiness with excited commitment. At least I am true to this country and its promise of Democracy.

[justabob]

8. I know what you mean

I have to remind myself that the old rules no longer apply. There is no separation of powers, no checks or balances, no consent of the governed. I am not new to the abuses of this admin, I have watched each new horror, taken reams of notes, but my early programming always kicks in (I started kindergarten during 1976/bicentenial and still have clear memories of learning about the Revolution, the greatness of our system of government, et al). Even though I have known what was happening, I have daily, sometimes hourly, 'reality checks' that literally take my breath away. I liken them to panic attacks, but that is not quite right. They are moments of stark and near-paralyzing terror.

[bonito]

11. This too shall pass

But while we are all here, lets give these comforting words some direction for our sake, shall we.

[driver8]

12. You are so right! It is scary when one thinks about all of the shit that

this administration has done or has tried to do. It really is overwhelming to try and keep it all straight. Voter rights, tax cuts, wars, spying on citizens, global warming, reckless spending...

These people are absolutely insane.

[I Have A Dream]

13. Going through times like this make me think of our founding "fathers"...

as being real people just like us who were fighting for our freedom. It's so easy to think of them as just figures in books. They were as real as we are thinking many of the same thoughts that we're thinking today. I find that thought really exciting, and it helps me to handle what is currently happening. We're on deck now, and it's up to us to save what they created.

[linazelle]

15. Yes I try to forget too, but there is this underlying malaise--

that I can't quite evade. At work, at the mall, in public--I am constantly reevaluating what I see vs. what I know is happening to the country politically. What I see: people are going about their lives without detecting the continuous assaults on their freedom and liberties that are being taken away. They don't worry about not being able to file lawsuits, not having competition in the market place so they shop at Walmart, global warming, the health care crisis. And since they don't worry about all that unimportant stuff, their TV sets keep them hopped up on fear--of bird flu, spies and boogeymen like OBL. In other words, people aren't worried about the political events that affect them personally--propoganda now satisfies most peoples' worry quotient.

[bonito]

18. I see that too

But than again, if change where to come, its only going to come from those who can see, thats us, and like I've said to my son, its better to go through life awake than asleep, even though waking up is hard to do. Peace

[Harper_is_Bush]

17. rape and kill and pillage and loot?

I agree there are criminals among the Republican party...and liars.

Accusing them of murderer and rape will only cause the bulk of America to tune out and make the label of "wacko" easier to throw at the opposition.

[Skip Intro]

19. what do you call 100,000 slaughtered for lies? I call it murder.

what do you call prisoners sodomized? I call it rape.

What do you call the draining of our treasury to fatten up fat cat friends of the crime family at the expense of the needy - at the expense of eveyone else? I call it looting.

What do you call the flagrant disreguard, the evident contempt for America's long held standards of freedom?

What words would you use?

I call the perps - gwbush anc co, the whackos.

check the stats, check the reports, check the pics

who's "whacko?"

If you don't get what I'm saying then you don't get it. Let's leave it at that.

[Harper_is_Bush]

20. I wouldn't characterize things as you do...

Firstly, we cannot claim 100,000 dead as a result of the war. The Lancet study sits on the shelf with other studies (one by the Red Cross which seems more thourough) that come up with lower numbers. But....100,000 or 30,000...it's still a significant amount.
Can we characterize it as "murder" though? I don't believe so.
"Senseless" or "uneccessary" are better terms, ones that will appeal to the broadest spectrum of people and generate the most thought. "Murder" will cause people to tune you out. Are you saying the troops murdered people? See my point?

As for rape, yes cases of sodomization in jails would be rape. You're referring to Bush (and presumably his cabinet) though, not those who committed rape.

I say focus on the realities that are easily demonstrated (such as Bush claiming no wiretaps happen without court orders). Avoid being labelled "emotional" or "wacko" by not making unsubstantiated and serious criminal accusations.

He lied about wire taps. Use that, it's something everyone can sink teeth into.

[Skip Intro]

22. No, I'm saying BUSH murdered people. I don't care how hard it is for you

or those you worry about to swallow.

I fear you miss the clear, big picture of what has happened since these thugs TOOK power in 2000, and what has happened since.

I fear you miss the true nature of the struggle we are in, and what is at stake.

The time for cozy wording is gone. There is a war on for this nation, between those who revere our laws and values, and those who shit on them.

The fact that you can't see it doesn't change it.

And, btw, why are you so worried about how what I say to other memebers of this board will sit with the sheeple?

Just wondering.

[Harper_is_Bush]

23. If you don't care....

then you can't be reasoned with.

[Skip Intro]

25. Don't lecture me about caring or reason, please.

There is no caring or reason from those for whom you seek to soften the fall.

I think we've said about all we have to say to each other.

Good luck selling your illusion here.

[Harper_is_Bush]

28. Don't misrepresent me, please.

I in no way have demonstrated that I seek to "soften the fall" of Bush & Co.

You falsely imply some nefarious intent to me.

The fact is that over the top accusations like yours will delay the fall because it gives those who support Bush the ammunition for their false claims that the source of Bush opposition is a wacko segment.

You didn't respond to my point about "murderers". Are you calling the soldiers murderers? Who has murdered? The war was illegal, and the death tragic and unneccessary. My point is simply that your accusation of murder is undefined and undirected and thus easily dismissed by the public (who you presumably would want to impact) as ranting not to be taken seriously.
Please don't take it personally.

[bloom]

24. The range

in the study was between 90,000 and 110,00 - not including Fallujah. So it was really quite a bit higher. Plus it was over a year ago - so it's probably doubled - with Tal Afar and everything else.

100,000 is a low number IMO.

[Harper_is_Bush]

27. I am a supporter of the study...

but to be credible we have to recognize that there are other reputable studies that have larger samples which report lower numbers.

A number is less important than a concept. Bush can say 30,000 died one day, and then imply that most of them were enemy combatants or killed by insurgents the next day.
It's important to give the public something that they can digest and be impacted by...such as realities about civilian or woman/children death.

[kster]

21. Keep fighting and spreading the truth

about the election theft machines, with enough people they will not be able to stop us from counting the vote. And their little vote theft machines will get tossed in the water if they can't show how the vote was counted, and a revote on paper will be demanded. We can't let them get away with it again, OR WE ARE CRAZY!

[uppityperson]

29. I hear them talking impeachment, abuse of powers, spying, torture

I gives me the creeps. But what gives me the creeps is that it has taken this long to get this out in the public, and that I am not paranoid, that it really is this bad. It is not just a computer game, playing over the internets, but real and this is very scary and very very sad.

[Twist_U_Up]

30. We have to STAND UP until they STAND DOWN !!

You hit the nail on the head. I think about this daily.

How far we have fallin in 5 years