Lou Dobbs over the top tonight: DU this poll.

[skids]

Normally I like a lot of what Lou has to say, but this is taking it way too far.

"Do you think the United States should declare that radical Islamists are the enemy in the global war on terror?"

http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/lou.dobbs.tonight/

(EDIT: before it becomes a flamefest: there are plenty of non-muslim terrorists doing bombings, kidnappings, and the whole lot. Maybe not many in the U.S., but they attack our allies.)

[rainy]

1. Wow, that's scary........ real scary

[Catch22Dem]

2. Funny, I thought terrorists were the enemy

Regardless of their religion. Hmmmmm McVeigh, Rudolph, etc... Are they radical Islamists? No. Are they terrorists? Fuck yes.

[stopbush]

3. WTF? Ever heard of "cause and effect?"

Unless you buy into "they hate us for our freedoms/religion" BS this is...bullshit.

[rodeodance]

7. 86% say YES. whow.

[dave502d]

4. Done, like you i did like Lou but not anymore.

Yes 86%

No 14%

[Stirk]

5. Send all muslims to concentration camps, in other words.

What an insane question.

[KarenInMA]

13. How do you get that??

Radical does not mean ALL.

I think we're at war with RADICAL Christians as well. Not all Christians, just the ones who commit acts of terror.

[Stirk]

24. "Radical" is a value judgement. "Muslim" is not.

That's how I get that.

We've got an administration that has repeatedly argued for the right to unilaterally declare certain individuals "enemy combatants", and disregard their human rights. If radical muslims were officially designated the enemy, well... there you go. It's not much a stretch.

[KarenInMA]

26. then let's agree to what the term "radical" is

[Stirk]

29. Why don't you tell me what a radical Muslim is.

[KarenInMA]

30. I'll cut and paste my answer from below:

Radical Islam would be defined by me as people who want to kill innocent civilians for political/religious reasons. Anyone willing to become a suicide attacker.

[Stirk]

32. We already have a perfectly good word for those people.

We call them terrorists. And they come in lots of flavors- not just Muslim. I don't see any reason to define a specific stripe of religious kook as an enemy combatant.

How would you feel about making Christian fundamentalists the official enemy of the United States?

[KarenInMA]

33. I'd love that!!

As far as I can tell, Christian Fundies do a hell of a lot more damage to the fabric of our country than Islamic Fundies.


To be honest w/ you, I don't see a whole lot of difference.

[Stirk]

35. Heh.

I don't see much difference between those two groups, either- but I don't want to lock them up for being religiously insane. Where do you stop? Know what I mean?

[KarenInMA]

38. No, I get it, but I really REALLY hate it

when people here (and other places) refuse to accept that some Muslims want to kill us. It really gives the Right Wing there talking points.

[EVDebs]

39. Irshad Manji and her book The Trouble With Islam

and Bernard Lewis's book What Went Wrong probably make them targets. I know that Irshad has been threatened.

The radicals don't accept any criticism at all.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

41. Neither do the Fundie Christians....and they are infinitely....

...more powerful than any Islamic radicals.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

40. Some Fundie Christians want to kill us too....and they have nukes.

[Lecky]

56. The Christians who do not associate with terror would see a big difference

Most people do not want their religious beliefs tied to terrorism.

[understandinglife]

6. No, I think we should declare Bush, Cheney and all the neoconsters ...

.... the gravest threat to humanity, ever. Oh, and you can toss in 'traitors,' as well.

WATCH IT; SPREAD IT http://www.bushflash.com/right.html

Peace.

www.missionnotaccomplished.us - How ever long it takes, the day must come when tens of millions of caring individuals peacefully but persistently defy the dictator, deny the corporatists their cash flow, and halt the evil being done in Iraq and in all the other places the Bu$h neoconster regime is destroying civilization and the environment in the name of "America."

[rodeodance]

9. it is a loaded question. what does he mean by Radical?

[geek tragedy]

8. He's right, actually. We're not at war with the Tamil Tigers or ETA

We're at war with the people who bombed our embassies and our cities.

The War on Terror is an even dumber title than The War on Drugs.

