Jesse Jackson on Katrina

[GayCanuck]

Jesse, on CNN said that it is only fair that the victims of Katrina and the hose job by FEMA deserve the same amount of compensation as the 9/11 victims; around $2 million each. Is this a fair amount? I thought the 9/11 victims received much more.

[Richardo]

1. Jessie Jackson needs to sit down and STFU

What a counterproductive, self-aggrandizing, divisive idiot. :banghead:

[Tomee450]

10. Perhaps some could say

the same about you. Jesse Jackson has a right to express his opinion just like everyone else. We have really reached a low point in this society when a person is told to shut up simply because he doesn't share your views. Jesse Jackson is a decent man whether you believe it or not. It seems the minute anyone suggest that blacks be compensated for their lost just as others have been, some people become outraged. Nothing ever changes.

[Richardo]

12. Do *not* race-bait me on this.

I've said the same thing about Michael Moore. I think self-aggrandizing, divisive, counterproductive characters do nothing to further the cause.

And I think giving ANYONE or ANY RACE $2 million to compensate for a natural disaster is insane. I even thought that of the 9-11 compensation. Now it's an entitlement - another example of Bush policital expediency with no thought as to long-term consequences.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Richardo]

17. You're right.

I'm a well-known racist. Ask anybody.

[Tomee450]

18. Well you know

the old saying," if it walks like a duck,.................

[ronnykmarshall]

Sounds like

duck shit to me.

Just because someone DARES to say something critical of La Jessie, it makes them a racist?

I didn't know Jessie was declared "untouchable"?

[Zuni]

23. you are a racist?

bastard :grr:

[Richardo]

29. ...and an anti-dentite.

:P

[ronnykmarshall]

69. You probably eat at KFC too!

[ronnykmarshall]

68. When you go to the kkkleaners .....

can you pick MY hood and robe up too?

:sarcasm:

[Richardo]

73. OK. THIS time.

[ronnykmarshall]

79. I'll pick up supplies at the KKK-Mart ---

it's KKKloser to my KKKompound.

[StopTheMorans]

80. you KKKrazy!!

[StopTheMorans]

19. "always shown by people who object to blacks receiving any money

from the government". generalize much? if it posts like an asshole...

[Tomee450]

21. It's a pity some people

can't stand the truth. In fact when confronted with said truth, their outrage becomes so great they must result to vulgar name calling. Usually when it sounds like a racist, it is.

[Zuni]

22. when it sounds like an idiot...

richardo is good people

[StopTheMorans]

26. exactly

"you're a freeper because i don't like what you posted". give me a fucking break :eyes:

[Tomee450]

35. Well, your reply is not

unexpected. Your reaction is typical of certain people in this society. The haters of African Americans rarely likes to hear the truth. They can't stand it and sometimes resorts to name calling or worse. Thus Martin Luther King becomes a commie, a trouble maker. Other blacks who speak about racism become thugs, morons, idiots, etc. As a black person, I've encountered these types all my life that's why they are easy to spot. I stand by what I wrote. Jackson, like others are vilified for just seeking fair treatment of African American. Nothing new. It has gone on for years and will no doubt continue.

[Zuni]

63. name one natural disaster where the government paid 2 mil

to each of the victims.

how many people were victims of Katrina---close to a million, at least.

my reply is not racist, and this has nothing to do with the race of the victims.

[Tomee450]

75. I don't recall any incident

in which millions of dollars have been paid to compensate victims except in the case of the 9/11 families. So what? Those victims of the hurricanes have suffered great loss. Some have even lost not only family members but their homes and businesses as well. Why should the 9/11 families be treated better than the current victims. And as I said earlier, for some it wouldn't matter if the amount was l0,000, 20,000, they'd still object if the money was going to black people. Unfortunately, needy whites are also affected by this attitude.

[StopTheMorans]

78. and needy Asians as well

[StopTheMorans]

25. i'll leave the generalizations to others (like you, for instance)

generalizations are like herpes: they don't make you look good, and noone wants to get them from you.

[Tomee450]

37. I'll continue

to tell the truth, a truth which you and others would prefer not to hear. But as my grandmother used to say,truth stands. Racism runs deep in this country and is reflected by the vitriol direct at blacks who seek fair treatment for African Americans.

