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TheFarseer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:35 PM
Original message
If we legalized marijuana
would it cut down on use of other drugs? Think about it: Pot is legal, and other drugs are not. Why take the chance of using some other drug, if using pot will definitely not land you in jail? Or am I using more logic than a drug user might? Of course, this assumes the theory that pot is not nearly as dangerous as other harder drugs and leads to much less crime.
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Viva_La_Revolution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yes.
My alcohol use would go down. :P
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Well, the distillers and brewers will fight the measure tooth and nail, in
that case!!!
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #1
14. yep
Alcohol poisons the whole body.
Marijuana is only bad for the lungs.
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TallahasseeGrannie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
2. Makes sense to me
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Dances with Cats Donating Member (545 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:47 PM
Response to Original message
4. For one thing
it would save me a bunch of time "hooking up" Godamighty....and I travel all over.
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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
5. i believe that is how it has worked in other places.
the whole gateway theory, i believe, has been explained by the fact that dealers in illegal drugs deal illegal drugs. if you bought it at the corner liquor store, you would just buy lottery tickets instead.
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
6. if we legalized marijuana and you could grow your own - >
- lots of government employees (cops, prosecutors, jail guards, etc)
would lose their jobs and have to do something productive for society
instead

- drug lords would lose their markets and go bankrupt, taking their dealers and killers with them

- and, especially in the case of latin american countires, entire cultures revolving around drug related corruption would wither away and people could live in peace while finding something more productive to produce

- I doubt that marijuana use would increase that much as a result

- crime committed by drug users desperate for money to buy their drugs would plummet

- and there are likely more benefits, as well as some drawbacks, but people already use marijuana.

by the way if making drugs illegal would stop drug use, should not drug use have stopped by now?

Msongs
www.msongs.com/chinamart.htm
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TheFarseer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #6
17. Good analysis
I think it would create legitimate jobs, but probably do away with more jobs on the whole. It would likely take most of the money out of marijuana. Of course, that's probably a good thing. Maybe the money that went to that (tax payer money and consumer dollars) would be put to something better and be good overall for the economy.
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alfredo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #17
25. The mob dropped pot for higher margin products.
I don't think the drug lords would lose that much if Pot was legalized. It would be a new cash crop, especially in the southern states. Some states could grow it for the fiber and oils.

I don't think it would make much difference in the use of the harder drugs. Some junkies I knew didn't even smoke weed. It just wasn't their thing. Everybody has their drug, be it caffeine (my favorite), alcohol, or cocaine.
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niallmac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
7. My weight would go up.
The legalization of drugs subject has been visited here before with much enthusiasm for
both sides as you can imagine. One of my arguments for legalization of just about everything is that then the distribution of the substances can be controlled, we can identify and at least begin to try and work with those whose lives are destroyed or in the process of being destroyed, black market disappears and the sexiness of the drug aka 'gang' culture disappears. It's the sexy cool nature of illegal drugs that I believe feeds the the gang thing that our society apparently just adores....IMHO...I am also very suspicious of the 'drug war' in it's present guise. It serves the purposes too well of those who wish to incarcerate our minorities and meddle in foreign countries.
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Spinzonner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Chocolate is my drug of choice

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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
8. If we legalized drugs it would cause a huge increase in use.
Taking away the illegality would mean it could be done without losing a persons liberty. I think it is a good idea because people could find out if they liked it or not (without worry) and get on with their lives either way.
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Kali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Do you really think so?
I don't - just don't think the legality of substances has much bearing on whether most folks try or continue to use them. It never did for me or anyone I know. Possible exception - urine testing for some jobs but likely the legality of the drugs wouldn't have much effect on the policies of the types of companies that test anyway.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. I believe it would push a lot of 'fence sitters' to try it.
If the gummit allows companies to grow/distribute drugs it would be a new product (or multiple products) that once were forbidden. I can see a huge increase just from the curiosity factor alone.

That doesn't mean they will become users, just because they tried something new. Some will, some won't. Longterm, I think introducing new 'drugs' into the market won't have any huge impact but upon the money made in illegal trafficking. Nicotine is as addictive as heroin and I'd have a hard time living without caffeine (just as addictive).
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Kali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 10:04 PM
Response to Reply #13
20. I guess I just question the idea that there are very many fence sitters.
Edited on Sun Dec-04-05 10:13 PM by Kali
I mean are there really very many folks out there who haven't tried pot that WOULD try it if legal? Seems to me the decision to use marijuana is based on whether one wants to get stoned or not, or say health issues such as not injesting any kind of smoke/foriegn substances etc. - not whether it is legal or not.

