Why would Rove have just assumed Plame sent Wilson to Niger?

[Quixote1818]

This seems to be the defense Rove is using?? Ignorance, jumping to conclusions and laziness. Thats his defense!

It's significant that Rove said that "Wilson's wife" sent Wilson to Niger because we now know beyond a shadow of a doubt she didn't. Other reports suggest it was Cheney yet Cheney denies having knowing and attributing Wilson's trip to Mid level CIA. It seems their defense is that they are trying to play stupid as if they had no clue why Wilson went to Niger and they just assumed it was because Wilson's wife sent him their because someone off the cuff JUST HAPPENED to mention that she worked on finding WMD's with the CIA but FAILED to mention that she was also undercover??? This is extremely hard to believe but hard to miss prove. All Rove had to do was ask Cheney EXACTLY who sent Wilson to Niger and Cheney could look into it and fill Rove in. So Rove was either lying or had no business talking to the Press with incomplete information.

This seems like a weak angle to take, however Fitzgerald does have to prove they knew without a shadow of a doubt that Rove and others knew Plame was undercover. But even if it's not proved, isn't spreading misinformation to the Press because of laziness illegal? You can't just go tell the press any kind of assumption that comes into your head can you? Rove had a responsibility to find out FOR SURE who sent Wilson to Niger not just pull something out of his ass!

It's as clear as day Rove knew she was undercover but proving it without reasonable doubt is going to take some good detective work on Fitzgerald's part.

This is obviously HUGE with many players. Just as John Dean said, this is looking more and more like a conspiracy to defraud the government much like we saw with Watergate. This is no longer just about someone spilling the beans but a consorted effort to spread misinformation, defraud the government, obstruct justice and perjury.

[dalloway]

1. here's another thought--Rove said he never leaked

her name; the Cooper email refers to Plame as "Wilson's wife".

So maybe he never leaked her NAME, just said "Wilson's wife." The ultimate in parsing, but with his back up against the wall, perhaps that is all he has.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TahitiNut]

3. It's probable that the WHIG wanted a toady sent to Niger. (Bolton?)

I regard the Niger Uranium scam as but one piece of a WMD disinformation strategy on Iraq, orchestrated in part by the WHIG. However the notion of sending someone to Niger came up, it's gotta be certain that the WHIG would want a disinformation agent rather than Wilson. It's entirely possible that Plame was "tapped in" to sources of information within the CIA that were aware of this regime's disinformation strategy and saw the opportunity to checkmate them in the selection of an envoy to Niger. This, of course, would enrage Rove and the WHIG.

[Quixote1818]

4. So you are saying that in a round about way Plame had a part

in Wilson being sent to Niger thus Roves words would have just enough truth in them to cover his ass?

[TahitiNut]

7. Plame wasn't a decision-maker.

It's possible that she was part of a "white hat" faction within the CIA who countered the threat of a Bushoilini Toadie being sent to Niger. It makes little difference how and who checkmated Rove/WHIG -- their rage at being countered would lash out at anyone who opposed them. Their WMD Fraud is the "smoking gun."

(It seems pretty clear to me that the CIA has its "white hat" and "black hat" factions. I'd bet other agencies are similar. E.g. NSA.)

[Quixote1818]

13. So what would be easier to get Rove and the rest of them on?

Their "Black Hat" CIA faction defrauding the government on WMD's or Rove spreading false information to the press?

[TahitiNut]

14. I don't yet know why Rove wouldn't be guilty of violating IIPA

It seems clear to me that he's probably prosecutable and could do at least 5 years in prison. All the speculation about his 'knowing' and not 'authorized access' sound like hogwash to me. 'Plausible deniability' is a hypocritical farce.

If he also committed perjury and obstruction of justice, any time he'd serve would be consecutive, not concurrent. IIPA makes sure of that.

What I'd think would be far more interesting speculation is what'd happen if Rove started spilling the beans. He's got the goods on so many people, it'd take completely separate issues of the NY Times to keep up with what he could disclose. Rove's a weasel and a coward.

[pacalo]

5. It was his slithery way of getting Plame's name out there.

He didn't assume anything. It was a babe-in-the-woods style, deliberate action when he went down the list of journalists he chose to participate in his treasonous game.

[Quixote1818]

8. Unless Rove ties Wilson's trip to Plame then his defense is that he

was basically assuming she sent him. Who told Rove that Plame sent him? Thats part of the picture we don't have from the Newsweek article. Of course he was using this as cover to out Plame but we now know Plame didn't directly send Wilson. Their are some big questions this opens up about WHY Rove SAID Plame sent Wilson. If Rove even ignorantly gave false information to the press when he could have checked to see if it was true or not is in John Deans view defrauding the government.

[pacalo]

15. Imo, Rove was enlightened by Cheney's office.

After the media's big to-do about Miller's "chilling" arrest, I'm hoping it only fuels Fitzgerald's determination to get the answer to all the why's, & that his results will have vindicated his decision to throw the treasonous game-participant into jail.

[proud patriot]

6. Ignorance is no excuse for the law

at least that's what I was taught by my father growing up.

[immoderate]

9. This law is the exception. It's written that way.

However, it's not this law that will trip them up, it's coordinating their cover stories that opens them up to charges of obstuction, perjury, and conspiracy. For those, ignorance is not an excuse.

--IMM

[Quixote1818]

11. Isn't spreading false information to the press defrauding the government?

Don't they have the responsibility to check their sources before they spread information to the press? John Dean seems to think so.

[immoderate]

16. Not a lawyer, so I don't know.

But if spreading false information to the press was a crime wouldn't they all be in jail by now?:shrug:

--IMM

[Quixote1818]

10. Spreading false information to the press is defrauding the government

John Dean's speculation on "the Conspiracy to defraud the government" appears to be the one Fitzgerald can prove. Spreading false information to the press is considered to be defrauding the government in John Dean's view. According to him that's what was used to send many of the Watergate figures to prison. Some of those who went to prison are now in the Bush administration.

[caledesi]

12. Excellent post Quix. nt

[emulatorloo]

17. Because he made the "Plame sent Wilson" up -- He was LYING

He didn't assume Plame sent wilson.

He MADE IT UP.

To Discredit Wilson.

Just More Rove BS.

[Quixote1818]

18. Then according to John Dean Rove is guilty under the law.

Spreading false information to the press is considered to be defrauding the government in John Dean's view.

What could even be worse is a cover up of a "Black Hat" faction of the CIA that was fixing the Niger/Yellowcake intelligence.

[emulatorloo]

19. This DU poster suggests Rove may have cut a deal w Fitzgerald

could get interesting.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4065787&mesg_id=4065955