DUMBASS! Until Dems call out Diebold and ES&S they are wasting our time!

[Melodybe]

Nothing they say matters, if our votes don't fucking count!

No bush impeachment, no end to the war, no end to deficits without our votes being counted none of that matters.

End of story.

[I Have A Dream]

1. Can't say it any more clearly than that. I absolutely agree. n/t

[Melodybe]

16. Do me a favor, nominate this one cause DUers need to get this!

We should all demand that our represenatives get on the fucking ball!

[I Have A Dream]

20. RECOMMENDED! (You've got it. We're at 3 nominations now.) n/t

[Melodybe]

22. Thanks only two more

We need to have this beaten into our heads quickly, cause 2006 is just around the bend.

[Vincardog]

2. Paper Ballots hand counts now

[Melodybe]

4. Really how can we impeach the mother fucker if we can't

get enough Dems into office next year?

WHY DO THE DEMOCRATS REFUSE TO GO AFTER OUR PRIVATISED VOTING SYSTEM?

If they aren't in on it then what is their excuse?

Of course there are a few exceptions and we all know who I mean.

[melissinha]

8. I hear India and Brazil have good electronic systems

try theirs, for God's sake!!!!!!!!

We have nothing til this is addressed. :tinfoilhat: or not.... 2004 was too painful and * is wreaking havoc.

[Melodybe]

9. If they would let go of the privatization and went with open source

we would all be the better for it.

[melissinha]

14. but that would be socialism!

everything should be owned by some corporation there is no such thing as sharing..... what are you, a Linux advocate?

;-)
:hippie:

[Melodybe]

15. No I looked at some of the European voting methods and open source

seems like the best way to go, with paper trails of course.

[Jo March]

30. Paper BALLOTS

A paper trail can simply be a report that spits out numbers. If there is a recount, we will need legal ballots.

We need to ask for what we want: Voter Verified Paper BALLOTS!!

[Angry Girl]

34. http://www.swissvs.org - Fast, cheap, AND reliable!

But getting this government to change to efficient, honest, open elections will be very difficult. It's like trying to feed the hungry: It's not for lack of food....

[Ladyhawk]

55. We don't need computers. V V P B!!!!! n/t

[titoresque]

63. kick

[Marleyb]

75. Ukrainians have it right

[klook]

32. Agree - "Sunshine Law"

should apply to this situation. Open source works for many mission-critical apps in business, why not voting?

Of course, it would require a lot of educamacatin' of the public, because the RW spin would be, "Are they crazy? They want to make the code PUBLIC where just any hacker could disrupt an election?"

[AlamoDemoc]

3. You hit the nail right on the head. n/t

[skylarmae]

5. agreed. paper trail

paper trail, paper trail...hand count, hand count the votes

[Spike from MN]

13. Yes. Most definitely.

That's the only way.

[WA98296]

6. Say it Often, it is Totally True. What the hell is being done?

[Angry Girl]

28. Check out these guys, to name a few...

Velvet Revolution
http://velvetrevolution.us/

$100,000 Reward for Information Leading to Arrest, Conviction of Corrupt Government Officials
http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=54282

Who's Counting
http://whoscounting.net/

http://www.reopen911.org/proofstolen.htm

http://uscountvotes.org/

[Pithy Cherub]

7. Amen!

O8)

[jrthin]

10. No it's not.

Getting a spine is the thing they need to do front and foremost.

[Melodybe]

11. Tell them to get a fucking spine about voting then I'll fucking listen!

Seriously until then they can royally FUCK OFF!

[jrthin]

12. AMEN to that! nt

[Melodybe]

17. kick

[Road Scholar]

18. AMEN BROTHER!!! Just the way it is. nt

[Melodybe]

19. kick

[I Have A Dream]

21. We need to get this on the GREATEST PAGE! n/t

[Melodybe]

23. kick cause the truth hurts

[greekspeak]

24. You have it. Step one is fair elections

Until we get those back, congress, the presidency, the courts, etc. will be in Puke hands.

[Melodybe]

26. Exactly!

[NoBushSpokenHere]

25. Kick for democracy and Amen!

[Nightjock]

27. That's it. In a nutshell.

Nominated.

[Lindsay]

29. Agreed.

Gotta get this changed soonest, or we're done for.

[ladjf]

31. That's it. Nothing else matters until problem #1 is corrected.

[realFedUp]

33. I agree...I'm a little concerned about California's "special" election

I'm hoping most voters slam Arnold's ballot measures
giving him their backsides to this expensive and
unnecessary election in November and as a message
in his race next year.