I am truly curious - anybody out there who's only reason for not trying weed is the legal issue?


edit - to anwer go here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5517820
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #13
21. Your argument suggests that there
a lot of people out there who haven't tried pot because it is illegal, and I have never seen any evidence of that. You may be right, I don't know.

I have never smoked pot in my life (it has nothing to do with it's illegality) and I think it should be legalized by the way.
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tridim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. I think you'll be surprised how many regular pot smokers
would come out of the closet, so to speak. There are millions and millions of private pot smokers in this country. Carl Sagan was a pothead for gawd's sake.
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Dances with Cats Donating Member (545 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. True
and I LOVE old "coke jaw" Bush photo!
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. I agree, I personally view pot as less harmless than beer.
I also think companies would sell it to people as a 'less harmless' drug than booze. People would try it in droves and yeah potheads could sit out on their porch and smoke it. ;)

I think everyone should be allowed to try drugs that won't kill them right off the bat so they can decide if it is what they want or not.
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demigoddess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 10:34 PM
Response to Reply #8
22. I don't smoke or drink and those are legal, I would not be tempted to
do marijuana unless I had cancer or some other disease. There is a certain percentage of any populations that are tempted and a certain percentage that would not do it even if it were legal.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #8
24. Didn't happen after Prohibition.
NT!

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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #8
29. that is not how it worked in prohibition
alcohol consumption increased under prohibition. the taboo is very alluring. although there was an immediate bump after repeal, usage level off, and dropped slightly. the streets of my town, chicago, quieted down, tho.
did you all realize that the reason that prohibition was repealed was that fdr wanted to tax it, and to stop spending money on enforcement.
the unfortunate thing, to me, is that there is still little that is done to help alcoholics, to say nothing of drug addicts. we have no real proven medical treatments. that is where we should be putting our billions and billions.
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Jed Dilligan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
16. According to "Let's Go Amsterdam"
17% of Dutch people (who can buy all forms of weed at a "coffee shop") and 36% of Americans (who buy weed from felons) smoke the gange.
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Digit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
18. Twinkie stock would go up
:hippie:
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Hekate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-04-05 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
19. Legalize it and tax it on the same terms as alcohol and cigarettes
The main reason pot is a gateway to prison records and worse drugs is its illegality. Legalize it and a user wouldn't have to consort with criminals to get it, nor fear a criminal record themselves. Legalize it and most of the failed war on drugs could be declared over.

The US government has had its head up its * on this issue for so many decades that I think the policy-makers are out of touch with reality on the subject. (That sentence could be phrased better, but I think I make my point.) The waste! The wasted lives, the wasted dollars! The stupidity!

I am a non-user, but I finally found myself voting in favor of medical marijuana because of the above conclusions. My mother is a cancer survivor, and ye gods her life would have been easier with a bit of pot to quell the vomiting and increase her appetite. One by one the voters of the individual states are passing medical pot laws, and eventually the federal government will have to acknowledge that.

Hekate
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In_The_Wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 12:47 AM
Response to Original message
23. If we legalized marijuana, it will no longer be the called the bridge drug
It is the largest cash crop.

Think of all the good that could be done with the monies collected in tax revenues.

Stop Marijuana Prohibition now.
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Beam Me Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 03:10 AM
Response to Original message
26. Here's a different question: What impact does drug use have on politics?
Despite all Regan's bull shit, we are hardly a "drug free" society. Millions of citizens of the United States use drugs, often multiple drugs, on a daily basis. The vast majority of them are perfectly legal.

Of course, I'm talking about a particular class of drugs, generally called psychotropics, that effect the mind and emotions of human beings. I'm not a Dr. or a pharmacist or an expert in this field but clearly there are a wide variety of psychotropic drugs and an equally wide variety of responses to them.

One, to me, very interesting effect of certain drugs is transparency. Nicotine is the prime example. Those of you who have smoked cigarettes have seen how they are a perfected drug delivery system and product. Nicotine is a drug and it does get you 'high' in its own way for a time. Fairly quickly, though, you become habituated to it in such a way that a) you do not notice any perceptible difference in your state of consciousness (you do not feel inebriated) and yet, at the same time, you feel somehow 'satisfied' with yourself. At least for the moment. It soothes you. You feel reassured in some way. Once you're addicted, the cravings are like an itch that must be scratched, to regain that sense of--well, 'satisfaction'--however illusory or fleeting.

It is always a revelation to discover, when you're ready, that the craving for a cigarette will go away whether one has one or not. It's just a matter of living through the craving without acting on it until your attention is taken up with something else. Time passes and suddenly you realize, 'Oh, I never did have that cigarette I craved,' and that you are no worse the wear for it. Eventually, at least for most people, the cravings do subside. I've been cigarette free for four years now and I hardly notice it. But once in a while when I'm around an old friend who is still a smoker, the habit of 'sharing' that abstract satisfaction of pulling smoke into and expelling it out of one's lungs reemerges into my consciousness and the craving is felt again. Some part of me says, "Oh, for heavens sake, why not! Go ahead, have a smoke." And another part of my head screams: NO NO NO, you KNOW how sick they make you, just STOP!

