George Galloway cuddles up to the dictator of Syria

[geek tragedy]

I guess he just has a fetish for Baathist strongmen:

http://www.champress.net/english/index.php?page=show_det&id=1127

<snip>President Bashar al-Assad’s speech is a pride for every honest and free Arab, British MP said in a dialogue symposium in Damascus University yesterday.
Pressures which Syria is exposed to comes in the framework of the US-Zionist schemes to hegemony the region and size its treasures,” George Galloway added, stressing that no free Arab country can accept the aggression on Syria .
“ It is the time for all honest all over the world to stand by Syria to confront such pressures and deluding campaigns she is facing due to her principled national stances.” He noted.
Galloway criticized report of the UN investigation committee on assassination of former Lebanese Premier Rafik Hariri, saying: “ The report was prepared in advance as it was planned to and to the assassination crime by Syria ’s enemies.”
He also criticized those who call themselves as “ Syrian opposition” clarifying that the real national opposition is to stand by your country and not against it to serve own interests at the expense of the peoples blood.
“ The strong national unity and religious coexistence that Syria enjoys will be a well-fortified front in the face of all the greedy who work to draw a new map for the region through dividing it into small conflicted states easy to be controlled on the pretext of spreading democracy.” Galloway said.
<snip>

For all those Galloway fans, please tell me who else has been talking like this recently: He also criticized those who call themselves as “ Syrian opposition” clarifying that the real national opposition is to stand by your country and not against it to serve own interests at the expense of the peoples blood.

[400Years]

1. blah blah blah

So are you joining up for the invasion of Syria, geek?

[geek tragedy]

2. No, but I'm not going to support a fascist dictator either.

I'm not with Bush. Unlike Galloway, I'm not with the dictator of Syria either.

[dutchdemocrat]

6. Brainwashed.

"...the real national opposition is to stand by your country"

I agree

"...not against it - to serve own interests at the expense of the people's blood. "'

I agree

That sounds more like Cheney doesn't it? What's wrong with this statement? People who put their own interests or the interests of those who paid for their way into power are dispicable.

I also agree with Galloway on this.

"... framework of the US-Zionist schemes to hegemony the region and size its treasures"

And this...

"The strong national unity and religious coexistence that Syria enjoys will be a well-fortified front in the face of all the greedy who work to draw a new map for the region through dividing it into small conflicted states easy to be controlled on the pretext of spreading democracy." Galloway said.

He renewed criticism of the war on Iraq, inquiring why the U.S., as long as it claims democracy, didn’t stop its war on Iraq in spit of all anti-war demonstrations all over the world.

And I'd argue you that I would rather have a 'Bathist Thug' like Bashar al-Assad, or a man who's not afraid to say what needs to be said like Galloway than the 'fundamentalist Christian war monger' and terrorist like George Bush who is responsible for more death and destruction than any dollar a dozen Muslim 'strongman'.

Pakistan's President Pervez Musharraf makes al-Assad look like Ghandi with his nuke peddling scientists and iron fist in his part of Asia.

What's your beef with Galloway anyway? And what do you really understand or know about Syria or al-Assad that has not been beaten into your head by the US press?

[geek tragedy]

11. I don't belong to the 'fascist left.'

So no, I'm not a big fan of Galloway, Assad, and Tariq Aziz.

And the suggestion that people who disapprove of fascist dictators are 'brainwashed' is laughably idiotic.

On the other hand, you've just endorsed blatant fascist propaganda. Congrats.

[400Years]

22. There is no such thing

[geek tragedy]

29. Sure there is--just look at Galloway. eom

[400Years]

37. empty rhetoric

next!

[dutchdemocrat]

52. Fascist left

Is truly oxymoronic. And probably the funniest thing I have seen anyone pen in awhile.

George W. Bush is a fascist.