[Melodybe]

35. kick

[Ladyhawk]

54. Uh oh. I'm not educated about this.

Where can I go to find out the low-down on these measures?

LH

[realFedUp]

72. here's one

http://www.calvoter.org/voter/elections/2005/special/index.html

there are links to the California Secretary of State also.

[Snotcicles]

36. AGREE n/t

[Stinky The Clown]

37. Media first

I agree with you wholeheartedly that if our votes don't count nothing else matters and that, even more than The War in Iraq©, getting a transparent voting system back is our highest priority ...... except .....

I honestly think that even ahead of that is the media. There is no doubt whatsoever that the media is controlled by the Right. We somewhat rhetorically refer to it as the corporate media or the right wing media or whatever, but there is truth in that rhetoric.

Imagine of the media had done its job and actually reported on the voting problems. Not the white wash they did around the 04 elections, but real, in depth reporting like 60 Minutes used to do. No one would be unclear or clueless about the problem.

Right now we are almost totally without the power to make any changes. If public opinion were on our side (and if the truth were to come out, public opinion **would** be on our side) we would be on equal or better footing than the opposition.

So, until we get back to either having an honest media **or** an effective message machine we are fucked.

[Melodybe]

39. Both are important but voting is democracy

lies are lies

[Pacifist Patriot]

42. Voting is democracy, but so is a free press.

If we cannot rely on the press to communicate the facts than votes cast based on propaganda are meaningless but oh so powerful.

[LaPera]

66. Our vote is what can change the media, bring back the fairness doctrine...

Voting is scared and our right, we can't keep allowing the republicans to continue to steal elections while the republican owned media never reports on the republican own electronic voting machines, no matter how much we scream about it.

Getting rid of the electronic voting machines should be our first priority.

Democrats have two bill in the house right now, but the republicans won't allow them to even reach the floor for a vote and the republicans won't let these bills see the light of day.

We need to make our voices heard!!!

[Pacifist Patriot]

41. Every journalist I know votes...

That's not to say that every journalist votes, just the ones I know. How do we convince them that their votes have been trashed? How do we get them to appreciate that this is more important than directives from their corporate bosses?

[Stinky The Clown]

45. That's the question that has stumped me since before the 00 cycle

I can NOT imagine how it is that not one single journalist, reporter, columnist, pundit, talking head, copy writer, editor, mail room boy, paper delivery boy has come forward and stood up for what is CLEARLY right.

I can only conclude a few possible reasons .....

They don't care (not likely to be true for the thousands of them in the industry)

They don't see it as we do (again, not likley to be universally applicable to everyone in the media)

The current situation suits their political ideology (yet again, not likley to be universally true)

They've had the living shit scared out of them (the only conclusion that seems at least possible)

But why not even ONE has come forward ion the last five years to talk about this is simply amazing. And inexplicable.

[Tactical Progressive]

51. America's establishment journalism is America's greatest enemy

American journalism has cravenly, thoughtlessly and cowardly turned itself towards deeply dishonest conservatism. One listen to Andrea Mitchell, NBC White House correspondent, makes it clear that these people, through self-interest or whatever, have ideologically corrupted themselves and their profession, and it isn't going to change any time soon. In fact, if it does change I'd bet on worse not better. Wolfie and the rest of them are just as bad.

The voting machine treachery on the other hand is a defineable, solvable problem. So while the wholesale corruption of establishment journalism is America's biggest enemy, the electoral treachery of right-wingers is the most immediate battle that must be fought.

[Pacifist Patriot]

38. Absolutely! Now how do we get people to understand the story?

I'm still conversing with dumbass Republicans who think voting problems are a myth.

[Stinky The Clown]

40. "Now how do we get people to understand the story?"

The media .... see my post number 37, above.

Voting is our biggest issue. The media is our biggest obstacle.

[Peace Patriot]

57. "How do we get people to understand the story?"

Here it is in a nutshell: Two far rightwing Bushite corporations gained control of the tabulation of our votes, during the 2001 to 2004 period, by selling electronic voting systems to the states, run on SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code, and, in many cases, with not even the merest "paper trail" for recounts and audits (let alone a real paper ballot).

The contracts that our stupid or corrupt election officials signed with these companies PERMITTED "TRADE SECRET," PROPRIETARY VOTE TABULATION.