[StopTheMorans]

45. this has nothing to do with racism. just because stupid comments

were uttered by a black man does not mean that they're not stupid. they'd be just as fucking absurd if they'd been said by anyone else. i wish there was a "stop playing the race card" smilie. i know that this may be hard to believe, but, there are actually some situations IRL where people's ethnicity really DOES NOT preclude them from uttering ridiculous statements.

[Tomee450]

48. Oh sure,

for some people anyone who dares to suggest that black people be treated fairly is stupid, an idiot, etc., blah, blah. It all boils down to race and the double standard that exists in this country when the issue involves black people.

[StopTheMorans]

49. no, it doesn't always boil down to race, no matter how many times

you say it. if a black person says "the world is flat", it is just as fucking stupid as if a white person says it. sometimes, a shit idea is just that, as much fun as it may be to race-bait people.

[Tomee450]

54. But many times it

does boil down to race and this is one of those times. When I see the kind of vitriol directed at black people who suggest that blacks be treated no differently than other communities, I know that it is indeed all about race. You can deny all you wish,but I have been on the receiving end of racist behavior many times, thus I have no difficulty whatsoever in recognizing it.

[StopTheMorans]

57. oh, sorry, you know better than anyone else on DU

i'll just leave now and go back to mailing out unsolicited racist literature :yoiks:

[ronnykmarshall]

71. You need more stamps??

I've got some left over from my anti-gay mailers.

[StopTheMorans]

74. well, if you're not going to use them to further your agenda of hatred

i guess i could take em off your hands. from one hater to another :toast:

[ronnykmarshall]

81. I've got some extra gas cans too.

I've torched my quota of abortion clinics this month.

[Magrittes Pipe]

82. I think Phyllis Schlafly says stupid things.

By your logic, I suppose that means I am a misogynist. :(

[ronnykmarshall]

87. Yes it does!!

[Zuni]

24. ....

:applause:

[Darth Lib]

51. I will bet you money...

I will bet money that the "Jackson Plan" calls for all that money to flow through him.

I do not believe that he is a very decent man who has his people's interest at heart.

[Tomee450]

58. What has Jesse Jackson done

to lead you to that conclusion? Most black people do not share your view of him. Most of Jackson's critics are those who oppose civil rights, who dislike his activism. Limbaugh, O'Riley and others have been after him for years spreading lies and rumors. O'Riley had him investigated by the Illinois Attorney General who found nothing wrong with Jackson's accounting. There is a history of attacking black leaders who fought for civil rights and it continues today.

[SouthernDem2004]

2. People should just ignore him.

Alot more "victims" of the hurricane. No way to give people 2 million.

[Tomee450]

11. Why should he be ignored?

So he advocates that the victims of Katrina and Rita be treated as the relatives of the victims of 9/11 and he should be ignored.
Why? Is it because most of those victims are black? I am so disgusted with the double standard. When the issue if compensation for blacks it seems the bigots come out in droves.

[Zuni]

28. giving 3000 9-11 families 2 million was ridiculous

giving hundreds of thousands of hurricane victims 2 mil each is pretty much impossible

[Tomee450]

53. Oh please.

For some people it wouldn't matter if the amount was ten thousand dollars. If the recipients were black, they'd object. It's the mindset, period. Black people should not complain, should accept their fate. If mistreated, should remain silent, if loss is suffered, don't expect compensation. Never mind that others in similar situation were paid from government funds. These situations just remind African Americans that equality has not been achieved.

[pitohui]

32. bingo you got it

i truly do believe it is because many or perhaps most of the victims are black, while i think we're going to discover that a great many victims were also vietnamese and white, but certainly the perception is the money would be going to black ppl & we can't have that in america, now can we

cynical much, why yes i am

great quote, this sums it up in a nutshell: When the issue of compensation for blacks it seems the bigots come out in droves.

[StopTheMorans]

33. so, any time a natural disaster happens to anyone, we should

give them 2 million? well, my aunt's house got struck by lightning and burned down 10 years ago, and she didn't even get the full cost of her house back from her insurance. damn, if my math serves me correct, she should still have roughly 1,900,000 coming to her from the federal government. (yes, the real estate market is rotten in the area where i'm from). 9-11 was a terrorist attack; it wasn't a natural disaster.