It really is like that. And yes, I remain, tobacco smoke free.

Now Marijuana isn't like that, at least not for me. Other folks' millage may vary. I get 'toasted' about four times a week at the end of the day as a way to 'unwind', much the way many would have a martini. (It both is, and is not, like that.)

I started smoking pot when I was 19 years old and that was in 1967. Although I started then, there have been years at a time when I didn't smoke at all and I've never had a too difficult time quitting if it was something I really wanted to do.

For me the original lure was partly 'hip and cool white boy' and also curiosity about altered states of consciousness. More the latter, if the truth be known, as I had experienced altered states of consciousness many many times as a child, although I did not have that categorization for them at the time. For me they appeared as strong 'reveries' and upswells of emotion, and I felt my imagination opened towards the hem of a celestial awareness that transcended my individuality. It was 'awesome.'

Was this just some halllucination? Well, let me tell you, if it IS, I much prefer IT than this insanity we're living in at the moment! What a beautiful world is possible for us if we only just get ourselves together.

Terrance McKenna once said something to the effect that "Straight people often accuse us psychedelic drug users of wanting to escape reality. They have NO IDEA how right they are!"

All kidding aside, though, McKenna also asked this important question: "What role have inebriants played in the development of human society and human consciousness?" This would be a silly question if we were not willing to admit that human beings have been medicating themselves with plant 'toxins' for tens of thousands of years if not much much longer. McKenna puts forward the idea that psilocybin containing mushrooms may have influenced the evolution of human consciousness through diet because low levels of psilocybin increase visual acuity, especially in edge detection and movement. At a time when our arboreal ancestors were climbing down out of the trees and becoming foragers where we were prey to wild beasts, the ability to stand upright on our hind legs to look across tall grasses, and the ability to detect patterned movement there in was essential to survival. Those who failed were soon eaten and did not reproduce.

Humanbeings physiologically little different from you or I have inhabited this planet for something over a hundred thousand years. Really think about that. And yet, strangely, we know almost nothing about these most ancient ancestors of ours. Imagine, a whole species with a form of amnesia. Oh, yes, we've written books and built museums where we di-o-ramicly display a way of living that our so called civilization has made impossible. It is "progress" we are told and, I mean, yeah, there are some GOOD things about it--ice cream in july and all that--but there still are a lot, I mean A LOT, of unresolved problems. I mean, look where we are: On the edge of a global resource war replete with weapons of mass distruction.

H E L L O? The way it looks to me is like a global bar-room brawl between competing gangs, only on the global scale. Male egos gone berserk. (Alcohol can do that to you if you don't watch out.) Meanwhile, those of us who would like nothing better than drink our beer or smoke our pot and enjoy the show are shoved right in the middle of a trans contentental firefirght. Poor Iraq. It could be Long Island, next, though. And, no, I'm not kidding. We've already seen what can happen to an entire city.

S o o o o.

Is any one SANE enough or SOBER enough or STONED enough to get us out of this mess? McKenna put forth the theory that The mokeys are out of control" because they--we--lost touch with something he called "the Gaian mind." We lost touch with our own organic nature. We lost touch with the myths that spoke of 'gods' not as supreme beings, but as forces that shaped the world we once knew and experienced. Forces with which WE have a RELATIONSHIP. McKenna postulated that due to further climate change, possibly due to creeping overgrazing by our own ancestors, psilocybin ceased to be plentifully available and, over time, other drugs, such as alcohol, replaced it.

Alcohol, however, had a very different psychological and emotional impact and once again the 'ape', especially the males, began to think and behave territorially. Now we're closer to what our history teaches us as our history. On the other hand, all this may be be nothing more than the ramblings of maniacs. Still, if you've read this far, you must yourself be interested in these kinds of questions.

We need a change and the change needs to be bigger, much bigger, than winning the next election--if that is even possible.
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thecai Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 03:24 AM
Response to Original message
27. Countries That Legalized Marijuana...
... have far less crime.
I believe it would be beneficial to legalize it. Or at least decriminalize it.
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clu Donating Member (228 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-05-05 03:30 AM
Response to Original message
28. if pot were legal
i wouldn't want to grow it, i'd wanna buy the good stuff from someone experienced.

in my ideal model, growing commercially would require a special license and visits from tax inspectors for auditing. these tax inspectors would be former drug enforcement agents. if the feds. want a reason to be in our business, this would give them a perfect opportunity.
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