What statement best describes your view on torture?

[Lone_Wolf_Moderate]

First off, let me be clear. I've no interest in starting a flame war. I think we can all agree that as a general rule, torture is wrong. Of course, besides the gray areas in which interrogation techniques are used that aren't necessarily torture, but not practices we really want to make a standard practice, there are a few questions I wish to pose:

If you knew for a fact that torturing prisoners in extreme circumstances would provide good intel and save American lives, would you approve, in those extreme cases?

What is the primary reason behind the prohinition of torture, besides the obvious one of preserving our American values? Is there any leeway at all?

Keeping this simple: If a soldier captures a high-ranking al-Qaeda agent, say even OBL himself, and you know that torture will net good intel in order to thwart the next terrorist attack. Does the soldier risk prosecution in order to save lives? Do we legalize torture in that instance?


BTW, I'm of the belief that torture should always be illegal and basically wrong. Americans don't torture. I'm not defnding this position, but there's an interesting argument floating around that suggests that we should keep torture illegal, and thus make the cost of torture so high that its only used in the rarest instances, meaning that soldiers risk prosecution.


UPDATE: I'm beginning to see a flaw in my poll (it's late). I'm trying to focus the debate on the gray areas, in which tactics could be used that may or may not be in accordance with our acceptable norms for interrogation (not what we ought to be doing), but may or may not save lives. It should be made clear that clear-cut examples of torture are ALWAYS wrong, and I can see no instance in which any benefits that may or may not exist could offset that obvious costs.

[w13rd0]

1. I selected the third option...

...because in your hypothetical, you presume that good intel can be gained via torture. In and of itself, that's a flawed assumption. You can't assume that torture will result in actionable intelligence, and most often, does not. Torture is a TERROR tool, used to terrorize the civilian population with fear of shadow prisons and cruel, inhumane treatment. It's never been demonstrated that torture yields reliable intel.

The Bush/Cheney desire to "keep the option open" is a psyops terror technique. They are trying to appear to be cowboys, willing to do anything. Now, we now already that this is true, but we also know that the anything they'd like to do is what is best for them and their sponsors, not for the soldiers, and not for the citizens of the US.

I say we see if Cheney will give up the details of his energy meetings and the transcripts of the WHIG under torture. Think he'd crack?

Torture is wrong, and it's not the soldiers that should be prosecuted, it's the Administration that gave rise to this mentality. Bush and Cheney are terrorists, and they should be treated as such.

[Lone_Wolf_Moderate]

3. I left the option open as to whether torture does in fact yield

actionable intel or not, or the option that that torture is bad regardless.

[Just Me]

2. Illegal, immoral, barbaric, ineffective, always wrong. n/t

[FSogol]

4. I picked the 3rd option, but #1 is correct also. n/t

[Eugene]

5. Three words: Ibn al-Shaykh al-Libi

Al-Libi is a captured high ranking al-Qaeda leader.
The U.S. tortured him using the "ticking bomb" justification.
The information he gave was mostly false.

Every torturer claims some kind of justification.
The excuse never washes.

I voted for #1 (never justified) but #3 (not worth it) is also true.

[MarianJack]

6. Once Upon A Time,...

...our enemies became our friends because of how well we treated our prisoners!

The torture administration is guaranteeing that the troops that they "support" will be tortured by those who capture them!

[OneBlueSky]

7. torture is a barbaric act that effectively separates us . . .

from the family of civilized nations . . . between torture and the use of weapons like depleted uranium and white phosphorus, the US is fast becoming a nation of international ghouls . . .