"Fascism is definitely and absolutely opposed to the doctrines of liberalism, both in the political and economic sphere. ... The Fascist State lays claim to rule in the economic field no less than in others; it makes its action felt throughout the length and breadth of the country by means of its corporate, social, and educational institutions, and all the political, economic, and spiritual forces of the nation, organised in their respective associations, circulate within the State." - Benito Mussolini, 1935, "The Doctrine of Fascism," Firenze: Vallecchi Editore.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

[400Years]

58. geek is just pushing Goebbels style rhetoric, keep it simple and repeat it

over and over and over again.

[geek tragedy]

65. No one has been able to deny my basic allegation.

Which of these is not true?:

A) Assad is the fascist dictator of Syria;

B) Galloway is a supporter of Assad.

[400Years]

71. Let's get beyond your simplistic thinking here

First, the whole world is filled with what are essentially fascist dictators including the U.S. and the U.K. Soft fascism and hard fascism are still two of the same. None of the West's involvement has resulted in anything other than secular dictatorships and these islamic nationalist movements have been a reaction to these dictatorships. Let's not forget the lesson of Iran here.

What people are opposing here is the implicit call for more Western intereference in the middle east.

Secondly, I see Galloway acting as trying to stop this process.
You can call that supporting Assad if you want. I don't care.

So, if you want to have a serious discussion lets do so but drop
the simplicities and act like a rational adult.

[geek tragedy]

74. Simplistic thinking is comparing the US and UK

to Syria.

[400Years]

79. Oh, did Syria invade Iraq? I missed that part.

Or maybe it was Assad who sent storm troopers to Miami to beat the shit out of people opposed to the FTAA.

And maybe it was Assad who stole the 2000 election.

Hell I guess I've missed out on some things here.

[geek tragedy]

85. Sorry, you obviously don't understand

what a dictatorship is.

Good luck.

[400Years]

91. I understand western intervention in the middle east and it's legacy

You don't.

[geek tragedy]

97. No, you can't comprehend how someone could wish that people

would overthrow their dictator without supporting outside intervention.

[400Years]

102. That is up to the people of Syria not the West, including you.

Your concern rings hollow.

And again you are obviously ignoring the legacy of Western intervention in middle eastern affairs.

[geek tragedy]

105. Then why is Galloway in Syria supporting the dictator

against his domestic opposition?

If it's not up to me, it's not up to Galloway either.

[400Years]

108. So it's about Galloway and not the people of Syria.

Thanks for playing you have just shown that all your ranting is really about your hatred of Galloway and not your "love" for the people of Syria. Now aside from your simplistic rhetoric and back to reality it is pretty clear Galloway is trying to stop the PNAC agenda and that is more of a non-intervention of middle eastern affairs than your agenda.

[geek tragedy]

62. And that describes the regime in Syria perfectly.

So tell me, why is Galloway sucking up to a fascist dictator?

[iconoclastNYC]

32. Excellent post.

How many democratically elected governments have the NEOCONS in the CIA toppled and replaced with US friendly dictatorships?

<>

[geek tragedy]

45. So, it's okay for the left to support fascists now that the

right no longer does?

[400Years]

53. By your logic, if you don't help invade Syria you are a "fascist" lover

Now are you gonna help invade Syria or be a "fascist"?

Yes, I am being as simplistic as you are.

This whole black and white bull you are pushing is very similar to bush.

[geek tragedy]

66. Sorry, I guess you just don't get the nuance of opposing war and

fascism at the same time.

[400Years]

76. it is your zero sum rhetoric that betrays you

Maybe you just hate Galloway, but I don't see you offering anything of substance here. What is your solution becuase if you go around calling for more Western interference in the Middle East you won't get anything better than what you are whining about now and I know you know that so what is your real agenda I ask?

[geek tragedy]

78. My agenda is to expose fake progressives for what they are.

People who cuddle up to and support fascist dictatorships should be shunned, not praised by progressives.

[400Years]

82. By what installing corporate friendly dictators all over the middle east

Your are obviously calling for regime change in Syria. So what is your real agenda here?

[geek tragedy]

88. OPPOSING FASCISM IS NOT THE SAME THING AS SUPPORTING

BUSH'S WARS.

Christ, it's like debating goddamn freepers.