You almost don't need to know anything else.

The election system is fraudulent on its face. No one but no one should have secret control of the vote tabulation.

People understand the ATM argument--that if an ATM machine routinely provides a receipt, why can't a voting machine generate a paper trail?--and they will immediately agree with that (though they might need explanations re: a real paper ballot, vs. a mere paper trail). But what we need to tell them--and what they need to understand--is that this condition (verification of the vote count) was NOT PRESENT IN THE 2004 ELECTION (nor in several of the 2002 elections, notably Georgia). This condition INVALIDATED those elections--and it was no innocent set of circumstances that brought this condition about.

But how the system got put in place is irrelevant to people understanding that there is no transparency (--although it's not irrelevant to solving the problem). Our elections have become completely non-transparent and unverifiable. And, actually, WHO is counting our votes with secret formulae is also irrelevant to this point: that the system is NON-TRANSPARENT. It is hidden. It is behind closed doors. It is behind the curtain. We really and truly DO NOT KNOW and CANNOT know who won the 2004 election (except for external evidence, all of which points to a Kerry win).

And it wouldn't matter if it was the other way around--if it was George Soros owning and controlling the vote tabulation. That wouldn't be right either!

How did it happen? Using the opportunity of the notorious 2000 election, and with the excuse of replacing the old "hanging chad" punchcard voting machines with something better, Congress proceeded to create a $4 billion dollar electronic voting boondoggle (the so-called "Help America Vote Act"--HAVA), with no controls on "trade secret" vote tabulation, no "paper trail" requirement (Tom Delay's doing), and such lax controls on quality that Diebold, ES&S and other corporations began by selling outright lemons to the states--extremely unreliable machines that constantly break down.

These machines are still breaking down--and producing weird results, and doing weird things like counting backwards and erasing thousands of votes--and are also easily hackable, with some machines containing horribly insecure additions, such as internal modems that private parties at private corporations can dial up and access.

The breakdowns require company personnel to be onsight during elections, fiddling with the machines, and with access to voting data. And these very expensive systems also require expensive servicing and upgrading contracts, creating even more insecurity.

It's just nuts!

But the most alarming item is the sheer speed and invisibility with which thousands of votes can be changed, leaving no trace. In times past, yes, there was some vote stealing and election fraud. But at least the perps were catchable. It all happened at human speed, accessible to human eyes and hands. Nothing like this!

In this election system, massive fraud can occur, instantly, merely by a few pre-programmed, self-erasing lines of computer code, that can change a thousand, or a thousand and four, or five hundred and sixty seven Kerry votes to Bush votes, wherever the perps so desire (and using whatever algorithm they need to provide an appearance of randomness), or, say, to shift random 1%-2%'s of Kerry votes to third party candidates in all precincts in the central tabulators.

The potential for fraud is immense. And..

AND...the people who control this software are BUSH PARTISANS. And...

AND... all the external evidence of the 2004 election contradicts the Bush win.

----------

People DO want to know HOW this happened, and they need and deserve answers. But the basic facts about the SYSTEM's fraudulence--its non-transparency, and unverifiability--are incontestable.

And the rightwing associations of Diebold and ES&S are also incontestable. (Wally O'Dell of Diebold was the Bush-Cheney campaign chair and a major Bush-Cheney fundraiser in Ohio, for godssakes! And ES&S was funded by well-known rightwing billionaires.)

When you're talking to a Republican, say, "How would YOU feel if George Soros controlled the vote count with 'trade secret' software? Would you trust that outcome?

I KNOW that most Americans would object to this if they knew. In fact, I strongly suspect that many, many REPUBLICAN votes for Kerry were changed to Bush. Republican voters may have been the biggest victims of the 2004 election fraud. Republican precincts would have been the easiest places to steal votes without anyone suspecting.

----------

So that's "Part One" of the story. The election system has become egregiously non-transparent, unverifiable and unfair.

"Part Two" is: Why didn't the Democrats object? (See my post below.) (--partly venal but widespread corruption connected to the billion dollar electronic voting boondoggle; partly pro-war Democratic Party leaders who didn't want to win, because it would have meant working with a president who was beholden to a big antiwar grass roots constituency--the people who elected Kerry and had the election stolen from them).

Part Three is what the TV networks did to their exit polls on election night--a critically important piece of information that explains why everybody THOUGHT Bush won, and that there was little or no evidence to the contrary.