[Straight Shooter]

10. Actions speak louder than words. The U.S. govt. has already declared it.

[me b zola]

11. Scary stuff.

Do you think the United States should declare that radical Islamists are the enemy in the global war on terror?**The radical christian cleric shouts**

Yes....86%

No.....14%

[KarenInMA]

12. Radical Islamists ARE the enemy.

If by Radical you mean terrorists.
I don't think this has anything to do with "rounding them up" or "all Muslims", it's the ones that would do us harm.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

18. We need a definition

of "radical Islamist". Does that mean al Qadea and its satellite organizations, or does it mean the Wahhabi sect of Sunni Islam? What about the Sunni mullahs in Iran?

I'm not in favor of terror of any kind-but definitions of groups are in order. Otherwise, Osama and his ilk will use polls like this to paint the US as a hater of Islam. Remember, this comes on the heels of the CO congressman who said if terrorists attack here, we should bomb Mecca.

[KarenInMA]

23. Ok, you can't use

Tancredo as an example of rational thought. The Republicans think this guy's on crack.

Radical Islam would be defined by me as people who want to kill innocent civilians for political/religious reasons. Anyone willing to become a suicide attacker.

I get really annoyed when I hear people on this board parrot Churchill's ridiculous "little Eichman" ideas. We do NOT deserve to die for our foreign policy, and there ARE Muslims who want to kill us.

Not all of them, not even 5%. But they are there. Denying that fact just hands the right more ammo against us.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

44. I didn't know that the Republicans thought

the "bomb Mecca" congressman was a radical-and I'm a US citizen and regular reader of DU. I can imagine what the normal person on the street thinks about this. Actually, I sort of know what typical Americans think. I don't dare let any of my co-workers know my faith, or I would lose my job. My husband's life was threatened after 911. I know several people who have said all Muslims in this country should be herded into detention camps or deported "back to their country" (an interesting thought, since my husband and I are native born American citizens; my ancestors came over on the Mayflower and his met the boat).

From this personal context, perhaps you can see why I look with concern at any poll that uses the word "Muslim" and "terrorist" because it reinforces the opinions and behaviors described above.

I will not disagree that some Muslims want to destroy America and Americans. But I am very wary and suspicious that Bushco would like to destroy American Muslims and Islam in general, just from how they are framing the debate.

[Lecky]

57. Do you think innocent civilians deserve to die for our foreign policy?

I think terrorism is horrible and unforgivable and I don't think anyone here is sympathizing with the terrorists BTW.

Screw the fucking RW and their ignorance, they will attack us every way they can regardless.

It's wrong when the media fuels this type of ignorance period.

[dogday]

14. I just have to say it---------WOW What Ignorance

let's just support OBL's position shall we? We are playing right into his hands....

[AlamoDemoc]

15. Lou Dobbs is RW fanatic in the closet....can't stand him

[joemurphy]

25. I totally agree with you. I don't care for him at all.

[bvar22]

16. Great Idea!!! Lets declare WAR on a religion!

That'll work......NOT.

I like LD on economic issues. He has always told the truth about NAFTA, Free Trade, and Tax Cuts for the RICH..

[NNN0LHI]

46. I never once heard Lou Dobbs bad mouth tax cuts for the wealthy

Are you sure you have?

Don

[Canuckistanian]

17. That question could be taken another way

Do you think that radical muslim extremists are the terrorists or are ALL muslims terrorists?
Michael Savage would vote no on that question.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

19. Know what's funny?

I've been called a "good Christian" by people who don't know my faith, simply because of my actions. They don't understand that the underlying teachings of all religions are the same-treat others as you would be treated.

[Canuckistanian]

31. And that's an integral part of Islam, too

In fact the Koran is just as explicit about it as the Bible is. In fact the Koran goes a step further than the Bible by making donations to the poor a REQUIREMENT of following Islam. It's one of the "5 Pillars" or mandatory actions.

[FloridaPat]

20. Only if radical Christians go on the same list with the same guns aimed at

them. They have so far been the enablers for the radical Islamists. (Reagan & Bush 1)

[The_Casual_Observer]

21. He has been on this new kick all week.

[Kerrytravelers]

22. DUne.

Yes 80% 428 votes
No 20% 107 votes

But there's only been 535 votes.

[flakey_foont]

27. What if the bombings in London

were the work of the IRA? would we go and invade Ireland?