[400Years]

95. You and your black and white rhetoric is what is freeperish here

And your refusal to understand why people are against more and more western involvement in middle eastern affairs. And the fact that Galloway is trying to stop it.

[geek tragedy]

98. True or false:

A person can oppose US intervention in the Mideast without supporting and praising the authoritarian dictators there?

[400Years]

106. Show me one western installed middle eastern regime that is

anything other than a dictatorship.

Saddam? Nope.
The Shah? Nope.
Chalabi? Gimme a fucking break.

That is what Galloway is opposing, your simplistic characterizatons aside. Other than that I could give a shit about Galloway.

[geek tragedy]

107. So, you're with Bush or with the fascists in Syria?

Sorry, I don't buy that from freepers. Not going to buy it from people on the left either.

[400Years]

110. No, you're either in favor of meddling in the ME or you are not.

If the people of Syria want to overthrow Assad that's great. I'll be happy to watch them do that. In fact, without the convenient boogie man of the "Western devils" the people of Iran would have overthrown the rule of the clerics a long time ago.

[PassingFair]

9. We know, we know....

you're with Israel. Period.

[geek tragedy]

13. It's about a fake progressive supporting a fascist, not about Israel.

Do people really need to be have explained to them that fascist dictators are bad and shouldn't be praised and supported by people who call themselves progressives?

[400Years]

23. no it's about you spreading the same old tired bullshit

[geek tragedy]

28. What's bullshit--the fact that Assad is a fascist dictator

or that Galloway is one of his supporters?

[400Years]

35. Your characterizatons and supposed concern

I don't buy any of it.

[geek tragedy]

38. Well, go on supporting fascists like Assad then. eom

[400Years]

How am I doing that? By not buying into your fantasy?

You have no solutions to anything yet you go around trying to smear Galloway.

[geek tragedy]

43. Is Assad a fascist?

If so, is it wrong for Galloway to support him?

[400Years]

47. Compared to Chalabi?

[geek tragedy]

50. Chalabi is a criminal and a scoundrel. Assad is a fascist dictator.

Neither of them deserve support, and shame on anyone who does support them.

[400Years]

63. You are obsessed with Galloway

He speaks out against Blair and Bush. Good for him but big fucking deal. I'll be happy to listen to Galloway berate Blair all day long.

[Demit]

3. That is some painful translation. eom

[wtmusic]

4. Invade! Invade!

Reforms not going fast enough for you, Geek? I know--if only Assad could rule like that freethinking King Fahd :eyes:

[geek tragedy]

5. Reform?

Sucking up to a secular dictator is no better than sucking up to theocrats and monarchs.

Amazing what people will defend because one of their sacred cows says it. Galloway is praising fascism and people here agree with him.

Amazing.

[confludemocrat]

17. yeah, let's purify the middle east so islamo- not secular fascists rule

along with feudal monarchs (S. Arabia, Kuwait, Jordan) or our todies (Egypt), so there will be endless turmoil, all to make Israel safer.

[geek tragedy]

19. Why are so many Galloway fans obsessed with Israel?

This is about SUPPORT FOR FASCISM.

NOT ISRAEL.

[Jacobin]

7. Yes, we must invade now "before its too late"

The United States has a responsibility to rid the world of all governments that we don't approve of.

Now, whose sons will I send to do the dirty work....surely, not mine...

[sui generis]

8. let me guess at the linkages here

if you aren't utterly mindlessly exclusively pro-Israel you must be scorned into oblivion.

Yawn.

I would rather everyone just tried a little harder to hear each other rather than pre-judge everything. Also, the subtleties of this post elude me.

Can we state what we mean more plainly than using language like "Syria's enemies", "Baathist supporters", etc. Just come out and say it.

I will. We are not ready to invade Syria because Israel would like to see them subjugated and off the political map. We are not Israel's butt-monkey - and IF Syria is a threat to legal American interests it is going to have to be established with a great deal more veracity than the last illegal war we jumped into.

[geek tragedy]

14. It's not about Israel. It's about praising and supporting a fascist

dictator.

If you support fascism, you lose the moral authority to criticize Bush. Period.