Late on election day, the TV networks ALTERED their own exit poll data (Kerry won) to "fit" the "official result" derived by Diebold's and ES&S's secret formulae (Bush won), thus depriving the American people of major evidence of election fraud, and squelching protests and calls for investigation.

In a non-transparent election system, exit polls are the best evidence you can have of whether or not the outcome is correct. These are scientifically-designed polls of people who actually voted (just after they voted). They are used routinely in other countries to verify ALL elections and check for fraud.

Not here. Here, they were DOCTORED to hide evidence of a Kerry win. Why? Because the network heads and decision-makers are all Bushites and war profiteers, and DIDN'T WANT there to be any questioning of Diebold's and ES&S's secret vote tabulation. (The real result--Kerry won by a 3% margin--was obtained by alert bloggers who took screen shots of the early exit poll numbers; the pollsters then later admitted the truth.)

So that's the story:

1. A fraudulent election system that any real American should find appalling.

2. The corrupt, collusive and/or fearful Democrats, who let this system be put in place without one word of objection.

3. The war profiteering corporate news monopolies who endorsed Diebold's and ES&S's secret vote tabulation and FALSIFIED their own evidence to the contrary, to keep Americans ignorant of it.

-------

It is a sorry and shocking tale. We are being ruled by war profiteers and people who have no belief in democracy. The evidence of it grows heavier--and more compellingly obvious--every day, with every death in Iraq, with every bloated corpse in New Orleans, with every new effort to rob the poor and loot the U.S. treasury, with every torture photo, with every incoherent, pre-programmed half-sentence that comes out of Bush's mouth. Americans did not re-elect this idiot, and they voted to oust him and the Oil Cartel that pulls his strings.

But the people who like the war and all the boodle thought otherwise, and had devised for themselves the means of having THEIR will done, in opposition to the voters.

And the fact that it cannot be proven with finality, one way or another, means that we are no longer living in a democracy, where transparent elections are the bottom line. They are the very definition of democracy.

[passy]

73. Very concise, very well written.

Anyone would get the point reading this. You could however make a non-political version of it just pointing out the problems, without the "us and them" rhetoric. It would a good little pamphlet to hand out at your local mall.

[marions ghost]

70. HERE ARE SOME NEW BOOKS....

FOOLED AGAIN--How the Right Stole the 2004 Election
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0465045790/qid=1128082481/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/104-7076526-8691966?v=glance&s=books
(this one available from booksellers very soon)

THE CRISIS OF AMERICAN DEMOCRACY: The Presidential Elections of 2000 and 2004
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1875639365/qid=1127138649/sr=1-7/ref=sr_1_7/104-7076526-8691966?v=glance&s=books

WAS THE 2004 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION STOLEN? Exit Polls, Election Fraud, and the Official Count
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1583226877/qid=1128084137/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/104-7076526-8691966?v=glance&s=books

DID GEORGE BUSH STEAL AMERICA'S 2004 ELECTION?
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0971043892/qid=1128082481/sr=2-3/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_3/104-7076526-8691966?v=glance&s=books

STEAL THIS VOTE: DIRTY ELECTIONS AND THE ROTTEN HISTORY OF DEMOCRACY IN AMERICA
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1560256761/qid=1128084067/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/104-7076526-8691966?v=glance&s=books

WHAT WENT WRONG IN OHIO: THE CONYERS REPORT ON THE 2004 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/089733535X/qid=1127139306/sr=2-1/ref=pd_bbs_b_2_1/104-7076526-8691966?v=glance&s=books

-----
Any of these books would be a start for educating people. Be aware that they don't cover the extent of the problems with electronic voting machines as that story is still unfolding, but they do point to the issues with those machines.

[Karenina]

43. That is the TRUTH

the whole TRUTH and NOTHING but the TRUTH.

[DerekG]

44. One has to wonder why Nader was a bigger priority for the elites than BBV

Did the elites of both parties make some kind of pact to re-appoint Bush or something?

[Pryderi]

Would it be possible to have the UN oversee the '06 elections?

eom

[kster]

46. Ban all forms of electronic voting and demand this NOW in the US

Paper Ballots Hand Counted in the UK.

If they can do it, so the hell can we.

Honest Dems and Repugs get this done NOW !






http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=&imgrefurl=http://www.highland.gov.uk/landaintra/corporate_services/elections/elections/ukparl2001/webcam.htm&h=241&w=321&sz=14&tbnid=xz4PBFi96z4J:&tbnh=85&tbnw=114&hl=en&start=4&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dreturning%2Bofficer%2Buk%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26sa%3DG

[titoresque]

47. Thankyou!!!

Ive been trying to say this as often as I can and in as many threads as it seems appropriate. No one ever responds to my comment about it...so thankyou for getting this discussion going!