[KarenInMA]

28. Uh...

England has pretty much done that.

[flakey_foont]

49. was meant to be cynical

[etherealtruth]

36. I think an even better question would be ...

Should Great Britain "bomb" the USA because the US has been such a fertile source of donations for the IRA?

[Ian David]

34. Done

Do you think the United States should declare that radical Islamists are the enemy in the global war on terror?
Yes


80%

428 votes
No


20%

107 votes
Total: 535 votes

http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/lou.dobbs.tonight

[Lecky]

37. Very irresponsible to promote the idea that Islamic fundamentalism is the

only cause of terror. In an indirect way he is becoming a cheerleader for a war against Islam. I wrote an email to complain...

The MSM has a responsibility to educate Americans with the truth not promote hatred against Islam. The ignorant masses just take that as a clue to hate Muslims.

I'm also going to write and complain that he sticks up for Judith Miller when it is evident she is covering for criminals and it's people like herself that make us weary of the press.

[jzodda]

42. I agree with Dobbs

The "war on Terror" is 100% directed at radical Islam so what would be so out of bounds by stating the obvious?

Sure there are non muslim terrorists but this is different. This is a worldwide Jihad movement with millions of people who are active participants. We are fighting radical islam and they are the enemy plain and simple. They have the numbers of recruits, they have the funding, they have the expertise. No other group deemed "terroist" has anything close to what they have.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

52. I politely disagree

the "War on Terror" has created an anti-Muslim climate in this country. Numerous mosques have had bomb threats or actual damage since 911. And the government rounded up Muslim-Americans and held many incommunicado, even though later it was found these same people were NOT involved in terrorism at all. The government alienated a vital group of Arab speakers who could have helped with finding al Qadea.

My boss told me he'd never hire a Muslim and would work to ship them all off. Obviously, I haven't told him of my faith.

[shadowknows69]

43. what the fuck have we become as a country

that poll is a prescription for genocide. how long until the definition of radical islamist is any one from the middle east who isn't a christian or jew.

[jzodda]

45. No a radical islamist has a certain point of view

They can be identified easy enough and certainly do not have to be from the middle east either. A hatred of the West in general, a hatred of all things secular, a hatred of all law thats not Sharia based, a hatred of all other religions or at least a feeling that crimes against them are not so bad b/c they are the enemy. A strong hatred of Western culture and democracy and a goal of re-uniting the entire muslim world into a great Calphiate resembling the ones from early Islam.

Mainstream muslims speak differently, look different and act different then these radical folks. Even religious muslims do not subscribe to these radical points of view.

What I am confused about is what do you think the "war on terror" is all about? Who is conducting 99% of the terror? Why is it wrong to mention what it really is by name?

[shadowknows69]

51. You think Joe sheeple

or joe FBI agent is going to have respect for the fact not everyone with darker than albino skin may be an upstanding citizen of the world? I guarantee the muslim world will look at it as a declaration of genocide. then we will feel the wrath of allah like never before i assure you.

[Lecky]

54. If our government was doing more than adding fuel to the flame

then I wouldn't have a problem with that poll. If I had faith that our government would handle the problem in an effective manner the poll wouldn't bother me. The current neocons in office seem relentless and ineffective in solving this problem.

I don't think you understand the indirect affects it has on encouraging bigotry against Islam in general. Most people are lazy thinkers and will just assume that Islam is the root to terror (it's not). I don't want public support for another unnecessary war either.

[Douglas Carpenter]

47. Thank you for your courage to speak up

Having lived much of my life in the Muslim world--I do know that Islamist extremism is a danger.

I also know that the whole effort by reactionary forces in the West to demonize Islam and the failed policy of Western dominance in the Middle East fuels this danger.

Again, Thanks.

[GreenPartyVoter]

48. Scary.. and done

[NNN0LHI]

50. Did Lou suggest waging war against Radical Catholics after Tim McVeigh...

...blew up the Murrah federal building? No? Wonder why? Too many Catholics to be fucking with, that why. Racist motherscratcher.

Don

[brentspeak]

53. Well, we can say truthfully that radical Islamists are AN enemy

in the global war on terror, perhaps not the only one.

[NNN0LHI]

55. The bright side is he is laying off the Mexicans this week n/t

[Lecky]

58. LOL