Who will be FIRST Democrat to say I was lied to by Administration/Iraq

[KoKo]

How many will come out and say I wish I had not voted for the Iraq War Resolution?

Or, will they join the Repugs in the trashing of Fitzgerald and throw smokescreens up and mirrors to reflect whichever way the Repugs spin?

Should those who "play along" so they can get re-elected get our vote anyway? Should those Dems in conservative areas play along because to admit they were wrong might lose them their seats? Or, should they gamble that declaring they were "LIED TO" (and they need to say "LIED"}
will gain them more votes than if they didn't, given the mood of the country about what Iraq has cost.

I say, it's time to throw the Dino's out. But, it would come at a cost.

[Maddy McCall]

1. Did not Kerry already say so?

[Mass]

3. Plenty of people said so, some more loudly than others.

No sure that Kerry said it in so many words (he certainly implied it more than once), but I know some have.

[ray of light]

8. yes, he did.

Though he may have not said specifically "Bush Lied." He did say close to that.

[globalvillage]

38. Several times that I know of.

He also said bush* lied, but I can't find the quote. Here are a few good ones, though.


my regret is that this President proved he not only didn’t know how to do it right, but was prepared to go back on his promises, be deceptive, and mislead the nation. I regret that he did that, and I regret that I put any trust in him at all. I shouldn’t have, obviously.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/122203A.shtml



<snip>
Did I think Bush was going to charge unilaterally into war? No. Did I think he would make such an incredible mess of the situation? No. Am I angry about it? You're God damned right I am. I chose to believe the President of the United States. That was a terrible mistake."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/121003A.shtml

edit here's the one I was thinking of. Interesting how he was bashed by both sides for saying it.

Senate leaders from both parties heading an inquiry of intelligence information on Iraq yesterday repudiated Sen. John Kerry's accusation that the Bush administration misled the country into war, and accused him of political posturing.

Mr. Kerry made the accusations against Mr. Bush while campaigning in Lebanon, N.H., on Wednesday.
"I will not let off the hook throughout this campaign with respect to America's credibility and credibility to me, because if he lied, he lied to me personally. I believe I can hold President Bush accountable if they have misled us," Mr. Kerry said.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20030623-122726-4425r.htm

[spanone]

2. This should be the Democrats Mantra. We were LIED to War.

[cassiepriam]

6. YES YES YES The dems were lied to.

[SoFlaJet]

7. damn good one too

it's gonna take 3-5 word mantras as you call them-culture of corruption we were lied to war.LEARN from the neo cons they have done a good job at realizing that Murica is pretty much a sound bite fast food society.

[Tiggeroshii]

4. Kerry said a number of times using the words "I was mislead by the

president"

[spanone]

9. Time for the LIE word. I hate that mis-spoke bullshit.

They Fucking Lied. Cheney, Bush*, Perle, Wolfowitz, Libby, Rove, Rumsfeld, Myers, Powell...ad naseum.

:toast: :toast: :toast: :toast: :toast: :toast:

[Dr Fate]

16. I agree- they need to say that actual words "Lie", "Lied" & "Lying."

n/t

[Tiggeroshii]

31. i second that.

"Those lying asswipes lied their sorry, shameless butts off, and they need to be dealt with appropriately"

[Raksha]

28. I want them to use the word LIE. BushCo LIED to them

and I want them to SAY so, dammit! Not "misspoke"....LIED!

[ourbluenation]

5. Boxer said it last week straight to Condi's gap toothed face. eom

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

12. The difference with Boxer is that she KNEW that they were lying and

voted against the war resolution with 21 other Senators.

Here is the list

Grouped By Vote Position YEAs ---77
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bayh (D-IN)
Bennett (R-UT)
Biden (D-DE)
Bond (R-MO)
Breaux (D-LA)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Campbell (R-CO)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carnahan (D-MO)
Carper (D-DE)
Cleland (D-GA)
Clinton (D-NY)
Cochran (R-MS)
Collins (R-ME)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
Daschle (D-SD)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dodd (D-CT)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Edwards (D-NC)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Fitzgerald (R-IL)
Frist (R-TN)
Gramm (R-TX)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Harkin (D-IA)
Hatch (R-UT)
Helms (R-NC)
Hollings (D-SC)
Hutchinson (R-AR)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Miller (D-GA)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-FL)
Nelson (D-NE)
Nickles (R-OK)
Reid (D-NV)
Roberts (R-KS)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Santorum (R-PA)
Schumer (D-NY)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Smith (R-NH)
Smith (R-OR)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thompson (R-TN)
Thurmond (R-SC)
Torricelli (D-NJ)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)

NAYs ---23
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chafee (R-RI)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Graham (D-FL)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)

[ourbluenation]

15. Given - but she did say it again last week...just saying. :)

[Tiggeroshii]

33. Good ol' Chaffee actually thinking

about things. Too bad his chances of making it back are slim. I think if he wins his seat back he'll most likely switch.