:applause:

[Melodybe]

48. Gladly, it is pointless for Dems to praddle on about anything

if the fix is still in.

[Melodybe]

49. kick

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

61. I've had similar ...

...experience. It's puzzling. Almost like the common initial response people have to being diagnosed with an incurable form of cancer. No hope for a solution is too painful, so they just pretend it isn't so. They won't allow themselves to even hear it.

[titoresque]

62. I'm seeing a lot of that lately

:banghead:

[Peace Patriot]

50. I recommend:

1. UScountvotes.org, which is trying to organize a national database, overseen by Ph.D.-ed statisticians, to monitor the 2006 elections, and help with legal challenges wherever suspicious results occur. They need donations and other help.

2. Votersunite.org. They publish a great pamphlet, easy to read, which explains the electronic voting problem simply and clearly, and which needs to be provided to all election officials and other interested parties--and of course voters. It's called,"Myth Breakers: Facts About Electronic Voting," and is available at their web site FOR FREE.

3. Concentrate on state/local jurisdictions, where the power over election systems still resides, and where ordinary people still have some influence.

(Note: The federal situation is hopeless! --and, if Congress meddles again, it will only make things worse. DO NOT SUPPORT the Baker/Carter Commission report, or ANY fed bill--they will only gut anything good in any fed bill, and turn it against the voters. I greatly fear that their next move will be to federalize elections under Bush Cartel control, and remove our last possible venue for reform--state/local-- by direct fiat, changing the Constitution, or by bribery--more billions to the Bushite electronic voting companies. They are certainly going to try to purge more black and brown and other Dem voters from the rolls with the venomous "voter I.D.")

4. Be patient. Be persistent. This is going to take time. As we gradually recover transparent elections, we will gradually begin to elect good leaders, who will further help us safeguard our right to vote. (Think of the long struggles of black citizens, of Martin Luther King and Nelson Mandela! Patience! Persistence!)

5. ENCOURAGE people to vote! NEVER, NEVER, NEVER concede our right to vote. NEVER!

We can still beat 'em with numbers. They were actually rather cautious in 2004, and stole only the amount of votes they needed to push Bush ahead to a better-than-2000 win. If Kerry had been a better candidate (if he'd been antiwar, for instance) and had won by 20%, instead of 5% to 10%--I think it would have overcome the election fraud. (We might then have been treated to the "terrorist alert" plan--well set up in "the news" beforehand--but that's another story.)

Electronic election fraud is easy, fast, and untraceable, but they still have to make it LOOK GOOD, and I'm fairly convinced that it has to be pre-programmed (does not occur on election day), so it's set to certain percentages and cannot be that easily changed to respond to events (such as a Democratic super-landslide).

Our voting system is still quite messy--with all kinds of messy controls in it, like absentee ballots, for instance (that's how some of the fraud was detected in 2004). We need to INCREASE voter turnout by 10% to 20%, and we can do it! In 2004, we blew the Bushites away in new voter registration, nearly 60/40. We have to make that 80/20!

We need a bumper sticker: "Don't give up! Keep voting! Blow them away!"

--------

Some other thoughts:

The bipartisan corruption at the state/local level, wrought by the $4 billion electronic voting boondoggle--and by lavish lobbying--is a formidable obstacle to reform. We've seen it in California (in Connie McCormack, head of Los Angeles elections and a Democrat, for instance, who is an advocate for Diebold and paperless voting, and led the vicious campaign against our very good Secretary of State, Kevin Shelley). I'm sure such corruption exists elsewhere in the country. It affects election officials as well as other public officials--including Democrats, who are are now beholden to this corrupt election SYSTEM, and to its corporations and advocates. We have to expose this kind of corruption and make it anathema; and make transparent elections a requirement of support.

If we lose on Schwarzenegger's dastardly initiative, we can thank Connie McCormack, because this election is going to be overseen by a Schwarzenegger patsy APPOINTEE to the Sec of State's office, who will not likely ride herd on corrupt county officials nor fight for the voters right to a paper ballot (which Shelley made provision for, but which many county election officials fail to provide), and who has packed his office and advisory panel with Diebold advocates and Bushites.