[pitohui]

40. do you understand acts of terror are EXCLUDED from coverage

the insurance companies gave the ppl money they were not entitled to under their insurance policies

acts of terror and acts of war are SPECIFICALLY excluded

the insurers opened the gate when they decided to pay off one group of ppl, even tho they did not owe those ppl a dime

it wasn't my idea, it was THEIR idea

fair is fair

if you are going to provide a bonus to one group of ppl, you should provide it to all

otherwise we are going to quite properly point out the racism & classism & i feel the regionalism involved

a southerner is not only 3/5 of a real human being

inequality is inequality, fair is fair

[StopTheMorans]

44. sure, i understand that. i don't think that the victims of 9-11 should

have received 2 million, and i sure as hell don't think that we should continue a shitty precedent that would very quickly bankrupt our nation were it applied equally simply because we erred once. yes, it sucks that it can't be consistent, but a bad decision was made once, and i'm not ready to set the precedent for reinforcing that precedent for all sorts of different scenarios.

[Tomee450]

56. It would be nice

if you would try to stand in the shoes of a black person. From where I sit, there is a double standard. No one talked of precedents when the 9/11 families were being paid. It seems most people in this country approved of the payments. Now, all of a sudden when most of the victims are black, all of a sudden people are talking about too much money, setting precedents, etc. All nothing but excuses for not treated people equally, and all because many of the new victims are black. If you can't see how that looks to the black populating, well, that's unfortunate.

[StopTheMorans]

59. i see how it looks, but a stupid decision is a stupid decision

and continuing it just because it happened once doesn't rectify the fact that it was originally stupid, nor does it right anything. if a decision is dumb to begin with, how does extending the stupidity justify anything? it doesn't, but it sure makes it fun to pick fights with people over.

[Tomee450]

64. Oh baloney.

It's only being called stupid now in an attempt to stop African Americans from being treated as the families of the attack victims were treated. I never heard one person call paying all that money was a stupid thing to do. Only now is the word "stupid" being uttered. If it wasn't stupid then to most people, it shouldn't be stupid now. There was overwhelming approval of them getting the money.

[StopTheMorans]

65. not by me, and not by the posters you implied were "racist" on this thread

nice broad-brush though. why not take an example from your rhetoric and try treating people based on their own opinions, and not assuming that they have the same opinions as some other people who happen to share their ethnic background. good god this place is a fucking waste of time sometimes...

[Tomee450]

46. Oh please.

Nobody talked about their grandma's house being burned down, or about whole families being lost in auto accidents when the families of the 9/11 victims were being compensated. I remember wondering why the 9/11 families were being treated differently from everyone else who had had sudden loss. In all cases, the relatives were just as dead. The grief is just as great when a person loses his family in an accident as it is when family members are suddenly lost in a terrorist attack. There is something wrong if one cannot see that. I did not approve of the giving of money to the families of the 9/11 victims. However, since the government did decide to compensate them for their loss, the same should be done for the victims of Katrina and Rita. There was virtually no outcry to all of that money going to the 9/11 victims families. The reason? Most were white, many upper middle class. The anger now at the suggestion that Katrina and Rita's victims be compensated is solely because of who they are, mostly black and a few whites. And the victims of Katrina and Rita are far poorer than many of the people who were compensated because of the terrorist attack. I don't think there would be much objection to the whites being compensated but many in this country just do not believe blacks are ever deserving of anything from the government.

[StopTheMorans]

50. did you hear that they now make color tv sets?

the world is available in other shades than just black and white. i'd advise investing in one pronto...

[ProfessorGAC]

62. Actually People Did Mention Those Sort Of Things

People who lost loved ones in war, families of cops killed in the line of duty, folks killed in the embassy bombing in Africa. . .

Those folks were brought up during the 9/11 compensation with regards to why they weren't compensated as well.

You're refuting another's point with information that just isn't true.
The Professor

[Tomee450]

70. If that is the case, then I missed it.

However, I do not recall that there was great outrage around this country from those victims of auto accidents and other tragedies, no demand that payments not be made. And I don't recall seeing the kind of anger that's being expressed by some here. I've seen this all before when the issue is about black people and it is most disheartening.

[ProfessorGAC]

76. You Will Note, However. . .

. . .no such anger came from me.
The Professor

[Tomee450]

61. It always happens ,even

here on a progressive forum. If it's anything to do with black people, a certain kind of individual will always pop up.

[DFWdem]

38. I agree with you Tomee, but...

All the residents of Mississippi who lost their homes should also be compensated. Thousands of homes along the Gulf Coast were completely wiped out with nothing left but the foundation. If we're compensating the victims of hurricane Katrina, then we must compensate ALL victims, and Mississippi was hit MUCH harder than New Orleans.

[pitohui]

41. absolutely the mississippi victims should be compensated

that is beyond question

it is beyond human comprehension what was done to the coast

[DFWdem]

42. You are correct Pitohui

I grew up in Long Beach MS and my parents still live there. i was down there Labor Day weekend helping them clean up, and the sheer magnitude of the destruction is incomprehensible until one is actually on the ground and walking around. I was in total shock while I saw mile after mile of nothing but foundations. Anything within about 1/4 mile of the beach was completely obliterated. There were no rooftop rescues because there were no rooftops. Anybody who stayed in their home along the beach had no chance. I've never seen anything like it.

[Tomee450]

67. I agree totally.

And Jesse Jackson and others have not called for only blacks being compensated but all victims of the hurricanes. But my point is that many people are objecting to compensation because so many of the victims are black. I was reading about black soldiers in one of the world wars. There was a call for veterans being paid certain benefits but a southern senator derailed the idea because he did not want the blacks to benefit. There is that kind of mindset among some in this country.

[Tomee450]

72. I agree

But the objection to compensation, I believe, is because many of the recipients would be black. Because of this attitude deserving whites will not be compensated out of fear that blacks would have to be included..

[Tim4319]

47. Not only that!

What about all of they money that is leaving our country and spent in Iraq? How come it is much easier for us to send money 6,000 miles away, and so reluctant to spend it in the gulf region of the United States.

[Tomee450]

90. And we send billions

to Egypt, Israel and other countries to help their citizens without barely a peep out of most Americans.

[SouthernDem2004]

52. Odd, I am white and I lost everything I own. I am disgusted that some

people seem to think most of the victims are black. Where exactly do you get that statistic????? I am white... About 75% of my neighbors are white... My neighbors lost everything also. Maybe do some research before you start calling people bigots.

[HamdenRice]

55. You moved from Georgia to Mississippi?

Or did Katrina do damage to Georgia that we are not aware of? Or am I mistaken in remembering posts you wrote in the past about Georgia?

[SouthernDem2004]

60. You are very mistaken. I never mentioned where I lived until after the

hurricane.

[HamdenRice]

88. Sorry then -- there was another DUer named SouthernDem

w/o the 2004 who was from Georgia.

[Tomee450]

77. You need to do a little

reading yourself. I am well aware of the fact that there were white victims. But in this country, there are people who object totally to any black person benefiting from government largess and if some whites have to suffer so be it. It's a sad thing that so many whites in this country don't appear to know the history of the treatment of African Americans.

[SouthernDem2004]

86. The history of the US has nothing to do with the current disaster.

This is not about politics. This is not about history. It is about the here and now. It is about recovery and rebuilding. N.O is just a small portion of the disaster. It is not a white v black issue.

[Tomee450]

89. I disagree.

[GayCanuck]

3. He said

any less would be racist.

[Richardo]

4. To Jackson, inhaling and exhaling is racist

:dunce:

[RethugAssKicker]

5. Most of the times he says and does good things...

But statments such as this, is absolutely ludicrous!

[goclark]

6. Would it be better for him to say give each $1.50 ?

Jesse is skilled enough to know that this will get the debate started.

They will bash him and say that is way too much and it may well be.

But,he is also sending a message to those that care to fight for something.

GW and Drownie have certainly sent massive checks to Halliburton to do nothing but help the rich get richer.


God knows, the poor in the Gulf States were left with little but the shirt off their backs.

