freedom of speech

[undergroundpanther]

Hmm looks like DU has got alot of Taboo topics these days. Why is this?
What has changed? What has changed in the DU demographics?

People need to remember the importance of the free exchange of liberal ideas among different people with different experiences,needs and demographics within the diverse spectrum of what is considered politics of the left.

I think maybe the "official" Dem's are upset..Maybe the Dem's with am "image" of "moderation to protect and project,are under stress and feeling less popular maybe..So some may be "circling the wagons" so to speak,and because of this defensiveness have become more shallow and censorious of subjects and ideas that go beyond their favorite P.R. safe zone "talking points". People get offended much quicker these days and censor posts if one challenges the favorite but limited ideologies and pundits favored by those of these certain political flavors of left.

It's called reaction.. liberals are not immune to it.Liberals are more resistant to reactionary tendencies but they are not immune to using it's corrosive repressive effects and becoming reactionary.History can show what happens to the left when the left becomes reactionary and it ain't pretty if it goes too far.Reactionariness is dangerous and ugly no matter what political party does it..
Reactionary and regressive tendencies are not just for the right wing anymore it seems.Sad development to see occurring here on the liberal side of the left IMHO.Scary sign to see.
I wonder how long this post will be tolerated until this thread is censored? Better save it now and PM me later if y0pu wish to discuss this depending on the reaction... time will tell.

As far as I know what I think will save our democracy from ruin..on all sides is MORE DEMOCRACY, MORE FREE SPEECH,MORE DIVERSITY and MORE CONTROVERSY and an acceptance of the sometimes volatile,always messy,contrary,confused ,inconvenient and even sometimes offensive process of real people hashing out different left leaning ideas and asking hard questions,challenging each other,sharing information from many diverse sources and sorting it all out..Some people for whatever reasons can't handle the mess and "disorder" that real freedom of speech causes in a party.So their solidarity is sadly,hollow and ends up demanding of supporters silly displays of party loyalties from people aligned with the left. Once this starts to become entrenched the movement cannot withstand any stress,freedom,diversity,controversy, or grow.It is basically dead.

Bush has ruthlessly censored left wingers from having a voice. Bush forbids the left from asking questions,countering his right wing agendas and speaking out at his campaigns,. Bush the insecure tyrant asshole is a reactionary,he and his party can't cope with real diversity, controversy or disagreement. He is a REACTIONARY.And his party is weak,maybe even dysfunctional to the point of self immolation.

I hope the left can catch itself before this reaction process goes too far and alienates too many allies like greens,anarchists,and certain types of moderates on the left side of the political spectrum that share alot of political threads with the Dems..Because if the reactionary tendencies I observe does not stop ,I fear there will be an Exodus from the Dem Party.. given enough reactionary censoring out of the"officials".

Just as there has been a more gradual but unmistakable exodus from the republican party ,that is reflected in Bush's poll numbers and Increased memberships to DU..
React too far and the Dem's will face the same Exodus.
Now is NOT the time to tell Dem's and Dem sympathizers What NOT to say,What NOT to link to, and What NOT to discuss here.

This post is not meant to undermine the Dem party. I said this to preserve it's integrity,those real outstanding,protean traits,it's real liberal values that are so noble,it's idealogical vibrancy, that deep thinking intelligence, and the visionary understanding of the sanity of equality and wisdom gained only in a acceptance of idealogical plurality.

[AuntPatsy]

1. We are all just terrified I think Panther and for good reason, you do make

sense as always, for me its not only fear of these individuals remaining in power, its fear that they have what amounts to disruptive spies in the midst of DU, and sometimes, its just hard to tell who is friend or foe, at one time, I seriously thought us all friends to a point regardless of party affiliation, but no longer, sadly, the need of some to demand one adheres to a viewpoint you yourself might not agree with has come to down to nothing short of a hostile style take over..

When we have those mouthy hate mongers like Hannity, coulter, oreily etc being given legitimacy by far too many it definately makes one wonder if they should at any time let their guard down...

A voice of reason, sadly, these times seem to have no reason...

[undergroundpanther]

2. Fear is the Mind killer..

We are all just terrified I think Panther and for good reason, you do make sense as always, for me its not only fear of these individuals remaining in power, its fear that they have what amounts to disruptive spies in the midst of DU, and sometimes, its just hard to tell who is friend or foe, at one time, I seriously thought us all friends to a point regardless of party affiliation, but no longer, sadly, the need of some to demand one adheres to a viewpoint you yourself might not agree with has come to down to nothing short of a hostile style take over..

What might that single viewpoint be about ? I ask this question because Dem's have been so diverse on so many issues.And these issues mean so much to so many of us and this is why we are Dem's,because we all get to have a voice. When one is censored in the name of party loyalty people are alienated who would otherwise be allies .How many allies are the Dem's willing to alienate to ensure party loyalty and assuage fear??

When we have those mouthy hate mongers like Hannity, coulter, oreily etc being given legitimacy by far too many it definitely makes one wonder if they should at any time let their guard down...

Never let your guard down against the right.

BUT do not become so afraid and react unwisely lest you make allies into enemies.

A voice of reason, sadly, these times seem to have no reason...

I know.And times like these as scary as they are,is no time to sacrifice the ideals of free speech,diversity, integrity and principles to soothe fear, create the feeling of security or excuse demands for uniformity and conformity through symbolic shows of loyalty.
The Neocons are crazy criminal and evil to the core they cannot be trusted. But even tho,we must allow the kinds of discussion that builds wisdom and teaches us to be more insightful into ourselves and the tactics of the enemies we face.

"If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; and posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." -Samuel Adams

"..it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather
an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in
people's minds.." --Samuel Adams

It was easy enough to kill yourself in a fit of despair. It was easy enough to play the martyr. It was harder to do nothing. To endure your life. To wait.
Erica Jong (b.1942)


Here is a "prayer " of sorts that I wrote awhile ago for gathering up my own courage in facing the future that appears so uncertain and dark these days.

I know..

...Eventually The enemy, the Apophis devouring the sun in the Whitehouse will have to blink.The Reptile cancer cannot keep the eyes focused on one thing forever and swallow it whole without a distraction or a show of fatigue,or hide from me the painful squint of denial,and shame caused by the force of a mouth forcing narrowing eyes,swallowing up the truth which is as futile as a snake swallowing the sun..May I stand apart and hold my spear aloft and throw it deep into the Mosters head even if it is to rule the world.. Let it suffer.
Great Mother Sekhmet,Let me be wise in my use of power.Do not let me corrupt your sacredness with my fear, insecurity or ambition.
Do not let me be the one to blink first in reaction. Do not permit me to close my eyes and betray my own principles and sully myself now when I need to see Sekhem working through me the most.Do not let me fall asleep and become dim in this watch.Keep the blades of wisdom bound to my hands ,hone them sharp and true teach mme to destroy that which seeks to dominate this world and devour the sun.. I want to hold tight to my freedom, my ideals and my impeccability and be true to my true self more than defend my own life here in this suffering place.
Because to die a coward,to sell my soul for popular support or a comfortable cage,is in my own heart intolerable ,a hell I will not accept. Sa Sekhem Sahu....
Underground Panther in the Sky