These powermongering county election officials must be gotten rid of--a far more doable thing, right now, than getting rid of Bush.

And we've got to fully understand this problem in order to solve it. We've got to understand WHY the Democratic Party leadership has been silent on this fraudulent election system, with the vote tabulation controlled by Bushite corporations using SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code. Are they INSANE? (I considered it!) No. They are, 1) corrupt (in two ways--on the electronic voting boondoggle itself, and/or on war profiteering); and/or, 2) fearful (Diebold and ES&S control elections; the Bush Cartel controls the media).

More in a moment....

[Peace Patriot]

58. For those who want more detail on 2004 election fraud evidence, go to

www.truthisall.net, which has TruthIsAll's famous "To believe Bush won, you have to believe..."series. Also excellent: www.freepress.org. And: http://www.solarbus.org/election/index.shtml

-----

I did not mention Ohio in my analysis above, because I don't believe that the main part of the 2004 election fraud occurred in Ohio, although I feel that what happened there--the sickening, massive violations of the rights of black voters and other Democrats--is paradigmatic of the Bush Cartel and its immoral behavior. It's my opinion that Ohio was Plan B, to be used in case of a big Kerry win. (Plan C was a "terrorist alert" election shutdown on the west coast, well set up in "the news" beforehand. That's my surmise, putting 2 and 2 together--of whatall was going on just before the election. But it was not needed, except for Warren County, Ohio. Kerry's win was big, but not that big. It was taken care of with a combination of massive but small percentage vote stealing, vote manufacture and vote switching--mostly in the east coast time zone--using the SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code, and massive vote suppression in Ohio.)

------

We need...

1. Paper ballots hand-counted at the precinct level (--Canada does it in one day, although speed should not even be a consideration, just accuracy and verifiability)

or, at the least...

2. Paper ballot (not "paper trail") backup of all electronic voting, a 10% automatic recount, very strict security, and NO SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code! (...jeez!).


The best place to work for this, in my opinion, is the state/local jurisdictions. We have to take back the country state by state, county by county. And it's not going to be easy, and it's not going to happen overnight. But I do think we will succeed.

------

Here's an important difference between Venezuela and the U.S. In Venezuela, they vote electronically but with OPEN SOURCE CODE--that is , anyone may review how the votes are tabulated. Not so in the U.S., where the code by which our votes are tabulated is a "trade secret" held by private corporations with heavy ties to the Bush Cartel.

Open source code = good president, good government.

Secret, proprietary source code - bad president, bad government.

Could it be any clearer?

-------

For a taste of the lavish lobbying by which our election officials are being bribed into purchasing election theft voting systems, see Amaryllis' post on the hogfest at the Beverly Hilton this August--a week of fun, sun and high-end shopping for election officials from around the country, sponsored by Diebold, ES&S and Sequoia electronic voting machine companies. It will burn your eyeballs...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x380340

[Melodybe]

59. Thanks I'm saving this thread cause I am talking to my SOS tomorrow

[mithnanthy]

52. I agree!

n/t

[gulfcoastliberal]

53. My thoughts exactly. n/t

[Mr Rabble]

56. recommended.

Who would have thought that we would be voting with NO PAPER TRAIL?

[freedomfries]

60. KICK & REC

[Helga Scow Stern]

64. Right on!

[Zinfandel]

65. You are absolutely correct!!!

[cassiepriam]

67. Yes, none of the scandals will matter at all... if the vote is fixed.

We must have free elections and a free press.
What a concept.

[SheepyMcSheepster]

68. agreed.

[leftchick]

69. You Said It! Paper Ballots, Hand Counted NOW!

:applause:

[Lost4words]

71. KICK!

Nothing they say matters, if our votes don't fucking count!

Spot On!

[pazarus]

74. absolutely.

Which is one reason I support Carter's plan, which calls for a paper trail. It also calls for ID cards, but I'd gladly take those too if it means I could be sure every vote was going to the right place. It is INSANE that I can't trust the voting in the most powerfulnation on Earth.

[tom_paine]

76. Unquestionably. Nominated.

Oops can;t vote for this one anymore. Bummer.

[stickdog]

77. Yep. Fraud-o-matic voting machines are job one.

The complicit, complaint corporate media are job two.

There are a lot of job threes, but these are the first two.

[Cocoa]

78. I guess Conyers is a total idiot then

he's taking the lead on something like a zillion non-BBV issues, I guess he's wasting our time.

:shrug: