Isn't Clark basically a Colin Powell...

[uconnyc]

who decided to join the Democratic Party?

If Colin Powell would have run as a Democrat against Gore and Bradley in 2000, would Democrats have welcomed him as a candidate?

[KittyWampus]

1. Colin Is A Company Man

Who strictly follows orders.

Clark proved in Kosovo that he would not let the conservative forces
control his sphere of influence.

[WillyBrandt]

2. Powell did not believe in fighting for human rights

for one. And his penchant for going to the UN had more to do with his caution and his conservatism (in the real meaning of "conservatism") than any deep belief in the value of international institutions.

If we can judge by his son's actions on the FCC, he's got that free-market ideologue gene. (Yes, unfair analysis.) Clark is NOT a mindless worshipper of the market.

Sorry, different guys.

[RichM]

3. Of course Democrats would have welcomed him. Democrats would

welcome Bush himself as a candidate, if he was willing to run as a Democrat. There is no principle that Democrats are not willing to be, ahh, "flexible" about, if the payoff seems good.

[WillyBrandt]

5. Excepting, you know, the exceptions

'There is no principle that Democrats are not willing to be, ahh, "flexible" about, if the payoff seems good.'

Except for extremist, right-wing judges and pandering to racism in order to win elections.

[RichM]

20. Wasn't the Sister Souljah incident an example of pandering to racism

in order to win elections? Wasn't "Welfare Reform," as well?

[noiretextatique]

22. YES...correct on both counts

:grr: and i'm STILL pissed about clinton's staged 'stunt'... and pissed that it worked, as planned.

[uconnyc]

10. My point being

if Colin Powell was not part of the Bush admin. and was working on Wall Street or for CNN as a military analyst and decided to run for Democratic nomination today - wouldn't he be very similar to Clark as a candidate and how Democrats viewed him (both in a positive and negative sense)?

[WillyBrandt]

13. Not really

Except for racial issues, Powell hasn't piped up too much in a progressive way.

In the military, Clark was a proven liberal internationalist. Powell was a cautious conservative.

Powell has a bunch of GOP contributions recorded to all sorts of Republicans. Clark's only contribution, and his only record campaigning post-military, has been for Democrats.

Moreover, Powell publically went against Clinton on the gays in the military fiasco, instead of maintaining a semblance of distance and neutrality.

He's a black avatar of old-style cautious Republicanism. I actually respect that point of view in a way, insofar as I can deal with it without crying. It's not radicalism.

But it's also not Clark.

[RichM]

14. Yes, of course. However, don't expect a Dem Party loyalist to be honest

enough to admit it.

[noiretextatique]

19. YES nt

[uberotto]

17. While your statement is somewhat true...

You probably could have phrased it a little better. Maybe something like this:

"Many democrats will often show a great deal of forgivness to any individual or group which is willing to understand, while not necessarily admitting to, the errors of their past days, and who will claim to make the effort to live their remaining days following the values and principals outlined by the democratic party."

Just a suggestion.

[noiretextatique]

18. actually, some democrats DID welcome him...until he fell out of favor

i remember the posts here about powell running as a democrat...made my skin crawl then, and now.

[fujiyama]

4. They may have...

but he probably wouldn't have won the nomination. Gore had served 8 years as vice president and always had shown presidential ambitions. He had served as a "party insider" and DLC bigwig for many years. Bradley really never had much of a chance though his independent styled campaign did have some admirers (including myself).

[Mz Pip]

6. I've never figured out

why Powell is a Republican.

I remember Powell saying that he would be will to work for either adminsistration. That seemed to piss of the Republicans more than the Dems. But he sold his soul to the devil. He's been out there front and center with the lies.

MzPip
:dem:

[mikehiggins]

7. Colin Powell

would have been welcomed if he had entered the race on the Democratic ticket. Many had approached him on just that topic but he opted not to.

Incidentally, while he wouldn't comment on Clark's campaign, Powell said he had been an outstanding officer when Lieutenant Colonel Clark served under his command years ago.

[newyawker99]

25. Hi mikehiggins!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[catforclark2004]

8. Considering his son, and what he's doing.......

Too loyal to his masters. I would have back in 2001, but not after the UN Iraq presentation. That kinda of sealed his fate for me.

[tabasco]

9. Yeah, right.

They were both in the Army, so they MUST be the same. It's a big army, pal. Powell does not have the moral courage to be a good Democrat.

[uconnyc]

12. I'm talking pre Bush administration!!!

Forget him as a candidate now. I have lost respect for him, as most here, but how about a few years back, how would he have been any different than Clark is now??

I am not trying to pu Clark down or put Powell up, just asking a question.

[tabasco]

15. An impossible hypothetical

Nobody knew about Powell's politics right after he came out of the Army. Military officers are required to remain non-political. If Powell had come out and said he supports a whole bunch of Democratic principles, and backed it up in debates, like Clark has, I'm sure he would have been welcomed as a candidate. But he was drawn to the conservatives, and has loyally served the most destructive regime in this nation's history.

[noiretextatique]

21. when did clark get out of the military?

it must have been fairly recent.

[PurityOfEssence]

11. Much as he bugs me, Clark is incomparably more ethical

Powell has sold his soul so thoroughly, it's merely a testament to his stubbornness that he's still there. Any underpinning of morality has long-since been torn out and discarded. If there was anything "pure" about his conservatism, even that has been shat upon by this mob of devious thieves.

Colin has painted himself into a corner, and he will only be able to fool a few--perhaps himself, too--in his waning years. Let's just call it wrecktitude.

Clark, regardless how much of the nastiness said about him is true, actually does seem to have his heart more or less in the right place.

[wtmusic]

16. His heart may be in the right place?

"I'm very glad we've got the great team in office, men like Colin Powell, Don Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney, Condoleezza Rice... people I know very well - our president George W. Bush. We need them there." - Clark in remarks delivered at the Pulaski County GOP Lincoln Day Dinner in Little Rock, Arkansas on May 11, 2001

Clark is all over the map with his allegiances. When push comes to shove and hundreds of billions in defense spending are on the line, he's going to give peace a chance? Forget it.

[Skwmom]

32. Did you ever consider the point of Clark's speech?

He was trying to get them to come around to his point of view. What was he supposed to do, tell them they were a worthless bunch of greedy idiots.

[Kahuna]

23. Clark is a maverick, not a lemming like Powell.

nt

[blkgrl]

24. Yes he is, and yes we would have

If Colin Powell would have run as a Democrat against Gore and Bradley in 2000, would Democrats have welcomed him as a candidate?

Then again, his campaign probably would have been dismissed as unrealistic because he's black, similar to the way Sharpton and Braun have been dismissed.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

28. When he toyed with running in 96

Colin Powell was actually beating Clinton in head to head matchups...

Middle America sees Colin Powell as having gravitas and being non-threatening....

I don't know if it's possible to "transcend" race in this country or a-n-y country but Colin Powell has enormous appeal to middle America...

He still polls better than any Bush official despite carrying out the administration's plans....

[union_maid]

29. If is such a big word. He didn't do that.

Of course, if he had joined the Democrats it probably would have allowed him to keep his soul and not sell it off to Bushco. He didn't join the Democrats and he's spent the last couple of years defending positions that he does not seem to have actually held.

[maha]

26. Yeah, and all black people are just alike, too.

It's the uniform, I guess. People can't see past it even when they stop wearing it ...

[IndianaGreen]

27. Colin Powell is a pathological liar

I don't think that Clark is on the same level as Powell.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

30. Colin Powell's Stance On Gays In The Military

would have destroyed him in the Democratic primaries....

[robbedvoter]

31. Clark lied, covered up - what? General is not synonymous with Powell

(See Zinni). In fact, Clark is in every way the opposite of Powell.