[sui generis]

27. Period.

What an odd way to defend not attacking Bush. Question mark.

The only thing I find more questionable than the authoritarian right is the authoritarian left. It's funny that they both agree that fascism is more criminal than authoritarianism.

Quite frankly I don't understand the teleology of this thread.

[rinsd]

10. LOL...everyone misses the point....

It's not let's invade Syria.

It's supposed hero of DU for thumbing his nose at Bush is actually a closet fascist. Read that last line for crissakes.

[geek tragedy]

12. What, progressives are supposed to OPPOSE fascists?

Somebody better tell Galloway and his fans.

[rinsd]

80. You say fascism....

...I say authoritarian secularized quasi socialistic moxy to fight the imperial hordes!

Its po-tay-to, po-tah-to.

What really makes me laugh is people thinking you are advocating war.

[H2O Man]

15. I like Galloway.

Might not agree with every word out of his mouth, nor with every opinion he holds. But it is a potential advantage to have people from western culture who can communicate with people from the middle east .... and I am thinking in broader terms than Cheney and Chalabi, or Bush and the "Royal Family."

I remember when we were warned about how dangerous MLK was, because he broke bread with communists.

[geek tragedy]

16. MLK would NEVER praise a fascist dictator.

It's an insult to his name to even suggest that.

[400Years]

21. Are you Syrian?

[geek tragedy]

26. How is that possibly relevant?

I'm not Italian, but I know that Mussolini was a fascist dictator.

[400Years]

30. Just curious, what are you gonna do about your "enemy" in Syria?

[geek tragedy]

33. I certainly don't think invasion is warranted. The Syrians themselves

should overthrow the thugocracy that rules that country.

See? One can oppose a fascist regime AND oppose a US invasion.

[400Years]

39. So this is a Syrian issue?

[geek tragedy]

42. Opposition and support for fascism is a universal issue.

Anti-fascism is a core progressive value. If you don't oppose fascism, you're not a progressive. Period. End of story.

[400Years]

49. So again are you going to help invade Syria?

[geek tragedy]

51. Do you not understand that a person can oppose fascism without

advocating invasion from outside?

[400Years]

55. So are you gonna support "regime change" then?

[geek tragedy]

61. By the Syrian people, absolutely.

By the US military, no way in hell.

[H2O Man]

24. You suggested it. n/t

[geek tragedy]

31. I did no such thing.

It is a tremendous insult to compare MLK to a scoundrel like Galloway.

[H2O Man]

41. Sure you did.

The idea came from you, and you alone.

It is no insult to compare the closed minds that attempted to marginalize King with similar efforts to marginalize Galloway. And, of course, closed minds, like closed rooms, often become stuffy. That stuffiness can manifest itself in finding insult in other people's opinions. That is what King dealt with in the '50s and '60s. We face similar conditions today.

[geek tragedy]

44. MLK never supported fascism.

Galloway is here, on the record, supporting a fascist dictator.

Galloway is no MLK.

[H2O Man]

46. No one said he was.

I was comparing the ignorance of those who try to demonize Galloway, with those who demonized King. Perhaps you were so darned insulted, that the point was entirely lost .... but only to you.

King spoke about loving one's enemies, and he always was willing to communicate with those he opposed. He never demonized others in the way you are attempting to demonize Galloway.

[geek tragedy]

48. Galloway is supporting a fascist dictator.

Why doesn't this bother you?

[H2O Man]

54. One thing that is constant

is that people misrepresent things Galloway says or does, and then do the Chicken Little clucking routine. I'm unlikely to read another attack on him and believe the sky is falling, without listening to what he says about it. I am also hesitant to put much weight on something that uses words like "fascist" for emotional value, when the person uses it in an incorrect manner that suggests they haven't a clue what it means.

[400Years]

56. You are right, geek has no clue as to what the word "fascism" means

[H2O Man]

59. It is interesting

in light of the fact that Galloway is so talented with words. A person may not agree with his views, but can recognize his skills with language. Words have power, and those who do not understand the meaning of words cannot appreciate that power.

[geek tragedy]

68. No, I know exactly what fascism means.

Saddam was a fascist. Syria is ruled by fascists.

The only people who don't are those defending Assad in this thread.

[H2O Man]

73. If you really do,

I'm surprised that you continue to hide it.

[geek tragedy]

75. How is Assad not a fascist?

He came to power because he was chosen to succeed his father, the prior fascist dictator who was infamous for torture and mass murder.

He is kept in power by the same brutal regime and party that kept his father in power.

His regime is an absolute authoritarian one which crushes any attempt at dissent.

[rinsd]

87. But did he criticize Bush?

You should know by now that singular quality overrides all.

Basically that same BS that got us into this mess in the first place by siding with asshat dictators because they were against the Soviet Union, a large segment DU does with anyone critical of Bush.

[geek tragedy]

90. The enemy of my enemy is my friend, I guess.

Ironic that people who hate Bush so much set their moral compass by him.

[H2O Man]

89. The ball is

in your court. You need to define fascism, and then apply the correct definition to Assad. History is filled with numerous dictators, often from hereditary lines, who were brutal thugs, but were in no way part of a fascist system.

[geek tragedy]

94. Here ya go:

fas·cism ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fshzm)
n.
often Fascism
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.
A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.
Oppressive, dictatorial control.
*********************************************
Let's see:


System of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator? Check

Stringent socioeconomic controls? Check
Suppression of opposition through terror and censorship? Check
Typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism? Check

[400Years]

99. That describes bush perfectly

[geek tragedy]

103. Where did I praise Bush?

Btw, the US is not a fascist dictatorship.

Seriously, folks who think the US is a fascist dictatorship but that Syria isn't don't live in a reality-based community.

[geek tragedy]

67. So you deny that Syria is ruled by a fascist dictatorship? eom

[Beelzebud]

57. Galloway is no Martin Luthar King.... Jeez...

He makes Norm Coleman look like a scared little boy, and that rises to the level of MLK?

Give me a fucking break...

[H2O Man]

60. You are silly.

Not serious, but certainly silly.

[Beelzebud]

64. No, you are silly for attempting to bring MLK into this.

[H2O Man]

70. Reading comprehension

is a skill, I suppose, that some lack.

[Beelzebud]

77. I comprehend just fine. Galloway is not a MLK.

Yes people tried to say MLK was a communist.

I got your drift just fine, I just don't think it's reasonable comparison.

What has Galloway done to rise to that level? Was he not hamming it up with a dictator?

What has Galloway done that seems to inspires such blind devotion to some?

[H2O Man]

84. I guess you

are taking a short-cut to logical thinking, which explains your error. I compared the demonization of King and Galloway, which in both cases included people saying they pose(d) dangers because of people they were associated with. Geek and you have difficulty distinguishing between the comparison of those tactics -- which I clearly did comment upon -- with a comparison of King and Galloway, which I did not. Hence, I can safely say you did not get my drift.

[Beelzebud]

93. No I got your drift. It's just that Galloway deserves to be criticized

for this.

MLK did not.

They are saying this stuff about Galloway because it's true. They said those things about MLK because they didn't like his power, and his message.

That is the difference.

Galloway is not a liberal. He WAS rubbing elbows with the Dictator of Syria.

And while I'm not advocating we invade Syria, I also don't think that means we have to like them, either.

[Malikshah]

18. Here we go again....boom--boom--boom

Drums in the deep....

They're coming...


Look out Pippin!!!

Some folks need to get over themselves in the very biggest way.

Perpetual victimhood/delusions of bogeymen --- it all gets tiresome.

[geek tragedy]

20. Galloway is praising Saruman while opposing Sauron.

Doesn't work that way in the real world. Either you oppose fascism or you don't.

Galloway doesn't.

[Malikshah]

25. I'll give partical credit-- at least there's a constant response

Oh to have a "whatever" emoticon.

This is old and tired...

We got enough crazy black/white/cosmic dualism at the moment

Do come back though--

Really, though....did Galloway pee in somebody's Wheaties recently? Fess up. ;)

[geek tragedy]

36. No, I just hope in vain that folks realize that Galloway

is no progressive.

But, I guess his praise of fascists and collaboration with radical Islamists isn't enough for some people.

[Malikshah]

92. Nah...it's rather the bellowing of those

who wish to attack Syria for whatever nefarious reasons...

Marks for subtle tone: 0
Marks for hyperbole: 90
Marks for tiresome-ness:90

[geek tragedy]

101. I oppose a US invasion of Syria.

However, I also recognize that Assad is a dictator deserving of scorn, not praise.

That makes me a progressive, as opposed to a neocon imperialist like Bush/Cheney or a supporter of fascism like Galloway.

[wtmusic]

34. What "doesn't work" in the real world

is equating Assad to Saddam Hussein. Wait -- that "black and white" kind of thinking seems awfully familiar...

[geek tragedy]

40. Assad is a dictator in a Baathist regime.

True, he hasn't committed the horrific crimes that Saddam did.

Of course, Assad's daddy did massacre people by the thousands. But, who cares about that, right? After all, it wasn't the US or Israel, so those victims don't count.

[Catrina]

69. How is Assad a 'fascist'?

Personally, I'm not all that interested in Syria. Our own fascist government is of more concern to me right now, (read Michael Ledeen, top advisor to the POTUS, especially on the Iraq War, if you're concerned about Fascisim, btw).

I think Israel should, by your logic, distance itself from Michael Ledeen, who has written of his admiration for fascism, yet they have not! Does this make Israel a supporter of fascism? And if so, by this tortured logic, shouldn't Michael Ledeen and his neoncon supporters, (and of course, Israel, so long as they work in concert with the neocons) be admirers of Assad, who, if you are correct, shares their idealogy?

It does get complicated when the objective is to smear a man who has been outspoken against the fascistic ideology of invading sovereign nations for the purpose of setting them up for corporatism.

I fail to see how Galloway, who opposed the war in Iraq, opposes the invasion of Syria, Iran or any other nation the neocons have on their list of countries to first 'creatively demolish, and then reconstruct according to THEIR idea of how the US should position itself in the New American Cenrury, can be accused of supporting fascism. If he did, he would be on board with the neocons, would he not?

[geek tragedy]

72. If you don't know why Assad would be considered a fascist, you need to do

some research.

Here's a starter:

http://www.boston.com/news/world/middleeast/articles/2005/11/06/in_syria_a_sagging_opposition/

[Name removed]

86. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[geek tragedy]

96. Sarcasm alert!

I hope.

[maximovich]

100. You Are Dodging the Question

How is he a fascist? Stop playing games and spreading Neo-Con crap.

[geek tragedy]

104. Anyone who asks that question is IGNORANT

of the reality of Syria's government.

Seriously, five minutes of research will show Syria's government to be a fascist authoritarian regime.

[maximovich]

109. Others Seem Convinced Otherwise

and you still haven't answered the question, yet accuse those who seem interested of being ignorant. I think it is you who is ignorant and full of shit, because YOU CAN'T answer the question, can you?

YOU MADE The accusation that he is a Fascist... you should be able to back that accusation.

[Cleita]

83. So by your logic Assad should be made to

pay for what his father did? By your logic, we should topple Bush for what his father did. Yes, Bush should go but not because of what his father did.

BTW, shouldn't we be concerned with overthrowing our own homegrown dictator, instead of someone elses? I agree with you that the people of Syria need to change their government if they are dissatisfied with it.

We should concentrate on our own. Also, Galloway is not a politician in the USA, so who cares what he says unless it's about the USA?

[0rganism]

81. Yep, Galloway is no angel

There's no reason to lionize everything the man does just because we agree with some -- or even most -- of it. I suppose some of the kneejerk support he gets in these threads is due to the retaliatory smear campaign waged by Sen. Coleman's bunch. The tendency is to circle the wagons at such times, but I'd suppose Galloway to be capable of defending himself when it matters.

[EstimatedProphet]

111. Locking

This thread is an exercise in baiting and personal attacks.