How much is their life worth? Is it worth less than a person that lived near the WTC?

[Marnieworld]

8. Besides the Katrina loss is greater

People lost loved ones on 9/11 but Katrina people lost loved ones, pets, homes, jobs and all of their possessions. WTC victims families had their lives go on as before, albeit with horrible grief and loss, but at least they never went without water.

I don't see why people are so offended by Jackson's statement. I really don't.

[Tomee450]

14. I saw that interview.

Jesse said the victims of Katrina were even more deserving since their plight was partly the fault of government. He also said many of those individuals who were paid from the 9/11 fund were well off and had insurance. I don't recall Jesse saying that each person should be receive millions of dollars. He mostly stressed that the people of New Orleans should have a say in the rebuilding of their city, that they should get jobs etc.

[CAcyclist]

66. Hey, Tomee, I'm with you.

I am white and I am tired of all these white people denying racism even when its staring them in the face. This whole fiasco has a lot to do with race.

[Tomee450]

85. Yes it is about race.

Unfortunately, some people will remain in denial. Some of the comments here and others heard in the media have really been shocking. I've heard black people repeatedly being accused of "waiting for their welfare check," "not having initiative" never having made a decision for themselves in forty years," "just sitting around having babies," "not having sense to evacuate," "criminal element." It goes on and on. All of this in reaction to Katrina. I get angry each time I hear such slurs. We seem to be moving backward as far as race relations are concerned. But maybe attitudes never had changed but just went underground for a while. Now, however, the bigots are out and unafraid to express their views.

[RethugAssKicker]

83. TWO MILLION DOLLARS????

you think that's fair?

[Tomee450]

13. Just why is it ludicrous?

Billions of dollars were given to the relatives of the victims of 9/11. The American taxpayer had nothing to do with that tragedy yet money was paid out. This case is no different. If you compensate one group of citizens, others should be treated similarly. This kind of anger is always seen when it is suggested that blacks be paid for their loss. It's always ludicrous, outrageous, etc. The double standard is glaring and disgusting. It was the same way with welfare benefits. When whites were the only ones receiving such payments, no outrage whatsoever. The minute the press gave welfare a black face, all of a sudden, welfare was the worse thing in the world and the recipients considered lazy and wanting government handouts. It just goes on and on.

[Zuni]

34. what about all the other natural disasters?

we have had many hurricanes, mudslides, tornados, earthquakes---do they get 2 million as well?

[faithfulcitizen]

7. R U serious? You think they should get *more* than $2 mil each?

[Spinzonner]

9. Wasn't that for the survivors of the dead ?

Not the same thing.

[pitohui]

31. hoo boy, you are aware there are dead in katrina, right?

even the media has not thoroughly erased the names & faces of the dead to the point of denying their existence...yet

there are hundreds of bodies at the st. gabriel mortuary alone, plus hundreds more from the mississippi gulf coast

unless you presume that every dead person had his complete family unit wiped out w. him, which is not a correct assumption, where there are dead, there are survivors of the dead

even w. katrina

[Spinzonner]

91. But the word victim does not imply only death and without more context

about what Jackson said he could have been referring to victims as people who lost their homes or severe damage.

So try not to fly off the handle without considering alternative explanations.

[IndyOp]

16. We can call it the Bubba's Momma Benefit Package --

Forest Gump gave half his shrimp-fishing fortune to Bubba's Mama because it was the right thing to do. Bubba's Momma didn't have to cook or clean for anybody else ever again, she got to sit down and rest.

I am all in favor of this massive redistribution of our national wealth - we let the richest 10% of the country keep 25% of their material wealth and the rest goes to a big trust fund. We pay Katrina survivors 250,000 per family and we use the rest to fund schools, roads, pay down the national debt and pay for job-works programs that will get people out of military careers and into good-paying social service jobs.

A complete re-investment program.

We have more than enough wealth as a country to respectfully compensate Katrina survivors for their losses and to create the country we want to live in.

[goclark]

20. Right IndyOp !

[IndyOp]

27. Thanks Goclark --

Love your avatar! :hi:

I was tempted to change to a Conyers avatar during the DSM hearings because I respect him so very, very much. I kept the Dalai Lama because seeing his picture reminds me of lessons that I need to learn.

[pitohui]

30. i think some did receive more, but i'll take the $2 million

i actually understand his point of view

acts of terror and acts of war were specifically excluded from the insurance policies, YET the 9-11 families received hefty pay-outs anyway

if Big Insurance Companies are going to make exceptions to give money to the ppl who have the most connections & the most ability to rebuild their lives without aid, where is the logic of that, the cantor fitzgerald widows would have prob. been able to get scholarships, loans, child care, and good jobs because of their connections that the average displaced katrina victim would never be able to dream of

i don't understand the logic of providing the biggest hand-outs to the very wealthiest of the wealthy

if they are going to give such pay-outs to the rich, they should give the same -- or MORE -- to the ppl who have no connections, no education, and very limited ability to start over from nothing

the only argument i can see AGAINST jackson's proposal is that the 9-11 families lost wage-earners who were on the job, while most katrina families lost elderly or in some cases babies or small children who are not wage earners, if you are not a wage-earner, then there is no loss of income for the insurance company to pay out to your family as in their hard cold world a baby or an elder is of no financial value & is in fact a financial liability

they can damn well get on the ball & start replacing ppl's houses though, these properties do have a known value

i for one have not seen one thin dime from my insurer, and it is a major, and i had only wind damage, no flood, so there is NO ground for dispute, they are not even trying to dispute, they are just dragging their feet for i assume cash-flow reasons...

[earth mom]

36. If the NOLA survivors don't get 2 million AT LEAST, then they should SUE

the shit out of * PERSONALLY and Brown of FEMA too!

I really hope some good lawyers get it together for a HUGE and I mean HUGE class action law suit, because the EVIL bastards who left all those people without food or water in the dome for days on end and who left people to die agonizing deaths in their attics and who have left dead bodies to rot on the sidewalk/in houses must be made to pay for their barbaric actions! :grr:

And that's putting it nicely!!!! :grr:

[raccoon]

39. I don't think the 9/11 victims' families should have received

compensation either.

Yes, it was a tragedy. I'm sorry they lost their loved ones.
But if a relative of mine (or yours) gets killed in a driveby shooting, do you or I get a big compensation check? Heck, no.

Flame if you will, but I don't see why they should've gotten compensation. Was it hush money, maybe?

[pitohui]

43. yes it was hush money of course

that was what was so odd abt it

these ppl held life insurance policies which specifically excluded acts of war & acts of terror (as all life insurance policies do)

if i go to israel & get blown up on my vacation while eating pizza, then my family don't get my life insurance pay-off because i died as an act of terror

if there's a nuclear exchange, the families are not entitled to pay-out on their life insurance policies because it's an act of war

i'm not sayin it is fair, i'm sayin it is how the contracts are written

yet for some odd reason they paid off the 9-11 families anyway

the families actually had to sign a settlement statement agreeing not to sue the airlines or anyone else in connection w. 9-11 if they took the pay-out

it was thought at the time the offer was made to keep the families from suing the airlines into bankruptcy, since some or maybe all of the hijackers should have been stopped from boarding the planes if the security had done their job, maybe so, united airlines & several others have ended up in bankruptcy anyway

as far as i'm concerned, if they pay off one group of ppl, they had better expect to play fair & pay off others

they could not have reasonably expected in sept. 2001 that we would never be hit by another catastrophe, they established a precedent, now they should live it up to it, & if some black ppl get some money they'll just have to deal

[RethugAssKicker]

84. I thought the money they received were from donations

received from us (Americans). Not from the government.

[raccoon]

92. Most of it was insurance cos. and the federal government (us taxpayers).

More Than $38 Billion Paid to 9/11 Victims
By Maggie Farley, Times Staff Writer
<snip>

Insurance companies and the federal government provided more than 90% of the payments..

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-110804compensation_lat,0,44112.story?coll=la-home-headlines

[Silverhair]

93. 1M victims X $2M = Two TRILLION dollars.

Ain't gonna happen.

One million figure is an estimate of the total number of victims, not just the NOLA victims. Lots of other places got badly hit by that monster. Even if it is only 500K victims, that still comes out to a trillion dollars.