[dchill]

43. That list is just pathetic...

I've known for almost 7 years that Bush would pick a fight with Saddam - I've got the internets. These Dems were playing a game with our sons' and daughters' lives - which is just as bad as the Republicans. They were afraid to appear "soft on terror" - so now they just prove that they were soft in the head.

Time to put up or shut up, all you macho war-mongering Dems. How many more have to die for the right of Republicans to steal our country?

[still_one]

10. I prefer the Democrats who don't have to say "I was lied to"

ones like Boxer, Feingold, Kucinich, Byrd, and others

These Democrats were not worried about political consequences, they had just as much knowledge as the rest of them.

[Mass]

17. So, we should forget Robert Kennedy because at some point he

supported the Vietnam War?

I think there is no problem with people who recognized their vote was a mistake. Only stupid people never change their mind (eg Bush).

[still_one]

32. it is NOT only about the war

it is also about the patriot act, the bankrupcy law, in fact rubber stamping almost everything this administration has done

but most important, CONGRESS DID NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY, TO GIVE UP ITS CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO DECLARE WAR, and those who did, should NOT be rewarded!!!

[Mass]

34. As I said, if somebody was wrong and recognizes it, I am ready

to consider this person (on whatever issue, including the Energy Bill that is literally killing our country on so many aspects).

There is a wonderful saying in French (Il n'y a que les imbeciles qui ne changent pas d'avis - Only stupid people never change their mind). This has been my view for a very long time and I will stand for it.

Except that, no need to yell.

[still_one]

35. I agree in principle with the statement, and will consider it

but how do you distinguish political opportunism from sincerity?

[Zynx]

39. My problem is that it shows a lack of judgement.

Anyone can discover they made a mistake. The fact that they made a large mistake is something to be concerned about.

[Mass]

40. May be concerned, but it should be compared to the rest of somebody's

record.

Bob Kennedy certainly made a lot of things he eventually regretted (from the Macarthy Commission to supporting the VietNam War for too long), but this should not erase what he became as Senator of New York and the wonderful president he could have been.

I was still a child during this period, but it is certainly somebody that I would have been proud to support.

[Zynx]

44. Looking back from a purely cold, historical perspective....

I'm not sure what kind of president he might have been. I've never been a particularly big fan of Bobby Kennedy or his brother for that matter. I wasn't alive at the time, but as an amateur presidential historian, I am not impressed with either one.

[FreedomAngel82]

47. True

While they shouldn't have voted for it and should've stud up and said "no fucking way" I do think that stating clearly and plainly it was wrong and it was a lie and going around and telling people and working on a way to get out and actually honor those who have fallen is better than just keeping on the course and being like Bush. Admitting a mistake does take cuts cause nobody likes to be wrong.

[leftchick]

11. only the Dems that are not profitting some way from the war

and don't look for any DLCers to be speaking out.

[FreedomAngel82]

48. If you haven't noticed

Kerry is a DLCer and he has been hitting everything pretty hard. Have you seen some of his floor speeches?

[leftchick]

49. kerry ....

he lost any support of mine on Nov. 3 2004. I think if he is finally denouncing his pro-war vote he is the only DLCer to my knowledge that is. Has he said he was wrong to give the chimp what he wanted? If so good on him for finally acknowledging the obvious.

[Mark E. Smith]

13. I'm Sick Of Dem Bashing

Not one single Democrat has come out in opposition to Fitzgerald's investigation. Not a single one.

Your suggestion that such a thing is possible is an utterly bullshit hypothetical, one that stinks so bad I can only wonder about your true motives.

[emulatorloo]

14. Democrats are not attacking Fitzgerald. So stop claiming they are.

EOM

[AlCzervik]

18. I believe both parties were lied to. Better question-who be the 1st Goper

to say that?

[GreenArrow]

24. I believe the American People were lied to

The Congress knew better. Calling it a lie now, after the fact, doesn't wash. If the war were going well, no one would be talking about the lies.

[Mass]

19. Where does your point about Fitzgerald come?

Or, will they join the Repugs in the trashing of Fitzgerald and throw smokescreens up and mirrors to reflect whichever way the Repugs spin?

I did not see any evidence of that. For the rest, plenty of Dems said they were lied to.

[KoKo]

22. We have some DINO Dems who will follow the Repug spin. They may

be in "unsafe seats" in conservative areas. They may be invited on the Pundit Shows because their views will be like the Repugs...Fitzgerald overeached. They may say: "we need to move on about Iraq and not dwell on the past."

I'm thinking of Joe Lieberman for one who may very well be seen on the pundit shows downplaying what Fitz comes up with.

[McCamy Taylor]

20. Remember MAX CLELAND Before You Start Throwing Stones

The GOP used the MSM and later E- Vote Fraud in Georgia to create the myth that if you did not support the war effort you would be voted out of office---and a Repub would take your seat.

However, I want to see this phrased a different way. Who will be the first smart Democrat to stand up and say "You know folks, we played non-partisan politics, we supported a bipartisan war to protect American, and that son of a gun Bush LIED to us. Maybe bipartisn only works when Democrats are in power."?

[KoKo]

23. That's an excellent way of phrasing it....as long as Bush lied is in there

:-)'s I have no problem with what you say...it's exactly what I would want them to say.

[sandnsea]

36. Kerry has said that too

And has qualified the word lie because it's hard to prove somebody knowingly and willingly lied. Prove, like in a court of law with undeniable evidence that the majority of the country would believe. But he did say that decisions about war are not traditionally political. Presidents just don't politicize war intelligence and the Congress traditionally gives Presidents the benefit of the doubt on matters of national security. He has said that. He's also pushed for all the investigations, along with an investigation of the DSM. But that fell off the left wing radar when Rove's indictment started percolating to the top.

[Patsy Stone]

21. The point is that the American sheeple were lied to by the WH.

That's the message to send.

[KoKo]

25. I know, but WEcouldn't vote on it. Instead we wrote and called and

stood on street corners with signs and went to DC protesting to try to stop it. We monitored Senators Byrd and Kennedy for hours every day on C-Span where they warned the Senate "DON'T VOTE FOR THIS." Senator Byrd said if the Senate voted for the Iraq Resolution they would give away their last powers to the President and they might as well hang out a sign saying: "GONE FISHING!" (An exact quote from Byrd) But, the majority voted for it anyway.

[Patsy Stone]

51. Because they, like all Americans, were lied to.

My point is that the message isn't that Democrats, even those Dems who voted for it, were lied to, it was that all of us, each of us, was deceived. The benefits inherent in being a member of Congress, classified intel, wasn't in play, because the intel was doctored and embellished.

[KerryOn]

29. The world was lied to. n/t

[dchill]

45. Sure, the world was lied to...

but the lies were obvious and self-serving in a midterm election kind of way. A LOT of us knew that. If our Democratic Senators and Congresspersons didn't know that, then they should be shamed out of office. If they DID know, and voted for the Iraq Resolution anyway, then they've sure got some explaining to do. People are dead. People are out of work. Prices are skyrocketing and wages going down.

To hell with "We were lied to." What about the fact that none of the lies justified their invasion and occupation and abuse and killing.

[KoKo]

46. Blair and Bush the "conjoined twins" did it...and there was nothing we

could do. Bush and Blair joined throughout history of our support for each other for generations...Unless one doesn't count the "founding of America" into the equation. :-)'s

[William769]

26. Many have already said so.

Your just looking for a fight. IMHO I see an ulterior motive here.

[longship]

27. Many have said it.

Not many used the word lied. IMHO, that is a mistake. We have to label these people as what they are, fucking liars.

[prescole]

30. Kucinich has said it often and loudly

and he's been labeled a fringe radical with little protest from Democrats.
There's a kernal of truth in the thought that Republicans have no hearts, and Democrats have no guts.

[Crunchy Frog]

37. Didn't Dick Gephardt say something along those lines recently?

I'm certain that I saw a thread about it here.

I have more respect for a Democrat who can admit a mistake than for one who keeps stubbornly sticking to the same view in spite of all the evidence.

In terms of retaining their electability, I think they need to put more emphasis on the "Bush lied" aspect than the "I was duped" one. Emphasize that Bush broke a fundamental contract and that under normal circumstances legislators feel that they HAVE to trust the President not to lie when it comes to matters of war and peace. Keep putting the onus on Bush, while acknowledging that they were mistaken to trust him.

[FreedomAngel82]

41. Kerry already said this during the last campaign

He said we were all lied to. And we were. So I guess he was the first?

[BrotherBuzz]

42. My Congresswoman, Ellen Tauscher, said it in July 2003

"The concern is they were in the cherry-picking business - cherry-picking half-truths and rumors and only highlighting pieces of information that bolstered the administration's case for war." - Ellen Tauscher, July 2003

[KoKo]

50. Okay...who has a list of Dems who've said "I was Lied To or Deceived or

it was misinformation...and I don't know, knowing Now what I Know..that I would have voted for Iraq Invasion and OCCUPATION?

If there is a list, please post here:

List:

1....

2....

etc, ...........